-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
There is nothing good in Satan. He is only destruction. There is no redemption for Satan only certain condemnation.
None of these things were a surprise to God. God had planned the redemption of His creation ever before He created it.
Why? Because God glorifies Himself through His mercy and grace. Remember the chief end of man is to glorify God. Either because we come to Him for salvation or because we turn away from His grace and perish. Lucifer had so much and much was expected of him. Now he has so great a condemnation.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
None of these things were a surprise to God. God had planned the redemption of His creation ever before He created it.
Why? Because God glorifies Himself through His mercy and grace. Remember the chief end of man is to glorify God. Either because we come to Him for salvation or because we turn away from His grace and perish. Lucifer had so much and much was expected of him. Now he has so great a condemnation.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
I'm beginning to get it. You guys are finding ways to explain the confusion that are really becoming helpful. 
OldHermit, you really did me a solid with your pm. I think my way of thinking is changing and that alone brings some peace. God bless you.
Tin thank you too. (for a few things)
OldHermit, you really did me a solid with your pm. I think my way of thinking is changing and that alone brings some peace. God bless you.
Tin thank you too.
(for a few things)
May God bless you.
G
The way I read this is "Why are we here?" And why is satan around?
The book of Job answers these questions. We are here to resolve the kingdom conflict.
We see satan as judged. Why is he not in the pit right now?
Satans 5 "Iwills" ......one of them is "I will be like the most High" satan sinned and fell in his pride.
Go to the book of Job, and satan is basically accusing God of being UNFAIR. Stop and think about that for a moment. Only a freewill creature could say that to God.
So satan fell and God obviously Judged and condemned him. And we see him in Job, still free to wander, and calling God unfair.
We are in satans "appeal trial."
This attack on freewill is from Satan. It is basically satans accusation against God......" You are UNFAIR. Its not my fault."
We are created as freewill creatures. And we freely choose God. And we prove to satan that God is FAIR,loving,Just,full of Grace and mercy and righteous........we are witnesses that reveal Gods Glory to the world.
Eph 3:10~~New American Standard Bible
so that the manifold wisdom of God might now be made known through the church to the rulers and the authorities in the heavenly places.
The book of Job answers these questions. We are here to resolve the kingdom conflict.
We see satan as judged. Why is he not in the pit right now?
Satans 5 "Iwills" ......one of them is "I will be like the most High" satan sinned and fell in his pride.
Go to the book of Job, and satan is basically accusing God of being UNFAIR. Stop and think about that for a moment. Only a freewill creature could say that to God.
So satan fell and God obviously Judged and condemned him. And we see him in Job, still free to wander, and calling God unfair.
We are in satans "appeal trial."
This attack on freewill is from Satan. It is basically satans accusation against God......" You are UNFAIR. Its not my fault."
We are created as freewill creatures. And we freely choose God. And we prove to satan that God is FAIR,loving,Just,full of Grace and mercy and righteous........we are witnesses that reveal Gods Glory to the world.
Eph 3:10~~New American Standard Bible
so that the manifold wisdom of God might now be made known through the church to the rulers and the authorities in the heavenly places.
I
So Satan's ultimate purpose was to tempt man away from God. He was always going to rebel.
And he had to be created as such in order to allow man the free will to choose their Creator. Or the adversary. Otherwise, a Christian's pure love for God couldn't be certain. (Summarizing from several posts)
Hypothetically (avoiding the why question), what if Satan had not risen up against God? Where would we be, would we even be, had Satan decided the outcome wasn't worth it? (His banishment from Heaven)
Is this question even relevant? Doubtful, just curious.
And he had to be created as such in order to allow man the free will to choose their Creator. Or the adversary. Otherwise, a Christian's pure love for God couldn't be certain. (Summarizing from several posts)
Hypothetically (avoiding the why question
), what if Satan had not risen up against God? Where would we be, would we even be, had Satan decided the outcome wasn't worth it? (His banishment from Heaven)Is this question even relevant? Doubtful, just curious.
I
I was typing as you posted, but wish I'd waited a few more moments lol.
