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1 Thessalonians 1:4 " Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God."
2. 2 Pet.1:10 "Therefore, my brothers, be all the more eager to make your calling and election sure. For if you do these things, you will never fall."
3. Eph.1:4 "According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love."
Barns notes on the bible.
Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God - The margin here reads, "beloved of God, your election." The difference depends merely on the pointing, and that which would require the marginal reading has been adopted by Hahn, Tittman, Bloomfield, and Griesbach. The sense is not materially varied, and the common version may be regarded as giving the true meaning. There is no great difference between "being beloved of God," and "being chosen of God." The sense then is, "knowing that you are chosen by God unto salvation;"
In other words elect or chosen of God.
2. 2 Pet.1:10 "Therefore, my brothers, be all the more eager to make your calling and election sure. For if you do these things, you will never fall."
3. Eph.1:4 "According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love."
Barns notes on the bible.
Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God - The margin here reads, "beloved of God, your election." The difference depends merely on the pointing, and that which would require the marginal reading has been adopted by Hahn, Tittman, Bloomfield, and Griesbach. The sense is not materially varied, and the common version may be regarded as giving the true meaning. There is no great difference between "being beloved of God," and "being chosen of God." The sense then is, "knowing that you are chosen by God unto salvation;"
In other words elect or chosen of God.
F
God calls only his elect and he does call all of them. Rom 8:28-30, And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the CALLED according to his purpose. For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also CALLED, and whom he CALLED, them he also justified, and whom he justified, them he also glorified. The few chosen are those that are clothed with the wedding garment which is a revealed knowledge of the truth. This also fits with the example in Matt 7:13-14. God's elect go in both of these gates. those that go in the wide gate are God's elect who are believing that their good works will save them eternally and the destruction is not having full fellowship with God because they are believing a false doctrine. Those that go in the strait gate are those that God has revealed the truth to. This also fits with the parable of the different soils. The soils are the different levels of knowledge that the elect have. The good ground is Christ's church, those who, by revelation of God, understand the truth. They are Christ's bride that have on the wedding garment.
I will comment on the false understanding of election,in the sense that some people believe that God has elected people to be saved in the beginning,and the rest are lost,all without the people deciding for themselves whether to believe or not.
If that is what they mean,and there are a few things to point out first,concerning God choosing some to be saved and some not to be saved,in the beginning,and they cannot fall away,and we do not choose for our self.
1.It goes against the kingdom of God,that it is based on love.
If people do not choose to be with God,then they have no choice but to follow God,so they would be a robot seeing no other alternative,which then God's kingdom would not be based on true love.
You can program your computer to say I love,but it does not,but has no choice but to say I love you.
If elect is true,the saints really do not love God,but have no choice but to love God,like the computer.
2.It goes against God's nature of love.
If God did not choose some people to be saved,without their choice,then God would be depicted as cruel,especially against people who did not make the choice to rebel.
It would be God damning for no reason.
3.Jesus told everybody to repent,and what would the elect have to repent about,if they were chosen in the beginning.
Also if they were chosen in the beginning to follow God why are they born in sin.
4.If the elect are chosen to follow God,then why when they come to God and follow Christ,sin and are hypocritical to a high degree.
If they are chosen to follow God and cannot fall away,then why don't they do good all the time like Jesus.
They are chosen in the beginning to be saved,but not chosen to do good all the time,when the Bible says that a person that names the name of Christ,must depart from iniquity,but I have noticed that people that believe in predestination for the most part are quite hypocritical to the Christian lifestyle,but I will not say all so as not to appear judgmental,but I have seen Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses,with a better lifestyle.
A dangerous doctrine,predestination,for if they believe they cannot fall away,no matter what,they become relaxed in their walk with God,and think,if I go out tonight and drink alcohol,and smoke pot,and cheat on my spouse,I am alright,for I cannot fall away.
They have no fear living for God in their behavior,for they believe they cannot fall away,when the Bible says work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
5.If everybody has sinned and come short of the glory of God,and everybody's righteousness is as filthy rags,and there is none that does good,no not one,putting them in the same boat,then why did God choose some to be saved,and some not to be saved,when the people chosen in the beginning are no different than the people not chosen.
6.The Bible says many are called but few are chosen,which means God calls people on earth,and then chooses them,not in the beginning.
If God chose them in the beginning,why would He choose them again on earth,and why would He call them since they were already chosen,and should come to God with no prompting,and if God called them,then why did He not choose them,indicating they had a choice concerning the calling,and some did not follow through with it.
God calls us on earth,for He knows our heart,and then chooses us if we heed that calling,and continue in it.
