predestination vs freewill

Maybe you can ask God about why you need to tell forums that Angels and Lucifer are "sons of God".

Only those that Christ died for

Because it’s the truth. Angels are sons of God.

Christ on the Cross is not just given to the French and the Italians and the Germans, but not the Americans or the Hungarians or the Chinese.

So, see how STUPID that is, to think that?
That is your theology.

"God does not offer the Cross to everyone".............

Read John 3:16

Read this verse....."If I Jesus, be lifted up on the Cross, i will draw ALL MEN TO ME">

Your Cross rejecting hyper calvinism, DENIES Christ's Words.

The sacrifice of Jesus was offered to God, for God's acceptance, not to mankind for mankind's acception.

ob 1:6 KJV Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them.

Let me explain this to you..

The bible is TRUTH, yet, it can be "wrongly divided". This means you can misunderstand verses, and this causes you to believe wrong.
So, in that condition, you are theologically confused.
What happens next is that if this is not corrected you will become locked into this theological confusion as your FAITH, which then causes you to become a deceived HERETIC.

I never said that regeneration is something we do. I still don’t see anywhere in the scripture where one is born again before they believe on the gospel. Read the following.

Nicodemus was not born again in John 3.

Jesus said the Spirit of truth was dwelling WITH believers in John 14 and WOULD BE ( future tense) in them. The Spirit in dwelling in the sense that He would be in and abide in and baptize believers into Christ would not come before the blood of the New Covenant was shed and until Christ was also GLORIFED.

John 7 said the Holy Spirit had not yet given. (John 7:39).

The Spirit of Truth was dwelling with believers in John 14. There were instances when the Spirit would be upon believers. He would be in them and would dwell in them forever after Jesus was glorified.

Regeneration can only mean importation of new life , a spiritual resurrection as a precursor to our future bodily resurrections, earnest of our inheritance.

Being born of the Spirit, born again happens when the Spirit indwells a believer forever. According to Jesus’ Words, this gift was not given until after He was glorified.

The Spirit was given and rested upon men as the fulfilled a specific office in the Old Covenant. NICODEMUS WAS still under the old covenant, for the blood of the New Covenant had not been shed

As well, the prophets said that one of the marks of the New Covenanant would be that God would write His Law on our hearts and put His Spirit to live in us forever. This is the New Covenant in Jesus blood, that was ratified by His blood and consummated on the day of Pentecost

Yes thank you Icedaisey, I did see that verse, but I don't think it informs that Satan was a son of God but rather that he wasn't. I think the "also" and "them" sets him apart from the others in it: he came with them, but the those two words separates him from them. Had he been one of them, that distinction wouldn't have been necessary.

What you are describing in the paragraphs that start with “ I know someone who thinks”…splounds like Cerenthius or adoptionism, which I reject.

But chapters like John 1, Johnny 17, and the baptism accounts show a clear distinction between persons in the Godhead.

God the Father.
Jesus the Word, and Only Begotten.

That's 2.

Now add the Holy Spirit.

That's 3.

Yes.

Let me explain this to you..

The bible is TRUTH, yet, it can be "wrongly divided". This means you can misunderstand verses, and this causes you to believe wrong.
So, in that condition, you are theologically confused.
What happens next is that if this is not corrected you will become locked into this theological confusion as your FAITH, which then causes you to become a deceived HERETIC.

Because it’s the truth. Angels are sons of God.


Angels, sons of God can be cast down to hell, for disobedience.


This is the warning from the Apostle Peter.



For if God did not spare the angels who sinned, but cast them down to hell and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved for judgment;
2 Peter 2:4




The point: sons of God are not exempt from going to hell.



For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning. For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them. But it has happened to them according to the true proverb: “A dog returns to his own vomit,” and, “a sow, having washed, to her wallowing in the mire.” 2 Peter 2:20-22

• For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them.

JPT

It doesn't say a thing in the NT about human freewill{Will we r all bond by something our job our loved ones our physical limitations.[he that sins is a slave to sin ]{It's implied not said out right,that is we have choices to make.}I think that you r defineing that sound very narrowly an maybe not considering what that sound means to the other person

1. The human will regarded as free from restraints,compulsions,or any antecedent conditions;freedom of decision or choice.
2. The doctrine that people have this:as opposed to determinism.

I am somewhat dumbfounded by your insistence of a verse that says we are born again before we understand the Gospel. Many things that believers have come to know, is a culmination of verses that help paint a particular conclusion. This is spiritual discernment. If I insisted on a verse of Scripture to prove many Truths, I would still be in the dark about a great many things. For instance:

1) Show me a verse of Scripture that says that God is a Triune God. Triune is not in Scripture.
2) Show me a verse of Scripture that says Christ was the God-man.
3) Show me a verse of Scripture that says there is going to be a Rapture. Rapture is not in Scripture.

See my point? Many things we know because we discern them from many verses, OT and NT alike.

I don't know why you remarked on Nicodemus in John3, I never said he was saved or a present believer. Indeed he was rebuked by Christ because of his lack of knowledge about the new birth because he was supposed to be a teacher of Israel. I am beginning to think you are not giving my posts a careful read and due consideration.

