Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances

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Studyman

Senior Member
Oct 11, 2017
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=Cee;3531505]
We can run into error if we try to merge the OT and NT together because they are two different agreements.
This represents my whole opposition to religious man. This statement can not be confirmed by scripture, it is man's teaching, no offence to the Brethren.

Matt. 4:3 And when the tempter came to him, he said, If thou be the Son of God, command that these stones be made bread.
4 But he answered and said,
It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God. Not just the NT.

The New Covenant is a promise from the Word which became Flesh. This New Covenant is the Change of the Priesthood, not a change of God's Instructions for man. As it is written.

Heb. 8:7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.

8 For finding fault with them, ( The Priests who gave people God's Instructions) he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:

Heb. 7:If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?

The New Covenant is the "CHANGE" of the Priesthood, Not the "good, Just, and Perfect Instructions of the Word which became Flesh.

Heb. 7:12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

What changed?

13 For he of whom these things are spoken pertaineth to another tribe, of which no man gave attendance at the altar.

14 For it is evident that our Lord sprang out of Juda; of which tribe Moses spake nothing concerning priesthood.

Look at Jer. 31 and show me if you can how the Word which became Flesh changed anything other than the Priesthood?

Two things were changed.

#1. How God's Laws are administered. No more Levite Priests to filter the Word, we have direct access to the Word through Jesus, and He writes God's Instructions on the hearts of the repentant.

#2. The manner in which sin is forgiven. No more Levitical Priesthood sacrificial, ceremonial "Works of the Law" for remission of sins. Jesus, the Word which became Flesh Himself, with His own Blood, forgives us our sins through faith in Him.

The preaching that the New Covenant is more than that is a deception.

One revealed the need for a Savior. And the other reveals the Savior. Obeying God is two fold. Believe in the One He sent. And love one another as He has loved us. What these two things look like is given to us through relationship with His Spirit.

Ive noticed this focus on don’t sin, but the way we don’t sin is through faith and love. We do these things through the power of the gospel transforming us from the inside out.
If we believe in the Word which became Flesh, we will believe His New Covenant. Not the teaching of man. The New Testament is our example of the Old Testament teaching put into practice. Jesus is the perfect example of how we should walk, and what instructions we should "WALK IN. We need look no further. He is the Author and finisher of my Faith.

"For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth."

This is why it is written;

"He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked."

He didn't live in opposition to the instructions He gave to man as the Word. He did partake in the New Covenant though, as He forgave sins without the Blood of one goat, or one Ceremony as described in the Old Priesthood, the Old Covenant..
 
R

Ralph-

Guest
Good luck trying to distinguish between God's law and rabbinical law. Moses had rabbinical authority to write law. We know this from the fact that Jesus said being allowed to divorce under certain circumstances is a rabbinical judgment passed down by Moses. We can't know what other judgments he himself added to the law he gave the Israelites.

We get messed up because Paul did not make the distinction in law that we seek to make. And it's not necessary to do that. The point is it was ALL binding on the people of God. You had to obey the sum total of the law including the rabbinical add on stuff or you were condemned.

The good news is that when Christ forgave your sins the witness for the prosecution (the law-Deuteronomy 31:26) died on the cross with Jesus and can't testify against you in God's court. Again, this doesn't mean you are released from the requirements of the law, but rather are released from the condemnation of the law. Who can bring a charge against Christ's elect? No one of course. The witness of the law against us has died and can't testify against us.


26“Take this book of the law and place it beside the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may remain there as a witness against you."-Deuteronomy 31:26

"having forgiven us all our transgressions, 14having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us, which was hostile to us; and He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross."-Colossians 2:13-14

"33Who will bring a charge against God’s elect?"-Romans 8:33
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
21,242
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This will not play with intellectuals and/or philosophers, but here it is anyway.

When we learn from the Word of Jesus the Holy Spirit will bear witness to us at every level..

=Cee;3531505]

This represents my whole opposition to religious man. This statement can not be confirmed by scripture, it is man's teaching, no offence to the Brethren.

