Sin, Sickness, and the Medical System

[lesjude]

Satan wants the people in his kingdom comfortable enough so they do not get the idea that the root of ALL sickness is sin and turn to God in repentance. As long as they can be deceived to continue in sin with the illusion that their sickness can be "cured" they will be less likely to turn to God. The medical system does keep them comfortable enough so they continue in the deception while providing torture for the demons' enjoyment and a lot of blood sacrifices to Satan and his demons.

There are many internet sites for the dangers and serious issues of nearly every antibiotic, prescription/over the counter drug including aspirin. God did not give the knowledge to use them any more then how arsenic was used as a food preservative for many years. Opium was sold over the counter for many years as were many other "illegal" drugs. I will say again that all drugs are poison and harm the body in any amount including antibiotics. The long term effects are NOT known for any drug until it is too late. Do some research!

Jesus NEVER used any aspect of medicine nor did He ever give any direction that His saints should EVER need it or use it. The apostles were the same in actions and instruction. He set healing in His church in James 5:14-15. You will note that sin forgiven and healing are closely connected in the verses including verse 16. Sin and sickness are together dealt with in Christ's atonement in Isaiah 53:4-5 and the word iaomai is used in 1 Peter 2:24 in reference to that atonement in Isaiah 53:4-5. The Greek word for heal iaomai-to heal is used to mean both physical (22 times) and "spiritual" healing and carries the meaning that upon dealing with the cause of sickness, sin, physical healing is available as well; also in the meaning of sozo to save both physical and spiritual healing are included.

Man's antichrist religion has separated the two and robbed God's people. They have many fellow travelers.

Christ Himself made the connection between sin and sickness in Matthew 9:1-8.

I realize what John 9:3 says and what it does NOT mean. The parents were not the ones who sinned but that obviously does not mean that the origin of his blindness is not sin because that is how it came into the world. Satan is the author of it, not God. His healing brought God glory, defeated sin as the source of the blindness and brought spiritual healing to the man. It also gives us some of the most humorous dialogue in the Bible!

God can allow sickness as in Job's case (and as a last resort for correction in others) but the purposes and who does it are clearly stated in Job 1 and 2 and James 5:11. Job was vindicated by God Job 42:7, healed, given more spiritual authority Job 42:8, and more than restored Job 42:10-17. There is no reason to believe that God will not do the same for those in Christ. However it seems most do not believe it. Again very, very sad.

 

[kenisyes]

What's worse? Doctors who act like they can heal everybody? Or denominations who claim that their interpretation of Scripture is right and the others are wrong?

 

[Colours]

If you think about it, doctors healing sick doesn't take anything away from God. We were called to do His work.

Does the action of healing a sick child via medicine not show an act of compassion? An act of using one's knowledge to help anohter human being in suffering?

What then is the difference between a doctor giving medicine to a sick child for it to eat, against a good samaritan giving a hungry, starving person food to eat?

Surely they are the same thing.

The man who needs food will die if he does not get it. And the child who needs a healing remedy will die if it does not get it.

And the act of giving both these things saves a life.

 

[Colours]

If you have the motive here that all chemical compounds that are grouped in the term 'medicine' are harmful, it might also be pointed out that EVERY compound and everything we do ultimately leads us to a physical death ..

If I eat food, chemical reactions take place in my body,using up energy, then creating energy for a short period. Medicine goes into my body, uses up energy in digestion, and takes away my ailment for a short period. Note, I define short period for food as a few hours. Short period for some medicine curing an ailment may be sixty years.

There's nothing evil about medicine other than it's malicious application by malicious people. The same goes for religion.

 

[Colours]

What you are actually suggesting is that we stop giving people medicine so they turn to God out of pain, suffering and death, in amongst peoples' refusal to do anything for the sick. Let me remind you that the apostle Luke was a practitioner of medicine. 'That beloved physician'.

 

[psychomom]

My doctor is a believer, an elder in his church, and a personal friend.

There are times he prescribes medicine (like for bacterial infections)
and times he 'prescribes' prayer, and the laying on of hands,
and healing services and ministries.
He does these mostly for his patients who are believers,
and sometimes for the lost, too, to bring them to the Source of all healing.

I think he tries to maintain a balance...prescribing meds
for easily curable illnesses, like ear infections and meningitis,
and sometimes prescribing palliative help, like pain meds
till the source can be rooted out.

