Abide in Christ, or in sin

[InSpiritInTruth]

Jesus said in John 15:1-10 “I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.[SUP]2 [/SUP]Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.[SUP]3 [/SUP]Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.[SUP]4 [/SUP]Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
[SUP]
5 [/SUP]I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.[SUP]6 [/SUP]If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.
[SUP]
7 [/SUP]If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.[SUP]8 [/SUP]Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.[SUP]9 [/SUP]As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.
[SUP]10 [/SUP]If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.”

Ok, some claim all Christians are sinners, and that they keep on sinning even though they have been saved. And even despite that disobedience and reoccurring sin they proclaim you still abide in Christ. This my friends is false, because you cannot remain in sin and in Christ at the same time.

Notice Jesus said in order to bear fruit one must abide in Him, that also means believing in and abiding in His words. And here is what it means to abide in Him…
1 John 3:9 “Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.”

The seed mentioned there is Christ, but again to be in Christ is to 1 John 3:6 “Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.”
So the simple truth is in order to bear fruit we must abide in Christ, and to abide in Christ one must stop sinning.

Now if one is sinning are they truly in Christ? Not according to the Lords words above. Also we are given what happens if one in Him does not bear fruit in Jesus, as said in John 15:2 [SUP]2 [/SUP]Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away:” So anyone in him that does not bear fruit he takes away. And not only that we are told in verse 6 [SUP]6 [/SUP]If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

Also we cannot bear fruit on our own except we abide in Him John 15:4 “Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.” And again, to abide in Christ means you cannot abide in sin.

And if you remain in sin, then you truly don’t abide in Christ do you? And as Jesus said, those who do not abide in Him are cast forth as a branch, and then gathered and cast into the fire and burned.

Christ is not a vine of sin (minister of sin) Galatians 2:17But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.

Anyone who says you can abide in sin and also remain in Christ at the same time is a liar and a deceiver.

 

[3Scoreand10]

Jesus said in John 15:1-10 “I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.[SUP]2 [/SUP]Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.[SUP]3 [/SUP]Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.[SUP]4 [/SUP]Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
[SUP]
5 [/SUP]I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.[SUP]6 [/SUP]If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.
[SUP]
7 [/SUP]If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.[SUP]8 [/SUP]Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.[SUP]9 [/SUP]As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.
[SUP]10 [/SUP]If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.”

Ok, some claim all Christians are sinners, and that they keep on sinning even though they have been saved. And even despite that disobedience and reoccurring sin they proclaim you still abide in Christ. This my friends is false, because you cannot remain in sin and in Christ at the same time.

Notice Jesus said in order to bear fruit one must abide in Him, that also means believing in and abiding in His words. And here is what it means to abide in Him…
1 John 3:9 “Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.”

The seed mentioned there is Christ, but again to be in Christ is to 1 John 3:6 “Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.”
So the simple truth is in order to bear fruit we must abide in Christ, and to abide in Christ one must stop sinning.

Now if one is sinning are they truly in Christ? Not according to the Lords words above. Also we are given what happens if one in Him does not bear fruit in Jesus, as said in John 15:2 [SUP]2 [/SUP]Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away:” So anyone in him that does not bear fruit he takes away. And not only that we are told in verse 6 [SUP]6 [/SUP]If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

Also we cannot bear fruit on our own except we abide in Him John 15:4 “Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.” And again, to abide in Christ means you cannot abide in sin.

And if you remain in sin, then you truly don’t abide in Christ do you? And as Jesus said, those who do not abide in Him are cast forth as a branch, and then gathered and cast into the fire and burned.

Christ is not a vine of sin (minister of sin) Galatians 2:17But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.

Anyone who says you can abide in sin and also remain in Christ at the same time is a liar and a deceiver.

You are the liar and the deciever.
You are ignorant of the WORD and borderline stupid.
The heresy you and those who agree with you preach is of Satan.
You are on a level with Nero, Hitler, and ISIS and their murder of Christians and Jews.
I pray that God will stop you.
No need to respond, you are not worth my time to read your post nor try to lead you to understand.

