Are Holy Spirit baptisms claims provable?

[joefizz]

Can any of us prove or disprove personal/individual claims of Holy Spirit baptisms? Should such claims hold any weight in this forum?

Please note: I am speaking of personal or individual claims, not the biblical existence of Holy Spirit baptism.

(sounds fishy but I like a challenge)
I know from experience of my own personal Holy spirit baptism that the Holy spirit exists and that it's a "real experience" and not to step on toes so to speak but for me it wasn't a "burst out in speaking in tongues" experience so I can't "vouch" for that.
It feels like "a heavy weight lifted" off one's shoulder and seems to "open up" one's "good emotions" but may "differ" one's individual experience,my individual experience started out with me "being excited" wanting to serve God unfortunately I let the excitement "go to my head" and ended up doing something "stupid" without "thinking" went and bought my cousin a bag of smoking tobacco and tried going all the way to his house to deliver it with my father without "knowing" how to get there and learned that a feeling of "calling" isn't always God/Jesus and taught my father a lesson about "promises" ironically.(not to tell someone you'll do whatever if you aren't sincere and not to make dumb promises)
Afterward realizing I had gotten "goofed up" I tried "clearing my mind" and "thinking" "what else can I do for God/Jesus" and started searching for "things to do" that were "right for God" such as "reading the bible more","writing songs for God" and hoping to "teach others of Salvation and baptism(got water baptized awhile later after receiving the holy spirit) but of course I still felt rather "alone" so I sought "dating sites" first but then noticed they were "too sleazy" and thought on "different words" to type in on the internet.
I realized what I wanted was to talk with others and thought on the word "chat" and then thought..."I want to chat with others christians and maybe find someone along the way for me" and eventually found this site,"Christian Chat" and then as I went discussing bible topics and talking in general I realized"most the words" I was "using" especially concerning the bible weren't "words I used "daily" or even "casually" and noticed some "answers" I typed were practically "over my own head" and started to think "how did this happen"?
And came to the conclusion that I did receive the Holy spirit I just needed to "let the Holy spirit guide me" instead of "running around" looking for tasks to do for God/Jesus" and that he often will "put the tasks in front of you on your path" and to try not to "go overboard" as I did,just like the saying "babe in Christ" your "first experience" with the Holy spirit won't necessarily be "what you think" or even "altogether automatic".

 

[Dino246]

...
The "gifts of the Spirit" are, I believe, in a different category, and are not all given to (manifested through) every believer. Rather, they are given to the Church through particular people, and that as an aggregate, the Church will manifest all the gifts as needed. Traditionally, these are the "manifestations" associated with the so-called "baptism of the Spirit". This is unfortunate, because it sets up an artificial distinction that is unsupported by Scripture. I will state that I don't believe that manifestation of these gifts (any of them, in particular) is normative for all believers, but that their manifestation in the Church is normative.
...

An additional thought for clarification... 1 Corinthians 12:7 says, "but to each one is given the manifestation of the Spirit for the common good". To restate, I don't believe that we should expect that every believer manifest any particular gift, but that it is normative that every believer manifest at least one of the gifts.

 

[breno785au]

(sounds fishy but I like a challenge)
I know from experience of my own personal Holy spirit baptism that the Holy spirit exists and that it's a "real experience" and not to step on toes so to speak but for me it wasn't a "burst out in speaking in tongues" experience so I can't "vouch" for that.
It feels like "a heavy weight lifted" off one's shoulder and seems to "open up" one's "good emotions" but may "differ" one's individual experience,my individual experience started out with me "being excited" wanting to serve God unfortunately I let the excitement "go to my head" and ended up doing something "stupid" without "thinking" went and bought my cousin a bag of smoking tobacco and tried going all the way to his house to deliver it with my father without "knowing" how to get there and learned that a feeling of "calling" isn't always God/Jesus and taught my father a lesson about "promises" ironically.(not to tell someone you'll do whatever if you aren't sincere and not to make dumb promises)
Afterward realizing I had gotten "goofed up" I tried "clearing my mind" and "thinking" "what else can I do for God/Jesus" and started searching for "things to do" that were "right for God" such as "reading the bible more","writing songs for God" and hoping to "teach others of Salvation and baptism(got water baptized awhile later after receiving the holy spirit) but of course I still felt rather "alone" so I sought "dating sites" first but then noticed they were "too sleazy" and thought on "different words" to type in on the internet.
I realized what I wanted was to talk with others and thought on the word "chat" and then thought..."I want to chat with others christians and maybe find someone along the way for me" and eventually found this site,"Christian Chat" and then as I went discussing bible topics and talking in general I realized"most the words" I was "using" especially concerning the bible weren't "words I used "daily" or even "casually" and noticed some "answers" I typed were practically "over my own head" and started to think "how did this happen"?
And came to the conclusion that I did receive the Holy spirit I just needed to "let the Holy spirit guide me" instead of "running around" looking for tasks to do for God/Jesus" and that he often will "put the tasks in front of you on your path" and to try not to "go overboard" as I did,just like the saying "babe in Christ" your "first experience" with the Holy spirit won't necessarily be "what you think" or even "altogether automatic".