I not only have been treated by him, but have worked for him.
And I appreciate him.
That beloved physician.

 

[psychomom]

It's always God Who heals.

 

[Matt37777]

There's a book every Christian should read. It's called "Confessions of a medical Heretic". It's written by a famous dr about the medical system. It's a shocking read. The summery is this.... use hosptials and dr's for "trauma care only!!!". Don't even visit a dr unless it's like a broken arm or serious infection or something that isn't easily treatable. Because you'll be setting yourself up for the possibility of a situation going from bad to worse. Clinics and hospitals are a business. There there to make money. Dr's must meet quotas with the amount of pills, tests, operations they prescribe. If they don't do enough they get pressured if they don't comply then rep-remanded and or fired.

As far as drugs go I agree avoid perscription drugs. Use alternative remedies. There's alternative remedies for most every common alement. The natural herb is something that is perfect. Perscriptions try and use drugs and the chemical make up tries and models many of the herbal remedies out there. But can't measure up so you end up getting side effects, bad reactions, and addictions as a result.

But I'm not sure I follow you on some scripture. I think Paul perscribed wine for an ill stomack. I think most definitely the naturalpathic remedies are safe and should be used as substitutes for perscription drugs as they do have medicinal properties. Like what you're suggesting is it sound like you're saying medicine isn't real and or doesn't work. I'd say it works, but the best is the a naturalpathic remedies like herbal remedies, vitimines, minerals etc. And I don't think sin is the cause of sickness. I think sin could be linked in some ways, but it's stretch. Although sin spiritually separates you from God which is not healthy.

I think sickness or decease is caused by either bad genetics and or the body not having what it needs. So the body needs: Air, clean water, nutrious food high in vitimines and minerals, sleep, sunlight. If you have enough of each of those you should start to get better. Like even if you take in a deep breath of air, hold it and release. You're body has sort of rush of a good feeling of vitality. That's one sign that proves that's true as most people don't even do enough deep breathing or areobic exercise to get enough proper oxigen into the system. Then we drink flourinated water which is basically poisoned, eat fast food, breath poluted city air (which is a constant haze of smog), stay indoors a lot out of the sun, and we wonder why we get sick? The body isn't getting what it needs.

Anyway one good website I'd recommend is Mike Adams (the health ranger) at naturalnews dot com. It's just packed with stuff on how to stay healthy. etc etc.

 

[Colours]

There's a book every Christian should read. It's called "Confessions of a medical Heretic". It's written by a famous dr about the medical system. It's a shocking read. The summery is this.... use hosptials and dr's for "trauma care only!!!". Don't even visit a dr unless it's like a broken arm or serious infection or something that isn't easily treatable. Because you'll be setting yourself up for the possibility of a situation going from bad to worse. Clinics and hospitals are a business. There there to make money. Dr's must meet quotas with the amount of pills, tests, operations they prescribe. If they don't do enough they get pressured if they don't comply then rep-remanded and or fired.

As far as drugs go I agree avoid perscription drugs. Use alternative remedies. There's alternative remedies for most every common alement. The natural herb is something that is perfect. Perscriptions try and use drugs and the chemical make up tries and models many of the herbal remedies out there. But can't measure up so you end up getting side effects, bad reactions, and addictions as a result.

But I'm not sure I follow you on some scripture. I think Paul perscribed wine for an ill stomack. I think most definitely the naturalpathic remedies are safe and should be used as substitutes for perscription drugs as they do have medicinal properties. Like what you're suggesting is it sound like you're saying medicine isn't real and or doesn't work. I'd say it works, but the best is the a naturalpathic remedies like herbal remedies, vitimines, minerals etc. And I don't think sin is the cause of sickness. I think sin could be linked in some ways, but it's stretch. Although sin spiritually separates you from God which is not healthy.

I think sickness or decease is caused by either bad genetics and or the body not having what it needs. So the body needs: Air, clean water, nutrious food high in vitimines and minerals, sleep, sunlight. If you have enough of each of those you should start to get better. Like even if you take in a deep breath of air, hold it and release. You're body has sort of rush of a good feeling of vitality. That's one sign that proves that's true as most people don't even do enough deep breathing or areobic exercise to get enough proper oxigen into the system. Then we drink flourinated water which is basically poisoned, eat fast food, breath poluted city air (which is a constant haze of smog), stay indoors a lot out of the sun, and we wonder why we get sick? The body isn't getting what it needs.

