True Born Again Christians Have Eternal Security

[homwardbound]

The problem is if you are declaring to me right now you will sin in the future then you are not repentant, and God only forgive those who have repented

So sinless you can predict the future, you can turn your hair from black to white, I repeat you sinless are now above God when Christ said plainly take one day at a time. Paul said die daily and to what does one die daily to? Can anyones flesh ever please God?
You can say without a doubt you will sin no more ever? WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I know I can't but I can take one day at a time and praise God in each day day by day praising and worshipping in the spirit of god as we are called to do God getting all the credit by Faith in God
Romans 4:16Therefore, the promise comes by faith, so that it may be by grace and may be guaranteed to all Abraham’s offspring—not only to those who are of the law but also to those who have the faith of Abraham. He is the father of us all.
Romans 4:20Yet he did not waver through unbelief regarding the promise of God, but was strengthened in his faith and gave glory to God,
Romans 5:1[ Peace and Hope ] Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ,
Romans 5:2through whom we have gained access by faith into this grace in which we now stand. And we boast in the hope of the glory of God.
Romans 9:30[ Israel’s Unbelief ] What then shall we say? That the Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have obtained it, a righteousness that is by faith;
Romans 9:32Why not? Because they pursued it not by faith but as if it were by works. They stumbled over the stumbling stone.

Please be careful mr.sinless that you are not stumbling over the stone

 

[sinless]

So sinless you can predict the future,

No I cannot predict the future, however Radius doesn't say that there is a possibility that he may sin. He says he will definitely sin in the future. Therefore I know he has no intentions on stopping

 

[homwardbound]

I haven't lied or flattered anyone since I can remember, nor can I remember the last time a swear word went through my head (although that is temptation, not sin). I thought something bad about someone today, but I immediately brought that thought into obedience to Christ.

As far as never sinning again that is my plan, it is my goal, and I believe by the grace of God I can accomplish it.

Ephesians 3
14 For this cause I bow my knees unto the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ,
15 Of whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named,
16 That he would grant you, according to the riches of his glory, to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man;
17 That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith; that ye, being rooted and grounded in love,
18 May be able to comprehend with all saints what is the breadth, and length, and depth, and height;
19 And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God.
20 Now unto him that is able to do exceeding abundantly above all that we ask or think, according to the power that worketh in us,
21 Unto him be glory in the church by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, world without end. Amen.

However IF I sin I have an advocate. You problem is you say WHEN you sin. This tells us all you have no intention on stopping therefore as I said you are not repentant and must choose to repent before you can be forgiven

All that believe God has recieved and i for instance only know of me for the Holy Ghost testifies to me my Spirt that I am by belief in him and he is at work in me teaching me by his grace to say no to unrighteousness and each eleiver is at differant stages of growth as an orange is on an orange tree hanging from the branch
Sinless when a person is born again by God from one's beleif they are born perfect in the sight of Father via the cross of Christ, born is by the life the resurrected Christ
Now look at an orange tree, when the orange is first born out of the tree branch is the orange perfect?
Why yes it is, the problem is that orange is not yet mature is it? Now God by staying in belief Matures that orange in and through the branch to full maturity and this ius what is happening in all that beleive in Christ, and not self or any other man or be of anything of this world.

 

[sinless]

Yes Homeward baby believers need to mature

 

[sinless]

Originally Posted by homwardbound So sinless you can predict the future

,

Originally Posted by Radius
Right, but to be sinless like you claim you are is to NEVER sin. That is a lie.

Seems to me tat Radius is the one claiming to know the future. Not only does he dogmatically claim he will continue in his rebellion toward God, but he insist I will also.

How in the world could he predict this?

 

[homwardbound]

"I thought something bad about someone today, but I immediately brought that thought into obedience to Christ." Sinless

"For from within, out of the heart of man, come evil thoughts, sexual immorality, theft, murder, adultery, [SUP]22 [/SUP]coveting, wickedness, deceit, sensuality, envy, slander, pride, foolishness. [SUP]23 [/SUP]All these evil things come from within, and they defile a person.” Mark 7:21-23

Interesting how Jesus actually starts this passage about sins with EVIL THOUGHTS.

Sounds to me Sinless, that you committed a sin today. It's ok, because Jesus can forgive you if you repent and ask him to forgive your sin! We all sin, and I think you have just admitted as much.

