Page 7 of 9 FirstFirst ... 56789 LastLast
Results 121 to 140 of 171
Like Tree78Likes

Bible Discussion Forum

Ask (or answer) Bible questions here. Join or start a Bible discussion now!

Thread: Law of God vs. Law of Moses

  1. #121
    Senior Member Shamah's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 6th, 2018
    Age
    35
    Posts
    1,260
    Rep Power
    20

    Default Re: Law of God vs. Law of Moses

    Quote Originally Posted by Jackson123 View Post
    So do you believe we have to do sabbath law because the word of God never pass away?

    animal sacrifice is also the word of God, kill sabbath violator is the word of God, is SDA kill the sabbath violator, or do animal sacrifice because the word of God never pass away?
    I have nothing to do with SDA so mentioning them to me is pointless. All of YHWH's Laws are valid. A number of sin deserve death:

    1 John 5:17, "All unrighteousness is sin, and there is a sin not unto death."

    murder, adultery, not putting YHWH first, Sabbath breaking, etc.

    Yahsua will judge righty when He returns:

    Isaiah 24:1-6, "See, יהוה is making the earth empty and making it waste, and shall overturn its surface, and shall scatter abroad its inhabitants. 2 And it shall be – as with the people so with the priest, as with the servant so with his master, as with the female servant so with her mistress, as with the buyer so with the seller, as with the lender so with the borrower, as with the creditor so with the debtor; 3 the earth is completely emptied and utterly plundered, for יהוה has spoken this word. 4 The earth shall mourn and wither, the world shall languish and wither, the haughty people of the earth shall languish. 5 For the earth has been defiled under its inhabitants, because they have transgressed the Torah, changed the law, broken the everlasting covenant. 6 Therefore a curse shall consume the earth, and those who dwell in it be punished. Therefore the inhabitants of the earth shall be burned, and few men shall be left.

    Revelation 19:11-16, “And I saw the heaven opened, and there was a white horse. And He who sat on him was called Trustworthy and True, and in righteousness He judges and fights. And His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on His head were many crowns, having a Name that had been written, which no one had perceived except Himself – and having been dressed in a robe dipped in blood (Isaiah 63:2) and His Name is called: The Word of יהוה. And the armies in the heaven, dressed in fine linen, white and clean, followed Him on white horses. And out of His mouth goes a sharp sword, that with it He should smite the nations. And He shall shepherd them with a rod of iron. And He treads the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of the Almighty Strength. And on His robe and on His thigh He has a name written: SOVEREIGN OF SOVEREIGNS AND MASTER OF MASTERS.”

    See the sword the comes out of His mouth? "out of His mouth goes a sharp sword, that with it He should smite the nations"

    Hebrews 4:12-13, “For the Word of Yah is living, and working, and sharper than any two-edged sword, cutting through even to the dividing of being and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart. And there is no creature hidden from His sight, but all are naked and laid bare before the eyes of Him with whom is our account.”

    John/Yahanan 12:48, "He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day."

    Revelation 21:1, "I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away."

    Mat 24:35, “Heaven and earth may pass away, but My teachings will not pass away.”

    Concerning animal sacrifice:

    Hebrews
    10:14, "For by one offering He has perfected for all time those who are being set apart."
    10:15, "And the Set-apart Spirit also witnesses to us, for after having said before,"
    10:16, "“This is the covenant that I shall make with them after those days, says
    יהוה, giving My laws into their hearts, and in their minds I shall write them,
    Exodus 20:6, “But showing love to thousands who love Me by keeping My Laws.”


    John/Yahanan 14:15, “If you love Me, keep My commandments.”


    John 14:23-24, "יהושע answered him, “If anyone loves Me, he shall guard My Word. And My Father shall love him, and We shall come to him and make Our home with him. He who does not love Me does not guard My Words. And the Word which you hear is not Mine but of the Father Who sent Me.”

  2. #122
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    August 8th, 2011
    Age
    35
    Posts
    16,356
    Blog Entries
    76
    Rep Power
    277

    Default Re: Law of God vs. Law of Moses

    5 spiritual disciplines (30 minutes or more each day)

    1.Worship (music, meditation, nature walk, bike ride, kayaking, swimming, etc) basically giving thanks for the wonderful blessings God has already given me.

    2. Listen/ read bible

    3. Outreach/ missions (cards, call someone, volunteering)
    Reaching out to others and reminding them of God's love

    4. Prayers/ journaling..a time for personal reflection and for me to talk to God or listen for His answers

    5.5. Classwork/ bible study (steven ministry reading, disciple 1, Christ care, other Christian books or movies)


    So you see I worship God every day. Each day is different because God moves me where He calls me but each day I see His blessings and His hope and I have His joy in my heart.

    Sunday I go to church sometimes I serve in the children ministry as a Sunday school teacher or serve communion or whatever God leads me to do.

    Monday I babysit for the Moms connect group at church and sometimes attend a yoga class an 87 lady teaches.,,it's not demonic but more of a stretching class. She is christian, we don't worship deities but she does each class by announcing us with oil on our foreheads, giving us a head and neck massage, telling us to let go of working and give our worries to God. Then she says " be kind to yourself and be kind to others."

    Tuesday I attend a bible study (discipleship 1 by the Methodist conference preacher) and a Stephen ministry training class

    Wednesday I volunteer and mentor and tutor 2 sixth graders, then tutor 9 teenagers at church from 4-5,

    Have dinner with our church (60-120 people) and then lead a Christ care small group for moms (just 3-6 people) we plan on starting Adam Hamilton video series "Half truths"

    (anyone else tired yet? Lol but God gives me energy to do it..,just not list it all) anyway keep in mind I have a husband and two kids 9 and 12 to care for as well.

