A few questions for brave non Israelites;

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john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
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only problem is...i never said that. RedTent did. which is a lie, of course.

"Zone says that she is not part of Israel, when scripture talks of Israel in the sense of all the believers who love Christ rather than racial Israel. "

you folks are so confused, ya haveta make things up as you go:)

i say only Christians today are the Israel of God. and only ever will be.

The Israel of God
http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/62123-israel-god.html
So, with this in mind, how do you feel about the New Covenant? Got the Torah written in your heart and mind do ya?
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
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FYI & FTR; I started this thread because on another thread when I rebutted something others posted, my rebuttal was overlooked or ignored. My original intention was to share what I believe is "the great deception" that is so clever that if "those days were not shortened -- no flesh would be saved"(Matt.24.22). I will say again that I believe that it came in through the common calendar, as Ps.142.3 says "When my spirit was overwhelmed within me, then thou knewest my path, in the way wherein I walk they have privily laid a snare for me". Since Luke 21.36 says "as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth", and Ex.34.12, Deut.12.30, Joshua 23.13 show that the snare is the same thing Paul preached against in Acts 17.22-23, and the calendar was brought in after the time that Christians were being mass murdered, I wanted to make it known to as many as possible - for the good of the flock of God.

I meant no ill towards anyone, but I met severe opposition that kept changing the corurse of the conversation to me trying to says we were still under the law. I will state that I do not believe that keeping the law will in any way make any one righteous, but I also know that no one can perform a thimble full of any form of righteousness unless the Lord grants them the abibity. But again FTR Rom.3.25 and Heb.10.26 work with Rom.2.12 & 16, for those who defended that not keeping the law is righteous because Christ's blood set them at liberty(1 Pet.2.16, 2 Pet.2.19).

I will not come back on this web site, if anyone wants to reach me, my email address is [email protected]

God's grace to all who read this.
so, it was about Constantine (Rome; Catholicism?).
and you offered zero evidence that either - God didn't intend a change of calendars; that it matters at all, since not one of you (us) is ancient israel (and even if you were, there is only ONE Covenant - which does NOT include or require Jerusalem; a Temple; or any of the things the old calendar was for).

the New Covenant does not teach OT observance of days weeks months or years; or sabbaths.

we are saved by grace through FAITH in JESUS CHRIST, not by days weeks months or years.....calendars.
any claim to the contrary is some other gospel, and leads away from Christ.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
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So, with this in mind, how do you feel about the New Covenant? Got the Torah written in your heart and mind do ya?
the Torah?:)

the New Covenant commands and laws are in....the New Testament.

...

1 Corinthians 2:16
Wisdom from the Spirit of God
15But he who is spiritual appraises all things, yet he himself is appraised by no one. 16For WHO HAS KNOWN THE MIND OF THE LORD, THAT HE WILL INSTRUCT HIM? But we have the mind of Christ.

John 15:15
I no longer call you servants, because a servant does not know his master's business. Instead, I have called you friends, for everything that I learned from my Father I have made known to you.

1 Corinthians 2:15
The person with the Spirit makes judgments about all things, but such a person is not subject to merely human judgments

what you need to do, is start with what Jesus said:

Matthew 28
The Great Commission

19"Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, 20teaching them to observe all that I commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age."

then you go to His apostles; and see what He commanded them.
and those are our instructions:)

Romans 5
Peace with God Through Faith

1Therefore, since we have been justified by faith, wea have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ. 2Through him we have also obtained access by faithb into this grace in which we stand, and wec rejoiced in hope of the glory of God. 3More than that, we rejoice in our sufferings, knowing that suffering produces endurance, 4and endurance produces character, and character produces hope, 5and hope does not put us to shame, because God’s love has been poured into our hearts through the Holy Spirit who has been given to us.

and what does that love poured into our hearts BY GOD lead us to do?

John 15:10
If you keep my commands, you will remain in my love, just as I have kept my Father's commands and remain in his love.

New Covenant.
read it.
it's in the New Testament.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
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BHG, I had not seen this post until I was going back over my own posts, I do apologize for not responding, but now that I have already seen your true colors, I do not wish to converse with you at all. The thread was started to draw out two others that kept dissappearing when they came to something they could not answer.
so why are you leaving?
still here.
ready to go the distance.
i reckon judaizing isn't any fun when christians hold fast to the faith delivered once for all.
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
11,365
186
63
the Torah?:)

the New Covenant commands and laws are in....the New Testament.