I gave a clear and concise explanation of what Regeneration was and was not, yet you then brought up the subject of the indwelling of the Spirit. What does this have to do with the new birth? The indwelling of the Spirit, in believers, is unique to the church age, as you pointed out; however, the indwelling of the Spirit is a completely different subject and has nothing to do with the new birth. Once again I say, the new birth is a work of the Holy Spirit upon the elect individual, at the appropriate time appointed by the Lord. This takes a spiritually dead person and breaths life into their spirit. Now possessing a living, working spirit, that person can hear and be effected by the Gospel message. The indwelling of the Spirit comes when the person believes upon Jesus Christ and they are then sealed. One must make the proper distinction between Regeneration and Conversion - Regeneration enables Conversion but Regeneration is not Conversion.

Then you brought up Pentecost. The Holy Spirit came not only to dwell in believers but also to empower the young Church. Everyone who was in the room, as a believer, had already been regenerated, otherwise they would have not been true believers. Christ gave the disciples a foretaste of this coming event in John 20:22.

It seems to me that you are mixing up terminologies. Regeneration is one act, indwelling is another act, sealing is yet another act, just as being Baptized in the Spirit, is still another act. Baptism in the Spirit is a collective act and is not done on Individuals. The Jews were baptized first, then the Gentiles. But this is getting off topic.

Regeneration or being born again, is the work of the Holy Spirit upon whom He was sent. When the person is born again, they are "passive" according to the "voice" of the Greek word. This means they are the recipients of the Birth but in no way had any part to play in it. The Holy Spirit acts upon the individual and what God sends is received. An individual so acted upon, could no more stop it from happening, than they could leap from the earth to the moon. This is God's Sovereign act of Election being poured out upon the individual in time.

If you do not believe that regeneration comes before hearing the Gospel, then you are left with one difficult problem. I pose it as a question that I would like for you to answer.

When the Gospel is preached to a large group, what is the determiner that makes some believe, while others do not? In other words, why is the Gospel "effectual" in some and falls upon deft ears in others?

Now possessing a living, working spirit, that person can hear and be effected by the Gospel message. The indwelling of the Spirit comes when the person believes upon Jesus Christ and they are then sealed.

verses you asked for.

1. Matthew 28:19

2. John 1:14.

3. 1 Thess 4:17.

I will now read the rest of your post.

I am somewhat dumbfounded by your insistence of a verse that says we are born again before we understand the Gospel. Many things that believers have come to know, is a culmination of verses that help paint a particular conclusion. This is spiritual discernment. If I insisted on a verse of Scripture to prove many Truths, I would still be in the dark about a great many things. For instance:

1) Show me a verse of Scripture that says that God is a Triune God. Triune is not in Scripture.
2) Show me a verse of Scripture that says Christ was the God-man.
3) Show me a verse of Scripture that says there is going to be a Rapture. Rapture is not in Scripture.

See my point? Many things we know because we discern them from many verses, OT and NT alike.

I don't know why you remarked on Nicodemus in John3, I never said he was saved or a present believer. Indeed he was rebuked by Christ because of his lack of knowledge about the new birth because he was supposed to be a teacher of Israel. I am beginning to think you are not giving my posts a careful read and due consideration.

I gave a clear and concise explanation of what Regeneration was and was not, yet you then brought up the subject of the indwelling of the Spirit. What does this have to do with the new birth? The indwelling of the Spirit, in believers, is unique to the church age, as you pointed out; however, the indwelling of the Spirit is a completely different subject and has nothing to do with the new birth. Once again I say, the new birth is a work of the Holy Spirit upon the elect individual, at the appropriate time appointed by the Lord. This takes a spiritually dead person and breaths life into their spirit. Now possessing a living, working spirit, that person can hear and be effected by the Gospel message. The indwelling of the Spirit comes when the person believes upon Jesus Christ and they are then sealed. One must make the proper distinction between Regeneration and Conversion - Regeneration enables Conversion but Regeneration is not Conversion.

Then you brought up Pentecost. The Holy Spirit came not only to dwell in believers but also to empower the young Church. Everyone who was in the room, as a believer, had already been regenerated, otherwise they would have not been true believers. Christ gave the disciples a foretaste of this coming event in John 20:22.

It seems to me that you are mixing up terminologies. Regeneration is one act, indwelling is another act, sealing is yet another act, just as being Baptized in the Spirit, is still another act. Baptism in the Spirit is a collective act and is not done on Individuals. The Jews were baptized first, then the Gentiles. But this is getting off topic.

Regeneration or being born again, is the work of the Holy Spirit upon whom He was sent. When the person is born again, they are "passive" according to the "voice" of the Greek word. This means they are the recipients of the Birth but in no way had any part to play in it. The Holy Spirit acts upon the individual and what God sends is received. An individual so acted upon, could no more stop it from happening, than they could leap from the earth to the moon. This is God's Sovereign act of Election being poured out upon the individual in time.

If you do not believe that regeneration comes before hearing the Gospel, then you are left with one difficult problem. I pose it as a question that I would like for you to answer.

When the Gospel is preached to a large group, what is the determiner that makes some believe, while others do not? In other words, why is the Gospel "effectual" in some and falls upon deft ears in others?

Mat. 28:19 - mentions the three persons of the Godhead but it does not say that God is a trinity or triune. I could conclude from this verse alone, that God is three gods. It says nothing about them being one. to make my point, where is the word trinity or triune found in this verse? Your not following my argument.

John 1:14 - says nothing about Jesus being the God-man.

1 Th, 4:17 - does not have any mention of a Rapture.

This is my entire point. You cannot find these things in black and white in the Scriptures but yet, we know them to be true. We discern them by comparing spiritual things with spiritual things. Verses with other verses. So you are not going to find a verse that teaches Spirit regeneration in one particular verse - it is gleamed from throughout the Bible by weaving together the verses.