Cessationism or Continuationism: What Does Scripture Say?

[Elizabeth619]

By claiming the gifts have ceased you say that something of God and the Holy Spirit has changed. And lots of people have brought forth evidence and experience but you continue to ignore them (like the cars whizzing by). And if the long winded versions haven't been accepted in the past, forgive me if I don't spend the time re-iterating them and summarize instead.

You know my views on this so I won't get in to that. but I will say that there is much fraud out there as well. Many do not believe in the gifts do to the infiltration of frauds in the church. You know they are out there. So do I. So if there are still active gifts in this day I am assuming for every 1 certified person who performs gifts there is at least about 50 frauds.

 

[damombomb]

i know they exist in any believer. they are not for a select few. any person who walks in love and carries his cross and follows love and lives in love. you will get 1 or more spiritual gifts depending on when the spirit gives it to you.

im only 15 and while im still a sinner he has healed about 8 people AT My school!! praise god

SEEK THEM EARNESTLY!!!!!!!!!!!

I have to agree here, anyone walking in love, bearing the name of Jesus, has the ability. Because they are humble and honor
God and understand they can do nothing, but he can. Because of his word. It accomplishes and conquers

 

[RachelBibleStudent]

Until we define what evidence would prove either, we cannot move forward. All that I've heard so far has been tentative.

that is a good point...in order to resolve this debate it will be necessary to prevent either side from 'moving the goalposts'

 

[RachelBibleStudent]

i voted 'yes' for spiritual gifts still existing...but 'i do not think it means what you think it means'...

 

[Kerry]

If you believe that miracles do not happen today, Then you do not believe the word of God. He said I am the same yesterday, today and forever.

 

[JaumeJ]

Not only as you say, our Father does even more than one reads of in His Word.

Anyone who has received His Holy Spirit knows this. It is beyond being a belief, it is an experience.

No one may shorten the Arm of the Lord in any manner.

Being almighty really does mean He is cabable of all things, even those not imagined.

Read His Word, believe Him, worship Him, for Yeshua is Lord, amen.

If you believe that miracles do not happen today, Then you do not believe the word of God. He said I am the same yesterday, today and forever.

 

[NiceneCreed]

I couldn't agree more. Did you read my article? I said exactly the same thing.

 

[NiceneCreed]

You raised a great point; most tongues/prophecies are fake these days. As you are well aware, Jesus warned us such things would occur. When you have so many Charismatic televangelists giving their viewers dates for the impending apocalypse, providing special "anointed" healings, and convulsing like an epileptic on the ground and shouting "O sheeba ba ba ba ba losa," it all tends to leave a lasting impression upon rational minds. That being said, just because there a plethora of fakes, doesn't mean that spiritual gifts are non-existent. Also, 1Corinthians 13:8-10 makes it clear that, " . . .For we know in part and we prophesy in part, but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears." It is apparent Paul is saying spiritual gifts will remain with believers until the 'Second Coming' of Christ . Can we then argue against Scripture? And yes, there are so many spiritual gifts not listed in 1Corinthians 12. Speaking in tongues is not the "be all, end all" of spiritual gifts; I could not agree more. Thanks for the reply.

 

[NiceneCreed]

The amount of frauds claiming to possess spiritual gifts is alarming and sickening! These frauds obviously exploit naïve (and usually elderly) people into giving away their savings, under the guise of being a prophet of God who offers "special anointing," prophecy, and salvation through tongues. There is obviously no such thing as "special anointing," as if my being saved by Christ were not special enough; now I need "special" anointing oil. Additionally, while people can and do really prophecy, it is different from being an actual prophet. I do not believe there are any more prophets, as the canon is complete. If you are going to prophecy, that is one thing. If you are claiming to be a prophet, that entirely different altogether. Lastly, speaking in tongues is not a requirement for salvation. I cannot count the number of times I have been told I am going to hell for not speaking in tongues. Also, if one is speaking gibberish and there is no one to interpret what they are saying, for what purpose are they speaking the gibberish in the first place? Surely it isn't for edification of the church.

Jesus did warn there would be false prophets who would try to lead His sheep away. This is just one of the signs we are told to watch for. However, it should be noted it is made clear in 1Corinthians 13:8-10 that, spiritual gifts will remain with believers until the second coming of Christ.


Conclusion: We are to believe spiritual gifts still exist. Yet we should be cautious in believing anyone who asks for our money or blind obedience (such as cults), simply because they seemingly display the spiritual gifts God promised He will give us through the Holy Spirit.