Ok. I have a good grasp of 'why.'
With the angels in heaven being below man, it serves that we're their example. We show why. We teach the angels who chose to remain in Heaven that God is NOT what Satan claims. (Angels having free will {besides the fallen} is a newish concept for me).
Thank you. Much help
(Im paraphrasing/summarizing to imprint it in my mind)
Ok. I have a good grasp of 'why.'
With the angels in heaven being below man, it serves that we're their example. We show why. We teach the angels who chose to remain in Heaven that God is NOT what Satan claims. (Angels having free will {besides the fallen} is a newish concept for me).
Thank you.
Much help (Im paraphrasing/summarizing to imprint it in my mind)
I
Gen 3:14,15
14 And the LORD God said to the serpent, “Because you have done this, Cursed are you more than all cattle, And more than every beast of the field; On your belly shall you go, And dust shall you eat All the days of your life; 15 And I will put enmity Between you and the woman, And between your seed and her seed; He shall bruise you on the head, And you shall bruise him on the heel.”
Ephesians 1:11 tell us that God does all things according to the counsel of his will.
satan is a creation of God who was originally good (1 Tim. 4:4).
Could have been an object lesson just as Job, in that we can exercise our will for good or evil.
When satan tempted Jesus on the pinacle of the Temple the man Jesus could have given in but He didn't, Jesus quoted God's Word to satan.
I think even though we are made in the image of God we are made from the dust of the earth and God had to have known we would fall, He just had to prove to use how imperfect we can be and that He would provide a way out for us.
Since God is a spirit I think He made man to interact with and when we show true love towrads one another (eh Willie-T) that gives him great joy to be able to experience that through His creation.
I thank the Good God that He told us in Gen:3 14,15 about "His Only Begotten Son Jesus the Christ of Nazareth".
14 And the LORD God said to the serpent, “Because you have done this, Cursed are you more than all cattle, And more than every beast of the field; On your belly shall you go, And dust shall you eat All the days of your life; 15 And I will put enmity Between you and the woman, And between your seed and her seed; He shall bruise you on the head, And you shall bruise him on the heel.”
Ephesians 1:11 tell us that God does all things according to the counsel of his will.
satan is a creation of God who was originally good (1 Tim. 4:4).
Could have been an object lesson just as Job, in that we can exercise our will for good or evil.
When satan tempted Jesus on the pinacle of the Temple the man Jesus could have given in but He didn't, Jesus quoted God's Word to satan.
I think even though we are made in the image of God we are made from the dust of the earth and God had to have known we would fall, He just had to prove to use how imperfect we can be and that He would provide a way out for us.
Since God is a spirit I think He made man to interact with and when we show true love towrads one another (eh Willie-T) that gives him great joy to be able to experience that through His creation.
I thank the Good God that He told us in Gen:3 14,15 about "His Only Begotten Son Jesus the Christ of Nazareth".
The Serpent – We do not yet know anything of Satan. All we know about evil at this point is the serpent. What do we learn about him from chapter three?
1. He is a member of the natural world, not a supernatural creature.
2. He is a citizen of the animal domain. He is described as a beast of the field. "Now the serpent was more crafty than any other beast of the field that the Lord God had made."
3. He is the craftiest of beasts. The word crafty suggests skills in evil scheming. He is a sly trixter who is able to deceive others. This seems to be his natural character. This does not place him on an intellectual level with man for he appears to be strictly dyadic in his power of reason. Beasts of the field is the standard of comparison that defines his intellect.
4. He possesses the capacity for speech and reason.
5. He seems to have been a willing participant in the deception so, what are the possibilities.
a. Could he simply have been possessed by Satan? Possibly.
b. Was he himself also tempted? This seems more plausible. For temptation to have any power, there must be the illusion of satisfying some desire. If so, what could he have hoped to gain by the fall of man?
* Seizure of preeminence? Of all natural beings, only man is higher than he.
* Question: Did God create the serpent with a diminished view of reality; an epistemology that was rooted solely in the five senses?