The Times of the Gentiles

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Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#182
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
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#182
eternally-gratefull said:
I am not in jerusalem, which is what I said,

where did I claim we were not the temple?

please learn to read, it really gets frustrating. It seems all your doing is looking for something to pounce on so you keeping making claims which are not true, because I never said what your claiming
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The Temple is in Heavenly Jerusalem where we are now if you can discern it. Seated in Heaven with Christ.
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#183
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
736
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#183
eternally-gratefull said:
Once again you refuse to look at scripture given.

how do expect people to,see your point if you can’t even tell them what the passage says and all you do is make strawman remarks
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Can you understand the scriptures you give?
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#184
#184
KJV1611 said:
People are coming to heavenly Jerusalem year to year, day to day . That’s where the living water is.


Heb 12:22 (KJV) But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,
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That’s not what the passage says

it says they will come to jerusalem once a year, and if they do not they will be punished with no rain

It’s not a symbolic prophecy

it is telling us what will happen, and the punishment given to those who do what will be required.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#186
#186
Dave-L said:
The Temple is in Heavenly Jerusalem where we are now if you can discern it. Seated in Heaven with Christ.
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It says they will be punished if they do not go once a year

did the prophet lie?

(please note, we as believers should go to the throne daily, sometimes hourly, to visit our high priest.

the peophecy has people,coming to give reverence or honor or worship the king.
huge difference)
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#187
#187
Dave-L said:
WHo offered Jesus all the kingdoms of the world?
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your all over the place man

answer my question and stop resisting

you only do this when deep down you know I am right.
 
Kolistus

Kolistus

Well-known member
#188
Feb 3, 2020
538
276
63
#188
eternally-gratefull said:
That’s not what the passage says

it says they will come to jerusalem once a year, and if they do not they will be punished with no rain

It’s not a symbolic prophecy

it is telling us what will happen, and the punishment given to those who do what will be required.
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This I believe is a classic case of: Lets take the verses about the New Jerusalem, heavenly Jerusalem and heavenly realities and apply them back to the OT.

Instead of: Things that are different are not the same.

There is a heavenly Jerusalem AND an earthly Jerusalem

There is Israel AND there is a Church

We dont have to just take one and throw out the other.

I will still look into it, eschatology is of great interest to me but I just find it difficult to disregard so many passages in the OT especially because none of the amillennialists are ever in agreement on what Zechariah 14 does mean, there is no concensus because its all spiritual realities so your guess is as good as mine. They will tell us we are carnal (possibly even unsaved) for not getting it, they know for sure what its not, but not what it is.
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#190
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
736
113
#190
eternally-gratefull said:
It says they will be punished if they do not go once a year

did the prophet lie?

(please note, we as believers should go to the throne daily, sometimes hourly, to visit our high priest.

the peophecy has people,coming to give reverence or honor or worship the king.
huge difference)
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Are the Chinese being punished today for trampling Christ under foot?
 
iamsoandso

iamsoandso

Senior Member
#191
Oct 6, 2011
7,850
1,565
113
#191
Kolistus said:
This I believe is a classic case of: Lets take the verses about the New Jerusalem, heavenly Jerusalem and heavenly realities and apply them back to the OT.

Instead of: Things that are different are not the same.

There is a heavenly Jerusalem AND an earthly Jerusalem

There is Israel AND there is a Church

We dont have to just take one and throw out the other.

I will still look into it, eschatology is of great interest to me but I just find it difficult to disregard so many passages in the OT especially because none of the amillennialists are ever in agreement on what Zechariah 14 does mean, there is no concensus because its all spiritual realities so your guess is as good as mine. They will tell us we are carnal (possibly even unsaved) for not getting it, they know for sure what its not, but not what it is.
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this may help,,see verse 14 "we seek one to come" https://biblehub.com/interlinear/hebrews/13-14.htm https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Hebrews+13&version=KJV
 
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garee

Banned
#192
Mar 28, 2016
15,954
1,528
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#192
Dino246 said:
That does not follow. One's ethnicity does not change on the basis of belief. Ethnic Jews are ethnic Jews, period.

Once again, what do you mean by your statement, "none of Abraham’s covenant seed had his DNA, only Ishmael then"?
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Covenant seeds plural as fleshly. Ishmael and Jacob the corruptible seeds .

Not seed singular, Christ the anointing Holy Spirit, the spiritual seed.

John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

Banned
#193
Nov 23, 2013
13,684
1,212
113
#193
eternally-gratefull said:
That’s not what the passage says

it says they will come to jerusalem once a year, and if they do not they will be punished with no rain

It’s not a symbolic prophecy

it is telling us what will happen, and the punishment given to those who do what will be required.
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Zec 14:16 And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.
Zec 14:17 And it shall be, that whoso will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, even upon them shall be no rain.

The feasts were shadows which were fulfilled in Christ.
In your view is God going to require the nations which came against Jerusalem to keep the feast of tabernacles? Is he going to require all Gentiles to start law keeping again?

Why would you assume that those "nations that came against Israel" is something future when we know that this happened in AD 70 and there is no mention of nations coming against Israel more than one time?
 
iamsoandso

iamsoandso

Senior Member
#194
Oct 6, 2011
7,850
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#194
iamsoandso said:
Your thinking the times of the gentiles that Jesus spoke of i.e. the beast of Daniel and the length of weeks(time) and that they would be in captivity under them ended sometime in the past consider this...

