A Born Again Person Can Not Become Dead OSAS is Biblical

[newbirth]

Sin is exactly what the Bible says it is. You sin. People sin.

The scripture says sin not....
1 Corinthians 15:34
Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.

 

[ELECT]

The scripture says sin not....
1 Corinthians 15:34
Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.

How readesth thou ?

[h=1]1 John 1:8-10King James Version (KJV)[/h]8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

 

[ELECT]

Sin is exactly what the Bible says it is. You sin. People sin.

sin is thought also without action

 

[BlackPlatypus]

I am not pious nor snide. You have no authority to let anything I share here to slide. If you agree with what I say you agree. If you do not, you do not.

Your judgment and conduct speak for itself. As does your venom.
May God have mercy.

I am a minister and have been a Pastor and I am going to let your pious and snide spirituality and attacks slide...
I asked you a simple question, and because you have no answer for it, launch an attack.

There is no sin here except your pride.

You should examine Rev 2 very thoroughly, before throwing acid and assuming things. Jesus says we must overcome, and then we will be granted access to the tree of life, the same thing is stated in Rev 22...

 

[newbirth]

How readesth thou ?

1 John 1:8-10King James Version (KJV)

8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

and your point is? the scripture still says sin not....people who say we sin but it's Ok God understands..get comfortable in sin...the reason the scripture says sin not, is so that we must never be comfortable with sin...we must hate the very appearance of sin....but some have not the knowledge of God....

 

[kennethcadwell]

The scripture says sin not....
1 Corinthians 15:34
Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.

It is the context that some do not understand.

Like in this scripture for one, and others like it are speaking of un-repented willful sin that is being spoken of.

It is not saying that you will never commit sin again, for we all back slide and are not perfect.
That total perfection does not come until we are transformed into our spiritual bodies.

 

[The_highwayman]

I am not pious nor snide. You have no authority to let anything I share here to slide. If you agree with what I say you agree. If you do not, you do not.

Your judgment and conduct speak for itself. As does your venom.
May God have mercy.

I take it you have not read through Rev 2 then?

 

[The_highwayman]

We are more than overcomers in Christ.

You cannot overcome the world but Jesus did on your behalf. Please do not rob God of His glory.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Roger, Jesus talks to the church in Rev 2 and 3 and he says in red, he that overcomes...

Rev 3.21 says:
[SUP]21 [/SUP]To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

The debate is not about how we overcome, that's a given, we do all things through Christ. Nobody is robbing God of his glory here.

 

[BlackPlatypus]

Actually, all one has to do is go to the teachings of our Lord Jesus Christ.

We are not saved through Adam. Adam stopped being part of the equation of the human condition when Jesus sacrificed himself for the sins the human race incurred due to Adam.
A Christian who accepted Christ is born again. That does not change. If they backslide they simply confess their sin, repent, and they are still in the grace of God.

God's grace is his gift to us. It is not something we work to receive. If we repent, after we backslide we are in the grace of God and our salvation is eternal. As it always was. It isn't as if God doesn't know we fell or had doubts. We confess ourselves so as to unburden our heart and mind.
When Jesus said no one will take us out of his hand after we are saved, that means not even we can leave his embrace, his promise of our eternal salvation.
Those who believe, have faith they can, have faith in something other than Jesus Christ. And they were never saved in the first place.
And no, just to give grace and credit to the detractors of Christ Jesus message, that is not a dismissive. That is scripture.

Eternal salvation and the promise of that made by our Lord is not a license to sin. The scriptures tell the Christian that as well. Yes, we may choose to turn away from that life in Christ, but that is nothing Jesus didn't know as possible in the human family. And that is why he testified that we are ever in the fold, so that we may not believe we perish because we make a mistake.
The prodigal son parable speaks to the truth of Christ and his promise as our Heavenly Father.

When Jesus said no one can snatch us out of his hand that means not even we can leap from there. If our will was stronger than God's he wouldn't be God. But that is exactly what detractors of eternal salvation in the scriptures are hoping to teach, to minister, to Christians here.