You have nothing to prove to anyone.
You can discern by the tone of the OP that anyone would end up down a rabbit hole of endless questions to attempt to discredit testimony.

 

[garee]

The signs of Mark 16 were really "the signs of an apostle" and meant for the Apostolic Age. That means that signs, and wonders, and miracles accompanying the Gospel would not continue indefinitely, and church history confirms this. But today the Gospel is still the power of God unto salvation (Rom 1:16).

I would offer.. The word apostle means sent one with no other meaning attached. God who had grace on Abel. Abel was sent with the gospel to his brother Cain .Cain killed the mis perceived intention of the gospel. Abel would be the first apostle.


If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.And Cain talked with Abel his brother: and it came to pass, when they were in the field, that Cain rose up against Abel his brother, and slew him. Gen 4:7

The faith to beleive God does not come by human jealousy .That belongs to natural uncovered man as the mark of Cain.

The phrase Apostolic Age comes from Catholicism. It is used to support their worship of what they call venerable men who are able to forgive sin, as a addition the unknown amount of grace they say comes form Christ, seeing a Catholic must believe Chrsit did not provide the fullness needed. They fullfill that un known with their own selves as tradtions of men... that do make God's tradtion the Bible without effect.

I would offer in regard to Mark 16. It is exactly what is meant from above using metaphors used in that parable to give us the spiritul understanding.

It’s a not a sign and wonder, or a sign as a wonder as an anticipation faith principle a prophecy that looks ahead. Christ said; its an evil generation, the generation of natural man, that seeks after sign and wonder.

Signs follow after to show the work of Christ, working in us. Christians will not be deceived by another gospel, another Christ, the antichrists (many) the gospel is the anti venom antitidote.

And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover. Mar 16:15

Casting out devils is the work of the gospel, speaking with a new tongue and heart after the things of God, is the result.

They are the ones Christ called fathers as a brood of vipers who walk after flesh, in a hope it could profit, as the things seen.

Killing the mis perceived competition as in, out of sight out of mind in respect to no faith that comes from hearing God alone)

This is as if we did wrestle against flesh and blood. God is still sending men with the gospel which apposes the things of men called a brood of vipers.

Poison is always used to represent the influence of the father of lies who brings the false gospel as false apostles as lying signs and wonders.God is still brining the strong delusion so that they can keep on beleiving the lies of those who appose His gospel of grace.

 

[Nehemiah6]

I would offer.. The word apostle means sent one with no other meaning attached.
And of course you would be totally off base. There is a very specific meaning attached to *apostle* hence there are twelve apostles of the Lamb embedded in the twelve foundations of the New Jerusalem.

 

[DJ2]

You have nothing to prove to anyone.
You can discern by the tone of the OP that anyone would end up down a rabbit hole of endless questions to attempt to discredit testimony.

The OP is a legitimate question that must be answered when claims of Holy Spirit baptism are asserted. Addressing this issue is by no means a "rabbit hole".

Such claims are never to be taken lightly but be understood for their serious nature. When someone claims that God has in someway instilled in them a seal of spiritual gifts, empowerment and salvation, we should pay attention. This claim if true would imply that they in some form have a undermistakable expression of acceptance by God. If not true it would imply a bogus claim of entitlement and unwarranted assurance.

So what is the danger of sincere but false claims of this nature? Simply put when one accepts the concept that a perfect God has blessed them personally with such gifts it becomes almost impossible for them to contemplate any notion that would suggest an error in there understanding of salvation. Simply put, "how can I be wrong since God Himself gave me the baptism of the Holy Spirit?" or "Why would God give the baptism of the Holy Spirit to someone who is not saved?".

This is played out clearly when witnessing to Mormons. They will stare at you puzzled at the suggestion that they could possibly have been mistaken about their Holy Spirit baptism.

 

[breno785au]

The OP is a legitimate question that must be answered when claims of Holy Spirit baptism are asserted. Addressing this issue is by no means a "rabbit hole".

Such claims are never to be taken lightly but be understood for their serious nature. When someone claims that God has in someway instilled in them a seal of spiritual gifts, empowerment and salvation, we should pay attention. This claim if true would imply that they in some form have a undermistakable expression of acceptance by God. If not true it would imply a bogus claim of entitlement and unwarranted assurance.

So what is the danger of sincere but false claims of this nature? Simply put when one accepts the concept that a perfect God has blessed them personally with such gifts it becomes almost impossible for them to contemplate any notion that would suggest an error in there understanding of salvation. Simply put, "how can I be wrong since God Himself gave me the baptism of the Holy Spirit?" or "Why would God give the baptism of the Holy Spirit to someone who is not saved?".

This is played out clearly when witnessing to Mormons. They will stare at you puzzled at the suggestion that they could possibly have been mistaken about their Holy Spirit baptism.

OK, well.. I asked for the Holy Spirit and I received it. How do I know I did?

