Whats your spiritual gift?

The older I get the more I disagree and understand that those who believe the initial evidence is only tongues will never reach the point of spiritual maturity they need to.

I don't believe that. In the modern church, regardless of its pentecostal afilliation, is not rediscovering anything within the movement. If anything, they are adding in things that are destructive, such as yoga meditation. This is in some of the ranks of the AOG right now. Phraseologies such as "pray in your prayer language" , or "put your praise on" like they are supposed to use these gifts and abilities on command. That attitude in & of itself is NOT walking in the Spirit. Those who use them this way display arrogance & authority, instead of humility & meekness. They forget important phrases like "walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fufill the lusts of the flesh", & "And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues as the Spirit gave them utterance." (Acts 2:4)

Most tongues in the 1906 revival in AzuzaStreet were actual languages, such as Spanish & German.

This isn't the only shameful group.

It's in their statements, but it shouldn't be. The reason is the same as the problem in the church in Corinth. They were "using" their "gifts" for personal gratification, rather than building up the body in love & maturity.

Many of today's pentecostals are practicing the "fake it till you make it" with tongues because tongues is the easiest gift to fake & most of their "interpretations" are so positive they could have been copied from Lakewood Church. Tongues is used also because it edifies self above all other gifts. It's become the "I've got it therefore I've arrived" attitude. In the modern church, those who use such fakery becomes a false prophet & will receive a false prophet's judgment.

I don't mean to sound like a killjoy, but it's just that bad, & getting worse because we are so close to the tribulation.

The predominant thing in the Pentecostal movement is the Falling Away, just as it is for every christian denomination.

Or. most of them are not faking anything and that is why their life is so different and their ministry is so different. I see a huge difference in the preaching, teaching and ministries of those who claim to be baptized in the Holy Spirit and speak in tongues. They are not elitist or proud or think they are better Christians, they simply are experiencing the benefits of the Gifts of the Spirit for ministry and power to be witnesses which is why the Baptism of the Holy Spirit was given.

There is such a major difference when being at a service where the preachers is baptized in the Holy Spirit and prays in tongues often and those who reject these doctrines. They may have intellect and accurate teachings but there is something missing. The Power Of GOD. This will be the case until Jesus comes back. It is not a salvation issue.

It is telling however that those who are baptized in the Holy Ghost and speak in tongues have great love for their brothers who do not and do not condemn them as false christians or false prophets for their opinions, but often those who are skeptics accuse the ones who speak in tongues as fakers and false prophets. This lack of love demonstrates who is more likely to be in darkness on the subject.

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The information you seek is located back in post No.23
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I agree with what 1 Corinthians chapter 2 says, but you didn't say what it says. You keep saying that someone who is lead by the Spirit is not qualified to be a teacher. 1 Cor. 2 says the opposite.

How an audience receives the word of God isn't related to how effective a teacher is. Jesus says that the word falls on good soil, stoney ground, among thorns, or by the wayside. We may plant and water but only God gives the increase.

No amount of seminary or Bible knowledge can change how someone receives the Word. In my estimation, shunning a "Spirit led" Bible study demonstrates a level of callousness to the Bible.

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Off the top of my head? Well; my first guess would be fear.

• Jas 3:1 . . Not many of you should presume to be teachers, my brothers,
because you know that we who teach will be judged more strictly.

The US Army taught my unit some basic mountaineering skills; so when our
son took up rock climbing some years ago he asked me to show him how to
tie a Swiss seat, which is a rudimentary rope harness. I declined because
were my son to fall to his death or be crippled for life due to my instructions,
it would be something I could not live with; and what would I say to his
mother?

I should think that the greatest concern common to all of Christ's God-given
teachers is that of leading his sheep astray just as I feared leading our son
astray.

There are Christians out there who tell me that they can hardly wait to meet.
Christ and thank him for what he did for them. As for me: I dread meeting
Christ because of the sit-down he and I are sure to have face-to-face
wherein he will want to hear my excuse for all the bologna that I posted on
internet forums.
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I think the context of James 3 is saying that the tongue is hard to control and when teaching it is possible to misspeak. Because we are attempting to lead others we are judged more strictly [by other people] because we're setting an example.

We see all the time that people are trying to find ways to find others in a contradiction or bad theology in a message board. Once the words are posted they can be scrutinized forever. We are judged and judge others, more strictly, attempting to teach; there isn't a separate judgement for teachers at God's judgement.

