When are we saved ?

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BenjaminN

Well-known member
Oct 7, 2020
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Halleluyah! Saved by grace, through faith, for good works. - Maybe needs a bit more clarity.

I don't think that is promoting the truth in the Gospel. Think about it
Halleluyah! Saved by grace, through faith, for good works, prepared by God.

Ephesians 2 (ESV)

8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. ... 10 ... for good works, which God prepared
 

14meatcc

Active member
Feb 17, 2020
154
86
28
San Diego
Halleluyah! Saved by grace, through faith, for good works. - Maybe needs a bit more clarity.



Halleluyah! Saved by grace, through faith, for good works, prepared by God.

Ephesians 2 (ESV)

8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. ... 10 ... for good works, which God prepared
You didn't finish the rest of the scripture....and that NOT OF YOURSELVES, it is the gift of God.
So, is the scripture saying that your faith is the gift of God, or your salvation is the gift from God?
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
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Today, as always, throughout the ages, we are and were:

Saved by grace.

paul washer
But who's faith is referenced in Eph 2:8? It is by the faith of Jesus Christ, Gal 2:16. The natural man's faith is in mankind, and his accomplishments. Spiritual faith is a fruit of the Holy Spirit, and comes with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit in regeneration.
Your assuming 'total inability from birth is true. ' Man when confronted with his drug addiction recognise his need for help . Man can realise his need for God in light of Gods revalation to him ,especially on hearing the power of God unto Salvation, the gospel. Don't tell people they cannot believe the Gospel. This is actually hindering the gospel and working against God..You do not want to work against God .
 

BenjaminN

Well-known member
Oct 7, 2020
1,504
307
83
You didn't finish the rest of the scripture....and that NOT OF YOURSELVES, it is the gift of God.
So, is the scripture saying that your faith is the gift of God, or your salvation is the gift from God?
Halleluyah! Saved by grace, through faith (the gift of God), for good works (prepared by God).


Ephesians 2 (ESV)


8 For by grace you have been saved through faith... the gift of God, ... for good works, which God prepared ...

The scripture says faith is the gift of God, and our good works is the preparation of God, and the elect's salvation is solely by God's grace - bestowed upon whom he had chosen since before the start of creation.
 

BenjaminN

Well-known member
Oct 7, 2020
1,504
307
83
I understand that . But today we are not saved by anything other than believing the gospel. The Gospel that involves what happened not before the cross .
We are not saved by ANYTHING we DO, whether it being works or faith in believing something, which requires cognitive reasoning, which is also work.

God's chosen covenant people have been saved since eternity, BY HIS GRACE (faith as a gift from God, and works as prepared by God follows salvation - faith and works is the result of us having been saved by God's grace).
 

BenjaminN

Well-known member
Oct 7, 2020
1,504
307
83
paul washer

Your assuming 'total inability from birth is true. ' Man when confronted with his drug addiction recognise his need for help . Man can realise his need for God in light of Gods revalation to him ,especially on hearing the power of God unto Salvation, the gospel. Don't tell people they cannot believe the Gospel. This is actually hindering the gospel and working against God..You do not want to work against God .
If the Spirit of God does not help us to fight our addictions (sins), it is a sign that God is not drawing the sinner closer to Him. Beware of the spirit of lawlessness (ill discipline) - it is not of God, it is of the anti-Messiah.


2 Thessalonians 2 (ESV)


7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work. Only he who now restrains it will do so until he is out of the way. 8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will kill with the breath of his mouth and bring to nothing by the appearance of his coming.

By God's grace, we will conquer our addictions if we persevere.


2 Peter 2 (ESV)


1 But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction. 2 And many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of truth will be blasphemed.


2 Peter 3 (ESV)


9 The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance. 10 But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the heavenly bodies will be burned up and dissolved, and the earth and the works that are done on it will be exposed.

Repentance is a continual proses of sanctification.
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
We are not saved by ANYTHING we DO, whether it being works or faith in believing something, which requires cognitive reasoning, which is also work.

