Christian Zionism

Jesus said He came to the Jews first. and Paul the Apostle wrote in Romans Chapter 11 acomplete answer to your objection.


Romans 11
New King James Version

Israel’s Rejection Not Total
11 I say then, has God cast away His people? Certainly not! For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin. 2 God has not cast away His people whom He foreknew. Or do you not know what the Scripture says of Elijah, how he pleads with God against Israel, saying, 3 “Lord, they have killed Your prophets and torn down Your altars, and I alone am left, and they seek my life”? 4 But what does the divine response say to him? “I have reserved for Myself seven thousand men who have not bowed the knee to Baal.” 5 Even so then, at this present time there is a remnant according to the election of grace. 6 And if by grace, then it is no longer of works; otherwise grace is no longer grace. [a]But if it is of works, it is no longer grace; otherwise work is no longer work.
7 What then? Israel has not obtained what it seeks; but the elect have obtained it, and the rest were blinded. 8 Just as it is written:
“God has given them a spirit of stupor,
Eyes that they should not see
And ears that they should not hear,
To this very day.”
9 And David says:
“Let their table become a snare and a trap,
A stumbling block and a recompense to them.
10 Let their eyes be darkened, so that they do not see,
And bow down their back always.”
Israel’s Rejection Not Final
11 I say then, have they stumbled that they should fall? Certainly not! But through their [b]fall, to provoke them to jealousy, salvation has come to the Gentiles. 12 Now if their [c]fall is riches for the world, and their failure riches for the Gentiles, how much more their fullness!
13 For I speak to you Gentiles; inasmuch as I am an apostle to the Gentiles, I magnify my ministry, 14 if by any means I may provoke to jealousy those who are my flesh and save some of them. 15 For if their being cast away is the reconciling of the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead?
16 For if the firstfruit is holy, the lump is also holy; and if the root is holy, so are the branches. 17 And if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive tree, were grafted in among them, and with them became a partaker of the root and [d]fatness of the olive tree, 18 do not boast against the branches. But if you do boast, remember that you do not support the root, but the root supports you.
19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off that I might be grafted in.” 20 Well said. Because of unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by faith. Do not be haughty, but fear. 21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, He may not spare you either. 22 Therefore consider the goodness and severity of God: on those who fell, severity; but toward you, [e]goodness, if you continue in His goodness. Otherwise you also will be cut off. 23 And they also, if they do not continue in unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again. 24 For if you were cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and were grafted contrary to nature into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these, who are natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree?
25 For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own [f]opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. 26 And so all Israel will be [g]saved, as it is written:
“The Deliverer will come out of Zion,
And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;
27 For this is My covenant with them,
When I take away their sins.”
28 Concerning the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the election they are beloved for the sake of the fathers. 29 For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. 30 For as you were once disobedient to God, yet have now obtained mercy through their disobedience, 31 even so these also have now been disobedient, that through the mercy shown you they also may obtain mercy. 32 For God has [h]committed them all to disobedience, that He might have mercy on all.
33 Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and His ways past finding out!
34 “For who has known the mind of the Lord?
Or who has become His counselor?”
35 “Or who has first given to Him
And it shall be repaid to him?”
36 For of Him and through Him and to Him are all things, to whom be glory forever. Amen.

There are many thounsands of Messianic Jews that believe in Yeshua Hamashiach/Jesus Christ both here in the USA and Israel and suffer persecution by some Christain Churchs rather than being suppoprted! Why I may ask? Do those "Christians" not believe God does not take note of their actions and will have to answer to Him?

Many that call themselves "Chrsitians" could learn much from these Messianic Jews as the Apostles were also Messianc Jews! The original believers were called members of the " the Way" long before the term "Christian" was ever formed. Remember the churches of Revelation; of which type church do you belong?

If you believe this reasoning you must therefore consider all Talmudic Jews to also from Satan because the Talmud also rejects Jesus' divinity and death on the cross. The depiction of God in the Talmud also contradicts the New Testament. Your attempt to demonize another group would in turn demonize the group you are trying to put on a pedestal and idolize.

Are you aware of the hateful and evil things written in the Talmud? Are you aware that many sects of modern Judaism observe the teachings of the Talmud? The Talmud and the New Testament are not compatible. Reject the Talmud.

Does any of this tell Christians they need to support national Israel? No. My comment stands.

God said HE would do such and such. He didn't tell us that we need to do anything about it. As for "the Jews first", that's done and dusted. God did reach out to the Jews first, and they consistently rejected Him. Those who reject Jesus are themselves rejected. Whatever further reaching out will be done by God Himself. We are called to spread the gospel... to Jews and to every other people group. We are to treat Jews as unsaved, so that they might come to salvation in Christ... there is no other way.

Excellent post and totally correct!

