Dan. 9

Bookends · Jun 18, 2017

[FONT=&quot]“Seventy weeks[a] are determined[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]For your people and for your holy city,[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]To finish the transgression,[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]To make an end of[b] sins,[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]To make reconciliation for iniquity,[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]To bring in everlasting righteousness,[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]To seal up vision and prophecy,[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]And to anoint the Most Holy.

We can all agree these six things are fulfilled in the 70th week:

1. To finish the transgression- Paul says:

Colossians 2:13 "[/FONT]13 [FONT=&quot]And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having [/FONT][FONT=&quot]forgiven you all trespasses[/FONT][FONT=&quot],

1 Thessalonians 2 14-16 "[/FONT][FONT=&quot]14 For you, brethren, became imitators of the churches of God which are in Judea in Christ Jesus. For you also suffered the same things from your own countrymen, just as they did from the Judeans, [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT][FONT=&quot]15 who killed both the Lord Jesus and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they do not please God and are contrary to all men, [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT][FONT=&quot]16 forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they may be saved, [/FONT][FONT=&quot]so as always to fill up the measure of their sins;[/FONT][FONT=&quot] but wrath has come upon them to the uttermost.

{The transgressions of the Jewish nation was filled up, killing Jesus and their unbelief was the tipping point, thus they could no long add to it, they were finished adding to it. No more sins could be added to provoke God to act His final judgment upon them}

The author of Hebrews says;

Hebrews 9:15 "[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT][FONT=&quot]15 And for this reason He is the Mediator of the new covenant, by means of death, [/FONT][FONT=&quot]for the redemption of the transgressions under the first covenant[/FONT][FONT=&quot], that those who are called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance.

{Not only did the Jews fill up the cup of wrath of God, but also God provided once and for all a way to receive redemption of the sins from the 1st covenant (physical Israel as God's people/economy). There is by no other means to receive forgiveness for Israel's (the people) past sins but through the work of Jesus on the Cross}

Jesus said in Matthew 23:29-32 "[/FONT][FONT=&quot]29 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! Because you build the tombs of the prophets and adorn the monuments of the righteous, [/FONT][FONT=&quot]30 and say, ‘If we had lived in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.’[/FONT][FONT=&quot]31 “Therefore you are witnesses against yourselves that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets. 32 Fill up, then, the measure of your fathers’ guilt.

{Jesus is telling the Jewish rulers to FILL UP, the measure of their father's sin - how? by committing one more murder, putting their true King on the cross}

2. To make an end of sins;

John the Baptist says in John 1:29 "29 The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him, and said, “Behold! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!

{If your in Christ, it's as if all your sins have been taken away past, present and future. God has forgotten them as far as the east is from the west. He has put an end to your sin.}

Paul says in Romans 5:20-21 "20 Moreover the law entered that the offense might abound. But where sin abounded, grace abounded much more, 21 so that as sin reigned in death, even so grace might reign through righteousness to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

{Where death reigned once because of sin, Eternal life reigns now through the grace God has showed by allowing His son to be the only one perfect sacrifice}

Romans 6:14 Paul says "14 For sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under law but under grace.

The author of Hebrews quotes Jeremiah 31:33-34 says, making the point that Christ's death perfects the sanctified (Hebrews 10:17-18) " 17 then He adds, “Their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more.” [FONT=&quot][/FONT][FONT=&quot]18 Now where there is remission of these, there is no longer an offering for sin.

{Sounds like to me that Christ put an end to sins}

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]3. To make reconciliation for iniquity;

Paul says in 1 Corinthians 5:19 "[/FONT]19 that is, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not imputing their trespasses to them, and has committed to us the word of reconciliation.

{and}

Romans 5:11 " 11 And not only that, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received the reconciliation.

4. To bring in everlasting righteousness;

Paul says to the Corinthians (1 Cor. 1:30) "30 But of Him you are in Christ Jesus, who became for us wisdom from God—and righteousness and sanctification and redemption

{And}

Romans 3:21-22 "21 But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, 22 even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all[h] who believe.

5. To seal up vision and prophecy;

Jesus says in Luke 24:44 "44 Then He said to them, “These are the words which I spoke to you while I was still with you, that all things must be fulfilled which were written in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms concerning Me.”

