Catholic Heresy (for the record)

[notuptome]

Only God can change hearts. Pray for mercy that God will withhold His terrible wrath just a little longer that we may gather the last souls into the kingdom before the great tribulation comes upon Israel and the nations of the world.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[JesusIsAll]

Only God can change hearts. Pray for mercy that God will withhold His terrible wrath just a little longer that we may gather the last souls into the kingdom before the great tribulation comes upon Israel and the nations of the world.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

But isn't this time one that only God knows, and one that will be exactly such a time as is right we perhaps can't, even shouldn't, try to pray around? If the Lord sees, for instance, more souls to gather, which only He could, would He not do this, anyway? Aren't such events on God's timetable, not given as options for us? Isn't the right time already a given of the Lord?

Also, I'd be delighted to see the Lord now, like every day for past decades, myself in what I suppose is a second to the last verse of the Bible camp, "He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus." The sin and despair in this world has already been quite enough, to my mind, want to gag every time I hear the news anymore, hear of such as ISIS dumping 50 new bodies in a well.

 

[notuptome]

But isn't this time one that only God knows, and one that will be exactly such a time as is right we perhaps can't, even shouldn't, try to pray around? If the Lord sees, for instance, more souls to gather, which only He could, would He not do this, anyway? Aren't such events on God's timetable, not given as options for us? Isn't the right time already a given of the Lord?

Also, I'd be delighted to see the Lord now, like every day for past decades, myself in what I suppose is a second to the last verse of the Bible camp, "He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus." The sin and despair in this world has already been quite enough, to my mind, want to gag every time I hear the news anymore, hear of such as ISIS dumping 50 new bodies in a well.

We groan within ourselves desiring to be with the Lord Yet having the fields white unto harvest lying before us. We work while it is yet day knowing that the evening comes when we can labor no longer.

I hope that the Lord gives additional mercy because of the prayers of His saints for the lost and the suffering.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[JesusIsAll]

Well, I have some other complaints, also. Can't say I really like being called a Protestant, as if I were ever Catholic, in the first place. As a matter of fact, the Bible was always my guide, was never a part of Catholicism I've had to protest. My faith is that from the beginning, taught in the New Testament, Catholicism just an irrelevant fringe cult of some I've known who are off-the-wall in their hubris and governing fables they have to try and lay-off on everybody, the Mariolatry thing, statues bleeding from their eyeballs, the cannabalism, just creepy stuff. But, thanks to the protesters of old, I'm born into a world where they're defanged. (Many still lack enough sense or any modicum of shame to even avoid the word "heretic" of others, which is the worst of manners, after the horrors of their Inquisitions for Satan.) But we've all been assaulted by these Pope figures in the news, making Christians look like idiots, off on some other tangent than Christianity, when one could easily speculate, were Christ at the same restaurant, He may say, "Me? No! I'm not with him!", but, anyway, I'm sorely disappointed of their performance in other areas.

Consider this. Our Lord Jesus used the name Holy Father (John 17:11) to pray to the One HE was in submission of when in the flesh. Here you have this Pope guy in some big hat that's sheer Alice in Wonderland stuff, in his Halloween costume, sitting on a throne, with a ring people bow to and slobber all over, one might suspect (got to wonder the germs on that thing!), who is called the name of the One Jesus Christ was in submission to, and what happens? They tour around some, promoting the Roman cult, go to a few viewings of an idol procession down a South American street, give the world shocking revelations that peace would be nice, twist scripture and Christianity into a worse pretzel most every time they open their mouths anymore, then they just die. I mean, this guy's supposed to be the Holy Father, bigger in the flesh than Christ ever laid claim to, I mean, his Holy Father name equal with celestial God the Spirit Father nobody has seen, and he won't even, for instance, go on a shopping spree in Venice on foot, open the earth to suck up ISIS, just turn some Pellegrino into Cabernet Sauvignon, for goodness sake? Cure somebody's hiccoughs? Okay then. Just agree with the last infallible guy?

There's got to be more to a Holy Father than funny clothes. What a letdown, to say the least.