Remember what the scriptures say; Even Satan can appear as an angel of light. And he can quote scripture too.
Satan wants people to go to Hell. It stands to reason he would inspire the false teaching that Christ failed on the cross and that eternal salvation is not eternal. That we and our carnal nature and our purpose in exhausting our worst behavior after being saved is stronger than the grasp of Christ and his promise to keep us in his hand eternally as the elect, the saved, who have eternal life.

By grace! Not by our actions. If we can't commit to a work in order to receive eternal salvation how then can we work to revoke it? That wouldn't be what 'eternal' is defined as would it?
And it would make Christ a liar. Behold I came to give you temporary salvation so that you can toss it away at whim and assure yourself you'd rather go to Hell for eternity.
No, that's not in scripture. Not anywhere. Hold to the narrow road my sisters and brothers. As we are beset on all sides by the whisperings of demons and evil men who hope to lead us from the righteous road so that they have us in their company.

God have mercy.

The problem of all this is lack of knowledge and wisdom and patience ,in all this we must take a trip to genesis and go back to Adam Our earthly Father by natural means now father Adam was ordered /commanded not to eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil ,and was told on the day he should eat from it he shall surely die , the death He incurred was a spiritual death a life in hell for from this day on all mankind had a destiny to hell through death in the spiritual being impure because of disobedience , but in History we see the exception of some that were ascended into heaven through faith , by faith they saw a better place to better illustrate the faith , we must look at Our Elohim being YHWH THE MOST HIGH being a Holy ELOHIM INCORRUPTIBLE for in Him there is no corruption and most important HE IS ETERNAL . Eternity is a good subject to understand the MOST HIGH ELOHIM THE ONLY ONE , WHO IS THE SAME AS CHRIST FOR THEY ARE ONE . eternity is not constant has no beginning and no end in all GOD's existence being omnipotent for HE IS , THE I AM SOLEMM PURE ALL POWERFUL. now that we have established God's Eternal solemnity , we then look at all His attributes holiness pure , righteousness ,peace ,goodness we then understand his characteristics and if we further search what God hates we Lear what He doesn't like because of such cannot dwell co existing where He is , which brings into remembrance the psalm , who shall ascend up His holy hill who shall enter His holy temple ? And the answer is he who is upright in heart who does not lend with usury who has clean hands , " here is the goal we must take and is a very description of Our LORD JESUS CHRIST who we have now as prime example . And the sin and abomination examples as the dangers that would mean seperation , which is why Jesus is the true light that perfectly shows up the way showing us where we must be , now if one deviates from Jesus(eternity) the life and the resurrection He is truly the way and those who not deny themselves and follow Him will not see eternity , set by example of Adam that man can be sent to death is a very true example and not to ignore the 1st book of john or even revelations or even Jesus warning us not to be deceived even Paul stated this in overall we must be seeking God's eternity by seeking His riches ,bringing in remembrance seek the kingdom and all its righteousness and all else will be added its seek first sorry bout that but we are to love God more than ourselves now question yourselves is Osas list it practical does your heart align with God ? Are you God's seed or Satan's does your actions align with God's eternity or are you living in the time that diminishes and not looking towards the promise 'for time will cease the earth will pass away even the heaven but God's Word will last forever , so in all my advise and God's LET HIS WORD ABOUND IN YOU LET HIM CONSUME YOU TILL HE IS ALL IS LEFT THAT IT BE HIM LIVING THROUGH YOU .

 

[The_highwayman]

Yes, but as we can read that refers to two different things. 3:5 assures the faithful that they shall not have their name blotted out of the book of life.