Matt. 4:3 And when the tempter came to him, he said, If thou be the Son of God, command that these stones be made bread.
4 But he answered and said,
It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God. Not just the NT.

The New Covenant is a promise from the Word which became Flesh. This New Covenant is the Change of the Priesthood, not a change of God's Instructions for man. As it is written.

Heb. 8:7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.

8 For finding fault with them, ( The Priests who gave people God's Instructions) he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:

Heb. 7:If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?

The New Covenant is the "CHANGE" of the Priesthood, Not the "good, Just, and Perfect Instructions of the Word which became Flesh.

Heb. 7:12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

What changed?

13 For he of whom these things are spoken pertaineth to another tribe, of which no man gave attendance at the altar.

14 For it is evident that our Lord sprang out of Juda; of which tribe Moses spake nothing concerning priesthood.

Look at Jer. 31 and show me if you can how the Word which became Flesh changed anything other than the Priesthood?

Two things were changed.

#1. How God's Laws are administered. No more Levite Priests to filter the Word, we have direct access to the Word through Jesus, and He writes God's Instructions on the hearts of the repentant.

#2. The manner in which sin is forgiven. No more Levitical Priesthood sacrificial, ceremonial "Works of the Law" for remission of sins. Jesus, the Word which became Flesh Himself, with His own Blood, forgives us our sins through faith in Him.

The preaching that the New Covenant is more than that is a deception.



If we believe in the Word which became Flesh, we will believe His New Covenant. Not the teaching of man. The New Testament is our example of the Old Testament teaching put into practice. Jesus is the perfect example of how we should walk, and what instructions we should "WALK IN. We need look no further. He is the Author and finisher of my Faith.

"For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth."

This is why it is written;

"He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked."

He didn't live in opposition to the instructions He gave to man as the Word. He did partake in the New Covenant though, as He forgave sins without the Blood of one goat, or one Ceremony as described in the Old Priesthood, the Old Covenant..
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
5,399
695
113

Your still not answering my questions. I asked hwo I can trust the Bible if it is a lie

Moses wrote, that God told him to write down the law. You claim Moses lied (it is not from God it is really from moses)

If I can not trust one part of the OT, I can not trust any of it, If it says mercy grace and justice and faith was taught in the OT, How can I trust it if I can not trust the OT.

do you understand what I am trying to ask
I understand what you are asking and I am sorry to have upset you. I will answer this way. The Bible, all of it is to be believed. It is a true account of an often wicked and disobedient people who sometimes worshipped other Gods. They killed the prophets, they killed the disciples and they connived to have Jesus killed. Such was their wickedness God had to make a New Covenant with them. Despite that there were many who were faithful and true to "The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace" of Isa. 9:6 whose name we call Jesus. Follow Jesus every step of the way and you won't go wrong. There is no need to distinguish between God's law and rabbinical law, just follow the Good Shepherd every step of the way, obey Him, worship Him and "goodness and mercy shall follow you all the days of your life: and you will dwell in the house of the LORD for ever." (Psalm 23:6) Amen.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
I understand what you are asking and I am sorry to have upset you. I will answer this way. The Bible, all of it is to be believed. It is a true account of an often wicked and disobedient people who sometimes worshipped other Gods. They killed the prophets, they killed the disciples and they connived to have Jesus killed. Such was their wickedness God had to make a New Covenant with them. Despite that there were many who were faithful and true to "The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace" of Isa. 9:6 whose name we call Jesus. Follow Jesus every step of the way and you won't go wrong. There is no need to distinguish between God's law and rabbinical law, just follow the Good Shepherd every step of the way, obey Him, worship Him and "goodness and mercy shall follow you all the days of your life: and you will dwell in the house of the LORD for ever." (Psalm 23:6) Amen.
I must ask why you can not answer if Moses was right or not by claiming it was God, and if not, WHy should I trust the bible?

