Jude condemns “grace-only without obedience” believers to hell
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lol.. Do they obey the commands TO GET SAVED.
or BECAUSE THEY ARE SAVED?
Do they love God to get saved. Or because they are saved (he loved them first)
We love because he first loved us, Saying we have to obey first is not love, it is saying earn your way yourself..
That's what I mean about taking a verse out of context. It does not say what you want it to say.
A very big factor in looking at scripture is the "lens" you use to view the scripture.
In the Old Covenant " you had to do or else"..If you do this..then I God will do that.." = conditional on the person performing
New Covenant = Jesus has done it for you which empowers you to "do"
Let's take a look at a common scripture with these 2 mindsets.
Jesus said.." If you love Me, you will keep My commandments"
Old Covenant mindset = conditional on the person "doing"..
So they would read it this way.."IF you love Me you will keep My commandments"..in their mind it's saying.."Keep My commandment and you will prove you love Me."
New Covenant mindset = it's a description of who you are in Christ.
They would see this "Jesus' love is in me so I keep His commandments"..it stems out of relationship and it is not conditional but descriptive of the believer.
1 John 4:18-19 (NASB)
[SUP]18 [/SUP] There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves punishment, and the one who fears is not perfected in love.
[SUP]19 [/SUP] We love, because He first loved us.
Then there is more..lol..there seems to be more sometimes eh?..just what are His commandments anyway?..Be perfect as My Father in heaven is perfect?...can we possibly do that?..of course not..that is Moses 2.0 - the Law of Moses on steroids
Ahhh..found His commandments in 1 John 3.
1 John 3:23 (NASB)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us.
...the "lens" that we view scriptures greatly affects us. We try to mix the Old Covenant ( before the cross and resurrection ) with the New Covenant and we get a religious mess.
Religious traditions of men, philosophies of men, ..what we were told all our lives in church or in the world etc. ..all influence how we view scripture. Sometimes some of our "sacred cows" can get sacrificed and it's painful.
Colossians 2:8 (NASB)
[SUP]8[/SUP] See to it that no one takes you captive through philosophy and empty deception, according to the tradition of men, according to the elementary principles of the world, rather than according to Christ.
In the Old Covenant " you had to do or else"..If you do this..then I God will do that.." = conditional on the person performing
New Covenant = Jesus has done it for you which empowers you to "do"
Let's take a look at a common scripture with these 2 mindsets.
Jesus said.." If you love Me, you will keep My commandments"
Old Covenant mindset = conditional on the person "doing"..
So they would read it this way.."IF you love Me you will keep My commandments"..in their mind it's saying.."Keep My commandment and you will prove you love Me."
New Covenant mindset = it's a description of who you are in Christ.
They would see this "Jesus' love is in me so I keep His commandments"..it stems out of relationship and it is not conditional but descriptive of the believer.
1 John 4:18-19 (NASB)
[SUP]18 [/SUP] There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves punishment, and the one who fears is not perfected in love.
[SUP]19 [/SUP] We love, because He first loved us.
Then there is more..lol..there seems to be more sometimes eh?..just what are His commandments anyway?..Be perfect as My Father in heaven is perfect?...can we possibly do that?..of course not..that is Moses 2.0 - the Law of Moses on steroids
Ahhh..found His commandments in 1 John 3.
1 John 3:23 (NASB)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us.
...the "lens" that we view scriptures greatly affects us. We try to mix the Old Covenant ( before the cross and resurrection ) with the New Covenant and we get a religious mess.
Religious traditions of men, philosophies of men, ..what we were told all our lives in church or in the world etc. ..all influence how we view scripture. Sometimes some of our "sacred cows" can get sacrificed and it's painful.
Colossians 2:8 (NASB)
[SUP]8[/SUP] See to it that no one takes you captive through philosophy and empty deception, according to the tradition of men, according to the elementary principles of the world, rather than according to Christ.
Romans 8
God Works In All Things
28And we know that God works all things together for the good of those who love Him, who are called according to His purpose. 29For those God foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brothers. 30And those He predestined He also called, those He called He also justified, those He justified He also glorified.…
why do folks feel this need to compel others to see the text in scripture as they do? Is it important that we walk with our Messiah in a way that is pleasing to Him? each one of us is given personal attention tailored to our needs and ability to accept and live in the truth we are given, the Holy Spirit will guide and lead each as the Father sees fit, his love and mercy toward is amazing, and His justice is absolutely righteous, as we walk with Him in humility and sincerity our characters are formed and molded in to the image and likeness of our Beloved Savior, however mankind can never change the heart or convince others without the aid of and the leading of His Spirit, knowing this we should be able not only to give answer for the hope that is in us , but also to share without any expectation of acceptance by others, either they will receive it or not... not for us to convince or pursued but rather just share....