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According to my understanding of 1Cor 3:8-15, Jesus' saved followers are on
track to undergo Christ's scrutiny one at a time, i.e. on an individual basis; and
in regard to how well and/or how poorly they put their gift to work building
and/or not building upon his foundation.
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I never said they wrote a weekly sermon; I used a modern application to illustrated one example of a person who has the gift and calling as a teacher. If you haven't noticed yet, they met daily in each other's homes, and weekly in the synagogue, which is where we get the weekly corporate patter of gathering from (Acts 13:14, 15:21, 18:4).
The question I was responding to was not in reference to the mere fellowship of the saints. It was in reference to the gift of teaching, and by implication, the subject of teachers. After all, that is one of the main reasons the Holy Spirit installed the "overseers" (Elders) within the body. They are appointed as the guardians and teachers of the Word.
All believers are called to "teach one another with psalms hymns and spiritual songs" (Col 3:16), yet "Not many of you should be teachers" (Jam 3:1). Obviously, there is a difference between teaching formally and informally. The gift of teaching is for those who are appointed by the will of the Holy Spirit (1 Cor 12:11), to be teachers and teach the body formally.
"Remember your leaders, those who spoke the Word of God to you...imitate their faith" (Heb 13:7), i.e. "pastors and teachers" (Eph 4:11).

I like your response but I would like to ask what you mean by preaching the word.

When you take things out of context you get a pretext. It says they met with the church and taught a great number of people. It doesn't say they prepared a sermon every Sunday. it does not say HOW they taught the people. There was no New Testament to prepare from. All they had was experience and if you were a devout Jew, the Old Testament.

The way we do it today is NOT the way they did it then. No where is it recorded that they had a band that played songs which they sang to. No where is it recorded that they had a sip of wine and bit of bread during the meeting. No where is it recorded that a "Pastor" preached a sermon. Nowhere is it recorded that they passed round a plate or bag to collect money. No where is it recorded that some of the leaders dressed up in fancy garb. No where is it recorded that some bloke in a dress swung a load of incense to make the place smell nice. No where is it recorded that they baptised infants. No where is it recorded that they had hymn books.

Need I go on????

Teaching can be a gift and a calling. Sometimes people have the gift and the calling to teach. Other times, they only have the gift and are meant to use it informally, rather than preparing a weekly sermon (which takes a lot of time to prepare).

I never said they wrote a weekly sermon....

...rather than preparing a weekly sermon....

I did learn teaching several years ago doing TESOL I also have helped out teaching Bibles in schools.
The way teachers are taught to teach there are different pedagogies. One thing is to do a lesson plan.
The other is to involve your students doing different activities.
Its not just chalk and talk. That is old school!

The other thing is some teachers go by the book. like a teachers manual, You are meant to teach this and this content in a lesson. The content is given in the manual, but you are free to improvise HOW you teach that content. A good teacher will reach out to their students.

A lazy teacher (and I have seen a few) do not really instruct students to do anything. They just talk and do not really involve their students in the lesson. it just ends up boring and uninspired. People can and do learn by rote, but, its hard for them to stay motivated.

I think teaching is a gift, not everyone can do it well.

Jesus was an amazing teacher, He still is, but you read the gospels and examine how he taught His disciples. You will learn a lot.

Write/prepare...basically, they virtually mean the same thing. When you write a sermon, you are preparing a sermon.

What is your response to my comment about elders and the formal teaching of the Word?

If you tell me what the comment was I will be able to say something.

Write/prepare doers not necesssaairly mean the same thing. You can write a sermon without preparing. I Remember one church I preached in and my sermon? was "In the beginning God." No preparation, nothing. I stood and allowed the Holy Spirit to direct every word I said. Afterwards the pastor told me that was the best sermon he had ever heard on the subject of holiness.

Sure, here is what we said:

it seems to me that your response shows you are all over the place when it comes to the subject of teaching and teachers and the main thing it shows is that you do not have the gift of teaching and in trying to teach you are stepping outside your boundary.

A teacher knows a teacher when he meets one. I have been trained in University to teach and I have been given an annointing to teach in the body of Christ. You might say that I am saturated in the act of teaching both in training and experience. At the same time my genre of books I read are generally those that teach. That is why I have over 1,000 books in my personal library as a teacher has a thirst for knowledge.

I am grateful that I have had the priviledge to be taught by one of the greatest teachers of the modern era, Derek Prince. year after year after year I have sat under his tutalage and have learnt things I have never heard from anyone else.

The main reason the Holy Spirit appointed Elders in the church is to oversee, shepherd, teach and discipline. Not all Elders did all four but if they taught they were coinsidered worthy of double honour which does not mean more money because if that were the case we have to pay Jesus because it says we honour him and it is the same word in the greek.

If you use the modern day church to be your standard for these things you are totally up the creek without a paddle because the church today is nothing like the church in the New Testament. Today, we have abandoned the word of God for denominational dictates.