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

Ezekiel 2:6
And thou, son of man, be not afraid of them, neither be afraid of their words, though briers and thorns be with thee, and thou dost dwell among scorpions: be not afraid of their words, nor be dismayed at their looks, though they be a rebellious house.

 

[DesiredHaven]

Ezekiel 2:6
And thou, son of man, be not afraid of them, neither be afraid of their words, though briers and thorns be with thee, and thou dost dwell among scorpions: be not afraid of their words, nor be dismayed at their looks, though they be a rebellious house.

Heb 6:8
But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing;
whose end is to be burned.

That is not what we desire to bear, but to abide in Christ

 

[DiscipleDave]

You are the liar and the deciever.
You are ignorant of the WORD and borderline stupid.
The heresy you and those who agree with you preach is of Satan.
You are on a level with Nero, Hitler, and ISIS and their murder of Christians and Jews.
I pray that God will stop you.
No need to respond, you are not worth my time to read your post nor try to lead you to understand.

Are these the words of a person who has Jesus in them? Wow, this must be one of those last days Christian. Full of hate towards others, and do not LOVE ONE ANOTHER as commanded by Jesus Christ for us to do. You will know who are True Christians and who are not True Christians by their fruits.

^i^ Responding to post # 2

 

[3Scoreand10]

Are these the words of a person who has Jesus in them? Wow, this must be one of those last days Christian. Full of hate towards others, and do not LOVE ONE ANOTHER as commanded by Jesus Christ for us to do. You will know who are True Christians and who are not True Christians by their fruits.

^i^ Responding to post # 2

This person said that those of us who agree with the Word that eternal security in Christ is truth are liars and decievers.
Where is you condemnation of him? Where is his love ?
What he teaches is heresy. What he teaches is of Satan. What he teaches leads people to hell. He is no better that those who murder Christians.
I will always pray that God stops those who teach hersey that leads people away from the true salvation.

 

[3Scoreand10]

This person said that those of us who agree with the Word that eternal security in Christ is truth are liars and decievers.
Where is you condemnation of him? Where is his love ?
What he teaches is heresy. What he teaches is of Satan. What he teaches leads people to hell. He is no better that those who murder Christians.
I will always pray that God stops those who teach hersey that leads people away from the true salvation.

I do not hate anyone, but I hate what some teach out of ignorance, and I will call them out and mark them.
I pray that They see the Truth before it is to late.

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

This person said that those of us who agree with the Word that eternal security in Christ is truth are liars and deceivers.

Show me where I said exactly what you just stated I said. If you cannot provide it, then you can add bearing false witness to your list of sins.

 

[Grandpa]

If you are abiding in Christ how would you know if you are sinning or not?

Wouldn't you have to stop abiding in Christ to check? You would have to look back to the law to check on your "progress". You would be turning away from Christ.

When you did that wouldn't you be sinning?

Maybe we should just focus on abiding in Christ and He will take care of our sin issues?

Ephesians 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

 

[DesiredHaven]

Ephesians 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

Good verse

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

If you are abiding in Christ how would you know if you are sinning or not?

Wouldn't you have to stop abiding in Christ to check? You would have to look back to the law to check on your "progress". You would be turning away from Christ.

When you did that wouldn't you be sinning?

When you are in Christ, and Christ is in you, you know the Way in which you should walk. For the Lord writes His words upon our hearts by way of His Spirit.

John 14:4
And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know.

 

[Jeff_56]

when you abide in Christ ...... well, when one of HIS children abide in Christ, they recognize sin instantly -- the spiritual man appraises everything (there are very few spiritual men anywhere)....
-- the carnal man appraises nothing. the carnal man is at home with sin, dwells with sin, instead of with Christ.

the spiritual man lives in union with Christ in yahweh.(see many times in the NT)

the carnal man is a slave of the enemy. (but often pretends to be something else )

 

[crossnote]

Jesus said in John 15:1-10 “I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.[SUP]2 [/SUP]Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.[SUP]3 [/SUP]Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.[SUP]4 [/SUP]Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
[SUP]
5 [/SUP]I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.[SUP]6 [/SUP]If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.
[SUP]
7 [/SUP]If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.[SUP]8 [/SUP]Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.[SUP]9 [/SUP]As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.
[SUP]10 [/SUP]If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.”