...

1 Corinthians 2:16
Wisdom from the Spirit of God
15But he who is spiritual appraises all things, yet he himself is appraised by no one. 16For WHO HAS KNOWN THE MIND OF THE LORD, THAT HE WILL INSTRUCT HIM? But we have the mind of Christ.

John 15:15
I no longer call you servants, because a servant does not know his master's business. Instead, I have called you friends, for everything that I learned from my Father I have made known to you.

1 Corinthians 2:15
The person with the Spirit makes judgments about all things, but such a person is not subject to merely human judgments

what you need to do, is start with what Jesus said:

Matthew 28
The Great Commission

19"Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, 20teaching them to observe all that I commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age."

then you go to His apostles; and see what He commanded them.
and those are our instructions:)

Romans 5
Peace with God Through Faith

1Therefore, since we have been justified by faith, wea have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ. 2Through him we have also obtained access by faithb into this grace in which we stand, and wec rejoiced in hope of the glory of God. 3More than that, we rejoice in our sufferings, knowing that suffering produces endurance, 4and endurance produces character, and character produces hope, 5and hope does not put us to shame, because God’s love has been poured into our hearts through the Holy Spirit who has been given to us.

and what does that love poured into our hearts BY GOD lead us to do?

John 15:10
If you keep my commands, you will remain in my love, just as I have kept my Father's commands and remain in his love.

New Covenant.
read it.
it's in the New Testament.
Perhaps you could enlighten us as to who said this...

Exo 20:1 And God spoke all these words, saying:

and then proceeded to give the Ten Commandments. Who was that?

And who gave the Laws you claim are the Laws of Moses?

Exo 24:3 So Moses came and told the people all the words of the LORD and all the judgments. And all the people answered with one voice and said, "All the words which the LORD has said we will do."
Exo 24:4 And Moses wrote all the words of the LORD. And he rose early in the morning, and built an altar at the foot of the mountain, and twelve pillars according to the twelve tribes of Israel.

So Moses wrote down what the LORD said. Who was this LORD?
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
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Zone says that she is not part of Israel, when scripture talks of Israel in the sense of all the believers who love Christ rather than racial Israel. She cannot be reached through man's reasoning about God, only in the name of Christ could she be reached.
only problem is...i never said that. RedTent did.

RedTent said:
"Zone says that she is not part of Israel, when scripture talks of Israel in the sense of all the believers who love Christ rather than racial Israel."

which is a lie, of course.

i say only Christians today are the Israel of God. and only ever will be.

So, with this in mind, how do you feel about the New Covenant? Got the Torah written in your heart and mind do ya?
are you going to address the thread on the Israel of God; and the fact Redtent once again just blatantly lied about what i "believe"? and you smugly tagged along?

and are you going to address how it is you have your sins forgiven; if the New Covenant is not now in place - the Old having been made obsolete?

please address the rank blasphemous heresy of looking forward to animal sacrifices in a temple made by human hands in this Jerusalem.

go to the New Testament to justify your current belief that you are under the Old Covenant (since the New isn't here yet).

please do sort all this out, once and for all john.
 
K

Karraster

Guest
you all believe the same myths about Christianity and paganism.
what's the diff?
If you ever admit you made a mistake, we should all declare a National Holiday.:) I will not wallow in the mud with u anymore on this thread.
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
11,365
186
63
are you going to address the thread on the Israel of God; and the fact Redtent once again just blatantly lied about what i "believe"? and you smugly tagged along?

and are you going to address how it is you have your sins forgiven; if the New Covenant is not now in place - the Old having been made obsolete?

please address the rank blasphemous heresy of looking forward to animal sacrifices in a temple made by human hands in this Jerusalem.

go to the New Testament to justify your current belief that you are under the Old Covenant (since the New isn't here yet).

please do sort all this out, once and for all john.
How about you stay on task instead of throwing up a smokescreen?

Who is the LORD?
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
Perhaps you could enlighten us as to who said this...

Exo 20:1 And God spoke all these words, saying:

and then proceeded to give the Ten Commandments. Who was that?

And who gave the Laws you claim are the Laws of Moses?

Exo 24:3 So Moses came and told the people all the words of the LORD and all the judgments. And all the people answered with one voice and said, "All the words which the LORD has said we will do."
Exo 24:4 And Moses wrote all the words of the LORD. And he rose early in the morning, and built an altar at the foot of the mountain, and twelve pillars according to the twelve tribes of Israel.