For example nowhere in the New Testament is a pastor appoined to lead a church. It was ALWAYS a plurality of Elders. ALWAYS.

Nowhere is a man brought in from outside the church to lead the church as Paul's letter to Timothy makes abundantly clear.

You said "The gift of teaching does not enable the teacher to understand or interpret the Bible better." A comment like that shows very clearly you do not have the gift of teaching and because you don't have the gift of teaching, it does not qualify you to make staements like that.

The gift of teaching is given by the ascended Christ, not the Holy Spirit. (Ephesians 4:11.)

As for the formal teaching of the word it depends on what you mean by formal?

There is nowhere in Ephesians 4:11 that says those ministries are leaders of the church. And if you have the gift you have the calling the same as with the other ministries. God does not endow with gifts just to tickle ones fancy.

A teacher is not called to be a pastor. That is a modern invention of denominations. The character and demeanor of a teacher does not suit them to be pastors because their temperament is quite different. In a church I started up I did not appoint anyone to anything. I let the Holy Spirit set aside various people for various ministries. I am a teacher, not a pastor, but we did have a man who was obviously a pastor so he got on and did the job. I didn't have to say anything.

Yes, I am in complete agreement. The senior pastor is not a Biblically-appointed office. I never said it was.
Yes, I am clarifying that the Bible doesn't teach this, however, many have assumed it to be the case.
Do you have any Biblical support for the gift of teaching enabling the teacher to interpret the Bible better?
The "gift of teaching" is not mentioned in Eph 4.
Romans 12 and 1 Corinthians 12 speak of gifts given to believers.
Ephesians 4:7 speaks more of gifted believers given to the church.
(i.e. certain believers who fill those offices are themselves, the gifts, so to speak. These "gifts" {the believers who fill these offices} are given to the body by Christ Himself). Eph 4 touches on the subject of teachers not the subject of teaching.

“Now there are varieties of gifts, but the same Spirit.” (1 Corinthians 12:4, NASB95)
“But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually just as He wills.” (1 Corinthians 12:11, NASB95)
They are even called "gifts of the Holy Spirit" in Heb 2.

"Formal" is something that should be given special attention to. God sees the office of the teacher as something that we should give special attention to, otherwise, He would have not told us about it.
Clearly, there are different levels of teaching because all believers are called to "teach one another" (Col 3:16), yet "Not many of you should be teachers" (Jam 3:1); All are not teachers, are they? (1 Cor 13:28).
Obviously, there is a difference between teaching and being a teacher.

Who are the leaders of the church? = "those who speak the word of God" (Hebrews 13:7)
Who speaks the Word to the church? = Overseers (Elders, 1 Tim 3)
Who are the ones who are skilled in teaching? = Elders (1 Tim 3:2, 5:17)
Who equips certain believers to become teachers? = The Holy Spirit (1 Cor 12:11)
Who ultimately makes and establishes overseers? = the Holy Spirit (Acts 20:28)

Conclusion: The gift of teaching is for those who are appointed by the will of the Holy Spirit to be teachers and teach the body in a different sense than the general teaching that all believers are called to do among one another.

I am not responding to any ad hominems...What is your Biblical defense?

And I never said you said it was as that is the first time a senior pastor has been mentioned.

Anyone who has a gift of any kind always does it better than those who do not have the gift. Derek Prince was exceptional in his teaching because he was gifted by the risen Christ to do just that.

Splitting hairs. It is obvious that ther gift of a teacher is obviously teaching is it not? if I am gifted as a teacher, it is clear that I will do teaching, not evangelism.

Eph 4:8 Because of this, He says, "Having gone up on high, He led captivity captive," and gave "gifts to men." Psa. 68:18

Eph 4:11 Christ chose some of us to be apostles, prophets, missionaries, pastors, and teachers,

Eph 4:11 And he gave some to be, (Jesus) apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;

No mention of the Holy Spirit.

I don't see why you are bringing this up. I already agreed with this in my original post:
It's called "rightly dividing the Word of truth" (2 Tim 3:15).
The Holy Spirit isn't mentioned because these are not the gifts of the Spirit (Rom 12, 1 Cor 12)...these are the gifts of the Son (the gifts of the Son are the people who equip the body for the work of the ministry).
I already explained this with the Biblical data:
You may have never noticed this distinction before. I am happy to point it out. If you disagree with the Biblical explanation of these differences, I am willing to listen to any Biblical response if you can identify one.
Again, I am here to discuss the Bible, not our opinions or what other people have told us. I would love to continue if you can bring a Biblical defense to the data I have presented.