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Thread: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by yaright View Post
    Or in the Book of Galations when the Apostle Paul said there is no difference, whether Jew or Gentile...

    they are the same in Christ;

    this is where division came, for the Jews who heard the Word of God and did not believe..
    There is no difference when it comes to salvation. even if they do not accept Christ. there is no difference between unbelieving jews and unbelieving gentyiles. They are all lost.

    There is a difference when it comes to Gods covenants. And romans 11. Paul made a difference that was my point.
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    There is no difference when it comes to salvation. even if they do not accept Christ. there is no difference between unbelieving jews and unbelieving gentyiles. They are all lost.

    There is a difference when it comes to Gods covenants. And romans 11. Paul made a difference that was my point.
    This clarification needed to take place, so that the witness revealed the difference between the believing and the unbelieving.

    The discernment between the left hand and the right hand becomes necessary for those who hear the witness, and your point is well taken.

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by yaright View Post
    Or in the Book of Galations when the Apostle Paul said there is no difference, whether Jew or Gentile...

    they are the same in Christ;

    this is where division came, for the Jews who heard the Word of God and did not believe..
    but.
    Samuel Untermyer funded Cyrus Scofield to write a new theology.
    one that would allow for TWO COVENANTS TO BE IN PLACE.
    and one that would create A Golem.
    MISSION ACCOMPLISHED.
    The Lutheran Church—Missouri Synod

    http://www.lcms.org/

    ~

    Sooner or later, somebody is going to insist that the Bible be studied, and then there will be disunity.
    Gary Summers

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    1. There is no new Jerusalem today. And the messiah is not on his throne in the New Jerusalem. The new jerusalem will not come to be until after Christ destroys this heaven and earth we know today
    (Galatians 4:26) But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.

    What is Jerusalem above?

    (Matthew 28:18) And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.


    Are you telling me Christ is not King?

    Are you saying we are not citizens of Gods Kingdom NOW? Is the Kingdom of God upon us?

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    2. God promised David he would have a son who would sit in his throne in the city named after him (the city of David, or Jerusalem)
    And Jesus made it absolutely clear that His Kingdom was not of this world. So are you gonna trust Jesus or Disptortions of ancient OT verses?

    Jesus is the son of David.
    Jesus is reigning NOW.

    (Matthew 21:5) Tell ye the daughter of Sion, Behold, thy King cometh unto thee, meek, and sitting upon an ass, and a colt the foal of an ass.

    (Luke 19:38) Saying, Blessed be the King that cometh in the name of the Lord: peace in heaven, and glory in the highest.

    Christ has been on Davids throne for a long long time. In the SPIRITUAL city of David, New Jerusalem. To say this will have EARTHLY FLESH fulfillment is to contradict Jesus Himself.

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    3. Revelations speaks of 1000 year reign, Where Satan is bound and NOT able to decieve the nations. Satan is not bound today. Has never been bound to the point he can not decieve the nations.
    Name me one single nation that is deceived by Satan. You have over 300 to choose from. Of course you would need a nation where there is not one Christian living there, for if there is a Christian there and the Gospel is there then that nation is certainly not deceived.

    (Matthew 12:29) Or else how can one enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he first bind the strong man? and then he will spoil his house.


    Satan BOUND.

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    4. Prophesy has to be interpreted literally. 69 weeks were fulfilled to the day. Any time God has prophesied any time frame, It has been fulfilled literally. To interpret this 1000 years as meaning anything but a literal 1000 is wrong.
    Maybe you should tell Peter?

    (2 Peter 3:8) But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.


    All 70 weeks were fulfilled. Christ fulfilled them, thats why I accept Him as Messiah.

    (Matthew 11:13) For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.

    Did the prophets prophesie 2000 years AFTER John or UNTIL John, like Jesus said?

    Listen to your KING:

    (Luke 24:44) And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.
    (Luke 24:45) Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,
    (Luke 24:46) And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:
    (Luke 24:47) And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.
    (Luke 24:48) And ye are witnesses of these things.
    (Luke 24:49) And, behold, I send the promise of my Father upon you: but tarry ye in the city of Jerusalem, until ye be endued with power from on high.


    ALL FULFILLED. All the promises gentle friend. Believe IT IS FINISHED.

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    5. As I said, the messiah only fulfilled one point of everything prophesied about him. He is yet to fulfill the rest of the stuff prophesied about him.
    Then why do you accept Him as Messiah? He didnt do His job!

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    6. I do not listen to other men. I study myself. I have studied this for almost 30 years. It is my favorite subject. I have studied ALL points of view. The only part I am not sure of is when Christ will "catch up" the church.
    Oh boy.....pre-trib rapture too? I guess thats inevitable.

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    I can't do that. Paul talks about NATURAL Flesh in romans 11. Not spiritual. I can not just throw a whole chapter of the bible out just because I want to believe something that is not true. If God through Paul says that at the end of the time of the gentiles (which would be the church age) the jews will repent and all isreal will be saved. If the prophety ezekial says God will regather natural Israel from the world where they were scattered because of sin. I can trust God that he will make it happen. I do not have to prove it. Can you prove there is a heaven? Yet you have faith in it.
    Other people have shown you that the times of the gentiles is fulfilled by the Gospel age, NOT at the END of the Gospel age. All those things have been fulfilled.

