Elect according to the foreknowledge of God. 1 Peter 1:2

The Bible teaches that God has an immutable purpose.

Talk to you after work.

3¶Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time. Kjv

When someone says what the bible ' teaches ' it's usually at the cost of what the bible actually ' says ' .

Hear and learn from the Spirit ? which verses please?

I direct you to Romans 9: 18-22, the Potter has made pots FOR destruction.

We may not always like what the Lord has proclaimed, but who can argue with God? It says what it says. And God even explains why He did this......
And He did so in order that He might make known the riches of His glory upon vessels of mercy, which He prepared beforhand for glory, v23

That would be the temporary hardening of Israel because of their own disobedience . Thats what Romans 9 is all about . If you read on to chapter 11 you get the big picture .

immutable purpose ? Again this is theology speak . Sometimes helpful, sometimes a way to sneak doctrine in thats not biblical.

You can direct me thereif you like but romans 9 is about god choosing Israel. the fatalistic view of Romans 9 is a misdirected consortium of God chosing babies not yet born for hell and other babies not yet born for heaven. When in reality paul is trying to show how God did not make a mistake chosing Israel, he planned it perfectly from the begining, not according to man way, but his way, so no one could say Isreal deserved a thing. But the world would (will according to romans 11) that he is the one true god.

god did not create hell for mankind, he created it for Satan and his angels, but men chose to join satan in that punishent by following him, yet God did not Creat mankind for hell either. He created him for a relationship, man rebelled God did not,

In Christianity the central point is the death ,burial and resurrection.

In Calvinism the central point is Total inability.

Christianity can exist without the Doctrine of ' Total inability ' , because its not the central point of christianity .

Calvinism cannot exist without the Doctrine of ' Total Inability ' .

This is the issue . This is why ' Total inability ' is the main topic in calvinsm . Everything is tied to it and dependant on it .

Christianity however . The main topic and as it should be, is the death , burial and resurrection.

I like the way you deny biblical concepts carelessly, without even looking in to them

Read Ephesians 3:1-11. Particularly verse 11

Ephesians 3:11. This was in accordance with His Eternal purpose which He carried out in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Unbiblical? Not so.

And did you not see the Omniscience passage in Isaiah 41:21-24? Read it with understanding.

Had this very same conversation with another Brother here a few weeks back. Nothing wrong with agreeing to disagree, but when the insults and childish behavior is displayed for all to see, it must have a negative impact on any seeking. Left this site myself for a few years because of it, and folk may not realize, but for some, this is the only fellowship they have. It is a real shame that this same horse has been beaten for months now, and so many threads about it. And not one single mind has been changed . Not to mention those booted because of their passion. Jesus can not be pleased. As said in another post, had to hit my knees and ask God to forgive me for some of my replies and comments, because they were not with love nor edification. Absolutely refuse to let myself be drawn into that behavior ever again.

God Bless, Brother!!

How about Revelation 22;17

Rev. 22:17.

Who in the world told you that the Son draws people independantly of the Spirit anyways?

The main topic is the death, burial, and resurrection, because number one Christ brought Glory to God and number two He brought redemption for us by doing for us what we could not do for ourselves.

Jesus .
"And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me."

17¶And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.?
This is not saying everyone hears this Audibly in their ears . its a declaration of truth .A person reads this and sees the invitation or hears this letter read to them . We only have a verse which says after the cross the Son draws . Never the Father or the Holy Spirit . Its theological systems that say otherwise and some church sermons .

I dont disagree . But Calvinsims main central meme is the T .

No one is saying God doesn't have eternal purposes . What I'm saying is what God has purposed and that is 1 cor 1.21 and After that Eph 1.13-14 amoung other things . I look for what the bible says He has done ( inductive METHOD)and not use inductive reasoning to declare what God has not said he has done .

Yes. Jesus draws through the Spirit and the Gospel. Rev 22:17.

Jesus speaks through the Spirit. And the Spirit speaks through Jesus. For example, in Revelation 2-3, it is Jesus speaking, yet He says repeatedly, “Hear what the Spirit is saying”.

You cannot divide the Trinity.

Jesus equated “drawing” with hearing and learning from the Father. Yet the Father speaks through His Spirit and He spoke through the Son. You cannot say Father or Jesus is speaking, but the Spirit is not speaking. That’s ludicrous

Jesus is speaking in Rev chapters 2-3, yet He says “ hear what the Spirit is saying to the seven churches”

I can’t believe you’re debating this.