Add to that,that God is not willing that any should perish,but all come to repentance and be saved.Jesus lights every person that is born in this world.Not all that confess Christ as Lord shall enter the kingdom of God.Paul said if he did not abstain from sin he would be a castaway,which I see a lot not abstaining from sin.
The predestination doctrine does not pan out scriptually or common sense wise.
17(As it is written, I have made thee a father of many nations,) before him whom he believed, even God, who quickeneth the dead, and calleth those things which be not as though they were(Romans 4:17).
God calls things that have not yet happened,as though they already happened,which all things were planned out in the beginning before God laid down the foundation of the world.
8And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world(Revelation 13:8).
The Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world,although it did not happen until 4000 years later.
When the Bible says the saints are predestined to be saved,it means that God already had the plan of salvation to give mankind in the future,by Jesus Christ 4000 years later,so it is the same as if mankind already has that salvation in the beginning,and that salvation is to mankind in general,like the Bible says whosoever will,meaning God has allowed us to chose it or not.
If some people were not chosen in the beginning,them not having a choice in the matter,then why are they judged and condemned,seeing they have no choice but to rebel,like a robot,and then how is God a fair and just God.
If that is what they mean,and there are a few things to point out first,concerning God choosing some to be saved and some not to be saved,in the beginning,and they cannot fall away,and we do not choose for our self.
1.It goes against the kingdom of God,that it is based on love.
If people do not choose to be with God,then they have no choice but to follow God,so they would be a robot seeing no other alternative,which then God's kingdom would not be based on true love.
You can program your computer to say I love,but it does not,but has no choice but to say I love you.
If elect is true,the saints really do not love God,but have no choice but to love God,like the computer.
2.It goes against God's nature of love.
If God did not choose some people to be saved,without their choice,then God would be depicted as cruel,especially against people who did not make the choice to rebel.
It would be God damning for no reason.
3.Jesus told everybody to repent,and what would the elect have to repent about,if they were chosen in the beginning.
Also if they were chosen in the beginning to follow God why are they born in sin.
4.If the elect are chosen to follow God,then why when they come to God and follow Christ,sin and are hypocritical to a high degree.
If they are chosen to follow God and cannot fall away,then why don't they do good all the time like Jesus.
They are chosen in the beginning to be saved,but not chosen to do good all the time,when the Bible says that a person that names the name of Christ,must depart from iniquity,but I have noticed that people that believe in predestination for the most part are quite hypocritical to the Christian lifestyle,but I will not say all so as not to appear judgmental,but I have seen Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses,with a better lifestyle.
A dangerous doctrine,predestination,for if they believe they cannot fall away,no matter what,they become relaxed in their walk with God,and think,if I go out tonight and drink alcohol,and smoke pot,and cheat on my spouse,I am alright,for I cannot fall away.
They have no fear living for God in their behavior,for they believe they cannot fall away,when the Bible says work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
5.If everybody has sinned and come short of the glory of God,and everybody's righteousness is as filthy rags,and there is none that does good,no not one,putting them in the same boat,then why did God choose some to be saved,and some not to be saved,when the people chosen in the beginning are no different than the people not chosen.
6.The Bible says many are called but few are chosen,which means God calls people on earth,and then chooses them,not in the beginning.
If God chose them in the beginning,why would He choose them again on earth,and why would He call them since they were already chosen,and should come to God with no prompting,and if God called them,then why did He not choose them,indicating they had a choice concerning the calling,and some did not follow through with it.
God calls us on earth,for He knows our heart,and then chooses us if we heed that calling,and continue in it.
Add to that,that God is not willing that any should perish,but all come to repentance and be saved.Jesus lights every person that is born in this world.Not all that confess Christ as Lord shall enter the kingdom of God.Paul said if he did not abstain from sin he would be a castaway,which I see a lot not abstaining from sin.
The predestination doctrine does not pan out scriptually or common sense wise.
17(As it is written, I have made thee a father of many nations,) before him whom he believed, even God, who quickeneth the dead, and calleth those things which be not as though they were(Romans 4:17).
God calls things that have not yet happened,as though they already happened,which all things were planned out in the beginning before God laid down the foundation of the world.
8And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world(Revelation 13:8).
The Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world,although it did not happen until 4000 years later.
When the Bible says the saints are predestined to be saved,it means that God already had the plan of salvation to give mankind in the future,by Jesus Christ 4000 years later,so it is the same as if mankind already has that salvation in the beginning,and that salvation is to mankind in general,like the Bible says whosoever will,meaning God has allowed us to chose it or not.
If some people were not chosen in the beginning,them not having a choice in the matter,then why are they judged and condemned,seeing they have no choice but to rebel,like a robot,and then how is God a fair and just God.
A
Lets let Jesus answer that....