Scripture fine.

Ok, some claim all Christians are

sinners, and that they keep on sinning even though they have been saved. And even despite that disobedience and reoccurring sin they proclaim you still abide in Christ. This my friends is false, because you cannot remain in sin and in Christ at the same time.

Here we go. Straw. Apparently, if they are in continual sin, they aren't a Christian in the first place.

Notice Jesus said in order to bear fruit one must abide in Him, that also means believing in and abiding in His words. And here is what it means to abide in Him…

1 John 3:9 “Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.”

The seed mentioned there is Christ, but again to be in Christ is to 1 John 3:6 “Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.”
So the simple truth is in order to bear fruit we must abide in Christ, and to abide in Christ one must stop sinning.

The verb pattern is that one 'cannot continue in sin' not 'one can't sin even once, period'. The true Christian is grafted into Christ and has the indwelling Holy Spirit and will bear fruit. The professing Christian who is devoid of His Spirit has no abiding position and thus will bear thorns and thistles.

Now if one is

sinning are they truly in Christ? Not according to the Lords words above. Also we are given what happens if one in Him does not bear fruit in Jesus, as said in John 15:2

[SUP]2 [/SUP]Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away:” So anyone in him that does not bear fruit he takes away. And not only that we are told in verse 6 [SUP]6 [/SUP]If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

Again, The true Christian is grafted into Christ and has the indwelling Holy Spirit and will bear fruit. The professing Christian who is devoid of His Spirit has no abiding position and thus will bear thorns and thistles.

Also we cannot bear fruit on our own except we abide in Him

John 15:4 “Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.” And again, to abide in Christ means you cannot abide in sin.

And if you remain in sin, then you truly don’t abide in Christ do you? And as Jesus said, those who do not abide in Him are cast forth as a branch, and then gathered and cast into the fire and burned.

Christ is not a vine of sin (minister of sin) Galatians 2:17But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.

Anyone who says you can abide in sin and also remain in Christ at the same time is a liar and a deceiver.

As Christians we already have been permanently placed in Christ and His Spirit has permanently come to dwell in us and seal us. So you are turning 'abide in Christ' into a 'work' we do when it is something that already has been done and as a result God leads and strengthens His Children along.

There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. For the law of the Spirit of life has set you free in Christ Jesus from the law of sin and death. (Rom 8:1-2)

You, however, are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if in fact the Spirit of God dwells in you. Anyone who does not have the Spirit of Christ does not belong to him. But if Christ is in you, although the body is dead because of sin, the Spirit is life because of righteousness. (Rom 8:9-10)

And because of him you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, righteousness and sanctification and redemption, (1Co 1:30) (This said to a very carnal church)

Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away; behold, the new has come.
(2Co 5:17)

Yet because of false brothers secretly brought in—who slipped in to spy out our freedom that we have in Christ Jesus, so that they might bring us into slavery—(Gal 2:4)

In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, (Eph 1:13)

I could go on listing more on "in Christ" and "In Him" passages and all the wonderful promises He has given us to enjoy. But if you want to suck on lemons and making faces at Christians who are enjoying their freedoms... and continually yelling at them "You better watch out or your gonna perish" then that's your prerogative but you are only revealing your misery and not the Joy of the Lord.

So we live on this side of the cross, signed sealed and about to be delivered outta here.

 

[atwhatcost]

Jesus said in John 15:1-10 “I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.[SUP]2 [/SUP]Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.[SUP]3 [/SUP]Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.[SUP]4 [/SUP]Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
[SUP]
5 [/SUP]I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.[SUP]6 [/SUP]If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.
[SUP]
7 [/SUP]If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.[SUP]8 [/SUP]Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.[SUP]9 [/SUP]As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.
[SUP]10 [/SUP]If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.”

