Unconstitutional

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
8,293
1,184
113
#81
church gatherings are not specifically spelled out in the temporary recommendations that we all avoid any and all kinds of groups of 10 people or more. i don't think there's a constitutional argument to be made here, at all.

i do think you have a point about what the implications of being told en masse not to congregate in anything other than small groups -- just that it's not a thing targeting church gatherings in particular, just like prohibition wasn't targeting churches when the law said wine couldn't be used for communion.
Jesus, himself, was told by the Roman government not to preach, but he did and Jerusalem was filled with his doctrine and he was crucified for it. The three Hebrew children were told not to pray, but they did, trusting that God would save them. Daniel also disobeyed the government and God saved him. I understand the government's reasons for not assembling, but I also understand that we are to follow God's commandments to not forsake the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is.. If God protected the Hebrew children and Daniel, and God changes not and is the same today as he was in those days, can he not also protect us when we obey his laws? I believe that God is in complete control of everything and could stop this virus in it's tracks. God tells us that his ways are beyond our understanding. Where is our faith in our God? Have we all lost our faith in God by listening to man, rather than God?
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
8,293
1,184
113
#82
by all means, continue to pray :)

i am unaware of anyone telling you not to?
Are you aware of God's law commanding that we are not to forsake the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is? Are you aware of the Apostles telling us that we are to obey God's law, rather than man's law?
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
8,293
1,184
113
#83
Faith VS stupidity? Faith keeps me in just as it did the Jews on Passover.
God instructed them to stay in. Has God instructed you to stay away from assembling to worship him, or is that man's instruction? Heb 10, God instructs us to not forsake the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is. Are we to obey man's law, rather than God's? The Apostles instruct us that we should obey God's law, and not man's law, Acts 5. I believe what the government is doing by keeping crowds from gathering together is necessary to fight the spreading of the virus, but I also believe God protects those who follows his commandments.
 
Jan 17, 2020
4,792
736
113
#84
God instructed them to stay in. Has God instructed you to stay away from assembling to worship him, or is that man's instruction? Heb 10, God instructs us to not forsake the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is. Are we to obey man's law, rather than God's? The Apostles instruct us that we should obey God's law, and not man's law, Acts 5. I believe what the government is doing by keeping crowds from gathering together is necessary to fight the spreading of the virus, but I also believe God protects those who follows his commandments.
Only if you pray for wisdom ...per James.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,647
13,121
113
#85
Are you aware of God's law commanding that we are not to forsake the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is? Are you aware of the Apostles telling us that we are to obey God's law, rather than man's law?
How many people together are needed?
Does it have to be in the flesh?
 
Sep 3, 2016
6,337
527
113
#86
The Pastor is supposed to be the protector of the flock. If that Pastor doesn't placed and maintained his Faith exclusively in Christ and His Finished Work at Calvary Cross where the victory was won (the Blood of Jesus), it becomes mans will (Satan's kingdom); the works of the flesh will manifest (Gal. 5:19-21).

We live in a dark world, but the Light of Jesus Christ will always shine.
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
#87
If it were a government order not to meet because of religious matters you would have a 1st amendment case. The government has issued the order for public health reasons not religious reasons.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 

hornetguy

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2016
6,639
1,392
113
#88
“Should Christians fight back physically or resist by force the such a Governmental Law and confiscation of property and destruction of life with weapons, such as guns, knives, and physical violence, for Jesus said, “… he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one”?

“Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.” – Luke 22:36 KJB​
“For I say unto you, that this that is written must yet be accomplished in me, And he was reckoned among the transgressors: for the things concerning me have an end.” – Luke 22:37 KJB​
“And they said, Lord, behold, here are two swords (*). And he said unto them, It is enough.” – Luke 22:38 KJB​

(*Simon Peter, being one, and the other likely being Simon the Zealot; the two Simons. Any system which today is like that?)​

What did Jesus mean?