If Rome was in it's final stages of the time it was to hold Judah/Israel in captivity then the Apostle Paul would not have said to them in Romans 13 to still see it/Rome as ordained by God https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Romans+13&version=KJV

If the fourth beast was in it's final state of time of rule over Daniels people that it was stated to rule over them or exist in the world then Revelation 17 would not have said that five were,one is. and that the 7th was coming(future) or that the 10 kings have received no kingdom as yet nor would it have said that the 8th was going to ascend out of the pit(future) it would have stated that all those heads and kings were present and at their end. https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation+17&version=KJV

In Romans 13 the Apostle said to see them as ordained by God, in Ephesians 6:5 he said to obey your earthly masters. In Colossians 3:22 again he says to obey your earthly masters. In 1 Peter 2:18-20 Peter says to obey your earthly masters.

Now this if you consider can only mean that in ad66-70 the Apostles last written testimony in regards to the point in time was exactly where the angel said to John/us in Revelation 17. That is at that time of the rule of domination of the fourth beast of Daniel the 6th head was present and the rest was to unfold in the future.

Now the mistake then is that they did not believe Jesus nor did they pay attention to the Apostles in regards to this issue of whether or not the rule of the 4th beast had yet completely unfolded in it's fulfillment of time. Instead you see they revolted and did not obey God and obey their master(the 4th beast) that was spoken to them.

Now if the image or the mark was present tense in the day when the Apostles stated that the Christians were to obey the masters over them(Rome at that time) then they would then have been saying it is correct to pay dues https://biblehub.com/interlinear/romans/13-7.htm that is to use the beast mark to pay that with(see Rev. 13:17) https://biblehub.com/kjv/revelation/13-17.htm

But then it is Scriptural'y clear to see that the Apostles were saying that the 6th head was present in their day and the 4th beast was to continue until the times of the gentile rule was complete.
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only one nation(singular), the forth beast of Daniel went to war with them in ad70 this is because the time that was prophesied for them to be over them was not finished. That is they obeyed and served under Babylon,Persia and Greece but instead of obeying God and being subject to the fourth beast they rebelled/revolted and tried to set off the captivity of the fourth beast before it's time was fulfilled.
 
T

TheDivineWatermark

Well-known member
#195
Aug 3, 2018
10,214
1,980
113
#195
Dave-L said:
What's your point?
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The same point I made before.

That every time Paul speaks of US as "temple," he never uses the definite article ('the').


Yet you are using it (in such a way), by your saying "we are THE temple..." (I'm saying, Paul does not use the definite article [with the word "temple"] when speaking of US … I do not believe v.17 is making that point, as you suggest).

Verse 16 is saying we are "temple" (no definite article). There are a number a passages that some think SOUND like they are just REPEATING what was stated in a previous verse, but which are actually speaking of a distinct thing (John 6:39 and then v.40, is one example I'm often pointing out [same time-period, but distinct items]).
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#196
#196
Dave-L said:
Can you understand the scriptures you give?
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Well let’s see

I explain them, you seemingly can not (be it pride, and you think you are smarter than me thus you do not have to, or the fact you cannot explain them in context in the passage, both of which you have basically left me no choice but continue to believe as I do)

so unless you can show me in the passage how I am misunderstanding, I must continue as I am.

now if you can show me in those scriptures where I am wrong, I will listen
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#197
#197
Kolistus said:
This I believe is a classic case of: Lets take the verses about the New Jerusalem, heavenly Jerusalem and heavenly realities and apply them back to the OT.

Instead of: Things that are different are not the same.

There is a heavenly Jerusalem AND an earthly Jerusalem

There is Israel AND there is a Church

We dont have to just take one and throw out the other.

I will still look into it, eschatology is of great interest to me but I just find it difficult to disregard so many passages in the OT especially because none of the amillennialists are ever in agreement on what Zechariah 14 does mean, there is no concensus because its all spiritual realities so your guess is as good as mine. They will tell us we are carnal (possibly even unsaved) for not getting it, they know for sure what its not, but not what it is.
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Nope

this is a case of you wanting to fit s rapture to fit your belief (see how ridiculous an argument this is? This is not going to convince anyone to see it your way or my way, this
is what we call a strawman argument with no meat)

what this is is a case of you not wanting to actually tell, us in context what the OT prophet said, Ie,

can you tell us why God said they would be punished if they did not come once a year to worship.. this is ALL families, not just the church

and he even gives us the punishment,

no rain

tell us what this means,
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#198
#198
Dave-L said:
Are you saying Satan isn't god of this world?
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So you can not answer. your going to do what you have continued t9 do and make excuses and try to turn it on me

i know the answer,God does not want us to call out one nation, since every nation is guilty

either way thanks again for showing me no reason to change my view of what you think.
 
Dave-L

Dave-L

Banned
#199
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
736
113
#199
TheDivineWatermark said:
The same point I made before.

That every time Paul speaks of US as "temple," he never uses the definite article ('the').


Yet you are using it (in such a way), by your saying "we are THE temple..." (I'm saying, Paul does not use the definite article [with the word "temple"] when speaking of US … I do not believe v.17 is making that point, as you suggest).

Verse 16 is saying we are "temple" (no definite article). There are a number a passages that some think SOUND like they are just REPEATING what was stated in a previous verse, but which are actually speaking of a distinct thing (John 6:39 and then v.40, is one example I'm often pointing out [same time-period, but distinct items]).
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“What agreement has the temple of God with idols? For we are the temple of the living God; as God said, “I will make my dwelling among them and walk among them, and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.” 2 Corinthians 6:16 (ESV)
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#200
#200
Dave-L said:
Are the Chinese being punished today for trampling Christ under foot?
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were the Chinese promised land, and promised they would be punished if they did something? Are they also promised if they repent God will remember his promise?

are all jews evil? Yet you judge them all as evil just because they are Jews.

hitler did this, where do you think he got this idea and hatred from?
 
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