 

[NiceneCreed]

I am certain you strongly believe 'Cessationism' to be biblical; however, what of 1Corinthians 13:8-10? It seems to me that Paul is making reference to the 'Second Coming.' Can we then conclude believers will have access to spiritual gifts until Christ's return? Do you believe the Holy Spirit is still among believers? If you do, can you explain what purpose it serves, if any? Why would the Holy Spirit be useful for other things, but not spiritual gifts any longer? What is the biblical evidence you claim supports the position of 'Cessationism'?


Thank you for taking interest in this topic. Grace and Peace!

 

[NiceneCreed]

Just because one does not have a spiritual gift, that doesn't make cessationism true or biblical. Either spiritual gifts are still used or they are not. There is insufficient evidence to make the claim cessationism is biblical for an individual who does not have spiritual gifts. One individual may have intelligence, whereas another individual may not; does that mean there is no such thing as intelligence?


Grace and Peace!

 

[NiceneCreed]

Thanks for your reply. I hope you had the time to read the article I wrote pertaining to cessationism and continuationism.

Grace and Peace!

 

[NiceneCreed]

Fantastic Point! We should not become focused on gifts to the point we forget where they came from in the first place; God. In all things we must be giving glory to God.

 

[TruthTalk]

Just because one does not have a spiritual gift, that doesn't make cessationism true or biblical. Either spiritual gifts are still used or they are not. There is insufficient evidence to make the claim cessationism is biblical for an individual who does not have spiritual gifts. One individual may have intelligence, whereas another individual may not; does that mean there is no such thing as intelligence?
Grace and Peace!

Hi NiceneCreed,

I am very eager to learn more on this topic of Cessationism vs. continuationism and the spiritual gifts. My first question to you on this topic is related to either side of this discussion and that is, are not all Christians given a least one or more spiritual gifts at the time of their salvation when they are born from above? My belief is that every Christian is given some form of spiritual gifts when they are born again. These gifts will become evident in the believers spiritual life for the building up of the Church as they mature in Christ. The bible does say, " All members do not have the same function and we have gifts that differ according to the grace given to us." Rom12:4-6 Seem logical to me that every part of the body of Christ would have some type of spiritual gift. But it is also possible that I am missing your point of view about God's gifts to the Church.

 

[zone]

I am certain you strongly believe 'Cessationism' to be biblical; however, what of 1Corinthians 13:8-10? It seems to me that Paul is making reference to the 'Second Coming.'

check the greek.
that which is perfect is not referring to Jesus, and is a stretch to make it the eternal state.
the context of the chapter is the partial and temporary nature of the gifts.
and the idea being that we all come to the unity of the faith.
this could only be accomplished in full with the full and finished (complete; perfect) revelation of the Will and Plan of God.

1 Corinthians 13:10
but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears. NIV

But when what is complete comes, then what is incomplete will be done away with. ISV


Cessationism - Cessationist - Spiritual Gifts - The Ultimate Cessationism Resource < click

 

[zone]

You raised a great point; most tongues/prophecies are fake these days.

how can you tell?

 

[zone]

The amount of frauds claiming to possess spiritual gifts is alarming and sickening! These frauds obviously exploit naïve (and usually elderly) people into giving away their savings, under the guise of being a prophet of God who offers "special anointing," prophecy, and salvation through tongues. There is obviously no such thing as "special anointing," as if my being saved by Christ were not special enough; now I need "special" anointing oil. Additionally, while people can and do really prophecy, it is different from being an actual prophet. I do not believe there are any more prophets, as the canon is complete. If you are going to prophecy, that is one thing. If you are claiming to be a prophet, that entirely different altogether. Lastly, speaking in tongues is not a requirement for salvation. I cannot count the number of times I have been told I am going to hell for not speaking in tongues. Also, if one is speaking gibberish and there is no one to interpret what they are saying, for what purpose are they speaking the gibberish in the first place? Surely it isn't for edification of the church.

Jesus did warn there would be false prophets who would try to lead His sheep away. This is just one of the signs we are told to watch for. However, it should be noted it is made clear in 1Corinthians 13:8-10 that, spiritual gifts will remain with believers until the second coming of Christ.

not it is not that clear.
its a presupposition.

