Are the Angels and Saints in Heaven alive? (Acts 23:8; Mat 18:10; Luk 20:38; Mat 17:3; Luk 16:23 etc)

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Nov 26, 2021
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#1
Dear Friends, so let's discuss this issue.

So, as we know, the Sadducees denied (1) the Resurrection, and that (2) there were Angels and (3) Spirits, i.e. human souls/saints in Heaven. This we read in Acts 23:8: "(The Sadducees say that there is no resurrection, and that there are neither angels nor spirits, but the Pharisees believe all these things.)" Now, St. Paul of course was a Pharisee and very strongly refutes the idea there is no Resurrection in his Epistles.

Also, it is clear the Lord Jesus strongly rejected the false opinion of the Sadducees too, that there was no Resurrection, or that there were no Angels etc. For e.g. as we know, in Mat 18:10, He taught: “Take heed that you do not despise one of these little ones, for I say to you that in heaven their angels always see the face of My Father who is in heaven." So, firstly, the Lord clearly teaches that there are Angels. He also calls them "their Angels", i.e. the Angels of the children, and this is the Biblical basis for the belief that each child, by God's Grace and Mercy, is given an Angel Guardian. The passage suggests the Angel helps obtain God's Protection for the child, and thus those who despise them etc will be punished by God; hence the "take heed that you do not ... for" etc.

Next in Luke 20, the Lord Jesus disproves the Sadducees opinion from the very 5 Books of Moses, or Pentateuch, the only books of the Bible that they accepted: "37But even Moses showed in the burning bush passage that the dead are raised, when he called the Lord ‘the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.’ 38For He is not the God of the dead but of the living, for all live to Him.” The Lord Jesus, the very God of Abraham, is here explaining what He Himself said in the Burning Bush. God said He is the God of Abraham and of Isaac and of Jacob, and this was in the time of Moses. Therefore, since He is the God of the living, Abraham and Isaac and Jacob were living in the time of Moses. That is the explanation the Lord Jesus is giving to the Sadducees to show them even Moses supported this Truth.

And this is also confirmed by the fact that Elijah and Moses appeared to the Apostles (Mat 17:3), that Abraham is shown in Paradise in the incident of the Rich Man and Lazarus etc (Luk 16:23). It is clear that, even before Christ, the OT saints were already in a place of rest.

Thoughts on all this, dear friends?

God Bless.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
55,249
25,719
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#2
John 11:25-26 Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. Whoever believes in Me will live,
even though he dies. And everyone who lives and believes in Me will never die. Do you believe this?”


Yes, Lord, I believe :)
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,167
12,764
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#3
Thoughts on all this, dear friends?
All the saints who have passed on (including all the OT saints) and all the holy angels are very much awake and alive in the New Jerusalem in Heaven. They are awaiting their glorious resurrection at the Resurrection/Rapture. There are no souls sleeping in graves six feet under. That area is reserved for burrowing creatures.

When Christ arose from the dead, He took all the righteous dead from Hades to Heaven. This included that thief on the cross, as well as Lazarus the beggar, and Abraham the "father" of all those who believe.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,424
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#5
Dear Friends, so let's discuss this issue.

So, as we know, the Sadducees denied (1) the Resurrection, and that (2) there were Angels and (3) Spirits, i.e. human souls/saints in Heaven. This we read in Acts 23:8: "(The Sadducees say that there is no resurrection, and that there are neither angels nor spirits, but the Pharisees believe all these things.)" Now, St. Paul of course was a Pharisee and very strongly refutes the idea there is no Resurrection in his Epistles.

Also, it is clear the Lord Jesus strongly rejected the false opinion of the Sadducees too, that there was no Resurrection, or that there were no Angels etc. For e.g. as we know, in Mat 18:10, He taught: “Take heed that you do not despise one of these little ones, for I say to you that in heaven their angels always see the face of My Father who is in heaven." So, firstly, the Lord clearly teaches that there are Angels. He also calls them "their Angels", i.e. the Angels of the children, and this is the Biblical basis for the belief that each child, by God's Grace and Mercy, is given an Angel Guardian. The passage suggests the Angel helps obtain God's Protection for the child, and thus those who despise them etc will be punished by God; hence the "take heed that you do not ... for" etc.