"Islamo-Christian" would be way less offensive and blasphemous than "judeo-christian". At least the muslims think Jesus was a prophet. Jewish Talmud says that Jesus was the lying son of whore who's burning in feces for eternity.

You must have very little understanding of eirther Islam or The Old Testament! LOL! Try reading Romans Chapter 11 prayerfully in as many translations as possible! The Old Testament and the New Testament agree! Jesus and if you accept Islam; you reject Jesus and His Salvation and are not a Christain; quite simple!

Do you not read your Bible?

7 Bible Verses about Prayer For Jerusalem

Source: https://bible.knowing-jesus.com/topics/Prayer-For-Jerusalem

Psalm 122:6
Verse Concepts
Pray for the peace of Jerusalem:
“May they prosper who love you.

Zechariah 12:2-3
“Behold, I am going to make Jerusalem a cup that causes reeling to all the peoples around; and when the siege is against Jerusalem, it will also be against Judah. It will come about in that day that I will make Jerusalem a heavy stone for all the peoples; all who lift it will be severely injured. And all the nations of the earth will be gathered against it.

Joel 2:28-29
“It will come about after this
That I will pour out My Spirit on all mankind;
And your sons and daughters will prophesy,
Your old men will dream dreams,
Your young men will see visions.
“Even on the male and female servants
I will pour out My Spirit in those days.

Zechariah 12:2
Verse Concepts
“Behold, I am going to make Jerusalem a cup that causes reeling to all the peoples around; and when the siege is against Jerusalem, it will also be against Judah.

Romans 9:3-4
For I could wish that I myself were accursed, separated from Christ for the sake of my brethren, my kinsmen according to the flesh, who are Israelites, to whom belongs the adoption as sons, and the glory and the covenants and the giving of the Law and the temple service and the promises,

Romans 10:13-14
for “Whoever will call on the name of the Lord will be saved.” How then will they call on Him in whom they have not believed? How will they believe in Him whom they have not heard? And how will they hear without a preacher?


Romans 11
Amplified Bible, Classic Edition

11 I ask then: Has God totally rejected and disowned His people? Of course not! Why, I myself am an Israelite, a descendant of Abraham, a member of the tribe of Benjamin!
2 No, God has not rejected and disowned His people [whose destiny] He had marked out and appointed and foreknown from the beginning. Do you not know what the Scripture says of Elijah, how he pleads with God against Israel?
3 Lord, they have killed Your prophets; they have demolished Your altars, and I alone am left, and they seek my life.
4 But what is God’s reply to him? I have kept for Myself seven thousand men who have not bowed the knee to Baal!
5 So too at the present time there is a remnant (a small believing minority), selected (chosen) by grace (by God’s unmerited favor and graciousness).
6 But if it is by grace (His unmerited favor and graciousness), it is no longer conditioned on works or anything men have done. Otherwise, grace would no longer be grace [it would be meaningless].
7 What then [shall we conclude]? Israel failed to obtain what it sought [God’s favor by obedience to the Law]. Only the elect (those chosen few) obtained it, while the rest of them became callously indifferent (blinded, hardened, and made insensible to it).
8 As it is written, God gave them a spirit (an attitude) of stupor, eyes that should not see and ears that should not hear, [that has continued] down to this very day.
9 And David says, Let their table (their feasting, banqueting) become a snare and a trap, a pitfall and a [a]just retribution [[b]rebounding like a boomerang upon them];
10 Let their eyes be darkened (dimmed) so that they cannot see, and make them bend their back [stooping beneath their burden] forever.
11 So I ask, Have they stumbled so as to fall [to their utter spiritual ruin, irretrievably]? By no means! But through their false step and transgression salvation [has come] to the Gentiles, so as to arouse Israel [to see and feel what they forfeited] and so to make them jealous.
12 Now if their stumbling (their lapse, their transgression) has so enriched the world [at large], and if [Israel’s] failure means such riches for the Gentiles, think what an enrichment and greater advantage will follow their full reinstatement!
13 But now I am speaking to you who are Gentiles. Inasmuch then as I am an apostle to the Gentiles, I lay great stress on my ministry and magnify my office,
14 In the hope of making my fellow Jews jealous [in order to stir them up to imitate, copy, and appropriate], and thus managing to save some of them.
15 For if their rejection and exclusion from the benefits of salvation were [overruled] for the reconciliation of a world to God, what will their acceptance and admission mean? [It will be nothing short of] life from the dead!
16 Now if the first handful of dough offered as the firstfruits [Abraham and the patriarchs] is consecrated (holy), so is the whole mass [the nation of Israel]; and if the root [Abraham] is consecrated (holy), so are the branches.
17 But if some of the branches were broken off, while you, a wild olive shoot, were grafted in among them to share the richness [of the root and sap] of the olive tree,
18 Do not boast over the branches and pride yourself at their expense. If you do boast and feel superior, remember it is not you that support the root, but the root [that supports] you.
19 You will say then, Branches were broken (pruned) off so that I might be grafted in!
20 That is true. But they were broken (pruned) off because of their unbelief (their lack of real faith), and you are established through faith [because you do believe]. So do not become proud and conceited, but rather stand in awe and be reverently afraid.
21 For if God did not spare the natural branches [because of unbelief], neither will He spare you [if you are guilty of the same offense].
22 Then note and appreciate the gracious kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God’s gracious kindness to you—provided you continue in His grace and abide in His kindness; otherwise you too will be cut off (pruned away).
23 And even those others [the fallen branches, Jews], if they do not persist in [clinging to] their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God has the power to graft them in again.
24 For if you have been cut from what is by nature a wild olive tree, and against nature grafted into a cultivated olive tree, how much easier will it be to graft these natural [branches] back on [the original parent stock of] their own olive tree.
25 Lest you be self-opinionated (wise in your own conceits), I do not want you to miss this hidden truth and mystery, brethren: a hardening (insensibility) has [temporarily] befallen a part of Israel [to last] until the [c]full number of the ingathering of the Gentiles has come in,
26 And so all Israel will be saved. As it is written, The Deliverer will come from Zion, He will banish ungodliness from Jacob.
27 And this will be My covenant (My agreement) with them when I shall take away their sins.
28 From the point of view of the Gospel (good news), they [the Jews, at present] are enemies [of God], which is for your advantage and benefit. But from the point of view of God’s choice (of election, of divine selection), they are still the beloved (dear to Him) for the sake of their forefathers.
29 For God’s gifts and His call are irrevocable. [He never withdraws them when once they are given, and He does not change His mind about those to whom He gives His grace or to whom He sends His call.]
30 Just as you were once disobedient and rebellious toward God but now have obtained [His] mercy, through their disobedience,
31 So they also now are being disobedient [when you are receiving mercy], that they in turn may one day, through the mercy you are enjoying, also receive mercy [that they may share the mercy which has been shown to you—through you as messengers of the Gospel to them].
32 For God has consigned (penned up) all men to disobedience, only that He may have mercy on them all [alike].
33 Oh, the depth of the riches and wisdom and knowledge of God! How unfathomable (inscrutable, unsearchable) are His judgments (His decisions)! And how untraceable (mysterious, undiscoverable) are His ways (His methods, His paths)!
34 For who has known the mind of the Lord and who has understood His thoughts, or who has [ever] been His counselor?
35 Or who has first given God anything that he might be paid back or that he could claim a recompense?
36 For from Him and through Him and to Him are all things. [For all things originate with Him and come from Him; all things live through Him, and all things center in and tend to consummate and to end in Him.] To Him be glory forever! Amen (so be it).