Our salvation is dependent on the work of Christ, and never on our own sinless perfection. The reason it is not dependent on our works, is because we live in this body of flesh, and sooner or later it will trip us us, including "bad thoughts." I am so thankful that my salvation is based on the cross of Calvary. I do try and obey God in every way, and to follow him with all my heart. But I think God would rather hear my confession of unrighteousness than the pride of the Pharisee who thought he was sinless and did everything right.

The Parable of the Pharisee and the Tax Collector.

[SUP]9 [/SUP]He also told this parable to some who trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and treated others with contempt: [SUP]10 [/SUP]“Two men went up into the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. [SUP]11 [/SUP]The Pharisee,standing by himself, prayed thus: ‘God, I thank you that I am not like other men, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even like this tax collector. [SUP]12 [/SUP]I fast twice a week; I give tithes of all that I get.’ [SUP]13 [/SUP]But the tax collector, standing far off,would not even lift up his eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, ‘God, be merciful to me, a sinner!’ [SUP]14 [/SUP]I tell you, this man went down to his house justified, rather than the other. For everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, but the one who humbles himself will be exalted.” Luke 18:9-14

This included just the thought of lust after another woman and one has already committed adultery with her in his heart, just be angry and one is in danger of the San Hedrin. Oh and if your hand cause you to sin cut it off better for part of you to go to heaven than all of you to go to hell
Wow!!!!! and after they the disciples saw the rich man walk away very sad because he could not give up his earthly treasure of being rich here on earth
The disciples then being anihilated asked well then Master how is it possible for any of us to enter into heaven, seeing there is nothing they can do to be able toto perfect in and of themselves underthe Law that was still in place at this time in Scripture and Christ replies
Matthew 19:25When the disciples heard this, they were greatly astonished and asked, “Who then can be saved?”
Matthew 19:26Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”
Mark 10:27Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but not with God; all things are possible with God.”

Now this was Jesus telling them without telling them that this will be done when he goes to the cross, and he asked then to pray this prayer known today as the Lord's prayer and this prayer was asked to be prayed before Christ went to the cross and it was toensure that he did go to the cross
And in this prayer it is written under the Law for that is what Christ came to do was fulfill the law
Hollowed by thy name thy will be done here on earth as it is in heaven.
After the cross is the will of Father done or not?
Before the cross the prayer was forgive us our debts as we forgive our debtors, and we could not be forgiven unless we forgave.
Waht is this after Fathers' will being done at the cross where the whole world ahs been forgiven (John 1:29) Eph. 1:7 and many other verses that proof this
Well Brothers and Sisters before the cross we forgave and loved to be loved and forgiven otherwise we were not children of God, because none of us could be perfect in and of self ever, proof of this is allover the Old Testament having to sacrifice and shed blood because of sins all the time, and God was never pleased with this.
So Christ went to the cross to take away the sacrifice and blood shedding once for all
So today we love because God first loved us
And we forgive because we are forgiven
Before the cross and after the cross WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Radius]

,Seems to me tat Radius is the one claiming to know the future. Not only does he dogmatically claim he will continue in his rebellion toward God, but he insist I will also.

How in the world could he predict this?

Please stop sinless. I never said that I will outright "REBEL" against God in the future. I simply said that I cannot guarantee, and if I may be honest, most definitely will probably sin again in my life (as I said before though, don't equate my last statement with WANTING to sin, I am just being real with myself when I say I will sin again, because I am not perfect). Whether it be a lie, or gossip or some other kind of sin, I will probably do it, though I will come to regret it after I do.

why do you paint me as some full fledged sinning, orgy-swinging, alchol swilling Christian craving and lusting for my next violation towards God? I don't do those things. But I do still commit sins from time to time, however small or large they may be. Why do you suggest I am against God in my life when in fact I meditate daily, even hourly on the Lord?

God knows me to be a humble man, you on the other hand do not know me yet cast judgments on me. Pride comes before the fall sinless, I hope you can handle it. And if you really do commit one sin a year or not at all, good for you, now I have two people to model my life after -- you and Christ.../sarcasm/

 

[homwardbound]

Haha, I didn't say it was evil. I certainly didn't want to kill the man, I just thought what he did was rude.

You people are wild

You love your sin so much you cant imagine someone loving Jesus

Sinless, have you ever sinned? and did Christ come here to earth in the flesh?