    Thursday is my family day. Sometimes I go to the elementary school in the morning but this is the day I normally clean the house and my family cuddles on the couch watching a Netflix movie...However during wrestling season. Not so much since my son wrestles with his middle school team.

    Friday I prepare food so I don't have to cook Sat. Sometimes we go camping on the weekends

    Sat I do what ever reminds me of my true home and my heavenly father's love. This Sat I spent at a Messianic service, listening to a friend, buying food at an oriental srore, petting animals at a pet store, bday party

  3. #123
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    August 8th, 2011
    Age
    35
    Posts
    16,356
    Blog Entries
    76
    Rep Power
    277

    Default Re: Law of God vs. Law of Moses

    My phone is dying so gonna charge it.,, currently 2.49 am so why am I awake again Lord?

  4. #124
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    February 6th, 2014
    Age
    62
    Posts
    5,160
    Rep Power
    65

    Default Re: Law of God vs. Law of Moses

    Quote Originally Posted by Shamah View Post
    I have nothing to do with SDA so mentioning them to me is pointless. All of YHWH's Laws are valid. A number of sin deserve death:

    1 John 5:17, "All unrighteousness is sin, and there is a sin not unto death."

    murder, adultery, not putting YHWH first, Sabbath breaking, etc.

    Yahsua will judge righty when He returns:

    Isaiah 24:1-6, "See, יהוה is making the earth empty and making it waste, and shall overturn its surface, and shall scatter abroad its inhabitants. 2 And it shall be – as with the people so with the priest, as with the servant so with his master, as with the female servant so with her mistress, as with the buyer so with the seller, as with the lender so with the borrower, as with the creditor so with the debtor; 3 the earth is completely emptied and utterly plundered, for יהוה has spoken this word. 4 The earth shall mourn and wither, the world shall languish and wither, the haughty people of the earth shall languish. 5 For the earth has been defiled under its inhabitants, because they have transgressed the Torah, changed the law, broken the everlasting covenant. 6 Therefore a curse shall consume the earth, and those who dwell in it be punished. Therefore the inhabitants of the earth shall be burned, and few men shall be left.

    Revelation 19:11-16, “And I saw the heaven opened, and there was a white horse. And He who sat on him was called Trustworthy and True, and in righteousness He judges and fights. And His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on His head were many crowns, having a Name that had been written, which no one had perceived except Himself – and having been dressed in a robe dipped in blood (Isaiah 63:2) and His Name is called: The Word of יהוה. And the armies in the heaven, dressed in fine linen, white and clean, followed Him on white horses. And out of His mouth goes a sharp sword, that with it He should smite the nations. And He shall shepherd them with a rod of iron. And He treads the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of the Almighty Strength. And on His robe and on His thigh He has a name written: SOVEREIGN OF SOVEREIGNS AND MASTER OF MASTERS.”

    See the sword the comes out of His mouth? "out of His mouth goes a sharp sword, that with it He should smite the nations"

    Hebrews 4:12-13, “For the Word of Yah is living, and working, and sharper than any two-edged sword, cutting through even to the dividing of being and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart. And there is no creature hidden from His sight, but all are naked and laid bare before the eyes of Him with whom is our account.”

    John/Yahanan 12:48, "He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day."

    Revelation 21:1, "I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away."

    Mat 24:35, “Heaven and earth may pass away, but My teachings will not pass away.”

    Concerning animal sacrifice:

    Hebrews
    10:14, "For by one offering He has perfected for all time those who are being set apart."
    10:15, "And the Set-apart Spirit also witnesses to us, for after having said before,"
    10:16, "“This is the covenant that I shall make with them after those days, says
    יהוה, giving My laws into their hearts, and in their minds I shall write them,
    so you do sabbath law, kill sabbath violator, do sacrifice animal, because all God word are valid?

  5. #125
    Senior Member Shamah's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 6th, 2018
    Age
    35
    Posts
    1,260
    Rep Power
    20

    Default Re: Law of God vs. Law of Moses

    Quote Originally Posted by Jackson123 View Post
    so you do sabbath law, kill sabbath violator, do sacrifice animal, because all God word are valid?
    you didnt read anything i wrote did you?
    Exodus 20:6, “But showing love to thousands who love Me by keeping My Laws.”


    John/Yahanan 14:15, “If you love Me, keep My commandments.”


    John 14:23-24, "יהושע answered him, “If anyone loves Me, he shall guard My Word. And My Father shall love him, and We shall come to him and make Our home with him. He who does not love Me does not guard My Words. And the Word which you hear is not Mine but of the Father Who sent Me.”

  6. #126
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    February 6th, 2014
    Age
    62
    Posts
    5,160
    Rep Power
    65

    Default Re: Law of God vs. Law of Moses

    Quote Originally Posted by Shamah View Post
    you didnt read anything i wrote did you?
    you quote a verse that say the word of God never pass away, and I curious, why, what is the reason, that is why I ask you

    1. Is that because you going to say sabbath law is valid

    2. Kill sabbath violator is valid because It is the Word

    3. Animal sacrifice is valid, because the Word never pass away

  7. #127
    Senior Member Shamah's Avatar
    Join Date
    January 6th, 2018
    Age
    35
    Posts
    1,260
    Rep Power
    20

    Default Re: Law of God vs. Law of Moses

    Quote Originally Posted by Jackson123 View Post
    you quote a verse that say the word of God never pass away, and I curious, why, what is the reason, that is why I ask you

    1. Is that because you going to say sabbath law is valid

    2. Kill sabbath violator is valid because It is the Word

    3. Animal sacrifice is valid, because the Word never pass away
    It means what it says if heaven and earth did not pass then the Law did not pass. Do you beleve the Messiah's words?