{and}

Luke 21:21-23 "21 Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let those who are in the midst of her depart, and let not those who are in the country enter her. 22 For these are the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. 23 But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! For there will be great distress in the land and wrath upon this people.

{also)

In 2 Corinthians paul says (2 Cor. 1:20) "20 For all the promises of God in Him are Yes, and in Him Amen, to the glory of God through us.

{What promises? ALL promises, must include promises made to Abraham}

6. And to anoint the Most Holy;

The author of Hebrews says (Hebrews 4:21-24) "21 Then likewise he sprinkled with blood both the tabernacle and all the vessels of the ministry. 22 And according to the law almost all things are purified with blood, and without shedding of blood there is no remission.[/FONT]
[h=3]Greatness of Christ’s Sacrifice[/h][FONT=&quot]23 Therefore it was necessary that the copies of the things in the heavens should be purified with these, but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. 24 For Christ has not entered the holy places made with hands, which are copies of the true, but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us;

{Christ entered the true Most Holy place and anoint it with His blood, which fulfilled what the earthly copy projected with the priesthood of Aaron and the earthly temple.}

It really baffles me how anyone could say the 70th week of Daniel has not been fulfilled. Paul, Jesus, John and the Hebrew author says they have!!! To inject and gap period between the 69th and 70th week is man projecting his own interpretation to make his end-time eschatological system work. These first six things are said to be completed in the 70th week as Daniel stated, therefore all the other things have to be fulfilled as well. Perhaps the destruction of the city was not included in the 70 weeks (although the decree was made by Jesus), however, it was direct consequence which followed after and directly related to the prophecy.[/FONT]

dcontroversal · Jun 18, 2017

Rainrider said:

AMEN and I agree........excellent approach....

Rainrider · Jun 18, 2017

Bookends said:

“Seventy weeks[a] are determined
For your people and for your holy city,
To finish the transgression,
To make an end of[b] sins,
To make reconciliation for iniquity,
To bring in everlasting righteousness,
To seal up vision and prophecy,
And to anoint the Most Holy.

We can all agree these six things are fulfilled in the 70th week:

1. To finish the transgression- Paul says:

Colossians 2:13 "13 And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses,

1 Thessalonians 2 14-16 "14 For you, brethren, became imitators of the churches of God which are in Judea in Christ Jesus. For you also suffered the same things from your own countrymen, just as they did from the Judeans, 15 who killed both the Lord Jesus and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they do not please God and are contrary to all men, 16 forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they may be saved, so as always to fill up the measure of their sins; but wrath has come upon them to the uttermost.

{The transgressions of the Jewish nation was filled up, killing Jesus and their unbelief was the tipping point, thus they could no long add to it, they were finished adding to it. No more sins could be added to provoke God to act His final judgment upon them}

The author of Hebrews says;

Hebrews 9:15 "15 And for this reason He is the Mediator of the new covenant, by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions under the first covenant, that those who are called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance.

{Not only did the Jews fill up the cup of wrath of God, but also God provided once and for all a way to receive redemption of the sins from the 1st covenant (physical Israel as God's people/economy). There is by no other means to receive forgiveness for Israel's (the people) past sins but through the work of Jesus on the Cross}

Jesus said in Matthew 23:29-32 "29 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! Because you build the tombs of the prophets and adorn the monuments of the righteous, 30 and say, ‘If we had lived in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.’31 “Therefore you are witnesses against yourselves that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets. 32Fill up, then, the measure of your fathers’ guilt.

{Jesus is telling the Jewish rulers to FILL UP, the measure of their father's sin - how? by committing one more murder, putting their true King on the cross}

2. To make an end of sins;

John the Baptist says in John 1:29 "29 The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him, and said, “Behold! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!

{If your in Christ, it's as if all your sins have been taken away past, present and future. God has forgotten them as far as the east is from the west. He has put an end to your sin.}

Paul says in Romans 5:20-21 "20 Moreover the law entered that the offense might abound. But where sin abounded, grace abounded much more, 21 so that as sin reigned in death, even so grace might reign through righteousness to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

{Where death reigned once because of sin, Eternal life reigns now through the grace God has showed by allowing His son to be the only one perfect sacrifice}

Romans 6:14 Paul says "14For sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under law but under grace.