 

[homwardbound]

You said WHEN you sin, that tells me and anyone with any common sense that you have no intention of quitting

none of us said we have no intetion of not quitting, but this statement is a deception for one to go to work as it is in and of themselves to stop sin being aware of sin only produces more sin a great deception from the enemy ,because the enemy knows as a man thinketh so shall he produce it and when one thinks to the flesh whether one deisres to do flesh or not that by his thoughts of, will do what he does not want to do
Galatians 6:8For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.
And this is how it works sinless, you are by self promoting sin trying to get others to walk in the flesh and stop sin ( whether you are aware of this or not) which only produces sin as the above verse reveals and most here know this to be true.
I know because I was caught up in what I am hearing you preach. I would think no I can't do this and I would always end up doing what I did not want to do as Paul preached so well on in Romans 7 and ended with it being the only one that could change this is Jesus Christ my Savior my Lord. So we are to quit from trying to do good because we can't and start trusting Christ the resurrected Christ to doing in us what we can't and thus it is done in us as it is done by Christ at the cross, us following after the resurrected one, so the power of the cross of Christ is no longer stripped, as over the years the enemy has tried to do and done to a lot of people. Everything one needs in in the cross for life and Godliness here and now

 

[homwardbound]

Temptation is not sin

You thought it you are guilty of it, period Brother, so you never thought it?

Matthew 5:28But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

 

[Radius]

You thought it you are guilty of it, period Brother, so you never thought it?

Matthew 5:28But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

This is a Christian forum, and most things said should be sacred, but what man on here can honestly say they never did a double take at a women after converting to Christianity. I know I have and I try to look away as quick as possible because I don't like this particular sin. To look at a woman once is fine, but to double take to get one more glance of her assets in before she passes is sin. Forgive me Lord for even typing that.

 

[homwardbound]

No one who believe it is impossible to do anything thing whatever that might be tries to do it, they know it is impossible.That is exactly why you cant stop sinning, because you believe it to be impossibleIf you hated your sin, you would do it anymoreThere is no such creature

And you just denied the power of the cross and are acting as a religious leader of Christ's day
Matthew 7:5Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.

You are not helping the people here that beleive in Christ you are putting on them and making it worse puttiing others under law
Matthew 23:13But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.
Matthew 23:15Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves

Whether you are aware of this or not this is what you are saying and taking away the power of the cross where all are forgiven and God is waiting for all to see this and come to beleif and recieve new life in him by the resurrection at the cross. there is no other way to Salvation except by the cross and tha tis where one recieves and is amde perfe4ct by God through the cross
and thus by beleif in the finished work we walk by Faith and are justified, sanctified made whole and we thus walk whole not by self ever by belief period, the result is the newness of life and we rejoice over tnis fact and do not take advatage otherwise how shall any of us escape
Hebrews 2:3How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard him;

I do not know if you see this or not but to add to this miraculous salvation as it appears you are by using scripture out of context doing this
So as Paul asked the Galatians
Galatians 3:2This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
Galatians 3:5He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
Galatians 2:16Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
Romans 3:27Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.

 

[Cobus]

Homey you are stretching it,,,, he did not lust, and the thought of a sin is not a sin. Jesus thought of sin, that is how he could judge it to be sin. Remember He lived with a devil for three years.
I understand Sinless, and I believe him. If I look where I came from and where I am now, I cannot believe their are so few people in the Truth...

 

[homwardbound]

My old man is dead, I have put on Christ. I am no longer driven by the lust of the flesh, but am walking in the Spirit empowered by grace to not sin.

Galatians 5:16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.

Yes the above verse is truth, so tell me how is this accomplished in you?

 

[homwardbound]

Maybe you need to re-read what I wrote.

However to answer your question I am sinless because I have been cleansed by the blood of the Lamb

from who'sperspective are you sinless, sinless?

