Pre Trib Rapture Moment 21: Will God Deceive Himself?

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ChosenbyHim

Senior Member
Sep 19, 2011
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#1
Pre Trib Rapture Moment 21: Will God Deceive Himself?


[video=youtube;Wp_6m_PW_Mk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wp_6m_PW_Mk[/video]

Published on Dec 21, 2013
Many people can't seem to understand the purpose of the Time of Jacob's trouble. They don't understand the difference between saved Christians of today versus the saints in the TOJT.


 
Nov 23, 2013
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#2
ChosenbyHim, sorry I can't watch the video... I have HughesNet. Anyway, my comment is about TOJT. Wouldn't you agree Jacob has been having his trouble for the last 2000 years. AD 70, Nazi Germany, bombed almost daily in today's time. I personally don't think TOJT has anything to do with last 7 years.
 

ChosenbyHim

Senior Member
Sep 19, 2011
3,343
114
63
#3
ChosenbyHim, sorry I can't watch the video... I have HughesNet. Anyway, my comment is about TOJT. Wouldn't you agree Jacob has been having his trouble for the last 2000 years. AD 70, Nazi Germany, bombed almost daily in today's time. I personally don't think TOJT has anything to do with last 7 years.

Hello there sir, I understand that the Jews have had trouble and persecution for the last 2,000 years. But the time that is predicted in Jeremiah 30 is described very specifically.


Jeremiah 30:4-11

Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)


4 And these are the words that the Lord spake concerning Israel and concerning Judah. 5 For thus saith the Lord; We have heard a voice of trembling, of fear, and not of peace. 6 Ask ye now, and see whether a man doth travail with child? wherefore do I see every man with his hands on his loins, as a woman in travail, and all faces are turned into paleness? 7 Alas! for that day is great, so that none is like it: it is even the time of Jacob’s trouble; but he shall be saved out of it. 8 For it shall come to pass in that day, saith the Lord of hosts, that I will break his yoke from off thy neck, and will burst thy bonds, and strangers shall no more serve themselves of him: 9 but they shall serve the Lord their God, and David their king, whom I will raise up unto them.
10 Therefore fear thou not, O my servant Jacob,
saith the Lord; neither be dismayed, O Israel:
for, lo, I will save thee from afar,
and thy seed from the land of their captivity;
and Jacob shall return, and shall be in rest, and be quiet,
and none shall make him afraid.
11 For I am with thee, saith the Lord, to save thee:
though I make a full end of all nations whither I have scattered thee,
yet will I not make a full end of thee:
but I will correct thee in measure,
and will not leave thee altogether unpunished.




Now notice brother where it says in verse 6 the following: "and see whether a man travail with child?"

Now what could this portion of Scripture be referring to? Well consider that in the time of Jacob's trouble, if a man does not have the mark, he cannot buy anything. He will therefore have to go away starving.

Notice as we read further into the verse 6, look at what it says:

"wherefore do I see every man with his hands on his loins, as a woman in travail, and all faces are turned into paleness?"


Again, this has to be talking about men that will have to go hungry because they have not taken the mark of the beast and therefore they cannot buy any food.


Think about it today brother, what happens if a man gets really hungry. What usually happens after a while? Doesn't his face start to turn pale? Doesn't he start to get pains in his stomach? Of course. That is what Jeremiah is seeing in this prophecy that the LORD gave him concerning Israel and Judah.


Now let us look at verse 7 brother:


7 Alas! for that day is great, so that none is like it: it is even the time of Jacob’s trouble; but he shall be saved out of it.

Notice that the day is described as being great and that there is none like it. Now let's compare Scripture with Scripture.


Matthew 24:19-21

Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)


19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! 20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day: 21 for then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.


So by comparing Scripture with Scripture we can see that this time which Jesus prophesied about in Matthew 24 lines up to the prophecy that the LORD grace to Jeremiah. The time of Jacob's trouble will be so severe that no other day will ever be like it. This is clearly a reference to the seventieth week of Daniel's Prophecy. And before Daniel's 70th week can happen, we (the church) must be taken off of the Earth. Another way that you can look at this sir is this way. During the last 2,000 years of Church History, what and who has been the focus?


Has Israel been the focus or has the Church been the main focus during these last 2,000 years?


Well, what dispensation are we now in?


We are in the Dispensation of Grace. The Church Age. Right now, God is dealing with the Gentile nations. Anyone can get saved today. With regard to salvation, there is no distinction.


There is no Jew or Gentile in the Church. There are only Christians (See Gal. 3:28 & Col. 3:11).


I do understand that while the Jews have been persecuted down through the centuries of these 2,000 years, that also the Church has been persecuted by the Papacy and Roman Catholic church.

But again sir, we read in Jeremiah 30:7, that in this time of Jacob's trouble, the focus is going to be on Israel (Jacob). We can see this by reading the remaining verses (8-11) in Jeremiah 30:


8 For it shall come to pass in that day, saith the Lord of hosts, that I will break his yoke from off thy neck, and will burst thy bonds, and strangers shall no more serve themselves of him: 9 but they shall serve the Lord their God, and David their king, whom I will raise up unto them.
10 Therefore fear thou not, O my servant Jacob,
saith the Lord; neither be dismayed, O Israel:
for, lo, I will save thee from afar,
and thy seed from the land of their captivity;
and Jacob shall return, and shall be in rest, and be quiet,
and none shall make him afraid.