The author of Hebrews quotes Jeremiah 31:33-34 says, making the point that Christ's death perfects the sanctified (Hebrews 10:17-18) "17 then He adds, “Their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more.” 18 Now where there is remission of these, there is no longer an offering for sin.

{Sounds like to me that Christ put an end to sins}

3. To make reconciliation for iniquity;

Paul says in 1 Corinthians 5:19 "19 that is, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not imputing their trespasses to them, and has committed to us the word of reconciliation.

{and}

Romans 5:11 "11 And not only that, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received the reconciliation.

4. To bring in everlasting righteousness;

Paul says to the Corinthians (1 Cor. 1:30) "30 But of Him you are in Christ Jesus, who became for us wisdom from God—and righteousness and sanctification and redemption

{And}

Romans 3:21-22 "21 But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, 22even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all[h] who believe.

5. To seal up vision and prophecy;

Jesus says in Luke 24:44 "44 Then He said to them, “These are the words which I spoke to you while I was still with you, that all things must be fulfilled which were written in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms concerning Me.”

{and}

Luke 21:21-23 "21 Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let those who are in the midst of her depart, and let not those who are in the country enter her. 22 For these are the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. 23 But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! For there will be great distress in the land and wrath upon this people.

{also)

In 2 Corinthians paul says (2 Cor. 1:20) "20 For all the promises of God in Him are Yes, and in Him Amen, to the glory of God through us.

{What promises? ALL promises, must include promises made to Abraham}

6. And to anoint the Most Holy;

The author of Hebrews says (Hebrews 4:21-24) "21Then likewise he sprinkled with blood both the tabernacle and all the vessels of the ministry. 22 And according to the law almost all things are purified with blood, and without shedding of blood there is no remission.
Greatness of Christ’s Sacrifice

23 Therefore it was necessary that the copies of the things in the heavens should be purified with these, but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. 24 For Christ has not entered the holy places made with hands, which are copies of the true, but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us;

{Christ entered the true Most Holy place and anoint it with His blood, which fulfilled what the earthly copy projected with the priesthood of Aaron and the earthly temple.}

It really baffles me how anyone could say the 70th week of Daniel has not been fulfilled. Paul, Jesus, John and the Hebrew author says they have!!! To inject and gap period between the 69th and 70th week is man projecting his own interpretation to make his end-time eschatological system work. These first six things are said to be completed in the 70th week as Daniel stated, therefore all the other things have to be fulfilled as well. Perhaps the destruction of the city was not included in the 70 weeks (although the decree was made by Jesus), however, it was direct consequence which followed after and directly related to the prophecy.

May I ask, if the 70th week has been fulfilled, then when we read in rev. a book written in or around AD75, do we find the following.
Rev 12:6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where God had prepared a place to care for her for 1,260 days.

Does this not give us the last 3 1/2 years of the Tribulation? I came to that understanding when I looked back and seen that Yeshua tooled us to flee into the mountains.
Mat 24:15 “The day is coming when you will see what Daniel the prophet spoke about—the sacrilegious object that causes desecration[fn] standing in the Holy Place.” (Reader, pay attention!)
Mat 24:16 “Then those in Judea must flee to the hills.

Now my mom would say that was talking off when Rome sacked Jerusalem. That how doesn't add up, as Rev. was written some 5 years later. SO what I am seeing here?

jb · Jun 18, 2017

Rainrider said:

Probably just PM'ing me would be best...

Yahweh Shalom...

samuel23 · Jun 18, 2017

Rainrider said:

Your Mom was correct, it is an historic fact. On the other hand, there are some of those things that will probably happen at the end of the age. Here is a little something that may help, Jesus told the people in that generation that saw the end of Judea and the destruction of the Temple to flee for their lives. However Jesus told the same folks that at the time of His return to rapture the church that they were not to flee or go anywhere, just stand their ground in faith because Jesus would send the angels to find them where ever they were.