Did the disciples understand Jesus’ words about the selling of the garment and the buying of a sword?

No.

The disciples still misunderstood Jesus’ spiritual meanings with physical meanings, even after so long a time with Him. Jesus was not talking about physical weapons.

1.John 1:19-25 (John the Baptist as Elijah)
2.John 2:19-22 (Temple of His body)
3.John 3:1-21 (Nicodemus, Born Again)
4.John 4:7-15 (Woman a the Well, Water)
5.John 4:31-34 (Meat to Eat, Water to Drink)
6.John 5:6-7 (Will you be made whole, Pool)
7.John 6:50-52 (Eat my Flesh, Word)
8.John 7:38-39 (Water out of the belly, Spirit)
9.Matthew 16:5-12 (Leaven, Bread)
The disciples were to trade in their old ‘garments’ of self-righteousness, and take up His righteousness, the sword of the word of God.

“And, behold, one of them (Peter; John 18:10 KJB) which were with Jesus stretched out his hand, and drew his sword, and struck a servant of the high priest's, and smote off his ear.” – Matthew 26:51 KJB​
“Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword (*) into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword.” – Matthew 26:52 KJB​
(* Did Jesus say, “My sword”, or “thy sword”?)
“Thinkest thou that I cannot now pray to my Father, and he shall presently give me more than twelve legions of angels?” – Matthew 26 :53 KJB​

Jesus also said:
Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.” – Matthew 5:10 KJB​
Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.” – Matthew 5:11 KJB​
“But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.” – Matthew 5:39 KJB​
“Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy. ” – Matthew 5:43 KJB​
“But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; ” – Matthew 5:44 KJB​

That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.” – Matthew 5:45 KJB​
Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.” – Matthew 5:48 KJB​
“Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.” – John 18:36 KJB​
“He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth.” – Isaiah 53:7 KJB​
“Yea, for thy sake are we killed all the day long; we are counted as sheep for the slaughter.” – Psalms 44:22 KJB​
“The disciple is not above his master, nor the servant above his lord.” – Matthew 10:24 KJB​
“It is enough for the disciple that he be as his master, and the servant as his lord. If they have called the master of the house Beelzebub, how much more shall they call them of his household?” – Matthew 10:25 KJB​

Romans 13 – God’s Ministers.

View attachment 213855

Jesus was made to be sin for us …

Our resistance is the "Word".
You just can't help yourself, can you? :sleep:
 

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
Jul 8, 2018
8,293
1,184
113
#91
If it were a government order not to meet because of religious matters you would have a 1st amendment case. The government has issued the order for public health reasons not religious reasons.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
Exactly, is not that the situation of the preacher who met with his congregation in Florida, and was arrested? Is not that a 1st amendment case?
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
#92
Are you aware of God's law commanding that we are not to forsake the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is? Are you aware of the Apostles telling us that we are to obey God's law, rather than man's law?

Fair warning, I'm about to go off, big time!! I'm so sick of people twisting the Bible and making Christians look like utter fools. No one is telling you forsake the assembling...

forsake -to quit or leave entirely; abandon; desert

People are being asked to voluntarily stay home until this virus passes. No one is nailing the doors shut to the church. No one is saying you can never go back, no one is taking away your religious freedoms!!! Stop with the nonsense!! God is in YOU not the building!! The doors will be open in a couple weeks. Give it a rest already. I'm so sick of hearing this nonsense. You could save a persons life over this. This is life and death. You going into a church building is not!! The gov't is not telling you to stop assembling, they are asking you to take a pause. How stinkin' selfish does it look when Christians are refusing to listen and close churches and restaurants and other small business have had to shut down and may never be able to open again?! Utterly ridiculous and selfish!! That's the problem with common sense, it's not common enough anymore.
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
#93
I do not believe you. I know better. Thank you for your scare tactics, but I ain't buyin'.