Matthew Henry's Commentary – Verses 1–6 (Revelation 3:5)
(Sic)"...III. We now come to the conclusion of this epistle, in which, as before, we have,


1. A great reward promised to the conquering Christian (Rev. 3:5), and it is very much the same with what has been already mentioned: He that overcometh shall be clothed in white raiment. The purity of grace shall be rewarded with the perfect purity of glory. Holiness, when perfected, shall be its own reward; glory is the perfection of grace, differing not in kind, but in degree. Now to this is added another promise very suitable to the case: I will not blot his name out of the book of life, but will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels. Observe, (1.) Christ has his book of life, a register and roll of all who shall inherit eternal life. [1.] The book of eternal election. [2.] The book of remembrance of all those who have lived to God, and have kept up the life and power of godliness in evil times. (2.) Christ will not blot the names of his chosen and faithful ones out of this book of life; men may be enrolled in the registers of the church, as baptized, as making a profession, as having a name to live, and that name may come to be blotted out of the roll, when it appears that it was but a name, a name to live, without spiritual life; such often lose the very name before they die, they are left of God to blot out their own names by their gross and open wickedness. But the names of those that overcome shall never be blotted out. (3.) Christ will produce this book of life, and confess the names of the faithful who stand there, before God, and all the angels; he will do this as their Judge, when the books shall be opened; he will do this as their captain and head, leading them with him triumphantly to heaven, presenting them to the Father: Behold me, and the children that thou hast given me. How great will this honour and reward be!
2. The demand of universal attention finishes the message. Every word from God deserves attention from men; that which may seem more particularly directed to one body of men has something in it instructive to all."





While 22:19 promises that those who take away from the words of the book, that which guides the faithful to know God's good news, God shall take away his part, notice it doesn't say name, out of the book of life.


Matthew Henry's Commentary – (Revelation 22) Verses 6–19
(Sic)"...Rev. 22:18, 19. He that adds to the word of God draws down upon himself all the plagues written in this book; and he who takes any thing away from it cuts himself off from all the promises and privileges of it. This sanction is like a flaming sword, to guard the canon of the scripture from profane hands. Such a fence as this God set about the law (Deut. 4:2), and the whole Old Testament (Mal. 4:4), and now in the most solemn manner about the whole Bible, assuring us that it is a book of the most sacred nature, divine authority, and of the last importance, and therefore the peculiar care of the great God."

Rev 3.5:
He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

This is rightly divided with what Jesus also said in Matt 10.32-33
[SUP]
32 [/SUP]Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven.

[SUP]33 [/SUP]But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

FOr the record, the commentary makes our point perfectly....

 

[The_highwayman]

Actually, all one has to do is go to the teachings of our Lord Jesus Christ.

We are not saved through Adam. Adam stopped being part of the equation of the human condition when Jesus sacrificed himself for the sins the human race incurred due to Adam.
A Christian who accepted Christ is born again. That does not change. If they backslide they simply confess their sin, repent, and they are still in the grace of God.

God's grace is his gift to us. It is not something we work to receive. If we repent, after we backslide we are in the grace of God and our salvation is eternal. As it always was. It isn't as if God doesn't know we fell or had doubts. We confess ourselves so as to unburden our heart and mind.
When Jesus said no one will take us out of his hand after we are saved, that means not even we can leave his embrace, his promise of our eternal salvation.
Those who believe, have faith they can, have faith in something other than Jesus Christ. And they were never saved in the first place.
And no, just to give grace and credit to the detractors of Christ Jesus message, that is not a dismissive. That is scripture.

Eternal salvation and the promise of that made by our Lord is not a license to sin. The scriptures tell the Christian that as well. Yes, we may choose to turn away from that life in Christ, but that is nothing Jesus didn't know as possible in the human family. And that is why he testified that we are ever in the fold, so that we may not believe we perish because we make a mistake.
The prodigal son parable speaks to the truth of Christ and his promise as our Heavenly Father.

When Jesus said no one can snatch us out of his hand that means not even we can leap from there. If our will was stronger than God's he wouldn't be God. But that is exactly what detractors of eternal salvation in the scriptures are hoping to teach, to minister, to Christians here.

Remember what the scriptures say; Even Satan can appear as an angel of light. And he can quote scripture too.
Satan wants people to go to Hell. It stands to reason he would inspire the false teaching that Christ failed on the cross and that eternal salvation is not eternal. That we and our carnal nature and our purpose in exhausting our worst behavior after being saved is stronger than the grasp of Christ and his promise to keep us in his hand eternally as the elect, the saved, who have eternal life.