I agree with everything you said here, the bible shows us about good people and evil people but that was not my question

WHat I am asking you about is the word itself. It claims to be the word of God. If it is the word of God would it not be perfect? And if their is a mistake in one aspect. can not the whole thing not be trusted? Who says what is right and what is wrong?

in fact, If what Moses said is error how can I believe the thing which you stated the bible talk about is truth or error?
 

Studyman

Senior Member
Oct 11, 2017
3,570
516
113
I understand what you are asking and I am sorry to have upset you. I will answer this way. The Bible, all of it is to be believed. It is a true account of an often wicked and disobedient people who sometimes worshipped other Gods. They killed the prophets, they killed the disciples and they connived to have Jesus killed. Such was their wickedness God had to make a New Covenant with them. Despite that there were many who were faithful and true to "The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace" of Isa. 9:6 whose name we call Jesus. Follow Jesus every step of the way and you won't go wrong. There is no need to distinguish between God's law and rabbinical law, just follow the Good Shepherd every step of the way, obey Him, worship Him and "goodness and mercy shall follow you all the days of your life: and you will dwell in the house of the LORD for ever." (Psalm 23:6) Amen.
You keep ignoring the Biblical fact that Able did none of these things, and neither did Noah, Abraham, Caleb, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Zechariahs, the list goes on and on.

These are our examples of Faith, not the lying Mainstream Preachers of their time, or ours.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,689
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I don't see Jesus cursing anyone in this life, instead he would rather take our sins upon himself otherwise his death was in vain.

I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain. (Gal 2:21 KJV)
What about that fig tree tho... ?

That's a figure, isn't it?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
36,689
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Good luck trying to distinguish between God's law and rabbinical law. Moses had rabbinical authority to write law. We know this from the fact that Jesus said being allowed to divorce under certain circumstances is a rabbinical judgment passed down by Moses. We can't know what other judgments he himself added to the law he gave the Israelites.

We get messed up because Paul did not make the distinction in law that we seek to make. And it's not necessary to do that. The point is it was ALL binding on the people of God. You had to obey the sum total of the law including the rabbinical add on stuff or you were condemned.

The good news is that when Christ forgave your sins the witness for the prosecution (the law-Deuteronomy 31:26) died on the cross with Jesus and can't testify against you in God's court. Again, this doesn't mean you are released from the requirements of the law, but rather are released from the condemnation of the law. Who can bring a charge against Christ's elect? No one of course. The witness of the law against us has died and can't testify against us.


26“Take this book of the law and place it beside the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may remain there as a witness against you."-Deuteronomy 31:26

"having forgiven us all our transgressions, 14having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us, which was hostile to us; and He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross."-Colossians 2:13-14

"33Who will bring a charge against God’s elect?"-Romans 8:33
But in Him all the righteous requirements of the law were met, and by faith He imputes this righteousness to us who join Him in His death, to walk with Him in His life
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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What about that fig tree tho... ?

That's a figure, isn't it?
Yes. The fig tree was a figure for unbelieving Israel. They brought a curse upon themselves by rejecting their Messiah.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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I don't see Jesus cursing anyone in this life...
Not sure what you mean by "in this life" but He did pronounce "woes" (curses) on the scribes, Pharisees, and lawyers who would not believe on Him even after seeing all that He did and said.
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
5,399
695
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I must ask why you can not answer if Moses was right or not by claiming it was God, and if not, WHy should I trust the bible?

I agree with everything you said here, the bible shows us about good people and evil people but that was not my question

WHat I am asking you about is the word itself. It claims to be the word of God. If it is the word of God would it not be perfect? And if their is a mistake in one aspect. can not the whole thing not be trusted? Who says what is right and what is wrong?

in fact, If what Moses said is error how can I believe the thing which you stated the bible talk about is truth or error?
It is true:
And the LORD said unto Moses, Write thou these words: for after the tenor of these words I have made a covenant with thee and with Israel. And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments. (Exo 34:27-28 KJV)

Remember though, these are the Ten Commandments and not the 613 Mitzvot Laws.
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
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695
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You keep ignoring the Biblical fact that Able did none of these things, and neither did Noah, Abraham, Caleb, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Zechariahs, the list goes on and on.