Anyway one good website I'd recommend is Mike Adams (the health ranger) at naturalnews dot com. It's just packed with stuff on how to stay healthy. etc etc.

Not in the UK they don't.

Sickness is caused by a multitude of things:

Bacteria, viruses, fungi, malnutrition, over-nutrition, cholesterol, dehydration, genetic predisposition, mutational anomalies, exposure to sunlight, environment, stress, anxiety, daily routine, habits, smoking, accidents.

You can't say 'get enough sunlight, water, food, air, vitamins and sleep and you'll be fine'.

Some things need a certain medicinal compound to go away.

Viruses generally respond to anti-viral drugs because of what they do to viruses, whatever that may be.

If I had HIV I could eat all the vitamin C in the world and it wouldn't cure it.

If I had Ebola I could sit in the sun all day and likely nothing would happen.

In America, yes, doctors are sometimes paid to promote certain brands of medicine over other brands but they aren't going to prescribe you Risperidone for a broken leg, it's all relevant to the ailment at hand.

I don't know much about health insurance in the USA and how that works but here in the UK, doctors tend to promote generic medicines that have exactly the same key ingredients as the big-bucks brands.

If it wasn't for the National Health Service I'd be dead.

 

[lesjude]

There's a book every Christian should read. It's called "Confessions of a medical Heretic". It's written by a famous dr about the medical system. It's a shocking read. The summery is this.... use hosptials and dr's for "trauma care only!!!". Don't even visit a dr unless it's like a broken arm or serious infection or something that isn't easily treatable. Because you'll be setting yourself up for the possibility of a situation going from bad to worse. Clinics and hospitals are a business. There there to make money. Dr's must meet quotas with the amount of pills, tests, operations they prescribe. If they don't do enough they get pressured if they don't comply then rep-remanded and or fired.

I read this and own it. He also calls the medical system a cult with rites, priests and priestesses, temples, mysteries, etc. He is EXACTLY right. For an example of one of the early occult hospitals see John 5:1-6.

As far as drugs go I agree avoid perscription drugs. Use alternative remedies. There's alternative remedies for most every common alement. The natural herb is something that is perfect. Perscriptions try and use drugs and the chemical make up tries and models many of the herbal remedies out there. But can't measure up so you end up getting side effects, bad reactions, and addictions as a result.

The Bible only PRESCRIBES one means. ALL the others are developed by fallen man.

But I'm not sure I follow you on some scripture. I think Paul perscribed wine for an ill stomack. I think most definitely the naturalpathic remedies are safe and should be used as substitutes for perscription drugs as they do have medicinal properties. Like what you're suggesting is it sound like you're saying medicine isn't real and or doesn't work. I'd say it works, but the best is the a naturalpathic remedies like herbal remedies, vitimines, minerals etc. And I don't think sin is the cause of sickness. I think sin could be linked in some ways, but it's stretch. Although sin spiritually separates you from God which is not healthy.

Please do a study on how sin and sickness entered the world. God is NOT the author of either. The Bible NEVER separates the two. Please read the OP again as you missed the point in the first paragraph. Being separated from God separates one from ALL that he provides including divine healing. The medical system simply keeps sinners comfortable enough that they are less likely to turn to God to get rid of the cause of their sickness which is SIN. Christians are deceived into believing that God gave them that murderous system and all "alternatives" to Divine healing to them.

I think sickness or decease is caused by either bad genetics and or the body not having what it needs. So the body needs: Air, clean water, nutrious food high in vitimines and minerals, sleep, sunlight. If you have enough of each of those you should start to get better. Like even if you take in a deep breath of air, hold it and release. You're body has sort of rush of a good feeling of vitality. That's one sign that proves that's true as most people don't even do enough deep breathing or areobic exercise to get enough proper oxigen into the system. Then we drink flourinated water which is basically poisoned, eat fast food, breath poluted city air (which is a constant haze of smog), stay indoors a lot out of the sun, and we wonder why we get sick? The body isn't getting what it needs.

Anyway one good website I'd recommend is Mike Adams (the health ranger) at naturalnews dot com. It's just packed with stuff on how to stay healthy. etc etc.

Christians are to take proper care of their bodies." Bad genetics" is the result of sin entering the world. God is not the author of it, Satan is!

 

[lesjude]

Not in the UK they don't.