By grace! Not by our actions. If we can't commit to a work in order to receive eternal salvation how then can we work to revoke it? That wouldn't be what 'eternal' is defined as would it?
And it would make Christ a liar. Behold I came to give you temporary salvation so that you can toss it away at whim and assure yourself you'd rather go to Hell for eternity.
No, that's not in scripture. Not anywhere. Hold to the narrow road my sisters and brothers. As we are beset on all sides by the whisperings of demons and evil men who hope to lead us from the righteous road so that they have us in their company.

God have mercy.

Ok...your repeating yourself with nothing knew, the same stuff, so when does eternal life/eternal judgement begin?

 

[The_highwayman]

Actually, all one has to do is go to the teachings of our Lord Jesus Christ.

We are not saved through Adam. Adam stopped being part of the equation of the human condition when Jesus sacrificed himself for the sins the human race incurred due to Adam.
A Christian who accepted Christ is born again. That does not change. If they backslide they simply confess their sin, repent, and they are still in the grace of God.

God's grace is his gift to us. It is not something we work to receive. If we repent, after we backslide we are in the grace of God and our salvation is eternal. As it always was. It isn't as if God doesn't know we fell or had doubts. We confess ourselves so as to unburden our heart and mind.
When Jesus said no one will take us out of his hand after we are saved, that means not even we can leave his embrace, his promise of our eternal salvation.
Those who believe, have faith they can, have faith in something other than Jesus Christ. And they were never saved in the first place.
And no, just to give grace and credit to the detractors of Christ Jesus message, that is not a dismissive. That is scripture.

Eternal salvation and the promise of that made by our Lord is not a license to sin. The scriptures tell the Christian that as well. Yes, we may choose to turn away from that life in Christ, but that is nothing Jesus didn't know as possible in the human family. And that is why he testified that we are ever in the fold, so that we may not believe we perish because we make a mistake.
The prodigal son parable speaks to the truth of Christ and his promise as our Heavenly Father.

When Jesus said no one can snatch us out of his hand that means not even we can leap from there. If our will was stronger than God's he wouldn't be God. But that is exactly what detractors of eternal salvation in the scriptures are hoping to teach, to minister, to Christians here.

Remember what the scriptures say; Even Satan can appear as an angel of light. And he can quote scripture too.
Satan wants people to go to Hell. It stands to reason he would inspire the false teaching that Christ failed on the cross and that eternal salvation is not eternal. That we and our carnal nature and our purpose in exhausting our worst behavior after being saved is stronger than the grasp of Christ and his promise to keep us in his hand eternally as the elect, the saved, who have eternal life.

By grace! Not by our actions. If we can't commit to a work in order to receive eternal salvation how then can we work to revoke it? That wouldn't be what 'eternal' is defined as would it?
And it would make Christ a liar. Behold I came to give you temporary salvation so that you can toss it away at whim and assure yourself you'd rather go to Hell for eternity.
No, that's not in scripture. Not anywhere. Hold to the narrow road my sisters and brothers. As we are beset on all sides by the whisperings of demons and evil men who hope to lead us from the righteous road so that they have us in their company.

God have mercy.

Constant backsliding and re-dedication is not found anywhere in the Bible either....

 

[kennethcadwell]

Constant backsliding and re-dedication is not found anywhere in the Bible either....

It is not mentioned in that way, but it does say that when we do sin again we have an advocate, our Lord Jesus. And when we ask for forgiveness, He is just and will forgive us.
This is a true example that future sins are not covered at a one time repentance, if they were we would not have to ask forgiveness of future sins. It shows future sins do happen in believers, and Paul himself also said he still does things he shouldn't.

 

[The_highwayman]

It is not mentioned in that way, but it does say that when we do sin again we have an advocate, our Lord Jesus. And when we ask for forgiveness, He is just and will forgive us.
This is a true example that future sins are not covered at a one time repentance, if they were we would not have to ask forgiveness of future sins. It shows future sins do happen in believers, and Paul himself also said he still does things he shouldn't.

agreed with you 100%

 

[newbirth]

It is not mentioned in that way, but it does say that when we do sin again we have an advocate, our Lord Jesus. And when we ask for forgiveness, He is just and will forgive us.
This is a true example that future sins are not covered at a one time repentance, if they were we would not have to ask forgiveness of future sins. It shows future sins do happen in believers, and Paul himself also said he still does things he shouldn't.

not only that but..there is a sin unto death...but the sin that is not unto death will end in death if left unforgiven...reason being he gives life to those who asks after they commit a sin that is not unto death...
1 John 5:16
If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it.