These are our examples of Faith, not the lying Mainstream Preachers of their time, or ours.
Exo_3:6 Moreover he said, I am the God of thy father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob. And Moses hid his face; for he was afraid to look upon God. (Moses was excluded)
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
It is true:
And the LORD said unto Moses, Write thou these words: for after the tenor of these words I have made a covenant with thee and with Israel. And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments. (Exo 34:27-28 KJV)

Remember though, these are the Ten Commandments and not the 613 Mitzvot Laws.
see what I mean?

I posted 2 places where God said the same thing.

do you ignore them? Are they in error? Was it not God who said it.

Please try to stick with what I said.

 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
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Not sure what you mean by "in this life" but He did pronounce "woes" (curses) on the scribes, Pharisees, and lawyers who would not believe on Him even after seeing all that He did and said.
When I said, "I don't see Jesus cursing anyone in this life..." I was thinking about the wicked at the judgement.
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
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see what I mean?

I posted 2 places where God said the same thing.

do you ignore them? Are they in error? Was it not God who said it.

Please try to stick with what I said.

I'm not understanding you, it is true that God told Moses to write down the Ten Commandments.
 

Studyman

Senior Member
Oct 11, 2017
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516
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Exo_3:6 Moreover he said, I am the God of thy father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob. And Moses hid his face; for he was afraid to look upon God. (Moses was excluded)

This verse does not make what I posted void. WE all will hide our face and look at the ground when we see God.
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
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This verse does not make what I posted void. WE all will hide our face and look at the ground when we see God.
I wasn't intending to make you post void, I just don't see Moses alongside Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and Nahor to name four.

Gen_31:53 The God of Abraham, and the God of Nahor, the God of their father, judge betwixt us. And Jacob sware by the Fear of his father Isaac.

Gen_32:9 And Jacob said, O God of my father Abraham, and God of my father Isaac, O Jehovah, who saidst unto me, Return unto thy country, and to thy kindred, and I will do thee good:

Gen_50:24 And Joseph said unto his brethren, I die; but God will surely visit you, and bring you up out of this land unto the land which he sware to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob.

Exo_2:24 And God heard their groaning, and God remembered his covenant with Abraham, with Isaac, and with Jacob.


 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
I'm not understanding you, it is true that God told Moses to write down the Ten Commandments.
Actually God wrote the ten commandments,

I asked about these earlier, was this God of abraham or some other God that told moses these things?


Lev 1:
1 Now the Lord called to Moses, and spoke to him from the tabernacle of meeting, saying, [SUP]2 [/SUP]“Speak to the children of Israel, and say to them: ‘When any one of you brings an offering to the Lord, you shall bring your offering of the livestock—of the herd and of the flock.

So this is not correct? God did not give this command to moses?

Ex 20: [SUP]22 [/SUP]Then the Lord said to Moses, “Thus you shall say to the children of Israel:

So all the laws God gave to moses after this were not from God?
was this God or was this Moses making these laws up (as you claimed earlier?)
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
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This verse does not make what I posted void. WE all will hide our face and look at the ground when we see God.
Let us end by looking on the face of Jesus who is a light in the darkness: who is gracious, full of compassion, and righteousness. (Psa 112:4) Who reflects the brightness of God's glory. He is the exact likeness of God and he sustains the universe with his powerful word. (Heb 1:3) and from whom nothing can separate us from the love of God through Christ Jesus our Lord. (Rom 8:39)


[video=youtube;czxd5oa-gi0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=czxd5oa-gi0[/video]
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
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Actually God wrote the ten commandments,

I asked about these earlier, was this God of abraham or some other God that told moses these things?


was this God or was this Moses making these laws up (as you claimed earlier?)
The giver of the Ten Commandments to Moses was the God of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Moses et. al.