    Mat 5:18, "I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh; the smallest of the letters will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."

    Revelation 21:1, "I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away."





    Mat 24:35, “Heaven and earth may pass away, but My teachings will not pass away.”


    Luke 16:16-17, "The Law and the Prophets were until John, since that time the Kingdom of YHWH is preached, and every man is pressed to enter it. But it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one yodh of the Law to fail."


    Daniyl 7:25, "And he will speak great words against YHWH, and will wear out; mentally attack to cause to fall away, the saints of YHWH, and think to change times and Laws…"


    and if you read my prior post I answered your questions about Sabbath, judgement and sacrifice.
    Exodus 20:6, “But showing love to thousands who love Me by keeping My Laws.”


    John/Yahanan 14:15, “If you love Me, keep My commandments.”


    John 14:23-24, "יהושע answered him, “If anyone loves Me, he shall guard My Word. And My Father shall love him, and We shall come to him and make Our home with him. He who does not love Me does not guard My Words. And the Word which you hear is not Mine but of the Father Who sent Me.”

  8. #128
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    August 8th, 2011
    Age
    35
    Posts
    16,356
    Blog Entries
    76
    Rep Power
    277

    Default Re: Law of God vs. Law of Moses

    Quote Originally Posted by Jackson123 View Post
    you quote a verse that say the word of God never pass away, and I curious, why, what is the reason, that is why I ask you

    1. Is that because you going to say sabbath law is valid

    2. Kill sabbath violator is valid because It is the Word

    3. Animal sacrifice is valid, because the Word never pass away
    i know you didn't ask me and folks have yelled at me for speaking up but i can give you what i believe the Bible says on the matter.

    1. sabbath law is still valid. however many forget or don't understand Jesus words when He says "Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath."

    2. God's grace teaches us to forgive those who do not keep the Sabbath because they do more harm to themselves than to anyone else. Jesus teaches turning the other cheek, going the extra mile, forgiving instead of seeking vengeance. we are in NEW covenant grace. Not Old covenant retribution. praise God.

    3. no more animal sacrifices because Jesus spread His blood on the altar of heaven and we have been cleansed of our sins and dwell with Him NOW in heavenly places

    i have scriptures if needed but only the Holy Spirit will show ANYone (not personal statement or judgement) HIS Truth.

  9. #129
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    August 8th, 2011
    Age
    35
    Posts
    16,356
    Blog Entries
    76
    Rep Power
    277

    Default Re: Law of God vs. Law of Moses

    i wanted to share a song with those who like me attend church on Sunday and love week long revivals.

    it is special to me because i didn't hear it first on the radio or in church, but sung by my daughter while she was cleaning her room. She turns 10 in March and witnesses to her classmates about the fact God is her best friend. when she was in 1st grade she was baptized and was showing her teacher her certificate. one of her friends asked her what it meant to be baptized and she told them clearly the simple truth: Jesus saved me from my sins and loves me forever. she was baptized by a Church of Christ minister and i didn't realize they normally only baptize adults not children. but she knew her bible and insisted she wanted my mother-in-law pastor to baptize her. not any of the other 3 or four churches we attended. (yeah i still attend at least 5 churches a year)

    anyway the words spoke to me because its is by the joy and music in my heart that i know i am walking with God. if it falls silent, i stop and pray because something isn't right.

    [COLOR=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.87)]Old Church Choir[/COLOR]
    Zach Williams





    There's revival, and it's spreading
    Like a wildfire in my heart
    Sunday morning, Hallelujah
    And it's lasting all week long
    Can you hear it?
    Can you feel it?
    It's the rhythm of a gospel song
    Oh, once you choose it, you can lose it
    There ain't nothing, there ain't nothing gonna steal my joy
    I got an Old Church Choir singing in my soul
    I got a sweet salvation and it's beautiful
    I've got a heart overflowing 'cause I've been restored
    There ain't nothing gonna steal my joy
    No, there ain't nothing gonna steal my joy
    When the valleys that I wander
    Turn to mountains that I can climb
    Oh, you are with me, never leave me
    Oh, 'cause there ain't nothing, there ain't nothing gonna steal my joy
    I got an Old Church Choir singing in my soul





    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-cRh8NqmXoE

  10. #130
    Senior Member beta's Avatar
    Join Date
    August 8th, 2016
    Age
    88
    Posts
    2,273
    Rep Power
    45

    Default Re: Law of God vs. Law of Moses

    Quote Originally Posted by Shamah View Post
    you didnt read anything i wrote did you?
    They never do....unless they CAN'T.... being blind and refusing to be healed !
    It is only when people turn to the REAL Jesus that they will be healed of their different maladies that beset them. The jesus they follow now can't do anything for them...not that he even wants to heal them and happy to keep them deceived !!!

  11. #131
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    August 8th, 2011
    Age
    35
    Posts
    16,356
    Blog Entries
    76
    Rep Power
    277

    Default Re: Law of God vs. Law of Moses

    the prosperity gospel and name it and claim it is a lie.

    God heals spiritual wounds always. miracles of physical healings only when it spreads His gospel message. these bodies are but tents and even Jesus endured suffering upon the cross. even Timothy had a stomach ailment.

    Jesus said it is not because of the man's sin or the sins of his parents that he was born blind.

    people jump to the fact that Jesus healed him, but forget that JESUS JUST DENIED THE LAW OF KARMA that the world has swallowed as truth. Good does NOT always come to those who do good. Evil does NOT always come to those who do evil only.

    sometimes Good people suffer. Jesus was sinless but he suffered and even died for OUR sins. sometimes we are called to be like Him and we suffer not for our sins (which Jesus has taken) but because we live in a sinful world.

    i could quote scriptures but folks should know it or search them out themselves. be bearens. don't expect to be spoonfed or take in only reguitated milk through 15 minute sermons on Sunday.