Revelation 3:5
He who overcomes shall be clothed in white garments, and I will not blot out his name from the Book of Life; but I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels.
Matthew 10:33
But whoever denies Me before men, him I will also deny before My Father who is in heaven.
Luke 8
13 But the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away.
Revelation 3:5
He who overcomes shall be clothed in white garments, and I will not blot out his name from the Book of Life; but I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels.
Matthew 10:33
But whoever denies Me before men, him I will also deny before My Father who is in heaven.
Luke 8
13 But the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away.
With this doctrine of election.
Nobody can be in the image of God unless they have an innocent nature.
If Adam was made in the image of God,it means he was made with an innocent nature,which is true,for he had fellowship with God,for God walked with him in the garden,before he sinned.
If Adam had a relationship with God and was right with him,how did he fall away,for God must of chosen him beforehand to follow him,according to predestination,for Adam to follow him.
How did he fall away if he had a relationship that was very close to God,that God walked with him in the garden,and according to predestination if you follow God,you have been chosen beforehand by God,and cannot fall away.
But we see Adam had an innocent nature,but he still had a choice,and he sinned and fell out of fellowship with God,to where he was kicked out of the garden.
And if someone goes the other way and says God chose them to be lost,so sin can enter the world and people would have to seek God,it would mean.
1.Why would God choose beforehand the first two people to be rebellious right off the bat.
2.God would not condemn people by being the one that allowed the sin nature to be in all people,by choosing beforehand Adam and Eve to be rebellious.
3.It would mean all the sin and chaos in the world would be coming from God,for He is the one who caused people to not be chosen that cause the chaos and sin,for how can they not sin since they were not chosen,which we know is not true.
If God chose them beforehand to follow Him,which we see they had fellowship with God,and God talked to them,and had a relationship with God,how did they fall.
If God chose them beforehand to be rebellious,would mean God is the one that caused the sin nature to be in all people,then how can God get mad at people if He caused the sin nature,and did not choose some of them beforehand,which we know is not true.
God is not evil and would not condemn people.
So did God choose beforehand Adam and Eve to be saved or lost,because either way it does not make sense.
It sounds to me the only logical conclusion is we have choice,which is what the Bible states.
Nobody can be in the image of God unless they have an innocent nature.
If Adam was made in the image of God,it means he was made with an innocent nature,which is true,for he had fellowship with God,for God walked with him in the garden,before he sinned.
If Adam had a relationship with God and was right with him,how did he fall away,for God must of chosen him beforehand to follow him,according to predestination,for Adam to follow him.
How did he fall away if he had a relationship that was very close to God,that God walked with him in the garden,and according to predestination if you follow God,you have been chosen beforehand by God,and cannot fall away.
But we see Adam had an innocent nature,but he still had a choice,and he sinned and fell out of fellowship with God,to where he was kicked out of the garden.
And if someone goes the other way and says God chose them to be lost,so sin can enter the world and people would have to seek God,it would mean.
1.Why would God choose beforehand the first two people to be rebellious right off the bat.
2.God would not condemn people by being the one that allowed the sin nature to be in all people,by choosing beforehand Adam and Eve to be rebellious.
3.It would mean all the sin and chaos in the world would be coming from God,for He is the one who caused people to not be chosen that cause the chaos and sin,for how can they not sin since they were not chosen,which we know is not true.
If God chose them beforehand to follow Him,which we see they had fellowship with God,and God talked to them,and had a relationship with God,how did they fall.
If God chose them beforehand to be rebellious,would mean God is the one that caused the sin nature to be in all people,then how can God get mad at people if He caused the sin nature,and did not choose some of them beforehand,which we know is not true.
God is not evil and would not condemn people.
So did God choose beforehand Adam and Eve to be saved or lost,because either way it does not make sense.
It sounds to me the only logical conclusion is we have choice,which is what the Bible states.
A
Your post is full of proof that you do not understand that ...
Almighty God has always seen the end from the beginning of man's history.
He actually has seen ALL of man's choices, and etc. beforehand.
It is from all of His foreknowledge that He makes His choices.
Please try fitting this into all of your ideas about this topic ... and see if it doesn't do a lot of explaining.
.
Almighty God has always seen the end from the beginning of man's history.
He actually has seen ALL of man's choices, and etc. beforehand.
It is from all of His foreknowledge that He makes His choices.
Please try fitting this into all of your ideas about this topic ... and see if it doesn't do a lot of explaining.
.
F
Ps 53:2-3, God looked down from heaven upon the children of men to see if there were any that did understand, that did seek God. Every one of them is gone back, they are altogether become filthy, there is none that doeth good, no, not one. This is what God had to choose from. But for the intervention of God, we all would be doomed to an eternal punishment.Eph 2:1-5.