11 For I am with thee, saith the Lord, to save thee:
though I make a full end of all nations whither I have scattered thee,
yet will I not make a full end of thee:

but I will correct thee in measure,
and will not leave thee altogether unpunished.


When verse 10 says that: Jacob shall return, and shall be in rest, and be quiet, and none shall make him afraid.

That happens after the tribulation (time of Jacob's trouble).

And then notice verse 11:


11 For I am with thee, saith the Lord, to save thee:
though I make a full end of all nations whither I have scattered thee,
yet will I not make a full end of thee:

but I will correct thee in measure,
and will not leave thee altogether unpunished.


The Lord says that He will save Israel. And that though He makes a full end of all nations where He has scattered them (Israel), that He will not make a full end of them (Israel). Then the Lord Almighty says that He will correct them (Israel) in measure, and will not leave Israel altogether unpunished.


This time that is prophesied to Jeremiah, is concerning Israel and Judah during Daniel's 70th week), the time of Jacob's trouble. We know it has to be future because the LORD declared that there will be no day like it (the time of Jacob's trouble). And when you compare it with Matthew 24:21, it lines right up.



 
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ChosenbyHim

Senior Member
Sep 19, 2011
3,343
114
63
#4
Also sir, another way you can know that the prophecy in Jeremiah 30 concerning the time of Jacob's trouble is future is in verse 11 where the LORD says that He will make a full end of all nations.


The Gentile nations and powers have not been destroyed yet. The UN (United Nations, better known as the United Nonsense) is still in power, the ECC is still in power.


So we know that Jeremiah 30 has to be referring to the future. When Jesus Christ comes back at His Second Coming and Advent, He judges the Nations, concerning how they treated His brethren (the Jews). And at His Second Advent, at the Battle of Armageddon, He will make a full end of all the Gentile Nations where His people had been scattered. And then will our Lord Jesus Christ set up His Millennial Kingdom and will sit upon the Davidic throne in the city of Jerusalem as He is ruling and reigning over the kingdoms of the Earth for 1,000 years.
 
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C

CRC

Guest
#5
The Bible shows that before the start of Christ’s promised Thousand Year Reign, there will be a period called the “great tribulation.” Said Jesus: “Then there will be great tribulation such as has not occurred since the world’s beginning until now, no, nor will occur again.” (Matthew 24:21; Revelation 20:6) Some place the rapture ahead of the great tribulation. Others expect it during that time. Still others think that the rapture will come after that unparalleled distress.
The posttribulation view was predominant until the early 19th century. Then, in England there developed a movement headed by a former Church of Ireland clergyman, John Nelson Darby. He and like-minded Anglicans became known as the Brethren. From his Plymouth base, Darby traveled to preach in Switzerland and elsewhere in Europe. He asserted that Christ’s return would occur in two stages. It would begin with a secret rapture, in which the “saints” would be caught away before a seven-year period of tribulation devastated the earth. Then Christ would appear visibly, accompanied by these “saints,” and together they would rule on earth for a thousand years.
Darby stressed the need to be separate from the world, and those sharing his views eventually became known as the Exclusive Brethren. B. W. Newton headed a different faction that believed in the rapture but not in a pretribulation one. Posttribulation advocate Alexander Reese maintained that “the Secret-Rapture theories are a menace to the hope of Christ’s Coming.”
Pretribulationists believe that this difference in viewpoint is serious enough to affect “the nature of [their] hope in relation to the coming of Christ.” Others place confidence in a “partial rapture theory,” believing that those who are most loyal to Christ will be raptured first and the more worldly will be taken later.
Many evangelical groups herald an imminent rapture of faithful Christians. In view of differing opinions, however, a booklet published by Britain’s Elim Pentecostal Church says: “Whilst we subscribe to a broad outline of events related to the return of the Lord Jesus . . . , freedom is allowed in the interpreting of prophecy according to the conviction of the individual. Many accept a non-dogmatic position, patiently waiting for the events themselves to unfold the prophetic programme.”
God’s inspired Word, the Bible, is the standard by which we need to measure the truthfulness of all beliefs. (2 Timothy 1:13; 3:16, 17) Therefore, what does it say about the rapture?
 
M

miktre

Guest
#6
Guy in the video can contemplate all day long about who or who will not make it through the tribulation. His entire video is made invalid with just a few verses off the top of my head.

Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.


Mar 13:20 And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.
 
Nov 23, 2013
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#7
Jer 30:8 For it shall come to pass in that day, saith the LORD of hosts, that I will break his yoke from off thy neck, and will burst thy bonds, and strangers shall no more serve themselves of him:
Jer 30:9 But they shall serve the LORD their God, and David their king, whom I will raise up unto them.

In "that day", the Lord will break the yoke from Jacob's neck. What was the yoke on his neck?
Act 15:5 But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.
Act 15:6 And the apostles and elders came together for to consider of this matter.
Act 15:7 And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.
Act 15:8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;
Act 15:9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.
Act 15:10 Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?
When was the yoke (keeping the law of Moses), broken off? When David their king (Jesus) was raised up.
So at least to this point wouldn't you agree we are talking about the first coming of Jesus?
 
N

nathan3

Guest
#8
That guy is going to be left out in the woods in the snow. Paul made that crystal clear in II Thessalonians 2.