 

[kennethcadwell]

not only that but..there is a sin unto death...but the sin that is not unto death will end in death if left unforgiven...reason being he gives life to those who asks after they commit a sin that is not unto death...
1 John 5:16
If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it.

Yes, this would be the willful sin the bible warns believers about not being apart of, or going back to. The non-repented sins.

agreed with you 100%

Thank you, and may God bless you in your walk in faith.

 

[fredjames]

Sadly, you are one of the near sighted believers, always enjoying milk remaining as babes in CHRIST and confessing baby things to others who have grown towards meat. As it is also written to those who judge not rightly and fairly regarding the new Covenant, who 'only condemn themselves of doing the very same things that others do';

"Ever learning but never come into the knowledge of the truth."

In the Old or New Covenant alike, GOD always starts of by proclaiming HIS promise to HIS people. And then at the same time HE continues on with HIS conditions, example;

1. Through Moses:

"I AM the LORD thy GOD who healeth thee, 'if' you obey/keep/abide My commandments, rules, instructions, ............................"


2. Through JESUS and saying to those who believe in HIM and HIS words, in order to inherit Eternal life:

'JESUS said to the Jews who believe in HIM; "If you abide in My Words, you are My disciples and you will know the truth and the truth shall set you free. ........................................................ and when the son sets you free, you are indeed free."


"Those who hear these teachings of mine and do/practice them - are wise builders who can stand beatings that comes their way"

"Those who hear these teachings of mine and not do/practice them - are foolish builders who fall , with a great fall from the beatings that comes their way"

"............................................................... The road that leads to the Kingdom is narrow, and it is very difficult to follow and only a few will make it."

Are you among many OSAS group in deception neglecting these Scripture that speaks of 'conditions' of rules and regulations that must be applied/practiced/done, in order to hold on to the gift of GOD and find their way to GOD's place of rest' given to those who believe in JESUS?

Or do you believe in ignoring these Scripture and moving on in your own understanding faith and believe and confessing, you and others with you can hold on to the gift of GOD's Eternal life?

If yes, sorry to say to you and many who are with you that, all of you 'are near sighted' and cannot see far. If in ignorance to what the LORD have revealed from Scripture again today and one still persist forward, then you will be surprised by or even over look a ditch that awaits for the ones who are 'blind leading another blind'.

Again by the 'HELPER', the HOLY BIBLE is written, and there is no corruption in them, even there are many versions. Not including modern versions that contradict what we have been taught and learned by the Help of the HOLY SPIRIT from the common reliable ones that agree with each other, even though seem contradicting in the beginning.

All in all, what OSAS group proclaim is of truth foundation, but partial, believes in Scripture taken out of context to justify the full salvation. There are other partial Scripture that defeats OSAS claims that i have been guided to share, and again i have brought forward them and highlight as above. Witnesses discern for yourselves and compare both claims and ask the HOLY SPIRIT to Help, teach how to unite both and understand as in whole and 'one', written in the New Covenant, for the born again, not only by water but also of the HOLY SPIRIT.

This means, be taught the HOLY BIBLE by the Help of the HOLY SPIRIT, understand them in whole and Christian according to all of them in sound doctrine spiritual knowledge in faith;

"'Workout your salvation in 'fear' and 'trembling' ."

i would truly want to be with the OSAS group, because no matter how much i do wrong, i will be forgiven and i am assured to be in Heaven. The muslims believe the same, even in them being murders for a good and holy purpose faith, given by their allah. So both one day can become brothers and sisters together in peace, to ways of islam. And sadly, baby believers ignoring the deception/trick of the devil and also during GOD's promised delusion one day, they themselves have to become muslims.