    God says My people die from the lack of knowledge and wisdom.

    seek WISDOM.

    you eat three times a day (most people in the Western world or who have the blessings to be able to be on this website)

    how often do you pray? How often do you read your Bible? how often do you do good works for others?

    Are you lukewarm? are you doubleminded? do you pray for things so that GOD's will will be done or your own?
    Don't take my word for it. Search Scriptures for yourself!

    Acts 17:11 Now the Berean Jews were of more noble character than those in Thessalonica, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true.

  12. #132
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    February 6th, 2014
    Age
    62
    Posts
    5,160
    Rep Power
    65

    Default Re: Law of God vs. Law of Moses

    Quote Originally Posted by Shamah View Post
    It means what it says if heaven and earth did not pass then the Law did not pass. Do you beleve the Messiah's words?

    Mat 5:18, "I say to you; Unless heaven and earth passes away, one yodh; the smallest of the letters will in no way pass from the Law, until all things are perfected."

    Revelation 21:1, "I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away."





    Mat 24:35, “Heaven and earth may pass away, but My teachings will not pass away.”


    Luke 16:16-17, "The Law and the Prophets were until John, since that time the Kingdom of YHWH is preached, and every man is pressed to enter it. But it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one yodh of the Law to fail."


    Daniyl 7:25, "And he will speak great words against YHWH, and will wear out; mentally attack to cause to fall away, the saints of YHWH, and think to change times and Laws…"


    and if you read my prior post I answered your questions about Sabbath, judgement and sacrifice.
    so It mean you do sabbat law, and kill sabbat violator because heaven and earth not pass, am I correct?

  13. #133
    Senior Member mailmandan's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 7th, 2014
    Age
    52
    Posts
    14,263
    Rep Power
    457

    Default Re: Law of God vs. Law of Moses

    Quote Originally Posted by Marcelo View Post
    Obviously you can't answer my questions, so you respond by calling me blind, unbelieving, disobedient, etc.
    Sadly, the Judaizing spirit continues on in yet another thread that pertains to the Law.



    The Gospel remains under attack by SDA/Hebrew Roots movement types who play the same game in salvation as every other false movement of Christendom. They profess to teach that salvation is by grace through faith, but then redefine this in a way that is contrary to the Truth. Even though they may even deny this, they teach that salvation is by "grace plus law, faith plus works." Their doctrine of salvation is a "subtle mixture of law and grace" that is a perversion of the Gospel. (Galatians 1:6-9).
    Marcelo likes this.
    I'm not a bad guy. I'm just misunderstood.

    Galatians 6:14 - But God forbid that I should boast except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world.

  14. #134
    Senior Member Marcelo's Avatar
    Join Date
    February 4th, 2016
    Age
    67
    Posts
    895
    Rep Power
    24

    Default Re: Law of God vs. Law of Moses

    Quote Originally Posted by Jackson123 View Post
    So do you believe we have to do sabbath law because the word of God never pass away?

    animal sacrifice is also the word of God, kill sabbath violator is the word of God, is SDA kill the sabbath violator, or do animal sacrifice because the word of God never pass away?

    There is an important reason why they don't kill Sabbath violators today: Not one of them would be left alive to keep their movement going.
    Grandpa likes this.

  15. #135
    Senior Member mailmandan's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 7th, 2014
    Age
    52
    Posts
    14,263
    Rep Power
    457

    Default Re: Law of God vs. Law of Moses

    Quote Originally Posted by Jackson123 View Post
    So do you believe we have to do sabbath law because the word of God never pass away?

    animal sacrifice is also the word of God, kill sabbath violator is the word of God, is SDA kill the sabbath violator, or do animal sacrifice because the word of God never pass away?
    Even when Sabbatarians set out to worship on the Sabbath, are they truly "keeping the Sabbath?" To "keep the Sabbath" as it was required in the Old Testament under the Old Covenant would involve compliance with specific regulations (Exodus 16:23; 35:3; Leviticus 23:32; Jeremiah 17:21) that were strictly enforced.

    If Sabbath day observances are still required and the word of God never passes away "in that sense" then so would the burnt offerings which went along with them (Leviticus 19:30; 23:2-3; Numbers 28:1-10; 29:39-40; I Chronicles. 23:30-31; II Chronicles 31:2-4; Isaiah 1:13). So no kindling a fire in any of your dwellings on the sabbath (Exodus 35:3). Every man must remain in his place (no traveling) on the sabbath (Exodus 16:29). No trading (Amos 8:5). No marketing (Nehemiah 10:31; 13:15,19).

    These were commanded by God to Israel (Exodus 35:1).

    If the seventh day Sabbath is still in affect, then why do not the Sabbatarians seek to obey ALL that the LORD commanded? How can a person keep a certain law when he keeps only part of it?

    If the Sabbath day laws were still in effect today, then according to Exodus 31:12-18; 35:1-3; and Numbers 15:32-36, anyone who profaned the Sabbath was put to death and any person who does any work on it, that person shall be cut off from his people.

    Who is going to enforce that? The Jewish synagogue? The Seventh day Adventist church? The Government? Since we do not live under a theocratic state as ancient Israel did under the Old Covenant, no Sabbatarian can live consistently under these Mosaic regulations. We are not fooled by Judaizer propaganda which is just SDA/Hebrew Roots smoke and mirrors.
    Grandpa likes this.
    I'm not a bad guy. I'm just misunderstood.

    Galatians 6:14 - But God forbid that I should boast except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world.