Rainrider · Jun 18, 2017

samuel23 said:

Your Mom was correct, it is an historic fact. On the other hand, there are some of those things that will probably happen at the end of the age. Here is a little something that may help, Jesus told the people in that generation that saw the end of Judea and the destruction of the Temple to flee for their lives. However Jesus told the same folks that at the time of His return to rapture the church that they were not to flee or go anywhere, just stand their ground in faith because Jesus would send the angels to find them where ever they were.

I will look that up, thanks.

Bladerunner · Jun 18, 2017

Rainrider said:

I saw this the other day.... It is unknown who actually set the fire... there is speculation some of the Jewish priest set the Fire.... I am sure that Titus wanted the temple saved and his order for saving the temple could very well been given.

There is a lot discussion on this with the scholars. However, in Matthew 24:2 "And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, , There shall not be left here one stone upon another that shall not be thrown down."

Here is a prophecy by Jesus Christ himself and it came true. Who set the fire becomes mute because the 'why' would it have been set becomes the question to be answered. One answer is simple because setting the fire would set the stage for the above prophecy of 38 years... You see the walls were lined with Gold plate. the fire was hot enough to run the gold through he floors. This is why the stones were separated from one another..to get the gold. Prophecy levels still at 100%....

I suspect that the priest set the fire in order to keep the gold and temple tools (all made of gold) away from the Romans. It does appear the temple was set early in the siege which did not give the Romans any time to put it out.

The 'Abomination of Desolate' that everyone tries to place in this time period simply did not happen... It is still future.

Blade

Bladerunner · Jun 19, 2017

Rainrider....So what we have to date is that we know all the items in Dan 9:24 have not happened yet (we can compare this later with REV) so everything from our date today is still future. Right?

The 7 weeks of years (49) that it took to rebuild the 2nd temple and Jerusalem. was completed as prophesied

The end of the 7 weeks of years plus the 62 weeks of years 490 years (173,880 days 360 lunar calendar days) we find that the Prophecy was exactly the date that Jesus rode into Jerusalem on a Donkey. Now there are other prophecies that tell the people that the Messiah will ride into the city on a donkey. (another discussion).

Dan 9:26.."26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined."

NOW..in Daniel 9:26...the first words are "And after threescore and two weeks". Rem the 62 weeks came after the 7weeks for the rebuilding. So we find ourselves after April 6th, 32 AD.

The next group of words tells us "shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself:". Notice the "SHALL" is not maybe,, is not could be but Shall --Will happen. The Messiah will WHAT????? "be cut off" = Killed. What did he die for----- "not for himself" but rather for our sins. Of Course, the Messiah arriving on April 6th, 32 AD was Jesus Christ.

The next group of words is where everybody gets all messed up."and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary;"

Who are the people of the prince...Prince who..... General Titus became a prince of Rome (his father became emperor) while he was surrounding the city of Jerusalem with four legions (V, X, XII and XV) in 68AD getting ready to carry out his orders as the General in charge... As you have mentioned, Josephus has a good account of the time period.

Having said that we got to know who are the people of the prince (Titus). Well you mostly answered it in you questions.. This area was the eastern leg of the Roman Army. While they had Roman Officers, the ordinary soldier wasusually those men who lived in the area the army was in. They enlisted for twenty years in return for Roman citizenship. These are the people of the prince (Titus) who destroy the city and sanctuary. The Bible tells us the antichrist will be an Assyrian (Syria). (Micah 5), I leave that to each to find out the truth. For more reading in this area there is " Joel Richardson’s book “The Islamic Antichrist”"

Being in Jerusalem was some distance away from Rome. In those day, everything was sent by courier so it took a while for news to travel, not so today. When Titus heard about his father, he left for the Roman capital (considered in the western leg of the Roman Empire) and left the Roman army camped out around Jerusalem with orders to do nothing until his return. They were just to sit there and do nothing. This took approx. by some figures 18 months for his return. One can go back to Nero in 66-68AD and read the story lines there.

In Luke 21:22-23.."20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. 21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter there into."

Jesus written by Luke is speaking in the temple to the people who believe in him. In verse 22, he warns them to leave when they see the armies around the city. This they do. For some 18 months they have time to flee the city itself without any harm coming from the Roman army thanks to Titus' commands. It is said that no Christians (true believers) died in the destruction of Jerusalem and the temple because of this Prophecy, yet over 1 million Jews (unbelievers) died from the direct action of the Roman Army and another 1/2 million is projected to have died from the pestilence, starvation, etc. that follows any war.