I've got news for a lot of people, God is a Zionist.

Brother, I think you'd agree I've treated you with respect, even though we have strongly disagreed on this subject. On others, we have agreed. But this comment should get you banned. That's how strongly I feel. I won't report it, I would appreciate an apology. But you are way out of line here. And you know it.

You apparent have not read the complete Bible as I have because the Bible tells us specific actions we are to do.

Jesus Himself says:

John 14:6
New King James Version

6 Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.

If you have not confessed your sins to Jesus and asked Him for forgivenes so that His blood sacrifce He shed on the Cross covers your sins then you are Hell bound.

What an asinine comment. When you want to be respectful, your comments might be worthy of a response.

OK, Dino246. Do you believe in the Literal Word of God?
Here Goes!!! How asinine are these in YOUR ESTIMATION??? Or is GOD a LIAR in Your ESTIMATION???

There are no time limits given and God changes not!
Malachi 3:6, James 1:17, Numbers 23:19, Isaiah 40:8


Psalm 122:6
Verse Concepts
Pray for the peace of Jerusalem:
“May they prosper who love you.

Zechariah 12:2-3
“Behold, I am going to make Jerusalem a cup that causes reeling to all the peoples around; and when the siege is against Jerusalem, it will also be against Judah. It will come about in that day that I will make Jerusalem a heavy stone for all the peoples; all who lift it will be severely injured. And all the nations of the earth will be gathered against it.

Romans 9:3-4
For I could wish that I myself were accursed, separated from Christ for the sake of my brethren, my kinsmen according to the flesh, who are Israelites, to whom belongs the adoption as sons, and the glory and the covenants and the giving of the Law and the temple service and the promises,

Romans 10:13-14
for “Whoever will call on the name of the Lord will be saved.” How then will they call on Him in whom they have not believed? How will they believe in Him whom they have not heard? And how will they hear without a preacher?

Romans 11:1
I say then, God has not rejected His people, has He? May it never be! For I too am an Israelite, a descendant of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.


Romans 11:25-26
King James Version
25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

WANT MORE???