So Moses wrote down what the LORD said. Who was this LORD?
Matthew 28
The Great Commission

16Now the eleven disciples went to Galilee, to the mountain to which Jesus had directed them. 17And when they saw him they worshiped him, but some doubted. 18And Jesus came and said to them, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.

19Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them inb the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.”

please find the apostles teaching ANYTHING on sabbath keeping in the NT.
anything.
if Jesus, who was given all authority at His Ascension taught sabbath keeping, His infallibly inspired chosen would have taught it.

find it please. along with their instructions on the feasts.

while you're at it, explain what the ONE who was given ALL authority meant when he said this - to a Samaritan, a woman:

John 4
7A woman from Samaria came to draw water. Jesus said to her, “Give me a drink.” 8(For his disciples had gone away into the city to buy food.) 9The Samaritan woman said to him, “How is it that you, a Jew, ask for a drink from me, a woman of Samaria?” (For Jews have no dealings with Samaritans.) 10Jesus answered her, “If you knew the gift of God, and who it is that is saying to you, ‘Give me a drink,’ you would have asked him, and he would have given you living water.” 11The woman said to him, “Sir, you have nothing to draw water with, and the well is deep. Where do you get that living water? 12Are you greater than our father Jacob? He gave us the well and drank from it himself, as did his sons and his livestock.” 13Jesus said to her, “Everyone who drinks of this water will be thirsty again, 14but whoever drinks of the water that I will give him will never be thirsty again.b The water that I will give him will become in him a spring of water welling up to eternal life.” 15The woman said to him, “Sir, give me this water, so that I will not be thirsty or have to come here to draw water.”

16Jesus said to her, “Go, call your husband, and come here.” 17The woman answered him, “I have no husband.” Jesus said to her, “You are right in saying, ‘I have no husband’; 18for you have had five husbands, and the one you now have is not your husband. What you have said is true.” 19The woman said to him, “Sir, I perceive that you are a prophet. 20Our fathers worshiped on this mountain, but you say that in Jerusalem is the place where people ought to worship.” 21Jesus said to her, “Woman, believe me, the hour is coming when neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem will you worship the Father. 22You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews. 23But the hour is coming, and is now here, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for the Father is seeking such people to worship him. 24God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.” 25The woman said to him, “I know that Messiah is coming (he who is called Christ). When he comes, he will tell us all things.” 26Jesus said to her, “I who speak to you am he.”

here:

but whoever drinks of the water that I will give him will never be thirsty again. The water that I will give him will become in him a spring of water welling up to eternal life.”

here:

Jesus said to her, “Woman, believe me, the hour is coming when neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem will you worship the Father.

and here:

But the hour is coming, and is now here, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for the Father is seeking such people to worship him.

God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.”

...

living water (Spirit)
no Jerusalem worship at all.
nor in Jerusalem will you worship the Father.
the Father will not be worshiped in Jerusalem.
the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth
for the Father is seeking such people to worship him.

do you know what Jesus was talking about?
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
11,365
186
63
Matthew 28
The Great Commission

16Now the eleven disciples went to Galilee, to the mountain to which Jesus had directed them. 17And when they saw him they worshiped him, but some doubted. 18And Jesus came and said to them, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.

19Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them inb the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.”

please find the apostles teaching ANYTHING on sabbath keeping in the NT.
anything.
if Jesus, who was given all authority at His Ascension taught sabbath keeping, His infallibly inspired chosen would have taught it.

find it please. along with their instructions on the feasts.

while you're at it, explain what the ONE who was given ALL authority meant when he said this - to a Samaritan, a woman:

John 4
7A woman from Samaria came to draw water. Jesus said to her, “Give me a drink.” 8(For his disciples had gone away into the city to buy food.) 9The Samaritan woman said to him, “How is it that you, a Jew, ask for a drink from me, a woman of Samaria?” (For Jews have no dealings with Samaritans.) 10Jesus answered her, “If you knew the gift of God, and who it is that is saying to you, ‘Give me a drink,’ you would have asked him, and he would have given you living water.” 11The woman said to him, “Sir, you have nothing to draw water with, and the well is deep. Where do you get that living water? 12Are you greater than our father Jacob? He gave us the well and drank from it himself, as did his sons and his livestock.” 13Jesus said to her, “Everyone who drinks of this water will be thirsty again, 14but whoever drinks of the water that I will give him will never be thirsty again.b The water that I will give him will become in him a spring of water welling up to eternal life.” 15The woman said to him, “Sir, give me this water, so that I will not be thirsty or have to come here to draw water.”