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

The word "Catholic" comes from the Greek adjective καθολικός and means "universal" and was first used by to describe the Christian Church in the early 2nd century, immediately following the apostolic age, in the ante-Nicene church period. In the early Christian church, immediately following the death of the apostles, ALL Christians were referred to as Catholics and there's absolutely nothing wrong with referring to yourself in this way as a member of Christ's body... His universal church.

So I can understand why you wouldn't view yourself as a Protestant . Honestly, the term 'Protestant' was first used by German princes who issued a protest against the edict of the Diet of Speyer reversing prior concessions they had made to Lutherans. During the Reformation, the term "Protestant" was not even used outside of German politics. We were called (and called ourselves) either Christians or evangelicals (which refers to the gospel) during the Reformation.

What we refer to today as the "Catholic Church" is divided into the Roman Catholic Church and the Orthodox Catholic Church which consists of 22 Eastern Orthodox Catholic churches. Considering that together they have about 1.2 billion or so members, I wouldn't call them "an irrelevant fringe"... whether or not they are a cult or not a cult. Compare that figure with the world's 801 million "Protestants."

Well, I have some other complaints, also. Can't say I really like being called a Protestant, as if I were ever Catholic, in the first place. As a matter of fact, the Bible was always my guide, was never a part of Catholicism I've had to protest. My faith is that from the beginning, taught in the New Testament, Catholicism just an irrelevant fringe cult...

 

[ThomistColin]

The word "Catholic" comes from the Greek adjective καθολικός and means "universal" and was first used by to describe the Christian Church in the early 2nd century, immediately following the apostolic age, in the ante-Nicene church period. In the early Christian church, immediately following the death of the apostles, ALL Christians were referred to as Catholics and there's absolutely nothing wrong with referring to yourself in this way as a member of Christ's body... His universal church.

So I can understand why you wouldn't view yourself as a Protestant . Honestly, the term 'Protestant' was first used by German princes who issued a protest against the edict of the Diet of Speyer reversing prior concessions they had made to Lutherans. During the Reformation, the term "Protestant" was not even used outside of German politics. We were called (and called ourselves) either Christians or evangelicals (which refers to the gospel) during the Reformation.

What we refer to today as the "Catholic Church" is divided into the Roman Catholic Church and the Orthodox Catholic Church which consists of 22 Eastern Orthodox Catholic churches. Considering that together they have about 1.2 billion or so members, I wouldn't call them "an irrelevant fringe"... whether or not they are a cult or not a cult. Compare that figure with the world's 801 million "Protestants."

True. And the Orthodox Catholics do recognize the Papal Authority. It's why within the Catholic Church we use the phrases "Latin Rite" and "Eastern Rite." So as no to build confusion about the Orthodox vs. the Orthodox Catholics.

 

[notuptome]

Please feel free to call me a protestant. Feel free to call me a fundamentalist.

I protest all that is against the fundamentals of the bible. I protest all that lessens the glory of God in Jesus Christ. I protest all that robs God of His grace through works, rites and rituals. I protest all that drags men away from the narrow gate that is entered only by grace through faith.

Please feel free to call me a protestant. My Lord and Savior was and is to this day called much worse by men of far less noble character.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[JesusIsAll]

The word "Catholic" comes from the Greek adjective καθολικός and means "universal" and was first used by to describe the Christian Church in the early 2nd century, immediately following the apostolic age, in the ante-Nicene church period. In the early Christian church, immediately following the death of the apostles, ALL Christians were referred to as Catholics and there's absolutely nothing wrong with referring to yourself in this way as a member of Christ's body... His universal church.

So I can understand why you wouldn't view yourself as a Protestant . Honestly, the term 'Protestant' was first used by German princes who issued a protest against the edict of the Diet of Speyer reversing prior concessions they had made to Lutherans. During the Reformation, the term "Protestant" was not even used outside of German politics. We were called (and called ourselves) either Christians or evangelicals (which refers to the gospel) during the Reformation.