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    what? Who said anything about pharisees being saved? "All Israel" means all israel who are alive and on earth at the time the prophesy is fulfilled. Never since Christ was here has every natural born child of jacob been born again. They are blinded at this time still. It is not that hard. Think about what your saying. It makes no sense!
    Which again begs the question, if this prophecy is fulfilled in the future, how will you know? Answer. You wont. Therefore your theology makes no sense.

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    Jeremiah 31: 33-34
    33 But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD: I will put My law in their minds, and write it on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. 34 No more shall every man teach his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, ‘Know the LORD,’ for they all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them, says the LORD. For I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more.”

    Yes the gospel has gone out. But what Jeremiah said in the above prophesy has not happened.. We can not even all agree in here. Jeremiah says in those days everyone will agree. Huge difference!
    I dont see the words 'everyone shall agree' in the verse you cited. Jesus is the most famous person on Earth. Everyone KNOWS Him. Our sins have been forgiven. He remembers our iniquity no more. Yes the verse speaks of the houses of Judah and of Israel and AGAIN you dont know that this has been fulfilled. You cant possibly know.

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    I am not looking for it. Who said I was? I know it will happen though. Because GOD SAID IT WILL. Thats good enough for me!
    Your expectations prove you are looking for it. If your not careful you will get caught in the pharisees plan.

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    lol. No pride is reading the word of God and ignoring it. and not seeing what it says. Romans 11 is not fullfille.d Jeremiah 33 is not fulfilled. EZ 37 is not fulilled. And I have never stated todays jews would fullfill it. why do you keep saying this? the twelve tribes are more than jew2s. Yet I have said this before.
    Huh? Why do I keep saying what? I SAID YOU know that "jews" are not fulfillment thats why your position makes even less sense than a full on dispy.

    All prophecies are fulfilled. Carnal eyes wont see it though.

    (1 Corinthians 2:14) But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    the point is, if we have always been saved the same way. what are all the different covenants for? If these covenants were not given as a "this is how you get to heaven" covenant "as the covenant of grace is today" then what did they mean?
    To reveal our need for a saviour?

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by Strangelove View Post
    (Galatians 4:26) But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.

    What is Jerusalem above?

    (Matthew 28:18) And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.


    Are you telling me Christ is not King?

    Are you saying we are not citizens of Gods Kingdom NOW? Is the Kingdom of God upon us?
    Rev 21:

    1 Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away. Also there was no more sea. 2 Then I, John,[a] saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 3 And I heard a loud voice from heaven saying, “Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people. God Himself will be with them and be their God. 4 And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes; there shall be no more death, nor sorrow, nor crying. There shall be no more pain, for the former things have passed away.”
    5 Then He who sat on the throne said, “Behold, I make all things new.” And He said to me,[b] “Write, for these words are true and faithful.”

    I guess you think this is alive today.

    Its ok. After your last statement on my thread. I am done discussing this with you. It is obvious you have no desire to find out why I believe the way I do. So I do not feel the need to discuss anything further on this topic!

    Believe what you want. I could care less!
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Why wont you answer my questions?

    (Galatians 4:26) But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.

    What is Jerusalem above?

    (Matthew 28:18) And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.


    Are you telling me Christ is not King?

    Are you saying we are not citizens of Gods Kingdom NOW? Is the Kingdom of God upon us?

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    Senior Member eternally-gratefull's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by Strangelove View Post
    Why wont you answer my questions?

    (Galatians 4:26) But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.

    What is Jerusalem above?

    (Matthew 28:18) And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.


    Are you telling me Christ is not King?

    Are you saying we are not citizens of Gods Kingdom NOW? Is the Kingdom of God upon us?
    Why should I. You never answer mine! You twist it and turn it to make me look like a fool. So why should I bow to your every whim??

    I have already explained there is a differecne between the redemptive aspects of Gods covenants and the fleshly aspects. But you do not want to go there. so why bother?


    Is Christ king?

    Does Iran worship Christ? Does russia? How about Jerusalm? Or America? Or canada? Or rome?

    The prophesies I showed said ALL THE KINGS OF THE EARTH WOULD WORSHIP HIM. Has this happened? It also said ALL who survived and made it to this time who come from the nations who attacked jherusalem would come every year to worship Christ. Is this happening today?

    I did not think so.

    If you can't separate the salvic and fleshly portions of Gods covenants.You will never understand why I believe the way I do. And you have no desire to discuss this so why bother?

    Thanks. I did not think so.
    Eternally Grateful for the grace God has shown a wretched soul such as myself.

    Rom 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by eternally-gratefull View Post
    Is Christ king?

    Does Iran worship Christ? Does russia? How about Jerusalm? Or America? Or canada? Or rome?
    SO THE SCRIPTURES LIE THEN?????