  16. #136
    Banned
    Join Date
    June 5th, 2017
    Age
    55
    Posts
    3,675
    Rep Power
    0

    Default Re: Law of God vs. Law of Moses

    Quote Originally Posted by mailmandan View Post
    Even when Sabbatarians set out to worship on the Sabbath, are they truly "keeping the Sabbath?" To "keep the Sabbath" as it was required in the Old Testament under the Old Covenant would involve compliance with specific regulations (Exodus 16:23; 35:3; Leviticus 23:32; Jeremiah 17:21) that were strictly enforced.

    If Sabbath day observances are still required and the word of God never passes away "in that sense" then so would the burnt offerings which went along with them (Leviticus 19:30; 23:2-3; Numbers 28:1-10; 29:39-40; I Chronicles. 23:30-31; II Chronicles 31:2-4; Isaiah 1:13). So no kindling a fire in any of your dwellings on the sabbath (Exodus 35:3). Every man must remain in his place (no traveling) on the sabbath (Exodus 16:29). No trading (Amos 8:5). No marketing (Nehemiah 10:31; 13:15,19).

    These were commanded by God to Israel (Exodus 35:1).

    If the seventh day Sabbath is still in affect, then why do not the Sabbatarians seek to obey ALL that the LORD commanded? How can a person keep a certain law when he keeps only part of it?

    If the Sabbath day laws were still in effect today, then according to Exodus 31:12-18; 35:1-3; and Numbers 15:32-36, anyone who profaned the Sabbath was put to death and any person who does any work on it, that person shall be cut off from his people.

    Who is going to enforce that? The Jewish synagogue? The Seventh day Adventist church? The Government? Since we do not live under a theocratic state as ancient Israel did under the Old Covenant, no Sabbatarian can live consistently under these Mosaic regulations. We are not fooled by Judaizer propaganda which is just SDA/Hebrew Roots smoke and mirrors.
    Hello MMD,

    You ignore all the scriptures and posts sent to you and do not reply to any of the posts and scriptures that show your interpretation is only building on sifting sand. I am worried about you my friend and ask that you at least consider the posts and the scriptures in them that disagree with your interpertation of God's Word.

    Do you disagree? Please adress the posts and the scriptures that disagree with your presentation of God's Word linked for your convenience adressing your post above and well pretty much everything else you have posted....

    Post # 3423; Post # 3424; Post # 3425; Post # 3426 and Post # 3427

    Now if you cannot answer these posts and the scriptures in them should you not just BELIEVE and FOLLOW the WORD of GOD?

    Only God's Word is true my friend and it is the Word of God that will be our judge come Judgement day. All who SIN do not KNOW him who loves all and SIN will keep all who practice is out of God's Kingdom.

    .......

    God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) If we knowingly break it when God asks us not to we stand guilty before God of committing sin (James 2:8-12). If we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness we are in danger of the Judgement (Hebrews 10:26-27)

    There is not one scripture in ALL of God's WORD that says God's 4th commandment is now ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to worship God on Sunday in it's place.

    Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has lead many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

    In times of ignorance God winks at but now calls all men everywhere to REPENT for the KINGDOM of HEAVEN is at HAND (Acts 17:30-31)

    Hope this helps..

  17. #137
    Senior Member lightbearer's Avatar
    Join Date
    June 17th, 2017
    Age
    52
    Posts
    886
    Blog Entries
    21
    Rep Power
    21

    Smile Re: Law of God vs. Law of Moses

    Quote Originally Posted by Jackson123 View Post
    Deuteronomy 4:13-14King James Version (KJV)

    13 And he declared unto you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.

    10 commandment is covenant, and It is in OT, so It is old covenant.

    do you believe 10 commandment is new covenant? If so why, tell me the reason.
    Not in tables of stone but in the fleshly tables of our hearts.


    Not according to the covenant that I cut with their fathers in the day I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt (which covenant of Mine they broke, although I was a HUSBAND to them, says Jehovah (and HE shall be joined unto HIS wife (us; HIS people), and we two shall be one flesh. This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.)

    For Jehovah your God will circumcise your heart, and the heart of your seed, to love Jehovah your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, that you may live. If thou shalt hearken unto the voice of the LORD thy God (that still small voice), to keep his commandments and his statutes which are written in this book of the law, and if thou turn unto the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul. For this commandment (Christ, the Word; the Commandments and HIS Statutes written in the Book of the Law) which I command thee this day, it is not hidden from thee, neither is it far off. It is not in heaven, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go up for us to heaven, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it? Neither is it beyond the sea, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go over the sea for us, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it? But the word (Christ, the Commandments and HIS Statutes written in the Book of the Law)is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, that thou mayest do it. That is the Faith in which Paul speaks in the Spirit's letter to us in Romans. Christ in us the Hope of Glory. The Word; HIS Commandments and HIS Statutes written in the Book of the Law in us the Hope of Glory. For HE is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, that thou mayest do it. That is the word of Faith in which we speak.

    There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling; One Lord, one faith, one baptism, One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all. For in him we live, and move, and have our being... For we are also his kind. We two shall be One flesh; the Body of Christ the Temple of GOD. For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.
    (Eph 4:4-6; Php 2:13; Act 17:27-28)


    Since we hardheartedly rejected to be joined unto the LORD then; to be HIS Wife. The LORD our GOD calls it to which HE speaks in Deuteronomy 30 a New Covenant in Jeremiah. But without a doubt this includes the Decalogue and all the Statutes and Commandments written in the Book of the Law as Deut. 30:6, 10-14 speaks. Not the Judgments and Ceremonies pertaining to sin, because all things are to be new and of GOD. We are a New Creation created in Christ Jesus. Not of the letter, but of the Spirit. Not in tables of stone , but in the fleshly tables of the heart. We are the Ark of the Covenant; the Body of Christ; the Temple of GOD. Surpassing the glory to which Israel could not steadfastly look upon in the face of Moses. Which Glory was to be done away with.

