Colossians 1:23

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JohnRH

Junior Member
Mar 5, 2018
534
259
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#41
Colossians 1:12) Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:
13) Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son: 14) In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins: 15) Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
16) For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: 17) And he is before all things, and by him all things consist. 18) And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence. 18( For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell; 20) And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they bethings in earth, or things in heaven. 21) And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled 33) In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:

23If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;

Previous Scriptures provided for context.............

This is an odd statement by the Apostle is it not? I mean, one group tells us that we have no choice in whether or not we are grounded and settled and be not moved away from the faith, and another group tells us it does not matter if we are or if we are not, for we are already saved. It makes me wonder what the Apostle was trying to say here, and if it may not really mean what it reads as.

John Gill said this:

If ye continue in the faith
In the doctrine of faith which they had received and embraced; and in the grace of faith, and the exercise of it which was implanted in them; and in the profession of faith which they had made: not that the virtue and efficacy of Christ's blood, sufferings, and death, and reconciliation of their persons to God thereby, depended upon their faith, and abiding in it; but that faith and continuance in it were necessary means of their presentation in unblemished holiness and righteousness; for if they had not faith, or did not abide in it or if the good work of grace was not wrought upon their souls, and that performed until the day of Christ, they could not be presented holy and blameless: this shows the necessity of the saints' final perseverance in faith and holiness, and is mentioned with this view, to put them upon a concern about it, and to make use of all means, under divine grace, to enjoy it; and nothing could more strongly incline and move unto it, than the blessed effect of Christ's death, reconciliation and the end of it, to present the reconciled ones blameless; in order to which it is necessary they should hold on and out to the end: hence the Ethiopic version reads the words, not as a condition, but as an exhortation enforced by what goes before; "therefore be ye established in the faith": it follows,

grounded and settled;
not on the sandy foundation of man's own righteousness, and peace made by his own performances; but upon the foundation and rock, Christ, against which the gates of hell cannot prevail; and so shall never finally and totally fall away, being rooted and built up in him, and established in the faith of him, in the doctrines of faith, respecting peace by his blood, justification by his righteousness, and life by his death; and so continue steadfast and immovable, always abounding in his work:

and [be] not moved away from the hope of the Gospel;
the hope of eternal life and happiness, which as set before us in the Gospel; which that gives a good and solid ground and foundation of, in the person, blood, and righteousness of Christ; and is the instrumental means, in the hand of the Spirit, of begetting to it, and of encouraging and increasing it: the law gives no hopes of eternal life to a poor sinner; it works wrath, and ministers death; there is nothing but a fearful looking for of judgment by it; but the Gospel encourages to hope in the Lord, from the consideration of rich mercy and plenteous redemption in him; and this hope of the Gospel is an anchor of the soul, sure and steadfast, and not to be let go; this confidence and rejoicing of the hope is to be kept firm unto the end:

This reminds me of what Jesus said in Matthew about those who endure to the end will be saved.

Thoughts?

21 And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled 22 In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight: 23 If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;

The way I understand it is:

If you continue in the faith, you'll be presented holy, unblameable, and unreprovable.
If you don't continue in the faith, you won'l be presented holy, unblameable, and unreprovable.

Either way you're reconciled. You were reconciled (positionally) IN ORDER TO be presented the in the right (practical) ways, which in turn are contingent on your continuance. I think "holy", "unblameable, and "unreprovable" are terms referring to practical sanctification, not positional sanctification.

So this verse would not support "perseverance of the saints", which states that all saints will persevere. God will preserve all saints (OSAS), but not contingent upon their perseverance or causing their practical perseverance if they choose not to "continue".
 

p_rehbein

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2013
30,169
6,528
113
#42
I continue to be amazed that folks remain determined to make this about OSAS. As is the case here on CC, the OSAS'ers and the Hyper Gracers ALWAYS interject their beliefs on ANY Thread they can to derail and detract from the OP and its intent.

Oh well............

It is also funny that PennEd continues to try and destroy ROSE Theology, which was just a idea I had, and not meant to be Biblical Theology carved in stone. However, as he and others strove to destroy the idea, and the more I read Scripture, I realized that ROSE was exactly what Scripture taught. Jesus taught it, and the Apostle Paul taught it.
PennEd and the others were hung up on ONE DEFINITION of secure, because it was the one they could use to try and attack me with. Even though I showed them the definition that made it perfectly acceptable, AND NOT A WORK DONE BY ME, they ignored it and continued their attack.

This OP was to simply discuss a passage of Scriptures.........AND NOT intended to discuss ROSE Theology. Sine PennEd and a couple of others here INSIST on doing so................well............ok, because PennEd himself admitted that HE lives by ROSE Theology. Read his comment about being purified as gold by fire............THAT IS A PROCESS of purification, sanctification!

Jesus said in Matthew........ 24:13) But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. This is a PROCESS! Enduring to the end........AND what must one do to endure to the end? Remain obedient! If one does NOT remain obedient, they can not possibly endure till the end.

Paul said: Romans 13:11) And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed. He is speaking of a PROCESS..... and he said: Colossians 1:23) If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;f ......... and this is a PROCESS.......

ROSE Theology DOES NOT disprove OSAS, nor was it intended to...........and those that rushed to attack me were so intent on doing just that.........attacking me that they could not even begin to understand. It HAS NOTHING TO DO with works salvation. That MUST break their hardened hearts........ :)

Remaining obedient IS REQUIRED BY GOD! Folks can deny this all they wish, but it IS GOSPEL. Remaining obedient to God/Christ ensures that we will be acceptable to Him and He will be faithful to do what He said He would do. We are not earning our salvation, WE ARE BEING OBEDIENT to Him BECAUSE of our salvation!

The fact that these people can not understand this is such a sad thing. They are so blinded by their Denominational/Church Theologies that they can NOT see the Truth of Scripture.

A long time ago.........I told these OSASers, that their mistake is "Saved." They need to change their wee diddy to Once Sanctified Always Sanctified. IF THEY DID THIS, I might well join in with them in believing it, for it is FAR MORE Truth according to Scripture than their carnal version. And, therein lies their stumbling stone. They can not seem to understand the difference between saved and sanctified. They are NOT the same. The Apostle spoke of this again and again and again in his Epistles, and, still, they do not appear to understand the difference between carnal believers and spiritual believers. They are BOTH believers, but the difference is, the carnal believer is in grave danger of being led astray by the things of the world, temptation, the devil, the pleasures of sin. They DO NOT HAVE the indwelling presence of the Holy Spirit to SECURE them in Christ!

Jesus spoke of them with the Parable of the Sower of the Seeds......and when He spoke of the falling away in Matthew 14. Paul spoke of them often in almost every Epistle. Yet, the OSASers can not see this, rather they try to insist that they were never saved to begin with, which Scripture itself disproves. Those Paul spoke of "who were never part of us" were NOT carnal believers, they were children of the deceiver who had come in among us. But because they are so tied to their OSAS ideology, they MUST use whatever they can to support the ideology.

ONCE SANCTIFIED ALWAYS SANCTIFIED is far more Biblical Truth than Once Saved Always Saved will ever be. And the Sanctified Believers WILL remain obedient and thus they can be secure in knowing their eternity will be forever with Christ!

Go back and read PennEd's comment about being "purified." The ONLY way this can occur is IF HE REMAINS OBEDIENT!

Anyway.............

God bless