Not By Works

Very true

AMEN, AMEN, and AMEN!

That testimony is a lot like mine. I certainly Understand, and KNOW, what it means to be CALLED, and WHY we CANNOT walk away from OSAS that is the TRUE DOCTRINE.

Yes, I used to be into the Party Hardy lifestyle and everything that went with it.
After a nasty Divorce where the marriage only lasted six months.
I attempted suicide three times the last week of 1977.
First two times with Pistol, and the trigger Half pulled, SHEAR TERROR of walking into Hades/Hell, by my own action, left me SHAKING.
Third time I tried to arrange a fatal Motorcylce accident, by getting drunker than I have ever been on my motorcylce, and while taunting GOD, rode down a very LOOSE, freshly graveled RODE, FULL THROTTLE, with NO HELMET, and leaning OVER the handle bars, so I WOULD HIT HEAD FIRST. The bike felt like I was riding of PAVEMENT, for a full mile of LOOSE GRAVEL.

Afterwards I went home and sat up until I was sober, trying to figure out what HAPPENED.
I think it was about 4:00 A.M. as I was walking into the Bed Room, it HIT ME, "I CAN NOT RIDE A BIKE LIKE THAT, EVEN SOBER." As I realized HE HAD TO HAVE GRABBED THE BIKE, and said, I HAVE A PLAN FOR YOUR LIFE! Wave, after wave, after Wave OF GUILT, for my whole lifestyle washed over me. I Kept CRYING LIKE A BABY for an hour or two, "CRYING OUT TO HIM, FORGIVE, PLEASE FORGIVE ME!"
On my Knees at First, then later on I went PRONE. At some time I PRAYED A PRAYER, that I had NEVER LEARNED BEFORE THAT NIGHT. I think it was the Holy Spirit, WHO gave it to me: "Lord FORGIVE ME, Please FORGIVE ME! If you have a purpose for my life, then you are going to have to come into it, and run my life. Because I CAN'T DO IT, I am making a Total Mess of it." I knew that was FOREVER, a total SURRENDER TO HIM, OUT OF LOVE. AND my Church Never taught that to me.

Then something Happened to me, besides the Holy Spirit took up PERMANENT residence in my heart. No, I am not a Charismatic, nothing like that, I Knew my spirit was alive, by the EXTREME CONVICTION OF SIN, but something else happened. I had a Dream or Vision. If it was a Dream, it was WAY VIVID BEYOND any Dream I ever had. I was LITERALLY at the Cross, Kneeling, reaching up to HIM on the Cross, and still CRYING, "Forgive Me, Please Forgive Me!" Then I NOTICED, the Nails were THROUGH HIS WRISTS, and that was years before I learned the JEWS consider the Wrists to be Part of the HANDS. I saw the Blood from those Nail Holes, fall and Splashed on my raised forearms, AND THE BLOOD FELT WARM:

That is where the Dream or Vision ENDED. AND I KNEW THAT BLOOD PAID FOR MY SINS FOREVER.

YES, HE GREW ME, CONTROLLED ME as long as my sin nature did not raise it's ugly head, BROUGHT A HUNGER FOR THE WORD, MOLDED ME THROUGH IT, AND USED ME. I am still in AWE how HE USED ME. I used to say: "There ain't No way I will ever move to California." Well, I have finally learned not to put limits on GOD, because HE DID MOVE ME TO CALIFORNIA. He wanted me a born and raised Nebraskan, with NO BIBLE COLLEGE; to Start a Prison Ministry in a New supermax Prison in California. HE KEEP OPENING DOORS, and I JUST KEPT WALKING THRU THEM, AND KEPT TRUSTING HIM TO DO WHAT I COULD NOT. HE DID IT ALL!

My wife passed away Nov. 2015, after I retired from the Post Office, so I came home to Nebraska.

That's an awesome testimony VCO! And a big AMEN to that. I am presently getting sober in a inpatient hospital getting clean. I battle addiction. Funny thing you mentioned saying you'd never move to California from Nebraska. I just moved out to california last May on a pulling since 2016. I'm in San Diego getting ready to hopefully do some damage to satan's kingdom. I am presently typing out my testimony while I am here. It's quite lengthy, and i dont "type" I "peck" at the keypad so that it's going to take awhile. I greatly appreciate ur testimony. I dont know if mine will be able to be put on here for the length of it. Thanks again VCO. Keep the faith my Bro0ther.
in christ,
Bob

Amen Sister!

Bribes are not taken back.
Either they are given, or they are not given.

Continuing to believe is not the definition of the works gospel.

It is actually

Not a GIFT .... but a bribe or reward by a fickle god who may or may not give it to you, because no one really knows when one has earned it?