Ok, some claim all Christians are sinners, and that they keep on sinning even though they have been saved. And even despite that disobedience and reoccurring sin they proclaim you still abide in Christ. This my friends is false, because you cannot remain in sin and in Christ at the same time.

Notice Jesus said in order to bear fruit one must abide in Him, that also means believing in and abiding in His words. And here is what it means to abide in Him…
1 John 3:9 “Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.”

The seed mentioned there is Christ, but again to be in Christ is to 1 John 3:6 “Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.”
So the simple truth is in order to bear fruit we must abide in Christ, and to abide in Christ one must stop sinning.

Now if one is sinning are they truly in Christ? Not according to the Lords words above. Also we are given what happens if one in Him does not bear fruit in Jesus, as said in John 15:2 [SUP]2 [/SUP]Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away:” So anyone in him that does not bear fruit he takes away. And not only that we are told in verse 6 [SUP]6 [/SUP]If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

Also we cannot bear fruit on our own except we abide in Him John 15:4 “Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.” And again, to abide in Christ means you cannot abide in sin.

And if you remain in sin, then you truly don’t abide in Christ do you? And as Jesus said, those who do not abide in Him are cast forth as a branch, and then gathered and cast into the fire and burned.

Christ is not a vine of sin (minister of sin) Galatians 2:17But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.

Anyone who says you can abide in sin and also remain in Christ at the same time is a liar and a deceiver.

What does this mean to you? "and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit."

 

[atwhatcost]

I do not hate anyone, but I hate what some teach out of ignorance, and I will call them out and mark them.
I pray that They see the Truth before it is to late.

I can tell, because nothing says love quite like calling someone a liar, deceiver, borderline stupid, Satan, Nero, Hitler, and ISIS. It just makes a person feel so warm and cuddly. I did my own effort to have you banned.

 

[DesiredHaven]

Heres a couple that might make sense to you Lynn

John 15:1 I am the true vine, (((and my Father))) is the husbandman.

John 15:2 Every branch ((( in me ))) that beareth not fruit (((( he taketh away))):
and every branch that beareth fruit, (((( he purgeth it )))) that it may bring forth ((( more )))) fruit.

Seems to mirror chastening

Heb 12:7 If ye endure ((( chastening )))) God dealeth with you as with ((( sons ))))
for what son is he whom the father ((( chasteneth not )))?

Heb 12:11 Now (((( no chastening )))) for the present seemeth to be joyous,((( but grievous))):
nevertheless afterward it ((( yieldeth )))) the peaceable (((( fruit of )))) righteousness unto them which ((( are exercised ))) thereby.

Bastards (which be not sons) would seem to be as branches (even as they are men) but without chastisement (purging/ pruning) being without fruit and taken away by the Father from the vine and cast forth to men to be gathered.

 

[Least]

Jesus said in John 15:1-10 “I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.[SUP]2 [/SUP]Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.[SUP]3 [/SUP]Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.[SUP]4 [/SUP]Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
[SUP]
5 [/SUP]I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.[SUP]6 [/SUP]If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.
[SUP]
7 [/SUP]If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.[SUP]8 [/SUP]Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.[SUP]9 [/SUP]As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.
[SUP]10 [/SUP]If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.”

Ok, some claim all Christians are sinners, and that they keep on sinning even though they have been saved. And even despite that disobedience and reoccurring sin they proclaim you still abide in Christ. This my friends is false, because you cannot remain in sin and in Christ at the same time.

Notice Jesus said in order to bear fruit one must abide in Him, that also means believing in and abiding in His words. And here is what it means to abide in Him…
1 John 3:9 “Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.”

The seed mentioned there is Christ, but again to be in Christ is to 1 John 3:6 “Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.”
So the simple truth is in order to bear fruit we must abide in Christ, and to abide in Christ one must stop sinning.