What we refer to today as the "Catholic Church" is divided into the Roman Catholic Church and the Orthodox Catholic Church which consists of 22 Eastern Orthodox Catholic churches. Considering that together they have about 1.2 billion or so members, I wouldn't call them "an irrelevant fringe"... whether or not they are a cult or not a cult. Compare that figure with the world's 801 million "Protestants."

Understand the nature of the word catholic, that, in fact, there is a catholic church, the body of all true believers in Christ born of the Holy Spirit, but I'm personally so appalled over the history of Rome, the fabrications placed in the catechism, that the word "catholic," itself, is tainted to me. Now, in the scheme of things, Roman Catholicism is not a fringe, over a billion members then, some obscene number, I know. But it's a fringe to me in terms of reality, perhaps could have better said it's not material, not relevant, to my New Testament faith, it's out there with the JWs and etc. Despite Satanic threats I've had thrown at me, many times by Catholics, that my New Testament faith damns, this rolls off like water on a duck's back and merely affirms the heinous nature of the Roman cult, last report touting evolution and Quran readings. It's a fringe of unfortunate news reports, most anytime a Pope opens his mouth these days, but that's about it. I just praise the Lord I have a Bible and the sense to not be a Roman Catholic!

 

[notuptome]

Understand the nature of the word catholic, that, in fact, there is a catholic church, the body of all true believers in Christ born of the Holy Spirit, but I'm personally so appalled over the history of Rome, the fabrications placed in the catechism, that the word "catholic," itself, is tainted to me. Now, in the scheme of things, Roman Catholicism is not a fringe, over a billion members then, some obscene number, I know. But it's a fringe to me in terms of reality, perhaps could have better said it's not material, not relevant, to my New Testament faith, it's out there with the JWs and etc. Despite Satanic threats I've had thrown at me, many times by Catholics, that my New Testament faith damns, this rolls off like water on a duck's back and merely affirms the heinous nature of the Roman cult, last report touting evolution and Quran readings. It's a fringe of unfortunate news reports, most anytime a Pope opens his mouth these days, but that's about it. I just praise the Lord I have a Bible and the sense to not be a Roman Catholic!

There is a way that seemeth right to men about a billion of them but the end thereof is death. Broad is the path that leads to destruction. Narrow is the gate that leads to eternal life and few there be that find it.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

Various theological strains occurred very early in the church; however, it remained essentially united for a thousand years and did so despite schisms, heresies and excommunications, and bitter controversies.

Only the authoritarian claims of Rome and it's insistence upon a papacy finally caused the division between Easter and Western churches formalized in 1054 (the 'Great Schism') and only after the Great Schism can we speak precisely of an aberrant Roman Catholic theology (RCC) which the 16th-century rift with Protestantism at the Reformation sharpened.

Truthfully, Roman Catholic theology is so comprehensive that it cannot easily be summarized. One must distinguish between official teaching and the opinions expressed by the many schools of theology in the RCC. That said, the teaching office of the church (e.g. the Magisterium) does present a much more monolithic structure than the diversity of the theology schools within the Catholic Church suggests.

Historically, it has been the role of the bishops of Rome and of ecumenical councils to sift the findings of the various Catholic theological schools and this was a significant work of the Council of Trent (1545–63) which took a firm stance against the challenge of Protestantism to initiate a genuine process of reform within the RCC back to apostolic orthodoxy instead deciding to pronounce over 100 anathemas against evangelical/Protestant Christians at the Councils of Trent (and later Vatican II) leading to some calling it the Council of Sklerokardia (e.g. literally the hardening of the heart).

But even after the Council of Trent, a large number of options were left open. Consider that even papal pronouncements and conciliar definitions are recognized to be historically conditioned. They are constantly open to new interpretation and application. This results in a theology that is constantly changing which is a source of bewilderment to lay non-Catholics.

This, of course, is rooted in the RCC's emphasis on a centralized priestly authority which is focused in the Pope (e.g. bishop of Rome) whom is supported by the college of bishops (both East and West) which the Catholic Church asserts has the power to exercise in a solemn manner God's supreme and full power over the whole Church. <--Obviously, us evangelical Protestant Christians completely disagree.