Notice that In Luke Jesus tells his believers (in the temple) to flee to the mountains, those in Jerusalem to depart out (no hurry here) and those out in the other parts of the country --Not to come to Jerusalem.

While Luke's account is different than that of Matthew and Mark's account, Mark's gospel is almost the same as Matthew's gospel which I will finish this post with.

Mat 24 15,20..."15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readth, let him understand16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:"

Do you see the difference? Here in Matthew, Jesus is giving a prophecy warning for the Jewish believers to flee Jerusalem when they WHAT???? SEE him stand in the Holy of Holies and they (believers) had better hope they get out fast enough. If one looks at Rev 12, one finds there is good reason for this warning. Satan has been thrown out of Heaven, He knows that He(Satan) has little time to accomplish his goals and comes after the people he has been trying to destroy for 6000 years. The very remnant of Israel!

Thus the rest of the prophecy in Dan 9:26"......The end will come with a flood, and war and its miseries are decreed from that time to the very end." pertains to this very chapter in REV 12:15,17 "And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.16 And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ."

Notice that everything fits so nicely and I did not have to resort to symbolism, change my hermeneutics or disregard the grammatical ways Dan 9:26 was written.

Who were the Beloved Prophets of God.(only two)?..... Daniel in the OT and John in the NT... These are the only prophets that have seen apocalypses shown to them by God himself. If you have not guessed it by now, Daniel in the OT and Revelation in the NT go hand in hand.

RainRider,,,, again it is late so I will try to get the final verse in print tomorrow evening.... Sorry for the wait.

Blade

Bladerunner · Jun 19, 2017

Rainrider said:

Let me try and answer this problem for you...... first the 70th week has not been fulfilled YET! It has not started YET! as some Mid -Tribers and Post-Tribers will tell you.

Revelation was written in 94-95 AD by John of .Patmos who was a prisoner at the time of

In Rev 12:6, the Woman, Jewish Believers flee to the mountains and God does care for them for 1260 days... Yes, you are right it is the beginning of the last 3 1/2 years of the tribulations known as the Great Tribulations.

"SO what I am seeing here?"...What you are seeing are preterist, replacement theology, the emerging Church theology at its best. They want to remove Israel from God's plan and place them where they want them..Do you know someone else who wants to do that?????.. The Roman Catholic Church has the same eschatology as these do and no matter what anyone says otherwise, they try to answer by confusing the verses by using verses throughout the Bible that could pertain to this time period but do not. These are false teachings and eschatologies.

Having said that,,,, I ask that you not believe a thing that Bladerunner says about Daniel 9:24,27 but rather use Acts 17,11 and find out for yourself. See my signature.

Rainrider · Jun 19, 2017

Bladerunner said:

Rainrider....So what we have to date is that we know all the items in Dan 9:24 have not happened yet (we can compare this later with REV) so everything from our date today is still future. Right?

The 7 weeks of years (49) that it took to rebuild the 2nd temple and Jerusalem. was completed as prophesied

The end of the 7 weeks of years plus the 62 weeks of years 490 years (173,880 days 360 lunar calendar days) we find that the Prophecy was exactly the date that Jesus rode into Jerusalem on a Donkey. Now there are other prophecies that tell the people that the Messiah will ride into the city on a donkey. (another discussion).

Dan 9:26.."26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined."

NOW..in Daniel 9:26...the first words are "And after threescore and two weeks". Rem the 62 weeks came after the 7weeks for the rebuilding. So we find ourselves after April 6th, 32 AD.

The next group of words tells us "shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself:". Notice the "SHALL" is not maybe,, is not could be but Shall --Will happen. The Messiah will WHAT????? "be cut off" = Killed. What did he die for----- "not for himself" but rather for our sins. Of Course, the Messiah arriving on April 6th, 32 AD was Jesus Christ.

The next group of words is where everybody gets all messed up."and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary;"

Who are the people of the prince...Prince who..... General Titus became a prince of Rome (his father became emperor) while he was surrounding the city of Jerusalem with four legions (V, X, XII and XV) in 68AD getting ready to carry out his orders as the General in charge... As you have mentioned, Josephus has a good account of the time period.