    (Matthew 21:5) Tell ye the daughter of Sion, Behold, thy King cometh unto thee, meek, and sitting upon an ass, and a colt the foal of an ass.

    (Luke 19:38) Saying, Blessed be the King that cometh in the name of the Lord: peace in heaven, and glory in the highest.

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    Default Re: Is the New Covenant for Israel only?

    Quote Originally Posted by distinctiveministry View Post
    Jeremiah 31:31-34
    “Behold, days are coming,” declares the LORD, “when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah, 32 not like the covenant which I made with their fathers in the day I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, although I was a husband to them,” declares the LORD. 33 “But this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days,” declares the LORD, “I will put My law within them and on their heart I will write it; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. 34 They will not teach again, each man his neighbor and each man his brother, saying, ‘Know the LORD,’ for they will all know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them,” declares the LORD, “for I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more.”


    Given that Jeremiah states and the author of Hebrews quotes that this covenant is with the houses of Israel and Judah, and that the New Covenant is never applied to Gentiles in any passage of the New Testament (as far as I can think of off the top of my head), is the New Covenant only for Israel? The only passage I can think of right now where Gentiles and the New Covenant have any interaction is 1 Corinthians 11, when Paul instructs Gentiles on the proper observance of the Lord's Supper. Also, Paul is clear in Galatians 3 that Gentiles are reconciled to God on the basis of God's promises to Abraham in Genesis 12 and 22, not through the Mosaic covenant.
    y : Sort by
    1. Jeremiah 31:31
      Behold, the days are coming, says the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah,
      Jeremiah 31:30-32 (in Context) Jeremiah 31 (Whole Chapter)
    2. Malachi 2:4
      And you shall know, recognize, and understand that I have sent this [new] decree to you priests, to be My [new] covenant with Levi [the priestly tribe], says the Lord of hosts.
      Malachi 2:3-5 (in Context) Malachi 2 (Whole Chapter)
    3. Matthew 26:28
      For this is My blood of the new covenant, which [ ratifies the agreement and] is being poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins.
      Matthew 26:27-29 (in Context) Matthew 26 (Whole Chapter)
    4. Mark 14:24
      And He said to them, This is My blood [which ratifies] the new covenant, [the blood] which is being poured out for (on account of) many.
      Mark 14:23-25 (in Context) Mark 14 (Whole Chapter)
    5. Luke 22:20
      And in like manner, He took the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament or covenant [ratified] in My blood, which is shed (poured out) for you.
      Luke 22:19-21 (in Context) Luke 22 (Whole Chapter)
    6. 1 Corinthians 11:25
      Similarly when supper was ended, He took the cup also, saying, This cup is the new covenant [ratified and established] in My blood. Do this, as often as you drink [it], to call Me [affectionately] to remembrance.
      1 Corinthians 11:24-26 (in Context) 1 Corinthians 11 (Whole Chapter)
    7. 2 Corinthians 3:6
      [It is He] Who has qualified us [making us to be fit and worthy and sufficient] as ministers and dispensers of a new covenant [of salvation through Christ], not [ministers] of the letter (of legally written code) but of the Spirit; for the code [of the Law] kills, but the [Holy] Spirit makes alive.
      2 Corinthians 3:5-7 (in Context) 2 Corinthians 3 (Whole Chapter)
    8. Hebrews 8:8
      However, He finds fault with them [showing its inadequacy] when He says, Behold, the days will come, says the Lord, when I will make and ratify a new covenant or agreement with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah.
      Hebrews 8:7-9 (in Context) Hebrews 8 (Whole Chapter)
    9. Hebrews 8:13
      When God speaks of a new [covenant or agreement], He makes the first one obsolete (out of use). And what is obsolete (out of use and annulled because of age) is ripe for disappearance and to be dispensed with altogether.
      Hebrews 8:12-13 (in Context) Hebrews 8 (Whole Chapter)
    10. Hebrews 9:10
      For [the ceremonies] deal only with clean and unclean meats and drinks and different washings, [mere] external rules and regulations for the body imposed to tide the worshipers over until the time of setting things straight [of reformation, of the complete new order when Christ, the Messiah, shall establish the reality of what these things foreshadow--a better covenant].
      Hebrews 9:9-11 (in Context) Hebrews 9 (Whole Chapter)
    11. Hebrews 9:15
      [Christ, the Messiah] is therefore the Negotiator and Mediator of an [entirely] new agreement (testament, covenant), so that those who are called and offered it may receive the fulfillment of the promised everlasting inheritance--since a death has taken place which rescues and delivers and redeems them from the transgressions committed under the [old] first agreement.
      Hebrews 9:14-16 (in Context) Hebrews 9 (Whole Chapter)
    12. Hebrews 12:24
      And to Jesus, the Mediator (Go-between, Agent) of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood which speaks [of mercy], a better and nobler and more gracious message than the blood of Abel [which cried out for vengeance].
      Hebrews 12:23-25 (in Context) Hebrews 12 (Whole Chapter)

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