If a son asks for bread from any father among you, will he give him a stone? Or if he asks for a fish, will he give him a serpent instead of a fish? If you then, being evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to those who ask Him!”
Luke 11:11*, ‬13

 

[Shamah]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Mat 7:15-20, “But beware of the false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are savage wolves. By their fruits you shall know them. Are grapes gathered from thornbushes or figs from thistles? So every good tree yields good fruit, but a rotten tree yields wicked fruit. A good tree is unable to yield wicked fruit, and a rotten tree to yield good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. So then, by their fruits you shall know them.”[/FONT]

 

[joefizz]

You have nothing to prove to anyone.
You can discern by the tone of the OP that anyone would end up down a rabbit hole of endless questions to attempt to discredit testimony.

Yeah I know that's a distinct possibility but I don't mind sharing my beginning with the Holy Spirit even for sort of a trivial matter.

 

[DJ2]

OK, well.. I asked for the Holy Spirit and I received it. How do I know I did?

If a son asks for bread from any father among you, will he give him a stone? Or if he asks for a fish, will he give him a serpent instead of a fish? If you then, being evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to those who ask Him!”
Luke 11:11*, ‬13

In other words, conjecture.

 

[breno785au]

In other words, conjecture.

When people wish to doubt, I point to simplicity.

 

[Shamah]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1 John 3:24, “And the one guarding His commands stays in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He stays in us, [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]by the Spirit which He gave us[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif].”[/FONT]

 

[joefizz]

In other words, conjecture.

Conjecture=Inference formed without proof or sufficient evidence
,you don't speak as someone who believes in spiritual things,more of someone who believes in what can merely be seen..

 

[breno785au]

The devil has come to many times, questioning this very thing, have you really received the Holy Spirit, prove it.

I just got some revelation! He's tempting me into works to prove something! Oh!

And I remember I've used the same scripture to shut the devil down, I asked and I received!

That's taking up your sword, the devil can't compete with that, just as he couldn't compete with Jesus!

 

[seed_time_harvest]

Can any of us prove or disprove personal/individual claims of Holy Spirit baptisms? Should such claims hold any weight in this forum?

Please note: I am speaking of personal or individual claims, not the biblical existence of Holy Spirit baptism.

Your profile says you are a christian but don’t you think an atheist would ask a question that would pull a believer Into minding fleshly things.

JESUS said there would be no sign,and HE said HIS words are SPIRIT and they are Life.

 

[Shamah]

Mat 7:15-20, “But beware of the false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are savage wolves. By their fruits you shall know them. Are grapes gathered from thornbushes or figs from thistles? So every good tree yields good fruit, but a rotten tree yields wicked fruit. A good tree is unable to yield wicked fruit, and a rotten tree to yield good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. So then, by their fruits you shall know them.”

1 John 3:24, “And the one guarding His commands stays in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He stays in us, by the Spirit which He gave us.”

JESUS said there would be no sign,and HE said HIS words are SPIRIT and they are Life.

Exodus 13:9, “And it shall be as a *sign to you on your hand and as a reminder between your eyes, that the Torah (Instructions/Law) of יהוה is to be in your mouth, for with a strong hand יהוה has brought you out of Mitsrayim.”

The word *Sign is word #H226 – owth from Strong's Exhaustive Concordance, Hebrew Dictionary: meaning mark, token, sign, consent, flag, evidence of consent.



2 Timothy 2:19, “However, the solid foundation of Yah stands firm, having this seal*, “ יהוה knows those who are His, Let everyone who names the Name of Messiah turn away from unrighteousness.”



Strong's Concordance *"seal"is word #G4973 - sphragis: a seal, a signet, Original Word: σφραγίς, ῖδος, ἡ, Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine, Transliteration: sphragis, Phonetic Spelling: (sfrag-ece'), Short Definition: a signet-ring, impression of a seal, the proof, Definition: a seal, signet ring, the impression of a seal, that which the seal attests, the proof.

 

[seed_time_harvest]

OK, well.. I asked for the Holy Spirit and I received it. How do I know I did?

If a son asks for bread from any father among you, will he give him a stone? Or if he asks for a fish, will he give him a serpent instead of a fish? If you then, being evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to those who ask Him!”
Luke 11:11*, ‬13

In other words, conjecture.

The just shall live by faith Is not only talking about salvation but also sanctification.

 

[DJ2]

Conjecture=Inference formed without proof or sufficient evidence
,you don't speak as someone who believes in spiritual things,more of someone who believes in what can merely be seen..

Do not attempt to twist my words, they are very clear. I am in no way implying the nonexistence of the baptism of the Holy Spirit, it is well supported by scripture. My question was about personal or individual claims of the event and do they hold any weight in these discussions.

Take your bogus assertions on my belief in spiritual things somewhere else.

 

[Waggles]

Take your bogus assertions on my belief in spiritual things somewhere else.

How about you do the same!!

 

[joefizz]

Power is the sign of the baptism of the Holy Spirit.


When a person is effective, spiritually, and displays some kind of supernatural connection with God they probably have the baptism of the Holy Spirit.


"8but you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you"-Acts 1:8

Yes definitely a connection of sorts takes place when we are baptized with the Holy spirit really I don't know if "mere words" can do it justice because it's a phenomenon that is not easily fathomed by even the most "intelligent" of people and what one can do through the spirit afterward is rather a guess until one starts walking in the spirit for a time.