Having said that we got to know who are the people of the prince (Titus). Well you mostly answered it in you questions.. This area was the eastern leg of the Roman Army. While they had Roman Officers, the ordinary soldier wasusually those men who lived in the area the army was in. They enlisted for twenty years in return for Roman citizenship. These are the people of the prince (Titus) who destroy the city and sanctuary. The Bible tells us the antichrist will be an Assyrian (Syria). (Micah 5), I leave that to each to find out the truth. For more reading in this area there is " Joel Richardson’s book “The Islamic Antichrist”"

Being in Jerusalem was some distance away from Rome. In those day, everything was sent by courier so it took a while for news to travel, not so today. When Titus heard about his father, he left for the Roman capital (considered in the western leg of the Roman Empire) and left the Roman army camped out around Jerusalem with orders to do nothing until his return. They were just to sit there and do nothing. This took approx. by some figures 18 months for his return. One can go back to Nero in 66-68AD and read the story lines there.

In Luke 21:22-23.."20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. 21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter there into."

Jesus written by Luke is speaking in the temple to the people who believe in him. In verse 22, he warns them to leave when they see the armies around the city. This they do. For some 18 months they have time to flee the city itself without any harm coming from the Roman army thanks to Titus' commands. It is said that no Christians (true believers) died in the destruction of Jerusalem and the temple because of this Prophecy, yet over 1 million Jews (unbelievers) died from the direct action of the Roman Army and another 1/2 million is projected to have died from the pestilence, starvation, etc. that follows any war.

Notice that In Luke Jesus tells his believers (in the temple) to flee to the mountains, those in Jerusalem to depart out (no hurry here) and those out in the other parts of the country --Not to come to Jerusalem.

While Luke's account is different than that of Matthew and Mark's account, Mark's gospel is almost the same as Matthew's gospel which I will finish this post with.

Mat 24 15,20..."15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readth, let him understand16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:"

Do you see the difference? Here in Matthew, Jesus is giving a prophecy warning for the Jewish believers to flee Jerusalem when they WHAT???? SEE him stand in the Holy of Holies and they (believers) had better hope they get out fast enough. If one looks at Rev 12, one finds there is good reason for this warning. Satan has been thrown out of Heaven, He knows that He(Satan) has little time to accomplish his goals and comes after the people he has been trying to destroy for 6000 years. The very remnant of Israel!

Thus the rest of the prophecy in Dan 9:26"......The end will come with a flood, and war and its miseries are decreed from that time to the very end." pertains to this very chapter in REV 12:15,17 "And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.16 And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ."

Notice that everything fits so nicely and I did not have to resort to symbolism, change my hermeneutics or disregard the grammatical ways Dan 9:26 was written.

Who were the Beloved Prophets of God.(only two)?..... Daniel in the OT and John in the NT... These are the only prophets that have seen apocalypses shown to them by God himself. If you have not guessed it by now, Daniel in the OT and Revelation in the NT go hand in hand.

RainRider,,,, again it is late so I will try to get the final verse in print tomorrow evening.... Sorry for the wait.

Blade

I am nothing if not patient. Never a good hunter that wasn't. Besides, all good things come to thous who wait. As it is I am getting a much clearer idea of how I misunderstood a lot of this. Thank you ever so much.
I will have more question however. I am going to hold off, as it seems they may be answered.

Bookends · Jun 19, 2017

Rainrider said:

The book of Revelation I believe to be to written just before 66AD, before the destruction of apostate Jerusalem. I believe Revelation was given to John for the events that literally were "to shortly take place."

As far as Rev 12:6, This in part is a recap of Christ's birth. The woman is God's people, the reference to the moon, sun and 12 stars are a reference to earthly Israel (Joseph's dream). Christ is born, He died and was raised for our benefit and ascended to His Throne in heaven. The Woman (His Children, His followers, Those in HIM) fled into the wilderness as God's wrath descended down to destroy His apostate wife (earthly Jerusalem) by Old Testament law.