The teaching authority the RCC claims enables them to extrapolate from the Scriptures a belief in ongoing doctrinal development (see Newman in the 19th century) has created unacceptable dogma for non-Catholics (e.g. those who are not formal members of the RCC or one of the 22 Orthodox Catholic "denominations"). The Marian dogmas of the immaculate conception and of the assumption illustrate the point (see RCC doctrine of Mary). The claim to papal infallibility only compounds the problem.

Nevertheless, despite the irreconcilable differences, there is common ground and why you see educated evangelical Protestants like myself treat the Catholic rank and file with respect and sensitivity. We don't take the gloves off, so to speak, unless we are dealing with someone in the RCC bent on propagating the RCC's many serious divergences away from apostolic orthodoxy (e.g. the orthodoxy of Christ and the apostles found in the early church).

Roman Catholics do accept the same Scriptures as normative (though they include the writings in the Apocrypha), they hold to the same early creeds, they believe in the doctrine of the Trinity and the divinity of Christ, they align with us (or us with them depending on how you look at it) against the forces of sweeping immorality and for God's normative morality in the lives of people and their societies, etc... which is why I have found in my own travels and interactions that I LIKE Catholics despite our irreconcilable theological differences.

Understand the nature of the word catholic, that, in fact, there is a catholic church, the body of all true believers in Christ born of the Holy Spirit, but I'm personally so appalled over the history of Rome, the fabrications placed in the catechism, that the word "catholic," itself, is tainted to me. Now, in the scheme of things, Roman Catholicism is not a fringe, over a billion members then, some obscene number, I know. But it's a fringe to me in terms of reality, perhaps could have better said it's not material, not relevant, to my New Testament faith, it's out there with the JWs and etc. Despite Satanic threats I've had thrown at me, many times by Catholics, that my New Testament faith damns, this rolls off like water on a duck's back and merely affirms the heinous nature of the Roman cult, last report touting evolution and Quran readings. It's a fringe of unfortunate news reports, most anytime a Pope opens his mouth these days, but that's about it. I just praise the Lord I have a Bible and the sense to not be a Roman Catholic!

 

[notuptome]

Roman Catholics do accept the same Scriptures as normative (though they include the writings in the Apocrypha), they hold to the same early creeds, they believe in the doctrine of the Trinity and the divinity of Christ, they align with us (or us with them depending on how you look at it) against the forces of sweeping immorality and for God's normative morality in the lives of people and their societies, etc... which is why I have found in my own travels and interactions that I LIKE Catholics despite our irreconcilable theological differences.

I have considerable agreement with this thought but I can find nothing to ease the fact that without a correct knowledge of Jesus Christ and the total efficacy of His blood on Calvary they are not saved.

They are non-Christians worshipping God and when they die they go straight to the devils hell. Like Cain salvation lieth at the door but they will not receive Gods salvation and pursue their own salvation which is not salvation.

I am exasperated by their unwillingness to hear the truth from Gods word.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

It's not so simple for many members of the Roman Catholic Church are born again spirit-filled Christians and presently in God's kingdom.

This occurs through various means ranging from self-study to interaction with evangelical Christians to an epiphany from no less than God Himself. Oh yes my Protestant brother, God loves Catholics too . And, since 1967 the charismatic movement has extended into the Roman Catholic Church.

But you're correct that the RCC has codified a maligned soteriology and imputed themselves into the place of God as the 'agent of salvation' to a large degree. As theologians Wilhoit, Longman, Duriez, Penney, and Reid point out:

"Nothing humans do can, in and of itself, changes their legal standing before God, creates a new nature or radically reorients their behavior. Human beings cannot save themselves (Rom 3:24; Tit 3:5). Salvation is wrought either by God himself or by a deputy of God: 'I, I am Yahweh, and besides me there is no savior' (Is 43:11). God is the ultimate source of salvation (Ps 25:5; 65:5)—the Savior (Ps 106:21) and salvation itself (Ps 118:14; Is 12:2).