God's chosen covenant people have been saved since eternity, BY HIS GRACE (faith as a gift from God, and works as prepared by God follows salvation - faith and works is the result of us having been saved by God's grace).
The bible is clear . Faith is not a work .
26To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.
27¶Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.
28Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
If the Spirit of God does not help us to fight our addictions (sins), it is a sign that God is not drawing the sinner closer to Him. Beware of the spirit of lawlessness (ill discipline) - it is not of God, it is of the anti-Messiah.


2 Thessalonians 2 (ESV)


7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work. Only he who now restrains it will do so until he is out of the way. 8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will kill with the breath of his mouth and bring to nothing by the appearance of his coming.

By God's grace, we will conquer our addictions if we persevere.


2 Peter 2 (ESV)


1 But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction. 2 And many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of truth will be blasphemed.


2 Peter 3 (ESV)


9 The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance. 10 But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the heavenly bodies will be burned up and dissolved, and the earth and the works that are done on it will be exposed.

Repentance is a continual proses of sanctification.
Are you a Calvinist?
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
Choose and elect means the same thing
Depends on which systematic is using those words . The reformed mean something entirely different when they throw around those terms . Which comes from Augustines gnosctism. Its traced back to him. People say " but I've never read his works ,or calvins " . My advice would be to do so . To trace back these concepts which only came about in the 4th century.
 

BenjaminN

Well-known member
Oct 7, 2020
1,504
307
83
Are you a Calvinist?
If you want to make me an "-ist", you can make me an Abrahamist - a child of God's eternal covenant with the men God chosen. Through Abraham all the nations of the world came to be blessed - as Yeshua ha'Mashiach / Jesus the Messiah came for all the chosen, dispersed peoples of God among all the nations of the world.
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
If the Spirit of God does not help us to fight our addictions (sins), it is a sign that God is not drawing the sinner closer to Him. Beware of the spirit of lawlessness (ill discipline) - it is not of God, it is of the anti-Messiah.


2 Thessalonians 2 (ESV)


7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work. Only he who now restrains it will do so until he is out of the way. 8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will kill with the breath of his mouth and bring to nothing by the appearance of his coming.

By God's grace, we will conquer our addictions if we persevere.


2 Peter 2 (ESV)


1 But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction. 2 And many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of truth will be blasphemed.


2 Peter 3 (ESV)


9 The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance. 10 But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the heavenly bodies will be burned up and dissolved, and the earth and the works that are done on it will be exposed.

Repentance is a continual proses of sanctification.
2 thes is about the whole world being restraint from its completely abandonment, not believers who might be struggling in areas.

2 peter 2 is about false teachers .

2 peter 3 is about the whole world , everyone.

I agree as believers we should continuously be renewed in our minds . But you seem to be preaching Lordship salvation nonsense.
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
If you want to make me an "-ist", you can make me an Abrahamist - a child of God's eternal covenant with the men God chosen. Through Abraham all the nations of the world came to be blessed - as Yeshua ha'Mashiach / Jesus the Messiah came for all the chosen, dispersed peoples of God among all the nations of the world.
Jesus came to the Lost sheep of the house of Israel . Are you a ' hebrew roots ' ist .?
 

14meatcc

Active member
Feb 17, 2020
154
86
28
San Diego
Halleluyah! Saved by grace, through faith (the gift of God), for good works (prepared by God).


Ephesians 2 (ESV)


8 For by grace you have been saved through faith... the gift of God, ... for good works, which God prepared ...

The scripture says faith is the gift of God, and our good works is the preparation of God, and the elect's salvation is solely by God's grace - bestowed upon whom he had chosen since before the start of creation.
Awesome. Revealed by the spirit of truth.
 

14meatcc

Active member
Feb 17, 2020
154
86
28
San Diego
Wisdom tells me that the Pauline Doctrine of Justification Solely by Faith is the correct Doctrine for the Gospel.
 

throughfaith

Well-known member
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
Halleluyah! Saved by grace, through faith (the gift of God), for good works (prepared by God).


Ephesians 2 (ESV)


8 For by grace you have been saved through faith... the gift of God, ... for good works, which God prepared ...

The scripture says faith is the gift of God, and our good works is the preparation of God, and the elect's salvation is solely by God's grace - bestowed upon whom he had chosen since before the start of creation.
Faith is not the gift in eph 2 . Salvation is the free gift . Faith is the prerequisite.