Now if one is sinning are they truly in Christ? Not according to the Lords words above. Also we are given what happens if one in Him does not bear fruit in Jesus, as said in John 15:2 [SUP]2 [/SUP]Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away:” So anyone in him that does not bear fruit he takes away. And not only that we are told in verse 6 [SUP]6 [/SUP]If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

Also we cannot bear fruit on our own except we abide in Him John 15:4 “Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.” And again, to abide in Christ means you cannot abide in sin.

And if you remain in sin, then you truly don’t abide in Christ do you? And as Jesus said, those who do not abide in Him are cast forth as a branch, and then gathered and cast into the fire and burned.

Christ is not a vine of sin (minister of sin) Galatians 2:17But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.

Anyone who says you can abide in sin and also remain in Christ at the same time is a liar and a deceiver.

Great study and scriptures InSpiritInTruth,

I woke up early this morning and was reading through a chapter in Isaiah. A portion of that chapter goes right along with your study.

Isaiah 32:15 Until the spirit be poured upon us from on high, and the wilderness be a fruitful field, and the fruitful field be counted for a forest.
Isaiah 32:16 Then judgment shall dwell in the wilderness, and righteousness remain in the fruitful field.
Isaiah 32:17 And the work of righteousness shall be peace; and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever.

What a statement!

"Until the spirit be poured upon us from on high."

"and the wilderness be a fruitful field, and the fruitful field be counted for a forest."

"Then...judgment shall dwell in the wilderness, and righteousness remain in the fruitful field."

The result of this:

"And the work of righteousness shall be peace,"

And the effect:

"Righteousness, quietness and assurance forever."

That passage reminded me of what Jesus said here:

John 4:34 Jesus saith unto them, My meat is to do the will of him that sent me, and to finish his work.
John 4:35 Say not ye, There are yet four months, and then cometh harvest? behold, I say unto you, Lift up your eyes, and look on the fields; for they are white already to harvest.
John 4:36 And he that reapeth receiveth wages, and gathereth fruit unto life eternal: that both he that soweth and he that reapeth may rejoice together.

Tree's can bear good fruit and bad fruit. Even in the natural there are fruit trees that are very poisonous. We definitely wouldn't want to eat from one of those trees.

The bible gives examples of both good fruit and bad fruit, good branches and branches that don't bear fruit as you showed in what you shared.

In the end, the entire world is going to be reaped and if we consider what Jesus said in the above passage (John 4.) Israel wasn't producing a "righteous harvest."

Matthew 25:26 His lord answered and said unto him, Thou wicked and slothful servant, thou knewest that I reap where I sowed not, and gather where I have not strawed:

Revelation 14:16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

Matthew 13:47 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a net, that was cast into the sea, and gathered of every kind:
Matthew 13:48 Which, when it was full, they drew to shore, and sat down, and gathered the good into vessels, but cast the bad away.

This is a worthwhile study, and important for every believer. I hope that it can be continued peacefully and with scripture rather than opinions.

 

[Grandpa]

When you are in Christ, and Christ is in you, you know the Way in which you should walk. For the Lord writes His words upon our hearts by way of His Spirit.

John 14:4
And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know.

Well yeah, that was my whole point.

You seemed to be saying that some people who abide in Christ also abide in sin. I didn't see how that was possible.

 

[Grandpa]

when you abide in Christ ...... well, when one of HIS children abide in Christ, they recognize sin instantly -- the spiritual man appraises everything (there are very few spiritual men anywhere)....
-- the carnal man appraises nothing. the carnal man is at home with sin, dwells with sin, instead of with Christ.

the spiritual man lives in union with Christ in yahweh.(see many times in the NT)

the carnal man is a slave of the enemy. (but often pretends to be something else )

They recognize sin in themselves instantly or sin outside themselves?

Why would they need to recognize sin if they are abiding in Christ?

 

[Jeff_56]

.....Bastards (which be not sons) would seem to be as branches (even as they are men) but without chastisement (purging/ pruning) being without fruit and taken away by the Father from the vine and cast forth to men to be gathered.

they, specifically, are never in the vine, not to start with, and not later. (so they are never even as if "taken from the vine" being never one in the vine)....