In the OT, kings were expected to be saving helps (2 Sam 14:4; 2 Kings 13:5), prophets proclaimed salvation (Is 42–43), and priests were said to be clothed with salvation (Ps 132:16; 2 Chron 6:41). The Gospels, however, apply the title Savior only to God and to Jesus (Lk 2:11; Jn 4:42). The term is used twenty-four times in the NT, sixteen times of Jesus (e.g., 2 Pet 1:1; 1 Jn 4:14) and eight times of God the Father. The name Jesus literally means 'Yahweh is salvation.' Mary calls her son Jesus, 'for he will save his people from their sins' (Mt 1:21 RSV). He shall be called 'Emmanuel, … God with us' (Mt 1:23 RSV)—the epitome and concrete embodiment of God’s original covenant promise to dwell with his people.

Jesus’ life and work demonstrates the aptness of his name (Lk 19:10; Jn 3:17). Jesus explained that he came into the world in order to save (Mk 10:45). Jesus heals (Mk 5:34) and forgives (Lk 7:47–48). He thus becomes the central character in the story of God’s salvation. According to Peter’s Pentecost sermon, 'There is salvation in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved' (Acts 4:12 RSV).

Jesus is Savior because his life and work as Messiah (the Christ) fulfills the three offices of, respectively, the prophet who announces salvation (Lk 4:18–21), the priest who effects forgiveness of sins ('it is finished,' Jn 19:30) and the king who rules in our hearts (Gal 2:20). Salvation, then, is being 'in Christ.' In Christ the saved receive a new status, a new nature and a new way of life. The believer lives in Christ and Christ lives in the believer (Jn 15:4). The original covenant promise of God—to be their God—is thus fulfilled in a startling new way."

As theologians Walters, Milne, Wood, Marshall, Millard, Packer, and Wiseman point out:

"Salvation is not to be equated with political order, liberty, or a specific denomination of a 'church.' Man is saved by God’s action in history in the person of Jesus Christ (Rom. 4:25; 5:10; 2 Cor. 4:10f.; Phil. 2:6f.; 1 Tim. 1:15; 1 Jn. 4:9–10, 14). While the birth, life and ministry of Jesus are not unimportant, the stress falls upon his death and resurrection (1 Cor. 15:5f.); we are saved by the blood of his cross (Acts 20:28; Rom. 3:25; 5:9; Eph. 1:7; Col. 1:20; Heb. 9:12; 12:24; 13:12; 1 Jn. 1:7; Rev. 1:5; 5:9). As this message is proclaimed and men hear and come to respond in faith God’s salvation is brought to them (Rom. 10:8, 14f.; 1 Cor. 1:18–25; 15:1 I; 1 Thes. 1:4f.)."
The modern Catholic Church is in critical need of genuine reform. Unfortunately, every time they've gathered for that purpose; its resulted in them getting even more lost.

Of course, if a Catholic apologist is reading this they may be along shortly to take issue with my post .

I have considerable agreement with this thought but I can find nothing to ease the fact that without a correct knowledge of Jesus Christ and the total efficacy of His blood on Calvary they are not saved.

They are non-Christians worshipping God and when they die they go straight to the devils hell. Like Cain salvation lieth at the door but they will not receive Gods salvation and pursue their own salvation which is not salvation.

I am exasperated by their unwillingness to hear the truth from Gods word.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[JesusIsAll]

While the Lord knows whether any Catholic is born again, of Catholicism, we know the devil comes as an angel of light, that the devil is a liar, and that the catechism is laced with lies, false prophecies, between its truths. And our Lord Jesus said to call no man father, and the Holy Father is God the Father, only. Lies and in-your-face disobedience? All the torture-murder? This the leading of the Holy Spirit? Must you Catholic sock puppets presume everybody stupid?

I tire of redacted history and apologetics for your mountain of hate crimes and deceptive evils out of one side of your mouths, then telling me I'm a heretic out of the other, for believing the Holy Bible, the faith of Jesus Christ and His apostles, which you even demean, by calling that faith taught by our Lord Jesus insufficient. In terms of Christianity, who looks stupid?