So everyone is lying, the president, the VP, the healthcare workers, the medical experts, all lying. And your evidence, without some Youtube knuckle dragger is??? What stats from professional, medical professionals is what?! I don't see any that you've shared. What's a scare tactic in asking you to stay home until this virus has passed?! The numbers are too high? So what. People aren't dying from this?! So what do we have to do, drag the dead bodies into your living room before you believe it?! How many pandemics have we had? Why are they suddenly lying about this one?! Unreal. You have no facts, no stats, no proof and are an expert or medical professional in nothing. Just a google university graduate. smh

You want to know whats real?! My mother just came through chemo treatments. And we are doing every single thing we can do to save her life, we are in a fight for her life. She's been home bound since this started. But my father has to go to work, essential that he works. And then people like you come along with bull crap Youtube videos and red flag junk and tinfoil hat conspiracy theories and put my mothers life at risk!!!!! At the risk of sounding like that spoiled climate change brat I hate to say it, but how dare you!!! Utterly selfish, utterly ridiculous and people like you are the reason we're in lock down. You need to take the word reason out your name, you use none!!
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
#94
Exactly, is not that the situation of the preacher who met with his congregation in Florida, and was arrested? Is not that a 1st amendment case?
Nope just the opposite. Church closed for public health reasons not religious reasons. Just think of it as the building was damaged by an earthquake and deemed structurally unsafe. If they say don't go in because its unsafe then don't go in.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#95
Fair warning, I'm about to go off, big time!! I'm so sick of people twisting the Bible and making Christians look like utter fools. No one is telling you forsake the assembling...

forsake -to quit or leave entirely; abandon; desert

People are being asked to voluntarily stay home until this virus passes. No one is nailing the doors shut to the church. No one is saying you can never go back, no one is taking away your religious freedoms!!! Stop with the nonsense!! God is in YOU not the building!! The doors will be open in a couple weeks. Give it a rest already. I'm so sick of hearing this nonsense. You could save a persons life over this. This is life and death. You going into a church building is not!! The gov't is not telling you to stop assembling, they are asking you to take a pause. How stinkin' selfish does it look when Christians are refusing to listen and close churches and restaurants and other small business have had to shut down and may never be able to open again?! Utterly ridiculous and selfish!! That's the problem with common sense, it's not common enough anymore.

'bout to go off big time? I have an avatar for that too!

I'm 'bout fed up to the point of playing whack a mole with people

if only.......might knock some sense into some of them
 

Demi777

Senior Member
Oct 13, 2014
6,877
1,949
113
Germany
#96
'bout to go off big time? I have an avatar for that too!

I'm 'bout fed up to the point of playing whack a mole with people

if only.......might knock some sense into some of them
Thats the moments the holy spirit says...calm down your christian now.. lol
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#97
Thats the moments the holy spirit says...calm down your christian now.. lol
yes

as my husband kindly reminds me from time to time

gotz some of that Irish blood going on
 
7

7seasrekeyed

Guest
#99
Imma german american military brat...know the feelin
have the German thing going on too...with Canadian flair

yah wanna just shake sense into people sometimes
 

massorite

Junior Member
Jan 3, 2015
544
118
43
The church choir that met in Washington now has 16 ill and 2 dead. Where does wisdom enter the picture? Should the choir director be held liable?

For the cause of Christ
Roger
Actually there are more then 16 diagnosed. Out of a 121 choir members 60+ showed up for the practice and they kept their social distancing. But they were in a closed setting and for 2 1/2 hours they exhaled and drew in air from each others breath. Now
nearly three weeks later, 45 have been diagnosed with COVID-19 or ill with the symptoms, at least three have been hospitalized, and two are dead.
The virus isn't are born but it can be caught by stand too close to someone while are talking in they are infected because of their exhales.
I have no problem with any law that would prohibit us from gathering for our safety as long as it was actually for our safety.
God gave us brains so that we could think for ourselves and not do stupid stuff.