Help with Question please

[CrimsonFlames]

How did the scepter come to be in Judahs hands?

Judah was refused to lead by Jacob and the line went to Rachels Children being Joseph and Benjamin but Joseph lived so it was to him. Josephs dream that they would all bow to him etc which came to pass in Jerusalem

Also Judah broke off and left his fathers clan to make his own clan.

Just wanna know how the scepter passed from Joseph to Judah?

 

[AnandaHya]

hmmm

Joseph was never king. He never had the scepter. His dream said his brothers would bow to him....

it has something to do with the blessing Israel gave to all his children.

let me post the scriptures.... the bold speaks of JESUS the Prince of PEACE (shiloh means peace by the way)

Genesis 49
8 “ Judah, you are he whom your brothers shall praise;
Your hand shall be on the neck of your enemies;
Your father’s children shall bow down before you.

9 Judah is a lion’s whelp;
From the prey, my son, you have gone up.
He bows down, he lies down as a lion;
And as a lion, who shall rouse him?

10 The scepter shall not depart from Judah,
Nor a lawgiver from between his feet,
Until Shiloh comes;
And to Him shall be the obedience of the people.

11 Binding his donkey to the vine,
And his donkey’s colt to the choice vine,
He washed his garments in wine,
And his clothes in the blood of grapes.

12 His eyes are darker than wine,
And his teeth whiter than milk.


compare to the blessings upon Joseph

22 “ Joseph is a fruitful bough,
A fruitful bough by a well;
His branches run over the wall.

23 The archers have bitterly grieved him,
Shot at him and hated him.

24 But his bow remained in strength,
And the arms of his hands were made strong
By the hands of the Mighty God of Jacob
(From there is the Shepherd, the Stone of Israel),

25 By the God of your father who will help you,
And by the Almighty who will bless you
With blessings of heaven above,
Blessings of the deep that lies beneath,
Blessings of the breasts and of the womb.

26 The blessings of your father
Have excelled the blessings of my ancestors,
Up to the utmost bound of the everlasting hills.
They shall be on the head of Joseph,
And on the crown of the head of him who was separate from his brothers.

also King David was from the tribe of Judah.

 

[CrimsonFlames]

Judah was not the oldest.., nor did he have Jacob's full trust

Remember the sister who was raped and the brothers went against Jacob and killed the tribe off who's prince had raped her.., among many other things the other brothers were derelict.., that is why Jacob made Joseph the coat as a sign of his destiny to rule over his brothers and that is what brought on his brothers jealousy and why they sold him into Egypt where he did see his brothers bow to him

So how did Judah come to have the scepter over Israel?

keeping in mind that Judah broke away to start his own tribe and had acquired a taste for the Canaanite women and culture

I'm a lil worn out from all the studying lately so I am relying on others is all

The scripture you gave me only states that Judah intends on keeping the scepter.., my question is how did Judah come into the scepter in the first place

Jacobs love was for Rachel remember? Leah was wedded to him by deceit

*sigh* I prolly know the answer my brain is probably just fried at the moment lol

Whats curious is Josephs line and Judahs line come together in David so was David chosen because he was from Judah or from Joseph?

 

[CrimsonFlames]

Rachel .., HELP hahahah

 

[2knowhim]

Num 24:17 I shall see him, but not now: I shall behold him, but not nigh: there shall come a Star out of Jacob, and a Sceptre shall rise out of Israel, and shall smite the corners of Moab, and destroy all the children of Sheth.

No doubt this is Christ, Remember Jacobs' name was changed to Israel

Natural seed, Spiritual Seed.

Heb 7:14 For it is evident that our Lord sprang out of Juda; of which tribe Moses spake nothing concerning priesthood.

Psa 45:6 Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: the sceptre of thy kingdom is a right sceptre.
Psa 45:7 Thou lovest righteousness, and hatest wickedness: therefore God, thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.

I don't know if this helps at all but that's what I found.

 

[AnandaHya]

it doesn't matter. Isaac wanted to bless Esau not Jacob but its not what the father wants but what God ordains to happen.

"your father's children shall bow down before you" that's what is spoken concerning Judah not Joseph with Israel's last words.

 

[Laodicea]

Judah was not the oldest.., nor did he have Jacob's full trust

Remember the sister who was raped and the brothers went against Jacob and killed the tribe off who's prince had raped her.., among many other things the other brothers were derelict.., that is why Jacob made Joseph the coat as a sign of his destiny to rule over his brothers and that is what brought on his brothers jealousy and why they sold him into Egypt where he did see his brothers bow to him

So how did Judah come to have the scepter over Israel?

keeping in mind that Judah broke away to start his own tribe and had acquired a taste for the Canaanite women and culture

I'm a lil worn out from all the studying lately so I am relying on others is all

The scripture you gave me only states that Judah intends on keeping the scepter.., my question is how did Judah come into the scepter in the first place

Jacobs love was for Rachel remember? Leah was wedded to him by deceit

*sigh* I prolly know the answer my brain is probably just fried at the moment lol

Whats curious is Josephs line and Judahs line come together in David so was David chosen because he was from Judah or from Joseph?