Sickness is caused by a multitude of things:

Bacteria, viruses, fungi, malnutrition, over-nutrition, cholesterol, dehydration, genetic predisposition, mutational anomalies, exposure to sunlight, environment, stress, anxiety, daily routine, habits, smoking, accidents.

You can't say 'get enough sunlight, water, food, air, vitamins and sleep and you'll be fine'.

Some things need a certain medicinal compound to go away.

Viruses generally respond to anti-viral drugs because of what they do to viruses, whatever that may be.

If I had HIV I could eat all the vitamin C in the world and it wouldn't cure it.

If I had Ebola I could sit in the sun all day and likely nothing would happen.

In America, yes, doctors are sometimes paid to promote certain brands of medicine over other brands but they aren't going to prescribe you Risperidone for a broken leg, it's all relevant to the ailment at hand.

I don't know much about health insurance in the USA and how that works but here in the UK, doctors tend to promote generic medicines that have exactly the same key ingredients as the big-bucks brands.

If it wasn't for the National Health Service I'd be dead.

No, you received God's great grace and mercy and look who you give the glory to. It makes my point about trusting both God and the medical system. They ALWAYS receive the credit. Israel was not allowed to "have it both ways" and neither are Christians. What will you do if they say they cannot help you, go to God? The Bible has much to say about that as well. Most often people STILL look to the medical system even when they give them up. Sad.

 

[Ariel82]

The medical system does keep them comfortable enough so they continue in the deception while providing torture for the demons' enjoyment and a lot of blood sacrifices to Satan and his demons. .

let me get this straight... are you accusing the medical system of torturing people and offering blood sacrifices to demons?

 

[lesjude]

It's always God Who heals.

Please give ONE scripture reference where God EVER used anything but divine healing. Figs have no known medicinal properties to cure boils any more than anointing oil does. These are means used by a sovereign God, not drugs. Jesus used mud and spit. I think to poke a little fun at the ultra clean religious Pharisees and the the drug using physicians of His time. The Samaritan was a heathen with no knowledge of divine healing and even then did not use drugs.
Jesus was God in the flesh and NEVER even suggested that medical means were God's way or anything but an invention of fallen man. A good example of an occult based "hospital" is in John 5:1-6. This shows how far Israel had fallen from God and His promises in Exodus 15:26, Exodus 23:25, and Psalm 103:1-5. Jesus came to change that. Most rejected it. Nothing has changed for MOST Christians.

 

[Ariel82]

1 Timothy 5:23
No longer drink only water, but use a little wine for your stomach’s sake and your frequent infirmities.

 

[lesjude]

My doctor is a believer, an elder in his church, and a personal friend.

There are times he prescribes medicine (like for bacterial infections)
and times he 'prescribes' prayer, and the laying on of hands,
and healing services and ministries.
He does these mostly for his patients who are believers,
and sometimes for the lost, too, to bring them to the Source of all healing.

I think he tries to maintain a balance...prescribing meds
for easily curable illnesses, like ear infections and meningitis,
and sometimes prescribing palliative help, like pain meds
till the source can be rooted out.

I not only have been treated by him, but have worked for him.
And I appreciate him.
That beloved physician.

He is in a profession that is in REBELLION against God. They do not acknowledge that sin is the root of ALL sickness, and helps keep the unbelievers comfortable in Satan's kingdom so they will not realize their problem is SIN. In the US they are the #3 cause of DEATH. If you count abortions it soars WAY out in front.

No snow flake in an avalanch feels responsible which is the only reason I can see a how a Christian could justify working in this field. Doing more good than harm to justify behavior is no where taught in the Bible and is a thought pattern which came from the fall. A renewed mind has thought patterns based on God's word.
He gives support to the lie that God gives His people the medical system in place of Divine healing. Please give scripture that God would send the bride of Christ to be stripped naked, drugged, and cut up.

He prescribes drugs all of which are harmful to the body in any amount and no one knows the long term effects of until it is too late.

Here is what the Bible says is the duty of an elder in case of sickness:
James 5:14-15

New King James Version (NKJV)

14 Is anyone among you sick? Let him call for the elders of the church, and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord. 15 And the prayer of faith will save the sick, and the Lord will raise him up. And if he has committed sins, he will be forgiven.
Note it does not include drugs. If an elder cannot pray the prayer of faith and see the promised result he is not qualified to be an elder in God's NT church.