 

[SarahM777]

Jesus did warn there would be false prophets who would try to lead His sheep away. This is just one of the signs we are told to watch for. However, it should be noted it is made clear in 1Corinthians 13:8-10 that, spiritual gifts will remain with believers until the second coming of Christ.


Conclusion: We are to believe spiritual gifts still exist. Yet we should be cautious in believing anyone who asks for our money or blind obedience (such as cults), simply because they seemingly display the spiritual gifts God promised He will give us through the Holy Spirit.

Sorry but Paul is very clear that the sign gifts will end BEFORE Jesus comes back

1 Corinthians 13

8 Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. 9 For we know in part and we prophesy in part, 10 but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears. 11 When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put the ways of childhood behind me. 12 For now we see only a reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.
13 And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.

Where in there does Paul say prophecies,tongues or knowledge remains? Even faith and hope will end,there will be no need for either once Jesus returns,because the hope that we have will be complete AT THAT TIME. So how does one get that the sign gifts will continue on till Jesus returns when Paul is very clear that all that remains is faith,hope and love?

 

[GreenNnice]

Sorry but Paul is very clear that the sign gifts will end BEFORE Jesus comes back

1 Corinthians 13

8 Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. 9 For we know in part and we prophesy in part, 10 but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears. 11 When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put the ways of childhood behind me. 12 For now we see only a reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.
13 And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.

Where in there does Paul say prophecies,tongues or knowledge remains? Even faith and hope will end,there will be no need for either once Jesus returns,because the hope that we have will be complete AT THAT TIME. So how does one get that the sign gifts will continue on till Jesus returns when Paul is very clear that all that remains is faith,hope and love?

"They" will end, this is correct, they will not remain but they are contained in power, in word, in deed, and, in the Word until Jesus comes again, until we WILL see Him face to face. We see only a reflection now, we have faith, hope, and, love, but, since this is so controversial a topic, Paul wants us to keep in mind that judgment, and , certainly, condemnation are NOT to be done by us,as we understand that the most important of all with us now is love, which is love of Him first, wholly Loving Him, who first Loved us, and, then, loving others as ourself, second.

We have faith and hope in Him, that is what we have, and, they are abstract concepts, yet, made concrete by Him in our eyes as we follow Him in our lives. But, love, that is just something concrete that we are to do, and, can see and show others, after having FIRST shown God that greatest of all things in the universe.

Spiritual gifts are not something to brag about, not some things that make one more special than another, and, those who RECEIVE, that is, truly receive a gift to use as God will show, KNOW this truth Gifts are for ONE purpose only by us, NOT our pleasure, not our will, but His will and His good pleasure, just as 1 Cor. 12:11 states, 'as He determines.'


So, that is what I do here, I give my opinion and I Love you all

 

[SarahM777]

"They" will end, this is correct, they will not remain but they are contained in power, in word, in deed, and, in the Word until Jesus comes again, until we WILL see Him face to face. We see only a reflection now, we have faith, hope, and, love, but, since this is so controversial a topic, Paul wants us to keep in mind that judgment, and , certainly, condemnation are NOT to be done by us,as we understand that the most important of all with us now is love, which is love of Him first, wholly Loving Him, who first Loved us, and, then, loving others as ourself, second.

We have faith and hope in Him, that is what we have, and, they are abstract concepts, yet, made concrete by Him in our eyes as we follow Him in our lives. But, love, that is just something concrete that we are to do, and, can see and show others, after having FIRST shown God that greatest of all things in the universe.

Spiritual gifts are not something to brag about, not some things that make one more special than another, and, those who RECEIVE, that is, truly receive a gift to use as God will show, KNOW this truth Gifts are for ONE purpose only by us, NOT our pleasure, not our will, but His will and His good pleasure, just as 1 Cor. 12:11 states, 'as He determines.'


So, that is what I do here, I give my opinion and I Love you all

We are told to TEST THE SPIRITS. Not every spirit is from the Lord. Satan himself can transform himself into an angel of light. Big difference between testing these things and condemnation. Please explain how you test the spirit that is speaking through you to know if that spirit is truly from the Lord. The Lord is clear we are to do that so how do you do test that spirit before you even open your mouth to allow that spirit to speak through you.

To try and make I Corinthians make into some future date from OUR perspective can lead us into a very bad place. He is telling the Corinthians that at THAT time all that remains is faith,hope and love. Perhaps the reason he wrote it that way is to give us a clue as to whether or not at a future date if these things do appear again we have a test to line it up with scripture.