In Matthew 24, Jesus was talking about the destruction of the earthly temple, and literally told His followers to leave when they see the Armies of Rome coming (Luke's account of the Olivet Discourse). I believe most of Matthew 24 to be about those living in that time (1st century) and not ours. Tell me, why does Jesus tell them when it's time to flee to come off their rooftops? Do people live on their rooftops today? Why should they hope that the day to flee isn't on a Sabbath? Could it be because the gates of Jerusalem where closed on a Sabbath preventing the Church to flee? Think about it!

eternally-gratefull · Jun 19, 2017

The thing to remember about daniel 9 is the context. It was an answer to Daniels prayer

What was daniel praying for? His People. His city, and his country

What was the context. Jeremiahs 70 year prophesy concerning the land.

Daniel knew it was at the end of the 70 years. Yet his people were still in sin, They still had not yet repented. SO what was the prophet daniel doing? What any prophet should do.. Pray for his people.

1. The reason for daniels prayer;

Dan 9:
[SUP]3 [/SUP]Then I set my face toward the Lord God to make request by prayer and supplications, with fasting, sackcloth, and ashes.

2. The context and content of daniels prayer.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]And I prayed to the Lord my God, and made confession, and said, “O Lord, great and awesome God, who keeps His covenant and mercy with those who love Him, and with those who keep His commandments, [SUP]5 [/SUP]we have sinned and committed iniquity, we have done wickedly and rebelled, even by departing from Your precepts and Your judgments. [SUP]6 [/SUP]Neither have we heeded Your servants the prophets, who spoke in Your name to our kings and our princes, to our fathers and all the people of the land. [SUP]7 [/SUP]O Lord, righteousness belongs to You, but to us shame of face, as it is this day—to the men of Judah, to the inhabitants of Jerusalem and all Israel, those near and those far off in all the countries to which You have driven them, because of the unfaithfulness which they have committed against You.

[SUP]8 [/SUP]“O Lord, to us belongs shame of face, to our kings, our princes, and our fathers, because we have sinned against You. [SUP]9 [/SUP]To the Lord our God belong mercy and forgiveness, though we have rebelled against Him. [SUP]10 [/SUP]We have not obeyed the voice of the Lord our God, to walk in His laws, which He set before us by His servants the prophets. [SUP]11 [/SUP]Yes, all Israel has transgressed Your law, and has departed so as not to obey Your voice;

3. He confesses that they are where they are because of what God told them would happen in the law of moses. That God confirmed his words and did what he promised he would do should Israel rebel and turn from him.

therefore the curse and the oath written in the Law of Moses the servant of God have been poured out on us, because we have sinned against Him. [SUP]12 [/SUP]And He has confirmed His words, which He spoke against us and against our judges who judged us, by bringing upon us a great disaster; for under the whole heaven such has never been done as what has been done to Jerusalem.

[SUP]13 [/SUP]“As it is written in the Law of Moses, all this disaster has come upon us; yet we have not made our prayer before the Lord our God, that we might turn from our iniquities and understand Your truth. [SUP]14 [/SUP]Therefore the Lord has kept the disaster in mind, and brought it upon us; for the Lord our God is righteous in all the works which He does, though we have not obeyed His voice. [SUP]15 [/SUP]And now, O Lord our God, who brought Your people out of the land of Egypt with a mighty hand, and made Yourself a name, as it is this day—we have sinned, we have done wickedly!

4. He makes intercession, and asks God to shew mercy on HIS PEOPLE. HIS CITY, AND HIS LAND, to keep his word to never let them be utterly destroyed.

[SUP]16 [/SUP]“O Lord, according to all Your righteousness, I pray, let Your anger and Your fury be turned away from Your city Jerusalem, Your holy mountain; because for our sins, and for the iniquities of our fathers, Jerusalem and Your people are a reproach to all those around us. [SUP]17 [/SUP]Now therefore, our God, hear the prayer of Your servant, and his supplications, and for the Lord’s sake cause Your face to shine on Your sanctuary, which is desolate. [SUP]18 [/SUP]O my God, incline Your ear and hear; open Your eyes and see our desolations, and the city which is called by Your name; for we do not present our supplications before You because of our righteous deeds, but because of Your great mercies. [SUP]19 [/SUP]O Lord, hear! O Lord, forgive! O Lord, listen and act! Do not delay for Your own sake, my God, for Your city and Your people are called by Your name.”