Matt 25:21 His lord said unto him, Well done, thou good and faithful servant: thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.

Salvation is not a reward....so I am sure this is not what is in view here.

Oh I am sorry, salvation is irrevocable.
I was thinking concerning works based salvation, you can't keep a tally on works, that would be work.

God Bless...

Just a little reminder

Wrong. Bribes are offered first! There is no guarantee of receipt of payment once one compromises their integrity and agrees to be bribed. This is crystal clear to the one offering the bribe. If someone will sell out on promise of a ill gotten reward, they have no expectation of the bribe being honored by the one offering the bribe. And usually the bribe isn't typically paid prior to the concession sought.

Therefore, the one offering the bribe can have what they intended from it accomplished and then say to the venal corrupt sell out, I have no idea what you're talking about! What payment?
What's the bribee going to do? Go to the authorities?

Show me in the verse below where it says believing is you trying to earn your salvation by working for it:

"5 to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited as righteousness" - Romans 4:5


You receive justification the moment you believe.
And that justification remains as you remain in that believing.

AMEN! I KNOW, as LONG as you TRUST HIM, HE WILL GIVE YOU THE VICTORY over the addiction. My wife was addicted to Pain Pills, when I first met her. She had a hard time kicking the addiction, because she had not FULLY Trusted the LORD YET! One day when Dad and I went fishing, she decided to go for Donuts, but before she left the house she popped several pain pills and muscle relaxers. The Donuts Shop was about a mile away. On the way home, she passed out while driving and Hit a telephone pole size of a Steel Sign Post, during our first year of Marriage. She hit the steering wheel so hard, it bruised her heart. Actually it stopped beating on the Emergency Room table, and they had to defib her, to get it started again.

After she got out of the hospital, I needed help from somebody to keep an eye on her, while I went to work in the Post Office. Her Mother volunteered to help us. Her Mother was in the habit of Praying for my wife, Bobbi, in the morning. About a week and a half later, here Mother, the Prayer Warrior, was on her kneels praying for Bobbi, out loud; when Bobbi came out of her Bed Room, and saw her PRAYING EARNESTLY FOR HER. Something Precious HAPPEN TO HER, THE SIGHT OF HER MOTHER PRAYING FOR HER, dropped her to her KNEES, as she REPENTED, now CRYING, and she cried out to the LORD, "FORGIVE ME! PLEASE TAKE THIS ADDICTION AWAY FROM ME!" And she meant that prayer with her WHOLE BEING.

She had built up her tolerance, to where she was actually taking what would be a LETHAL dose for normal person. SHE WENT FROM THAT ALL TIME HIGH OF PAIN PILLS, to ZERO that day, WITHOUT WITHDRAWALS OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT. I AM A WITNESS! A few days later, she had an appointment with her doctor. He insisted that she checked in at the local Rehab Center. I tried to explain that SHE had been HEALED of the Addiction, in answer to Prayer. The Dr. said, "If you believe that, you are either a fool, or a liar." I figured out that the Dr. was not a CHRISTIAN real QUICK. So my wife went into the REHAB CENTER anyhow.

We were 36.5 years of marriage, when the LORD called her Home with a fatal heart attack.


That is the Two of US, about 30 years ago, in the Redwoods near Crescent City, CA.
Where GOD wanted us to move to, so I could Start a PRISON Ministry. Yes, I am 71 now.

KEEP TRUSTED HIM TOTALLY!

Salvation is free...and along the path of righteousness which the saved tread, when a saint comes under Holy Spirit conviction of sin yet refuses to repent of it, he proves that the low low cost of "free" has become too high a price to pay for eternal life. God's love is conditional, salvation is not.

That REALLY sounds like YOU HAVE A COUPLE OF THINGS TOTALLY CONFUSED.

Salvation is a TOTALLY FREE GIFT For those who HIS. GOD KNOWS EVERY DECISION YOU WILL MAKE IN YOUR ENTIRE LIFE, BEFORE TIME BEGAN.

That is what GOD's Omniscience actually MEANS.

2 Timothy 1:9 (HCSB)
9 He has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace, which was given to us in Christ Jesus before time began.


That MEANS, if you want to believe there is a CONDITION, IT WAS MADE before time began.

SO WE ARE NOT INVOLVED AT ALL.


2 Timothy 2:19 (ESV)
19 But God’s firm foundation stands, bearing this seal: “The Lord knows those who are his,” and, “Let everyone who names the name of the Lord depart from iniquity.”


That TOO, was KNOWN BEFORE THE BEGINNING OF TIME. BECAUSE THAT WAS WHEN HE WROTE OUR NAMES IN THE BOOK OF LIFE.