    Not that our sufficiency is of ourselves. Our sufficiency is of GOD. Not of the letter. But of the Spirit to which was to be since the beginning.

    For this shall be the covenant that I will cut with the house of Israel: After those days, declares Jehovah, I will put My law in their inward parts (minds), and I will write it on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. And they shall no longer each man teach his neighbor, and each man his brother, saying, Know Jehovah. For they shall all know Me, from the least of them even to the greatest of them, declares Jehovah. For I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sins no more.
    (Rom 10:6-8; Deu 30:10-14; Jer 31:32-34; Eph 5:31-32)
    Ariel82 likes this.
    LORD I believe; help THOU my unbelief! For YOU have given us all things that pertain to Life and godliness through Jesus Christ.

  18. #138
    Senior Member mailmandan's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 7th, 2014
    Age
    52
    Posts
    14,263
    Rep Power
    457

    Default Re: Law of God vs. Law of Moses

    Wonderful testimony and article from Patricia Allen who escaped from legalism in the SDA church.

    The Bible Says....

    WELCOME to my blog! As a former Seventh-day Adventist, I address the false doctrines I was taught to believe as a child and are still being espoused as truth from Adventists' pulpits today. I thank God for unshackling me from this different gospel and from the fear that gripped me daily because of uncertainty regarding my salvation. Eternal life is ours NOW if we believe the simple, unadulterated Good News of the Gospel. It is my prayer that we focus our attention on what The Bible Says...

    The Bible Says....: Are God's Law and Moses' Law Two Different Laws?

    Are God's Law and Moses' Law Two Different Laws?

    It has been my experience that whenever a Seventh- day Adventist (SDA) sees the words ‘law(s) or commandment(s)’ the automatic conclusion is that the author is referring to the Ten Commandments. That is why we are admonished to “Study to show ourselves approved unto God.’ It involves a lot of cross-referencing and reading the Bible in context to get to the real meat of what is being said. It also most definitely involves an attentive ear to the voice of the Holy Spirit.

    Even though it was in my future plans to post a blog on Moses Law and God’s Law, I find myself prematurely doing so as the result of a dialogue I am currently having with a member of the SDA church. His position is that there are two distinct laws: Moses Law and God’s Law. The Bible Says they are the same and they are, in fact, used interchangeably. The SDA’s position is that Moses’ Laws were the ceremonial laws, that only the ceremonial laws were nailed to the cross and God’s Law (the Ten Commandments) are permanent and were not nailed to the cross. My position is that the entire Torah referred to as God’s Law and Moses Law were nailed to the cross.

    The question is asked, “Are God’s Law and Moses’ Law the same? The following answer to this question is copied from my blog title, Seventh-day Adventists’ Amazing Facts Are Really Amazing, Question 13, for those you have read it and might want to skip down to ‘Are the Ten Commandments Eternal”? (IN RED)

    According to Amazing Facts and what Seventh-day Adventists teach, the answer is NO! They teach that Moses' law contained the temporary, ceremonial law of the Old Testament. It regulated the priesthood, sacrifices, rituals, meat and drink offerings, etc. all of which foreshadowed the cross. This law was added 'till the seed should come.' and that seed was Christ (Galatians 3:16,19). The ritual and ceremony of Moses' law pointed forward to Christ's sacrifice. When He died on the cross, this law came to an end, but the Ten Commandments (God's law) stands forever. That there are two laws is made crystal clear in Daniel 9:10,11.

    10 we have not obeyed the LORD our God or kept the laws he gave us through his servants the prophets. 11 All Israel has transgressed your law and turned away, refusing to obey you. "Therefore the curses and sworn judgments written in the Law of Moses, the servant of God, have been poured out on us, because we have sinned against you

    My Rebuttal: Yes, they are the same. The Law of God and the Law of Moses can be used interchangeably. The Bible Says in Luke 2:22-24 and Luke 2:30....

    22 When the time of their purification according to the Law of Moses had been completed, Joseph and Mary took him to Jerusalem to present him to the Lord 23 (as it is written in the Law of the Lord, "Every firstborn male is to be consecrated to the Lord" ), 24 and to offer a sacrifice in keeping with what is said in the Law of the Lord: "a pair of doves or two young pigeons (clearly what he is quoting from the Law of Moses did not come from the Ten Commandments and clearly what he is quoting from the Law of the Lord is not from the Ten Commandments. What he is quoting comes from the 'Book of the Law' which is God's Law AND Moses' Law).

    39 When Joseph and Mary had done everything required by the Law of the Lord, they returned to Galilee to their own town of Nazareth.

    Please note that the Law of the Lord in these verses is NOT referring to the Ten Commandments but the 'so-called' ceremonial laws. So Amazing Facts and SDA’s cannot correctly say that Moses' Law was strictly ceremonial. Furthermore, God's law was a unit (613 commands) and could not be divided.

    The text ( Daniel 9:10, 11) that Amazing Facts references does not prove otherwise. Daniel was praying to God and was rehearsing how the people had sinned against Him. You have to read the verses preceding the texts that Amazing Facts chose. Starting at Daniel 9, verse 7 sets the backdrop...

    7 "Lord, you are righteous, but this day we are covered with shame--the men of Judah and people of Jerusalem and all Israel, both near and far, in all the countries where you have scattered us because of our unfaithfulness to you. 8 O LORD, we and our kings, our princes and our fathers are covered with shame because we have sinned against you. 9 The Lord our God is merciful and forgiving, even though we have rebelled against him; 10 we have not obeyed the LORD our God or kept the laws he gave us through his servants the prophets. 11 All Israel has transgressed your law and turned away, refusing to obey you. "Therefore the curses and sworn judgments written in the Law of Moses, the servant of God, have been poured out on us, because we have sinned against you.”