Judah was the 4th Born it is possible that it passed to him because of the sins of the 3 older brothers.
Genesis 35:22
(22) And it came to pass, when Israel dwelt in that land, that Reuben went and lay with Bilhah his father's concubine: and Israel heard it. Now the sons of Jacob were twelve:
Genesis 34:24-25
(24) And unto Hamor and unto Shechem his son hearkened all that went out of the gate of his city; and every male was circumcised, all that went out of the gate of his city.
(25) And it came to pass on the third day, when they were sore, that two of the sons of Jacob, Simeon and Levi, Dinah's brethren, took each man his sword, and came upon the city boldly, and slew all the males.

Simeon and Levi were deceitful and used their customs to kill people. This could be the reason it passed to Judah

 

[Crossfire]

Judah was the 4th Born it is possible that it passed to him because of the sins of the 3 older brothers.
Genesis 35:22
(22) And it came to pass, when Israel dwelt in that land, that Reuben went and lay with Bilhah his father's concubine: and Israel heard it. Now the sons of Jacob were twelve:
Genesis 34:24-25
(24) And unto Hamor and unto Shechem his son hearkened all that went out of the gate of his city; and every male was circumcised, all that went out of the gate of his city.
(25) And it came to pass on the third day, when they were sore, that two of the sons of Jacob, Simeon and Levi, Dinah's brethren, took each man his sword, and came upon the city boldly, and slew all the males.

Simeon and Levi were deceitful and used their customs to kill people. This could be the reason it passed to Judah

I'm pretty sure that you are correct.

 

[WeStand]

Judah was not the oldest.., nor did he have Jacob's full trust

Remember the sister who was raped and the brothers went against Jacob and killed the tribe off who's prince had raped her.., among many other things the other brothers were derelict.., that is why Jacob made Joseph the coat as a sign of his destiny to rule over his brothers and that is what brought on his brothers jealousy and why they sold him into Egypt where he did see his brothers bow to him

So how did Judah come to have the scepter over Israel?

keeping in mind that Judah broke away to start his own tribe and had acquired a taste for the Canaanite women and culture

I'm a lil worn out from all the studying lately so I am relying on others is all

The scripture you gave me only states that Judah intends on keeping the scepter.., my question is how did Judah come into the scepter in the first place

Jacobs love was for Rachel remember? Leah was wedded to him by deceit

*sigh* I prolly know the answer my brain is probably just fried at the moment lol

Whats curious is Josephs line and Judahs line come together in David so was David chosen because he was from Judah or from Joseph?

Gen:49/10; The sceptre shall not depart from Judah/Praise, nor a lawgiver from between his feet, until Shiloh/Peace come; and unto him shall the gathering of the people be.

I think your right, you just need a rest

I'm a little rusty on some of this stuff, so if someone notices an incorrect statement, feel free to correct the time, though it shouldn't be that relavent to the overall point.

The 10 tribes of Israel were taken captive (northbound) by the Assyrians, its either 200 or 400 years prior to the Babylonians taking captive both Judah and Benjiman.

David was definatly chosen for his Judah/Praise lineage in Christ, as Judah is The Lineage of The kings, both good & bad. (eg: Saul/David)

Benjiman, is the Lineage of The Priest/Levite line of High Preists, both good & bad.(Zeddikiah/Zechariah)

These 2 tribes of Israel were separated as they are The representitive of the King and Preist lineage, leading up to the birth of Messiah. These 2 tribes are the ones who had to follow ALL of the cumbersome duties of the Statutes and Ordinences of the Law; though the rest of Israel were under the Command to obey what these 2 tribes told them.

The First 2 Commandments of Our Father, The Creator of Life and Source of Love, the same 2 Christ confirmed, have NEVER changed.

It IS because of the fact that the children could NOT obey these 2 simple Commands that Our Father added The Law; The 10 Commandments, to enforce them to obey.

It just make me shake my head in total insanity when people preach that these Laws of Moses are obsolete talk about being blinded through their religous beliefs.

Though i've stated this many times, and am sick of pointing it out to them, as they choose to remain blind to the facts of reality, The LAW IS VERY MUCH NOT done away with; rather it IS Confirmed In and Through Christ, that IT REMAINS FOREVER; though when things are RE-STORED to MoreNatural Order, WE DON"T need them, because; WE DON"T do them.

They REALLY are not that difficult, compared to the liebrary's of Man's law'ssssssss.

7 of them: DO NOT HAVE THE WRONG FATHER.

The other 3 though some falsley attempt to preach that they are not in effect , well if you really can not see that 3/4's of the worlds wealth is spent on enforcing (inscribe into their minds) these 3 COMMANDMENTS; then BLIND you truly are.

Thou Shalt Not; Murder/Rape?Abuse.( Nothing to do with a Justified KILL)

Thou Shalt Not Steal.

Thou Shalt Not Lie.

ALL enforced BY The Father, through, The Military, The Police, The Courts & Prisons.

REALLY

Forever in Christ​

 

[2knowhim]

Hi WeStand,

That was a interesting post, I like this:

David was definatly chosen for his Judah/Praise lineage in Christ, as Judah is The Lineage of The kings, both good & bad. (eg: Saul/David)

Benjiman, is the Lineage of The Priest/Levite line of High Preists, both good & bad.(Zeddikiah/Zechariah)

I am am rusty on these too it's been a long time since I did study on this.
But that makes sense, And I agree with you on the Law, how do you do away with The Word?
You can't. We establish The Righteousness of The Law, In the Spirit, Not by a Dead Letter,
But by The Living Word.


Blessings