 

[Jesse819]

LOL "WALA NA MARIA"

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

Here's the personal testimony of a former RCC priest who held that position honorably for 22 years: Berean Beacon proclaims the Good News of Salvation, The Gospel of Jesus Christ. The President and founder is Richard Bennett, a former Roman Catholic Priest. - Do Catholics Possess Life Eternal?

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

But not the Old Catholic Church . Though they are presently in dialogue with the RCC since 1987, they assert no foundation to papal claims of universal immediate jurisdiction or to claims of papal infallibility.

True. And the Orthodox Catholics do recognize the Papal Authority. It's why within the Catholic Church we use the phrases "Latin Rite" and "Eastern Rite." So as no to build confusion about the Orthodox vs. the Orthodox Catholics.

 

[masha]

If a man would have the power to decide whom to give salvation i think a person like you, you'd only save those who are in your chuch.but thank God man can help other to get salvation but can't decide who to save or not.it doesn't matter where you go to warship but at the approaching time of judgement will come, what will you have in your heart. Cos we'er all sinners. Jesus simplified things to us by teaching us to keep his love,loving him we will all live well but only having true love of our Lord Jesus.so don't wast your time by thinking n hoping others to go to hell just cos they don't worship in your church.

 

[JesusIsAll]

Roman Catholics do accept the same Scriptures as normative (though they include the writings in the Apocrypha), they hold to the same early creeds, they believe in the doctrine of the Trinity and the divinity of Christ, they align with us (or us with them depending on how you look at it) against the forces of sweeping immorality and for God's normative morality in the lives of people and their societies, etc... which is why I have found in my own travels and interactions that I LIKE Catholics despite our irreconcilable theological differences.

I have also found many Catholics I like, but, that said, there's a Catholic I can't help but find repulsive and obscene, the ones which throw around words like heretic, that demean your Bible faith in our Lord Jesus, call you out of communion, etc., blah, blah, blah. That is, pompous liars, deluded and psychopathic control freaks, that were always at the source of the evils through they ages. They still exist, a couple here on CC. You never can dialog with them, rather they deign themselves papist steamrollers, the eventual bottom line nothing is real or good that is not under the Roman Pope's thumb, which Pope, of late, infallibly busy sucking the kneecaps of antichrist Muslims and stunts like a Quran reading at the Vatican. It's like ecumenicism with Christians. There are many reports, especially from England, of these ecumenical fronts, groups, that are trying to draw evangelicals in, then sneak in the real message "ecumenical" is under Rome, come home to the "real church."

Those who don't fully accept me, with my faith in our Lord Jesus Christ, as prescribed in scripture by the first century church, those who are deceptive and spiritually offensive, I feel no obligation to wish any God speed. I also have an identical stand on any pushy "Protestant" cult, and their worthless extra-Biblical blather they would try to threaten and demean others with who won't assent to their fables and errors.

 

[ThomistColin]

But not the Old Catholic Church . Though they are presently in dialogue with the RCC since 1987, they assert no foundation to papal claims of universal immediate jurisdiction or to claims of papal infallibility.

Old Catholic Church broke away during the First Vatican Council. My point was there are Eastern Rite/Orthodox Catholics who do recognize Papal Authority. They are not the Orthodox that existed during the Schism.

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

The Eastern Orthodox Church is opposed to the Roman Catholic doctrine of papal supremacy, the expansion of which reached its climax in 1870 at the First Vatican Council that proclaimed the doctrine of papal infallibility and anathematized (cast out of the Church) all who refused to recognize papal supremacy stating:

"We teach and define that it is a dogma Divinely revealed that the Roman pontiff when he speaks ex cathedra, that is when in discharge of the office of pastor and doctor of all Christians, by virtue of his supreme Apostolic authority, he defines a doctrine regarding faith or morals to be held by the universal Church, by the Divine assistance promised to him in Blessed Peter, is possessed of that infallibility with which the Divine Redeemer willed that his Church should be endowed in defining doctrine regarding faith or morals, and that therefore such definitions of the Roman pontiff are of themselves and not from the consent of the Church irreformable.So then, should anyone, which God forbid, have the temerity to reject this definition of ours: let him be anathema." (see Denziger §1839). — Vatican Council, Sess. IV , Const. de Ecclesiâ Christi, Chapter iv

^ While not denying that some form of primacy could exist for Rome's bishop, Eastern Orthodox Catholics argue that the tradition of Rome's primacy in the early Church was not equivalent to the current doctrine of supremacy.