    If Moses is the servant of God and God gave him a message or laws, then it is God's message or law for Moses, in turn, to give to the people. Example: Paul, in the New Testament, received direct communication from God as His servant and his words are as commandments or laws from God. The same with Moses. Paul and Moses both received from God to teach the people; they were willing servant vessels. They weren't Paul's or Moses' laws but God's. Paul remarks regarding his calling in Galatians 1:11-12

    11 'I want you to know, brothers, that the gospel I preached is not something that man made up. 12 I did not receive it from any man, nor was I taught it; rather, I received it by revelation from Jesus Christ."

    To conclude this portion, The Bible Says, Moses’ Law and God’s Law are the same; it’s the Torah, 613 commands.

    ARE THE TEN COMMANDMENTS ETERNAL?

    The Bible’s position is that when the law and the prophets were fulfilled, they were no longer effective; they were abolished because of their fulfillment. Seventh-day Adventists’ position is that they are permanent and still binding on us today. The Bible Says in Ephesians 2:15, ‘...by abolishing in his flesh the law with its commandments AND regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new man out of the two, thus making peace.” The law (nomos) is referring to the Torah or Moses Law aka God’s Law.

    Following are some proof texts that SDA’s (my friend in particular) use to prove that the Ten Commandments are permanent. My SDA friend’s comments are in red and mine are in black to make it a little easier to follow along. He is proving that Paul, James and John say that God’s Law (written with His finger) is permanent and still binding.

    BUT, THE HOLY TEN COMMANDMENTS OF GOD ARE PERMANENT...

    Jesus said in Matthew 5:17-19 "Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven."

    ‘The law’ in Matthew 5:17-19 is referring to the Greek word nomos (3551). According to The New Strong’s Expanded Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible (Red-Letter Edition), the SDA's proof texts are….. ‘of the Mosaic Law, 'the law' of Sinai, e.g., Matthew 5:18, John 1:17; Romans 2:15, 18, 20, 26, 27; 3:19; 4:15; 7:4, 7, 14, 16, 22; 8:3, 4, 7; Gal. 3:10, 12, 19, 21, 24; 5:3; Eph. 2:15; Phil. 3:6; 1 Ti 1:8; Heb. 7:19; Jas. 2:9.

    PAUL SPEAKS OF THIS SAME LAW OF GOD, CONCERNING ITS IMPORTANCE...

    Romans 2:12 "For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law;"

    The word 'law' in this text does not have 'the' article preceding it; Strong says without the article, it is stressing the Mosaic law in its quality as “law,” e.g., Rom. 2:14 (first part)…Romans 2:14 (NLT) “Even Gentiles, who do not have God’s written law…..Romans 5:20 (NLT) “God’s law was given so that all people could see how sinful they were…”

    According to Strong’s. ‘The absence of the article before nomos indicates the assertion of a principle.”

    Romans 3:20 "Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin." (nomos – Mosaic Law or Law of God)

    Romans 4:15 "Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression." (nomos – Mosaic Law or Law of God)

    Paul's references point to the Mosaic law or Torah.

    JAMES SPEAKS OF THIS SAME LAW OF GOD, CONCERNING ITS IMPORTANCE...

    James 2:10-12 "For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all. For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law. So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty."

    The Bible Says in James 2:9, “But if you favor some people over others, you are committing a sin. You are guilty of breaking the law.” (Notice that it has the article ‘the’ preceding the word ‘law’ so it is referring to the Mosaic Law, the Law given at Sinai, God’s law)

    If James is read in context, you will discover that James is scolding the Jews, who were authorities on the law, about showing favoritism. Showing favoritism is not one of the Ten Commandments, however, it is in the Torah or Book of the Law. Verses 10 and 11 are reiterating to the Jews that if they showed favoritism they are as guilty as murdering and committing adultery because the same God who said thou shalt not commit adultery and thou shalt not murder also said do not show favoritism. He was reminding them that if they showed favoritism they were breaking the law and if they broke one law they were guilty of breaking them all.

    Since showing favoritism is not a Ten Commandment law, why would James compare apples with oranges? Why would James say they have broken God’s law by showing favoritism if showing favoritism wasn’t written by the finger of God? Be mindful that James is speaking to the Jews who did not accept Jesus as the Messiah, which is why he could speak to them about the law. They knew the law very well.

    In conversation, it was said that we shall be judged by the Ten Commandments, which is why my friend made bold ‘shall be judged’ in James 2:10-12. In defense of the Ten Commandments (because of the two ‘thou shalt nots’) it was not noticed that James was saying we will be judged by the Law of Liberty, not the Ten Commandments. The Law of Liberty is God’s Law.

    The NLT version reads, ‘you will be judged by the law that sets you free.’ The Law of Liberty is the law of love, God’s law. The Bible Says in John 13:33-35, “Dear children, I will be with you only a little longer. And as I told the Jewish leaders, you will search for me but you can’t come where I am going. So now I am giving you a new commandment: Love each other. Just as I have loved you, you should love each other. Your love for one another will prove to the world that you are my disciples.”

    The Bible Says in 1 John 5:1-3 (NLT) reads, “Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ has become a child of God. And everyone who loves the Father loves his children too. We know we love God’s children if we love God and obey His commandments. Loving God means keeping his commandments and his commandments are not burdensome.”

    1 John 3:23-24 explains to us what God’s commandments are. The Bible Says, “And this is his commandment: We must believe in the name of his Son, Jesus Christ and love one another, just as he commanded us. Those who obey God’s commandments remain in fellowship with him, and he with them. And we know he lives in us because the Spirit he gave us lives in us.”