Next in Luke 20, the Lord Jesus disproves the Sadducees opinion from the very 5 Books of Moses, or Pentateuch, the only books of the Bible that they accepted: "37But even Moses showed in the burning bush passage that the dead are raised, when he called the Lord ‘the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.’ 38For He is not the God of the dead but of the living, for all live to Him.” The Lord Jesus, the very God of Abraham, is here explaining what He Himself said in the Burning Bush. God said He is the God of Abraham and of Isaac and of Jacob, and this was in the time of Moses. Therefore, since He is the God of the living, Abraham and Isaac and Jacob were living in the time of Moses. That is the explanation the Lord Jesus is giving to the Sadducees to show them even Moses supported this Truth.

And this is also confirmed by the fact that Elijah and Moses appeared to the Apostles (Mat 17:3), that Abraham is shown in Paradise in the incident of the Rich Man and Lazarus etc (Luk 16:23). It is clear that, even before Christ, the OT saints were already in a place of rest.

Thoughts on all this, dear friends?

God Bless.
There is a big difference between saints and angels. There were angels at the time God created the world and us. Scripture speaks of one class of angels (watchers ) that are alive with us and report to God. Saints are not given jobs to do on earth after they pass.
 

williamjordan

Senior Member
Feb 18, 2015
495
122
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#6
I am reminded of what Paul said in 1 Corinthians 5:6-8,

Therefore, being always of good courage, and knowing that while we are at home in the body we are absent from the Lord — for we walk by faith, not by sight — but we are of good courage and prefer rather to be absent from the body and to be at home with the Lord.
And Philippians 1:21-24,

For to me, to live is Christ and to die is gain. But if I am to live on in the flesh, this will mean fruitful labor for me; and I do not know which to choose. But I am hard-pressed from both directions, having the desire to depart and be with Christ, for that is very much better; yet to remain on in the flesh is more necessary for your sake.
When saints pass out of this life they go on to live in the presence of the Lord in heaven. However, heaven is not the final abode. For God will create a new heaven and a new earth and man will rule over the earth as Adam was destined to do in the first creation. But this time man will walk in conformity to the image of their creator, the Son of God -- the second Adam. And being in the image of the Son of God, man will fulfill the original obligations God had intended in the Genesis creation.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,167
12,764
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#7
When saints pass out of this life they go on to live in the presence of the Lord in heaven. However, heaven is not the final abode. For God will create a new heaven and a new earth and man will rule over the earth as Adam was destined to do in the first creation.
Actually the New Jerusalem will be the eternal home of the saints, while the New Earth will be populated by redeemed and restored Israel and the saved nations. The New Jerusalem will come down out of Heaven to become a heavenly body outside the earth and to give light to the earth. See Revelation 21. There will be no sun nor moon, but the glory of God and of the Lamb will be the Light shining on the earth.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,167
12,764
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#8
Saints are not given jobs to do on earth after they pass.
That is incorrect. The saints will indeed by given "jobs" -- responsibilities as kings and priests in the eternal Kingdom of God.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,424
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#9
That is incorrect. The saints will indeed by given "jobs" -- responsibilities as kings and priests in the eternal Kingdom of God.
Are you saying that saints and angels are the same?
WE are told of many tasks the angels do such as being watchers that report to the Lord, and being messengers. What work is it you have been told of in scripture that saints are assigned?
 
Nov 26, 2021
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#10
Well, the Lord did say that, in the next life, they shall not marry etc, but be like the Angels in Heaven. But beside that generic statement, that the saints shall be like the Angels, in the Book of Revelation, we see human elders, saints etc offering prayers and worshiping God just like the Angels.

Rev 5:8 "When He had taken the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb. Each one had a harp, and they were holding golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints."

Rev 8:4 "And the smoke of the incense, together with the prayers of the saints, rose up before God from the hand of the angel."

Rev 19:4 "The twenty-four elders and the four living creatures fell down and worshiped God, who was seated on the throne. And they cried: “Amen, Hallelujah!”

In the Jewish book of Tobit, one of the 7 Deuterocanonicals, the Archangel Raphael introduces himself to Tobit and his son Tobias as: “I am Raphael, one of the seven holy angels, which present the prayers of the saints, and which go in and out before the glory of the Holy One.” https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/Tobit-12-15/

God Bless.