But other Scripture that justifies otherwise is that there are teachings to be obeyed and practiced that directs us to mature, forsake flesh/carnal and sin no more, which is also from the, 'Author and finisher of our faith' the new Covenant Himself, who says;

"Your sins are forgiven, sin no more."

"See that you sin no more or something worst will happen to you."

Only to those who believe the LORD JESUS CHRIST in whole, by the spiritual HOLY BIBLE knowledge taught by the HOLY SPIRIT in whole and though that knowledge spiritual practices in whole, as 'abiding' in all of them, the words of spirit and life of their MASTER, assuredly have Eternal Life and destined for Heaven, GOD's place of rest.

How about those who believe partial of LORD JESUS CHRIST, from what have been already written in whole and have been established for the churches by GOD to honor HIS SON.

That is why the flesh and the SPIRIT are warring each other in the lives of Christian and this stop them from doing what they want to do and so they become 'lukewarm' and find ways and Scripture taken out of context to justify their faith is genuine. Hypocrites!, who are destine for dead once again, sooner of later, because for now Grace and Truth still abounds for one to make a wise choice or in gloomy and sadness, seek rehabilitation, make peace by finding help in all their weakness from their MASTER, who resides as Great High Priest for all saints, in Heaven before HE returns.

i was an OSAS thinker and believer in faith before in the beginning and when the HOLY SPIRIT Helped me in HIS Spiritual HOLY BIBLE knowledge further, i discovered partial understandings and partial practices i was living before and i was near sighted then and have not add/supplement to my faith. And now understanding them all in whole in 'supplement', there is a GOD and man fear and trembling in me, if i don't workout HIS words of Eternal Life and witness to others according to the New Covenant in whole.

i hope dearly beloved, being lower than you, this Helps as a reminder and a stir up of memory to what is already written and established from Heaven, the New Covenant which GOD made with us through HIS SON and the HOLY SPIRIT and the HOLY BIBLE and in faith to all of them that we have accepted and agreed, to obey/abide/practice them of love and togetherness as bloomed good citizens for this sad wretched world with Christian themselves in ignorant taking part, Catholic and non-Catholic alike.

 

[fredjames]

Again by the 'HELPER', the HOLY BIBLE is written, and there is no corruption in them, even there are many versions. Not including modern versions that contradict what we have been taught and learned by the Help of the HOLY SPIRIT from the common reliable ones that agree with each other, even though seem contradicting in the beginning.

All in all, what OSAS group proclaim is of truth foundation, but partial, believes in Scripture taken out of context to justify the full salvation. There are other partial Scripture that defeats OSAS claims that i have been guided to share, and again i have brought forward them and highlight as above. Witnesses discern for yourselves and compare both claims and ask the HOLY SPIRIT to Help, teach how to unite both and understand as in whole and 'one', written in the New Covenant, for the born again, not only by water but also of the HOLY SPIRIT.

This means, be taught the HOLY BIBLE by the Help of the HOLY SPIRIT, understand them in whole and Christian according to all of them in sound doctrine spiritual knowledge in faith;

"'Workout your salvation in 'fear' and 'trembling' ."

i would truly want to be with the OSAS group, because no matter how much i do wrong, i will be forgiven and i am assured to be in Heaven. The muslims believe the same, even in them being murders for a good and holy purpose faith, given by their allah. So both one day can become brothers and sisters together in peace, to ways of islam. And sadly, baby believers ignoring the deception/trick of the devil and also during GOD's promised delusion one day, they themselves have to become muslims.

But other Scripture that justifies otherwise is that there are teachings to be obeyed and practiced that directs us to mature, forsake flesh/carnal and sin no more, which is also from the, 'Author and finisher of our faith' the new Covenant Himself, who says;

"Your sins are forgiven, sin no more."

"See that you sin no more or something worst will happen to you."

Only to those who believe the LORD JESUS CHRIST in whole, by the spiritual HOLY BIBLE knowledge taught by the HOLY SPIRIT in whole and though that knowledge spiritual practices in whole, as 'abiding' in all of them, the words of spirit and life of their MASTER, assuredly have Eternal Life and destined for Heaven, GOD's place of rest.