 

[lesjude]

What you are actually suggesting is that we stop giving people medicine so they turn to God out of pain, suffering and death, in amongst peoples' refusal to do anything for the sick. Let me remind you that the apostle Luke was a practitioner of medicine. 'That beloved physician'.

No, any believer should point them to the promises of divine healing in the Bible. Also the Bible says this:
Mark 16:17-18

New King James Version (NKJV)

17 And these signs will follow those who believe: In My name they will cast out demons; they will speak with new tongues; 18 they[a] will take up serpents; and if they drink anything deadly, it will by no means hurt them; they will lay hands on the sick, and they will recover.”
Notice it does not say the sick have to believe anything.
And this:
Matthew 10:7-8

New King James Version (NKJV)

7 And as you go, preach, saying, ‘The kingdom of heaven is at hand.’ 8 Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead,[a] cast out demons. Freely you have received, freely give.



Please click the link and read the post:http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/40849-so-you-want-love-people-like-jesus-did.html


Here is a discussion of Luke and divine healing. Please click and read:
http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/54003-luke-physician-divine-healing.html

 

[Colours]

Please give ONE scripture reference where God EVER used anything but divine healing. Figs have no known medicinal properties to cure boils any more than anointing oil does. These are means used by a sovereign God, not drugs. Jesus used mud and spit. I think to poke a little fun at the ultra clean religious Pharisees and the the drug using physicians of His time. The Samaritan was a heathen with no knowledge of divine healing and even then did not use drugs.
Jesus was God in the flesh and NEVER even suggested that medical means were God's way or anything but an invention of fallen man. A good example of an occult based "hospital" is in John 5:1-6. This shows how far Israel had fallen from God and His promises in Exodus 15:26, Exodus 23:25, and Psalm 103:1-5. Jesus came to change that. Most rejected it. Nothing has changed for MOST Christians.

Tell me this: Does morphine dampen the central nervous system's response and alleviate pain?

Then tell me this: Who created the atoms which eventually grew into poppies, that were harvested and refined to make morphine?

...God did.

So Are you suggesting we just pray for people that are starving, ill, maimed or in pain, when we already have methods to help all of these people ourselves?

'Love thy neighbour'.

We are called to help people. Not stand by and pray when they need something.

God gets us to do His work. He doesn't ask us to sit on our laurels and do nothing.

To me, it's a miracle that we even HAVE medicine to be able to use. Thank God for giving all those doctors the intellect to invent such things.

And let me clarify: If it wasn't for the man who took me into his ambulance and revived me as a child, I'd be dead. If it wasn't for the nurses who bandages my wounds and kept me fed and hydrated for months afterward, I'd be dead.

To me, those are the true samaritans and compassionate people of the modern world. And I owe them my life.

 

[Colours]

No, any believer should point them to the promises of divine healing in the Bible. Also the Bible says this:
Mark 16:17-18

New King James Version (NKJV)

17 And these signs will follow those who believe: In My name they will cast out demons; they will speak with new tongues; 18 they[a] will take up serpents; and if they drink anything deadly, it will by no means hurt them; they will lay hands on the sick, and they will recover.”
Notice it does not say the sick have to believe anything.
And this:
Matthew 10:7-8

New King James Version (NKJV)

7 And as you go, preach, saying, ‘The kingdom of heaven is at hand.’ 8 Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead,[a] cast out demons. Freely you have received, freely give.



Please click the link and read the post:http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/40849-so-you-want-love-people-like-jesus-did.html


Here is a discussion of Luke and divine healing. Please click and read:
http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/54003-luke-physician-divine-healing.html

Be aware of the biblical definition of sick, also.

'And he rubbed the mud of the earth (the earthly ground the man walked on, his earthly ways) into his eyes (into his sight) and the man's sight was restored (the man saw his errors again).

 

[Colours]

1 Timothy 5:23
No longer drink only water, but use a little wine for your stomach’s sake and your frequent infirmities.

Again, the biblical symbolism of 'drink' is different to what we know.

We 'eat' and 'drink' the teachings of God.

'Eat this scroll I have given to you'.

 

[Bookends]

Yes doctors and the overall medical system is corrupt and abusive. Sure, they over subscribe drugs etc. etc., but there are also people who call themselves Christians who abuse God's word to promote their doctrines. Which is worst is God's eyes?

And that's all I got to say about that!