Revelation 13:8 (HCSB)
8 All those who live on the earth will worship him [Antichrist], everyone whose name was not written from the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb who was slaughtered.


OH MY, there goes your Conditional Theory.

Now How Can WE Tell Who is a TRUE CHRISTIAN, from a PHONY CHRISTIAN.

Oh that is easier Than You Think, True Christians are those WHO HAVE the HOLY SPIRIT in them, which is OBVIOUS By the AGAPE LOVE that Comes out of them. BECAUSE THAT IS GOD's Agape LOVE, that HE HAD THE HOLY SPIRIT pour it into our HEARTS or Human Spirit.


Romans 5:1-10 (HCSB)
1 Therefore, since we have been declared righteous by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.
2 We have also obtained access through Him by faith into this grace in which we stand, and we rejoice in the hope of the glory of God.
3 And not only that, but we also rejoice in our afflictions, because we know that affliction produces endurance,
4 endurance produces proven character, and proven character produces hope.
5 This hope will not disappoint ⌊us⌋, because God’s Agape love has been poured
out in our hearts through the Holy Spirit who was given to us.
6 For while we were still helpless, at the appointed moment, Christ died for the ungodly.
7 For rarely will someone die for a just person—though for a good person perhaps someone might even dare to die.
8 But God proves His own Agape love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us!
9 Much more then, since we have now been declared righteous by His blood, we will be saved through Him from wrath.
10 For if, while we were enemies, we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, ⌊then how⌋ much more, having been reconciled, will we be saved by His life!


CAN YOU SEEN NOW, that We had NOTHING TO DO WITH IT, We LOVE because HE First LOVED US.
When ? BEFORE TIME BEGAN, when HE DECIDED HE WOULD DIE FOR US and Write our NAMES in the Book of LIFE.

CHRIST CHOSE US, WHOM HE COULD SEE WE WOULD MAKE A DECISION FOR CHRIST OUT OF PURE AGAPE LOVE SOMETIME IN THE FUTURE.

THAT KIND OF LOVE WAS ONLY POURED INTO OUR HEART or Human Spirit, by GOD, Who KNEW we would make a Decision For CHRIST.
IT PRODUCES the SAME KIND OF LOVE IN US, therefore WE AGAPE LOVE GOD and our Brethren.

THEREFORE, HE WROTE OUR NAMES IN THE BOOK OF LIFE BEFORE TIME BEGAN.

Matthew 7:19-20 (HCSB)
19 Every tree that doesn’t produce good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
20 So you’ll recognize them by their fruit.


IT IS GOD'S LOVE IN US, THAT PRODUCES THE FRUIT OF AGAPE LOVE.

I hope and pray that this info, deepens your AWE FOR GOD, when you SEE how much involved HE IS in your life.

Well, let us see then. Dissensions are all over the BDF forum from what I've read others say of the board. Some even avoid a board where the bible is discussed in this Christian community due to the discord, hatred, dissensions and even factions that align together on the same track and weave dissension, sew discord, express hatred.

Works have everything to do with your salvation. If not, why does God judge you by your works and reward accordingly when you stand before him after death?
Revelation 20:12 And I saw the dead, both great and small stand before God: and the books were opened, and another book was opened, which is the book of life, and the dead were judged of those things, which were written in the books, according to their works.

And then there is this that in part explains why you'll be judged for your works. Philippians 2:12-13 Therefore, my dear friends, as you have always obeyed-not only in my presence, but now much more in my absence-continue to work out your salvation with fear and trembling, 13. for it is God who works in you to will and to act in order to fulfill his good purpose.

Yes, there are lots of babies in the church who think the correctness of doctrine, particularly osas doctrine, is what it means to believe and be saved and be spiritual and have God's approval. But their lives show they "do not yet know as they ought to know " (1 Corinthians 8:2), and are "conceited and understand nothing" about godliness (1 Timothy 6:3-4).

1 I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual men, but as to men of flesh, as to infants in Christ.
3for you are still fleshly. For since there is jealousy and strife among you, are you not fleshly, and are you not walking like mere men? - 1 Corinthians 3:1,3

Jesus wasn't just talking about salvation when he said this:

13“...the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it.
14“For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are few who find it." - Matthew 7:13-14

It seems there are lots of Christians who will never find "the life that is truly life" (1 Timothy 6:19), the life of "righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Spirit" (Romans 14:17). Instead, they will live out their lives in the dogmatic wranglings of baby milk doctrines thinking that is what constitutes the life of knowing Jesus. They have yet to move on to maturity and to that which really matters (Galatians 5:6, 6:15).