How about those who believe partial of LORD JESUS CHRIST, from what have been already written in whole and have been established for the churches by GOD to honor HIS SON.

That is why the flesh and the SPIRIT are warring each other in the lives of Christian and this stop them from doing what they want to do and so they become 'lukewarm' and find ways and Scripture taken out of context to justify their faith is genuine. Hypocrites!, who are destine for dead once again, sooner of later, because for now Grace and Truth still abounds for one to make a wise choice or in gloomy and sadness, seek rehabilitation, make peace by finding help in all their weakness from their MASTER, who resides as Great High Priest for all saints, in Heaven before HE returns.

i was an OSAS thinker and believer in faith before in the beginning and when the HOLY SPIRIT Helped me in HIS Spiritual HOLY BIBLE knowledge further, i discovered partial understandings and partial practices i was living before and i was near sighted then and have not add/supplement to my faith. And now understanding them all in whole in 'supplement', there is a GOD and man fear and trembling in me, if i don't workout HIS words of Eternal Life and witness to others according to the New Covenant in whole.

i hope dearly beloved, being lower than you, this Helps as a reminder and a stir up of memory to what is already written and established from Heaven, the New Covenant which GOD made with us through HIS SON and the HOLY SPIRIT and the HOLY BIBLE and in faith to all of them that we have accepted and agreed, to obey/abide/practice them of love and togetherness as bloomed good citizens for this sad wretched world with Christian themselves in ignorant taking part, Catholic and non-Catholic alike.

And when there is commandment given in the New Testament and one of them given by JESUS through Apostle Paul to the churches, are not to be ignored and they are spoken like this;

"Do not be conformed to the pattern of this world but rather allow GOD to renew your thinking."



To all that GOD have highlighted in the New Covenant in whole, for all Christian's thinking to be renewed in Spiritual knowledge and practicing them. Discovering the weakness of carnal/flesh that oppose them in whole, by the Help of the Teacher the HOLY SPIRIT, which it is waring against.

Then come in gloomy and sadness, knowing unable to do what GOD has called to do, seek Help in all of that weaknesses highlighted with the Great High Priest in Heaven making peace with the MASTER and find Help in rectifying them according to the New Covenant, in now once again 'abiding' to them in whole.

Let us not boast in our gifts placed in us, debating and arguing and fighting and justifying saints, when truthfully in submission and obedience we ignore and neglect what is written and established and called the New Covenant.

We all know by the Help of the HOLY SPIRIT that GOD becomes angry when anyone breaks HIS Covenant and continue in the past. This is what JESUS said to HIS disciples, who did not posses the HOLY SPIRIT and the HOLY BIBLE:

"Oh ye of little faith, how much longer must I put up with you and how much longer must I be with you."

But we have all of them until today and we are not consistent in knowledge and running forward in togetherness in understanding the marathon set ahead of us, for them who were in the beginning lacking without what we have today in our hands and be taught in whole, in order to do better and not repeat their mistakes.

Why are we fighting and arguing with each other, because we are full of selfish feelings and desires. We even want to murder by our words using the gifts, even in Scripture to get what we want. Respect and honor just like a carnal/flesh in ignorance Pharisee.

 

[The_Wanderer]

It is not mentioned in that way, but it does say that when we do sin again we have an advocate, our Lord Jesus. And when we ask for forgiveness, He is just and will forgive us.
This is a true example that future sins are not covered at a one time repentance, if they were we would not have to ask forgiveness of future sins. It shows future sins do happen in believers, and Paul himself also said he still does things he shouldn't.

If so, then what happens if a Christian sins and suddenly dies (before asking for forgiveness)? Is that one sin outside of Christ's atonement? If so, that's a scary proposition indeed.

 

[EmethAlethia]

The issue is not whether or not anyone, with any belief can gather passages of scripture(Or facts, data ...) that they can "use" to support their beliefs, and whether or not they can gather passages of scripture(Or facts, data ...) that they can "use" to refute opposing beliefs. Everyone can. The problem is that no one using this method wants the truth. As a matter of fact, their eyes and ears are firmly closed lest they see or hear the truth. Their beliefs are far more important than the truth is.