And, of course, both the Old Catholic Church and about 800 million or so "Protestants" assert that they didn't leave the Catholic Church (in the "universal" sense if the original context) but rather that Eastern Catholic Churches and the Roman Catholic Church left them when they materially deviated from the teaching of Jesus Christ and the apostles and fabricated cacodoxical replacement theologies which they presently follow and continue adding to as time progresses.

This last point figures prominently in evangelical prophecy which points to the formation of a "world" church consisting of a political union between the Roman Catholic Church, Eastern Orthodox Catholics, and liberal ecumenical Protestants which will be spiritual in name only, freely using the name of Jesus Christ, but really will be antichrist and political in many of its activities.

This powerful church union will wrap itself in social action, charity programs, and ministries of compassion. Its leaders will make sweeping statements about meeting human need by sending out a call for renewed social action, political intervention, and a greater voice in world affairs.

But underneath the "good works," in the guise of "understanding," will be the full acceptance and vindication of homosexuality that will not only be accepted but encouraged amongst its members. Homosexual and lesbian ministers will be ordained and given places of authority in this church union and will be heralded as a new breed of pioneer introducing new concepts of love and evangelism.

Certain of these homosexual member churches will branch out into "brave" "new" "expressions of love" engaging artistic nude dancing. Men will become worshippers of the creature more than of the Creator and the one true holy God will be forced to give these kinds of "worshippers" over to their sins resulting in a reprobate mind respite with severe mental problems that do not respond to any kind of treatment.

Of course, this world church will never officially accept occult practices outright; but phrenology, palmistry, fortune-telling, and horoscopes will be tolerated (and widely respected). So it will be ironic when this new union singles out charismatic Catholics for special discipline with high-level pressure on local priests to "put the fire out."

Of course, as the prophet Isaiah stated, God raises a standard in such times and while this is occurring a great supernatural union of all the true followers of Jesus Christ, bound together through the Holy Spirit and mutual confidence in Jesus Christ and a materially accurate exegesis of His Word will arise and become a kind of underground fellowship that will include Catholics and Protestants of all denominations binding together young and old, black and white, and people of all nations.

While the visible super world church gains political power, this invisible supernatural church will grow tremendously in spiritual power. As the super world church's persecution of them begins, these ones will be driven closer together and simultaneously closer to Jesus Christ. There will be less concern for denominational concepts and more emphasis on the return of Jesus Christ. The Holy Spirit will bring together, as one, people from all faiths and walks of life.

Although this supernatural church already exists around the world, it will become politically more invisible. But as persecution becomes intense, this body of believers will become almost radical in its evangelistic efforts. This invisible church will receive supernatural unction and Holy Ghost power to continue preaching the gospel until the ends of the earth have heard.

Of course for this evangelical eschatology to occur, Rome must position the Pope as more of a political than a spiritual leader of this great union. Protestant leaders of the ecumenical movement will insist upon and receive certain concessions from Rome in exchange. They will not be asked to consider the Holy Father as the infallible head of the church and, in return, will accept his political leadership without accepting his role as Peter's successor.

In this new super world church union, an army of ungodly antichrist career driven people will hold the most influential posts driving this super church union to political power strong enough to put pressure on all those who oppose its actions. While those in the highest posts of leadership will be speaking about miracles, love, and reconciliation, hirelings who work under them will be harassing and persecuting those religious organizations opposed to their leadership.

A schism is coming ThomistColin, but it won't be between Catholics and Protestants...

Old Catholic Church broke away during the First Vatican Council. My point was there are Eastern Rite/Orthodox Catholics who do recognize Papal Authority. They are not the Orthodox that existed during the Schism.