So
Dino246
Senior Member do you deny the bible gives us specics actions we are to do, calling it in your vernacular asinine (extremely stupid or foolish) when directed toward a fellow Christian on a Christian site. I find your choice of words interesting in sharing your choice of Christian Fellowship and Love as a "Senior Member" on this site. Is this your normal way of expressing yourself and your "Christ like nature"? To what "Church" do you claim membership? Please share.

Do you deny that the Bible tells us specific actions we are to do? A simple Yes or No answer will suffice like Acts 16:31 KJV, 31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.







!

Matthew 7:21-23
King James Version
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.



Religion, and going to Church will not save your soul; only a personal relationship with Yeshua Hamashiach/Jesus Christ will save you!

I highly suggest you drop the personal attacks against users.

I simply responded to his post using his own words and asked Biblical questions. If that is an attack then what was his post Jocund? Not that you will give an honest answer since you refuse to answer my questions to you honestly.

Kayla,
You have treated me with respect. And I do appreciate it.

Now, you put me in a bit of a pickle here. Cause if I apologize, then that makes me a cuck!

But, I'll tell you what.....since I do like you and respect your fervency, I will explain myself. Not out of fear of getting banned...

"Cuck" as I've used it is obviously not a literal cuckold. It's a word meant to describe someone who despises their own in order to gain favor with others, especially when those outsiders are hostile to your own self interests. When I think of Christian zionists, one of the first things I think about are people that join the military to go fight wars for Israel. I think it's cucked because most guys in the military are at least nominally Christian and they go off sacrificing themselves for the sake of another nation - one that is anti-christian. That's exactly what I had in mind. Heck, I was one of those cucks! I even tried to join the Israeli IDF because I believed it so hard.

Another thing I think about that's cucked in this regard is taxing Americans and giving that money to Israel (or any foreign nation). It's a total fail. The government takes money from Christians in America and gives it to Jews in Israel. It's a total scam. And I think that the perpetrators of this scam fill Christians' heads with the idea that they're honoring God to do it. They put out this vibe of "If you don't $$$support$$$ the jews, then you're going to hell!!" And many, many Christians fall for it. It's cucked. So please don't be mad at me when I point this out. Instead be mad at the ones that are running this scam.

Now here's one more thing about the term "cuck". I have a lot of "friends" that laugh at me because they say if Christianity is true then God is a cuck. Why? Because God sacrificed Jesus to save a bunch of people the despise Him. Is this Cucked? I say no. Why? Because "cuck" implies a certain weakness. It's pathetic. God is anything but weak and pathetic. Therefore, it's not cucked. But when we have so many well meaning Christians that buy into the whole "support Israel" scam, then it kinda makes us all look like....cucks.

So there you go. Absolutely nothing against you personally. I promise. I'm not trying to insult you. I'm trying to just get you to think about this from a little different perspective. Don't grab onto the view that you have because you've always had it. Instead seek truth, and be willing to challenge your preconceived ideas. The truth can stand a good challenge.

You attacked his character. He criticised your comment. You attacked his character again. Do you really find your approach to be a productive exploration of any topic?

You know what's funny? I'm not sure that I've ever agreed with @Dino246 on anything. But I find myself liking/respecting him just because of how this roar guy attacks him. hahaha

As a Christian Zionist I take GREAT EXCEPT TO YOU.

First off Zionism is simply those that stand for God's Word in the Old Testament were He made the The Mosaic covenant Exodus 19-24. God is not a man that He changes His mind or His word or your faith is in vain sinse you make God a liar. My God is not a liar even if yours is. Romans 11:29, King James Version, 29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance. If you don't want to beleieve God's word I do and since you like to use foul languge to degrade other Christian's views that does not make you very Chrsit like now does it! Romans 11:26, King James Version, 26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob; but i know you refuse God's word on the subject! Mark 8:18, King James Version, Having eyes, see ye not? and having ears, hear ye not? and do ye not remember? I do not know why you have hardened your heart toward trying to save Jews souls but shame on you as they ar deserving of salvation just as much as gentiles are.

Revelation 11:3–12
In Revelation 11:3–12 is a description of two individuals who will help accomplish God’s work during the tribulation: “I will appoint my two witnesses, and they will prophesy for 1,260 days, clothed in sackcloth” (verse 3). Nowhere does the Bible identify these two witnesses by name, although people through the years have speculated.

The two witnesses in Revelation will have miraculous powers to accompany their message (Revelation 11:6), and no one will be able to stop them in their work (verse 5). At the end of their ministry, when they have said all they need to say, the beast will kill them and the wicked world will rejoice, allowing the bodies of the fallen prophets to lie in the streets (verses 7–10). Three and a half days later, however, God’s two witnesses will be resurrected and, in full view of their enemies, ascend to heaven (verses 11–12).

Do you understand what their message will be???