    James texts are referring to the Mosiac law to bring the Jews in line, but his emphasis is on the New Testament law of love (God's Law), which we will be judged by.

    JOHN SPEAKS OF THIS SAME LAW OF GOD, CONCERNING ITS IMPORTANCE...

    1 John 3:4 "Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law." (Again, John is not referring to the Ten Commandments. When the entire chapter is read in context, you will discover that John is talking about living as God’s children, urging them to love one another and to live in right relationship with God. Verse 10 reads, “So now we can tell who the children of God and who are the children of the devil. Anyone who does not live righteously and does not love other believers does not belong to God."

    MY SDA friend said, “My dear kind sister, you are leading people astray concerning the Law! for Revelation 22:14 says... "Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city."

    Revelation 22:14 is not referring to the Ten Commandments. Again, according to Strong’s, the word ‘entole’ is the Greek word for commandments, which means an ‘injunction or authoritative prescription’. Our prescription for ‘righteous living’ is to obey God’s commandment of believing the Good News of the Gospel and loving others.

    To conclude, the Law of Moses and the Law of God under the Old Covenant are the same and are used interchangeably. The Law of God in the New Covenant is the Law of Love aka the Law of Liberty. The Old Covenant in its entirety was nailed to the cross. The Old Covenant was for Israel only; the New Covenant is for ALL who believe. The Old Covenant was temporary; the New Covenant is eternal. We, today, are under the New Covenant. The Holy Spirit tells us what to do and the Holy Spirit empowers us – not the tablets of stone.

    I John 2:27 (NLT) reads, “But you have received the Holy Spirit, and he lives within you, so you don’t need anyone to teach you what is true. For the Spirit teaches you everything you need to know, and what he teaches you is true – it is not a lie. So just as he taught you, remain in fellowship with Christ.”

    John's texts are referring to the law of love, God's Royal Law, not the Ten Commandments. Paul, James and John are not promoting the keeping of the Ten Commandments. The Bible Says, that only three things will last FOREVER, faith, hope and love; the greatest of these is love.

    I can only request that you give this information prayerful study to see whether these things are so.

    "God cannot kiss His bride until the veil is lifted." Patricia A. Allen

    Be blessed.
    I'm not a bad guy. I'm just misunderstood.

    Galatians 6:14 - But God forbid that I should boast except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world.

  19. #139
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    February 6th, 2014
    Age
    62
    Posts
    5,160
    Rep Power
    65

    Default Re: Law of God vs. Law of Moses

    Quote Originally Posted by Marcelo View Post
    There is an important reason why they don't kill Sabbath violators today: Not one of them would be left alive to keep their movement going.
    that what I believe brother. If they consistent to interprate the Word never pass before heaven and earth pass mean sabbath law not pass, kill the sabbath violator is not pass

    then they not kill the violator because afraid of human law/ police instead of God law

  20. #140
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    February 6th, 2014
    Age
    62
    Posts
    5,160
    Rep Power
    65

    Default Re: Law of God vs. Law of Moses

    Quote Originally Posted by mailmandan View Post
    Even when Sabbatarians set out to worship on the Sabbath, are they truly "keeping the Sabbath?" To "keep the Sabbath" as it was required in the Old Testament under the Old Covenant would involve compliance with specific regulations (Exodus 16:23; 35:3; Leviticus 23:32; Jeremiah 17:21) that were strictly enforced.

    If Sabbath day observances are still required and the word of God never passes away "in that sense" then so would the burnt offerings which went along with them (Leviticus 19:30; 23:2-3; Numbers 28:1-10; 29:39-40; I Chronicles. 23:30-31; II Chronicles 31:2-4; Isaiah 1:13). So no kindling a fire in any of your dwellings on the sabbath (Exodus 35:3). Every man must remain in his place (no traveling) on the sabbath (Exodus 16:29). No trading (Amos 8:5). No marketing (Nehemiah 10:31; 13:15,19).

    These were commanded by God to Israel (Exodus 35:1).

    If the seventh day Sabbath is still in affect, then why do not the Sabbatarians seek to obey ALL that the LORD commanded? How can a person keep a certain law when he keeps only part of it?

    If the Sabbath day laws were still in effect today, then according to Exodus 31:12-18; 35:1-3; and Numbers 15:32-36, anyone who profaned the Sabbath was put to death and any person who does any work on it, that person shall be cut off from his people.

    Who is going to enforce that? The Jewish synagogue? The Seventh day Adventist church? The Government? Since we do not live under a theocratic state as ancient Israel did under the Old Covenant, no Sabbatarian can live consistently under these Mosaic regulations. We are not fooled by Judaizer propaganda which is just SDA/Hebrew Roots smoke and mirrors.
    In other word, they make their own law, or man Made law, I hope Holy Spirit speak to them, tell them about love law.
    Grandpa and mailmandan like this.

Page 7 of 9 FirstFirst ... 56789 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Moses' final speach, "Happy Birthday Moses" 120 candles!
    By BenAvraham in forum Bible Discussion Forum
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: September 20th, 2015, 05:49 AM
  2. The law of Moses
    By ivanc0 in forum Bible Discussion Forum
    Replies: 46
    Last Post: April 20th, 2015, 08:55 AM
  3. ~~~~~~~~~~According to the law of Moses
    By MissPickles in forum Christian Family Forum
    Replies: 17
    Last Post: July 21st, 2014, 10:39 PM
  4. the law of Moses
    By just-me in forum Bible Discussion Forum
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: July 21st, 2014, 08:12 AM
  5. Was there law before Moses?
    By Bornfromabove in forum Bible Discussion Forum
    Replies: 56
    Last Post: May 4th, 2012, 01:39 AM