 

[homwardbound]

I fell sad for you Blain, so young, and so deceived. I do pray for you, that you will study the word, get out from whoever is misleading you and trust in Christ to deliver you from all sin

Are you proud over this claim of yours that you seem to know the future are you sure you are not setting yourself up for a big fall

 

[homwardbound]

If I may butt in; Is Jesus sinning with bad though when he tell us Take heed , bewareof the leaven of the Pharisees,and of the leaven of Herod or when he calls the Pharisees and Scribes "fools and hypocrites" and if we can't be sinless why does he tell us; Be ye therefore perfect,even as your Father which is inheaven is perfect

This Christ did for us via the cross that begins a t the death where all are forgiven but not all are saved by the death he made us perfect by taking away all sin, so Christ can present us perfect and thenwe can be born again in the Spirit of God here and now our flesh beiing dead by beleif
Romans 6:11Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
now oif pone practices this to be dead to self and this world then one will walk daily in being alive to God, but for me I can only claim this daily, for I do not know the future and therefore I stay rigth here right now in thepresent trusting God being alive in God here and now,m so that I will not sin against God, but if I do I am elated over the fact that I and all that believe we have an advocate Jesus Christ the righteous that makes constant intercession for us all, just be thankful and praise this miraculous salvation and one will be one in the Spirit of God where no sin can occur

 

[homwardbound]

Any person God gives HIS love too can claim to have the Love of God in him... That is what God does.... God gives a PURE PERFECT love to His Children to walk in HIS statutes... Eze 1 John AND JUST ABOUTH THE WHOLE Bible teaches this...

Radius are you implying nobody can recieve the Love of God to HIS MEASURE?... Does God do this?...Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world.

If God stopped making our love perfect, NOBODY WILL GO TO HEAVEN...

Cobus it is not our love it is God's LOVE in and through us best desribed in 1 Cor13, and no flesh can recieve or do this type of LOVE only God can by the Spirit of God which is where we all are called to live 24/7 now if we do not live up to living in the Spirit of God we are past tense forgiven and this is not for to take advantage of, rather appreciate and thus move on and learn where we stepped out of trusting God to do our leading
The born again part comes from the resurrected Christ back at the cross of Christ after one recieves that they are forgiven in and only by the death of Christ at the cross, where it is the last sacrifice and sheddinig of blood no more forgiveness is ever to executed after the cross it is finished right there after the proof in the resurrection

 

[homwardbound]

Homeward Im shocked, not one of those verses say anything about future sins being forgiven before we even commit them, must less if we refuse to repent of them, but oddly enough if you would have kept reading from Romans 3:24 you would have seen Paul tells us that only our past sins are forgiven at conversion

Romans 3:25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

There is nowhere in the new covenant after the death of Christ, anywhere any of the apostles ever asked any one to ask for further forgiveness nowhere to be found after the death of Christ on the cross
The only place that anyone uses is 1 John 1:9 as an ongoing forgiveness mantra. And after agreeing with John that Chrsit did come in the flesh and that I have sinned tere is nowhere after that, that it states to ask over and over again when god already forgave all sins once for all at the cross
Hebrews 10:10By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.
Hebrews 7:27Christ is not like other religious leaders. They had to give gifts every day on the altar in worship for their own sins first and then for the sins of the people. Christ did not have to do that. He gave one gift on the altar and that gift was Himself. It was done once and it was for all time
Hebrews 9:28It is the same with Christ. He gave Himself once to take away the sins of many. When He comes the second time, He will not need to give Himself again for sin. He will save all those who are waiting for Him.
Hebrews 10:10Our sins are washed away and we are made clean because Christ gave His own body as a gift to God. He did this once for all time.
1 Peter 3:18[ Christ Suffered for Us ] Christ suffered and died for sins once for all. He never sinned and yet He died for us who have sinned. He died so He might bring us to God. His body died but His spirit was made alive.
Jude 1:3Dear friends, I have been trying to write to you about what God did for us when He saved us from the punishment of sin. Now I must write to you and tell you to fight hard for the faith which was once and for all given to the holy people of God.

It is all by Faith and from Faith in the finished work of Christ at the cross which it seems you are avoiding

 

[homwardbound]

No I cannot predict the future, however Radius doesn't say that there is a possibility that he may sin. He says he will definitely sin in the future. Therefore I know he has no intentions on stopping

Maybe, he doesn't understand this possibility only found in Christ by the resurrected Christ and only relying on Christ to dothis daily in Christ. Now this is what I know as possible to die daily to my flesh and world so that I can see mynew life in Christ and reaspond with thanksgiving and praise so much that there is no time for sin.
Do you agree. For I know I can't predict what will be tommorrow and I know Christ said take no thought of tomorrow, so when I heard Paul say I die daily I understood him to mean to his carnal nature body that is not redeemed, therefore we can beleive we are dead to it and thus be alive to God here and now wallking in the Spirit of God where no sin can ever occur