So who's on which side, are the Calvinists wrong or the Armenians? Yes. The problem is with what is loved, ... the beliefs, and not truth. The problem is that both will ignore context, flow of thought, flow of discussion and arguments, consistent meaning of words/root words as they are used throughout scripture... both will throw out logic and reason and accept contradictions, just to hold fast to their beliefs. Many will ignore clear interpretations of easy passages to interpret them instead in accordance with a muddy passage that they can make "appear" to support their beliefs.


If you want truth, then you must gather every passage that might apply to the topic at hand, and not just the passages that you and your opponents "select out" to prove your beliefs true. You must hold to the context, flow of thought, flow of discussion, consistent meaning of words as they are used throughout scripture, EVEN WHEN YOU MUST DISCARD THEM AS IRRELEVANT TO THE BELIEFS YOU WULD LIKE TO SEE SUPORTED. You must interpret the fuzzy passages in the light of the clear passages on the exact same topics, not the other way around because you can make them support your beliefs.


That which you love least will always be altered, and forced to conform, to that which you love most. Everyone loves the truth, or their beliefs more.

Ok, but on losing your salvation, where do I stand? I stand on the fact that most people who believe themselves to be Christians aren't. "Many will say to Me, Lord, Lord ... and I will say to them, depart from Me ye who work iniquity for I knew you and you chose to leave Me." "They went out from us for ... while they were from us, they lost their salvation." "I have decided to deliver such a one(Who is in the church and is sleeping with his mother, and is non-repentant) over to Satan for the destruction of His flesh that his soul might burn in hell for his non-repentant sin."

I understand the "need" for some to change the scriptures to conform to their beliefs. I understand that there are still many of my beliefs that might still be wrong, because I have yet to even recognize my own inconsistencies. This is an issue that, first off, I couldn't care less which belief is true or not, other than I want to get to the truth and put it all together so that everything fits with everything else, with EVERYTHING "Cut-straight".

There are dozens of passages of scripture that "VERY CLEARLY" state that while there is a big group that never were Christians (Many on the broad path that leads to destruction, and, who went out because they were never of us.), that there is another big group that is TRULY Christian, and who refuse to judge themselves correctly, and thus receive the judgment of God, and thus were "sick", or "slept"(Physical death)(See the Lord's supper incident), because they did not want to recognize their sins and repent.

This is not a loss of "sonship", resulting in being un-adopted into the kingdom of heaven. This is proof that, while unrepentant, and sinning, that they remain children of God, even to the point where their stiff necks are broken (Destruction of the flesh). If they lose sonship, then they no longer receive judgment now. Making this passage non-sensical, as well as others.

1Co 11:27 Therefore whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner, shall be guilty of the body and the blood of the Lord. 28 But a man must examine himself, and in so doing he is to eat of the bread and drink of the cup. 29 For he who eats and drinks, eats and drinks judgment to himself if he does not judge the body rightly. 30 For this reason many among you are weak and sick, and a number sleep. 31 But if we judged ourselves rightly, we would not be judged. 32 But when we are judged, we are disciplined by the Lord so that we will not be condemned along with the world.

oh yes, I understand that those who differ in opinion can readily state that I am guilty of the same thing, picking out passages and verses to readily support my beliefs and to refute all opposing beliefs. Due to the limited nature of a forum, the ability to go over each and every passage here, along with context, an examination of every place each and every key word / root word that is found in every passage is used and holding to a meaning that fully fits in EVERY place, is beyond the scope of the medium. Who would read such a post?

Yes, there are such issues as "close to being cursed and it ends up being burned". where "Close to being" is ESSENTIAL, and looking up other passages where burning is described after salvation, and after death, where, because of loss of rewards, due to burning, people end up walking into heaven with no rewards whatsoever, are key. Be careful on how you build on your foundation.

Again, the "clear" passages are the foundation. The more difficult require work beyond the scope of the capabilities here.