16Jesus said to her, “Go, call your husband, and come here.” 17The woman answered him, “I have no husband.” Jesus said to her, “You are right in saying, ‘I have no husband’; 18for you have had five husbands, and the one you now have is not your husband. What you have said is true.” 19The woman said to him, “Sir, I perceive that you are a prophet. 20Our fathers worshiped on this mountain, but you say that in Jerusalem is the place where people ought to worship.” 21Jesus said to her, “Woman, believe me, the hour is coming when neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem will you worship the Father. 22You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews. 23But the hour is coming, and is now here, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for the Father is seeking such people to worship him. 24God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.” 25The woman said to him, “I know that Messiah is coming (he who is called Christ). When he comes, he will tell us all things.” 26Jesus said to her, “I who speak to you am he.”

here:

but whoever drinks of the water that I will give him will never be thirsty again. The water that I will give him will become in him a spring of water welling up to eternal life.”

here:

Jesus said to her, “Woman, believe me, the hour is coming when neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem will you worship the Father.

and here:

But the hour is coming, and is now here, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for the Father is seeking such people to worship him.

God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.”

...

living water (Spirit)
no Jerusalem worship at all.
nor in Jerusalem will you worship the Father.
the Father will not be worshiped in Jerusalem.
the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth
for the Father is seeking such people to worship him.

do you know what Jesus was talking about?
So, who is the LORD?
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
How about you stay on task instead of throwing up a smokescreen?

Who is the LORD?
a SMOKESCREEN?
THAT'S HOW YOU REFER TO CHRIST AND HIS AUTHORITY AND TEACHING?

Matthew 28
The Resurrection
1Now after the Sabbath, toward the dawn of the first day of the week, Mary Magdalene and the other Mary went to see the tomb. 2And behold, there was a great earthquake, for an angel of the Lord descended from heaven and came and rolled back the stone and sat on it. 3His appearance was like lightning, and his clothing white as snow. 4And for fear of him the guards trembled and became like dead men. 5But the angel said to the women, “Do not be afraid, for I know that you seek Jesus who was crucified. 6He is not here, for he has risen, as he said. Come, see the place where hea lay. 7Then go quickly and tell his disciples that he has risen from the dead, and behold, he is going before you to Galilee; there you will see him. See, I have told you.” 8So they departed quickly from the tomb with fear and great joy, and ran to tell his disciples. 9And behold, Jesus met them and said, “Greetings!” And they came up and took hold of his feet and worshiped him. 10Then Jesus said to them, “Do not be afraid; go and tell my brothers to go to Galilee, and there they will see me.”

The Report of the Guard
11While they were going, behold, some of the guard went into the city and told the chief priests all that had taken place. 12And when they had assembled with the elders and taken counsel, they gave a sufficient sum of money to the soldiers 13and said, “Tell people, ‘His disciples came by night and stole him away while we were asleep.’ 14And if this comes to the governor’s ears, we will satisfy him and keep you out of trouble.” 15So they took the money and did as they were directed. And this story has been spread among the Jews to this day.

The Great Commission
16Now the eleven disciples went to Galilee, to the mountain to which Jesus had directed them. 17And when they saw him they worshiped him, but some doubted. 18And Jesus came and said to them, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them inb the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.”


Luke 9:35
A voice came from the cloud, saying, "This is my Son, whom I have chosen; listen to him."


you don't obey the Father at all.
you don't listen to the Son at all.
you don't believe He even accomplished what He came to do.

Luke 22:20
In the same way, after the supper he took the cup, saying, "This cup is the new covenant in my blood, which is poured out for you.

because you do not defer to His chosen, and the commandments He gave them.

2 Corinthians 3:6
He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant--not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

even though the Father ORDERED us to obey The Son.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
So, who is the LORD?
you follow Moses if you think that pleases the Father.

i will listen to the Beloved Son - as He commanded me to do, and He proved it by raising Christ from the dead.
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
11,365
186
63
And again I ask, who is the LORD who gave the Law at Mt. Sinai?