Then we see Gods response to Daniels prayer. (I will touch on this in a bit)

So from the start, and in context, ANY interpretation which does not have Israel, the nation and the city of Jerusalem as the context, and resolution is taking Daniel 9 out of context.

Daniel 9 was not written about ANY gentile nation, Gentile kingdom, or Gentile person (we who are gentiles, this verse was not written for us, only for information, to once again, Prove God is the one and only true God who can tell the future, and the future happens exactly when, where and HOW he said it would..

Bookends · Jun 20, 2017

eternally-gratefull said:

The thing to remember about daniel 9 is the context. It was an answer to Daniels prayer

What was daniel praying for? His People. His city, and his country

What was the context. Jeremiahs 70 year prophesy concerning the land.

Daniel knew it was at the end of the 70 years. Yet his people were still in sin, They still had not yet repented. SO what was the prophet daniel doing? What any prophet should do.. Pray for his people.

1. The reason for daniels prayer;

Dan 9:
[SUP]3 [/SUP]Then I set my face toward the Lord God to make request by prayer and supplications, with fasting, sackcloth, and ashes.

2. The context and content of daniels prayer.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]And I prayed to the Lord my God, and made confession, and said, “O Lord, great and awesome God, who keeps His covenant and mercy with those who love Him, and with those who keep His commandments, [SUP]5 [/SUP]we have sinned and committed iniquity, we have done wickedly and rebelled, even by departing from Your precepts and Your judgments. [SUP]6 [/SUP]Neither have we heeded Your servants the prophets, who spoke in Your name to our kings and our princes, to our fathers and all the people of the land. [SUP]7 [/SUP]O Lord, righteousness belongs to You, but to us shame of face, as it is this day—to the men of Judah, to the inhabitants of Jerusalem and all Israel, those near and those far off in all the countries to which You have driven them, because of the unfaithfulness which they have committed against You.

[SUP]8 [/SUP]“O Lord, to us belongs shame of face, to our kings, our princes, and our fathers, because we have sinned against You. [SUP]9 [/SUP]To the Lord our God belong mercy and forgiveness, though we have rebelled against Him. [SUP]10 [/SUP]We have not obeyed the voice of the Lord our God, to walk in His laws, which He set before us by His servants the prophets. [SUP]11 [/SUP]Yes, all Israel has transgressed Your law, and has departed so as not to obey Your voice;

3. He confesses that they are where they are because of what God told them would happen in the law of moses. That God confirmed his words and did what he promised he would do should Israel rebel and turn from him.

therefore the curse and the oath written in the Law of Moses the servant of God have been poured out on us, because we have sinned against Him. [SUP]12 [/SUP]And He has confirmed His words, which He spoke against us and against our judges who judged us, by bringing upon us a great disaster; for under the whole heaven such has never been done as what has been done to Jerusalem.

[SUP]13 [/SUP]“As it is written in the Law of Moses, all this disaster has come upon us; yet we have not made our prayer before the Lord our God, that we might turn from our iniquities and understand Your truth. [SUP]14 [/SUP]Therefore the Lord has kept the disaster in mind, and brought it upon us; for the Lord our God is righteous in all the works which He does, though we have not obeyed His voice. [SUP]15 [/SUP]And now, O Lord our God, who brought Your people out of the land of Egypt with a mighty hand, and made Yourself a name, as it is this day—we have sinned, we have done wickedly!

4. He makes intercession, and asks God to shew mercy on HIS PEOPLE. HIS CITY, AND HIS LAND, to keep his word to never let them be utterly destroyed.

[SUP]16 [/SUP]“O Lord, according to all Your righteousness, I pray, let Your anger and Your fury be turned away from Your city Jerusalem, Your holy mountain; because for our sins, and for the iniquities of our fathers, Jerusalem and Your people are a reproach to all those around us. [SUP]17 [/SUP]Now therefore, our God, hear the prayer of Your servant, and his supplications, and for the Lord’s sake cause Your face to shine on Your sanctuary, which is desolate. [SUP]18 [/SUP]O my God, incline Your ear and hear; open Your eyes and see our desolations, and the city which is called by Your name; for we do not present our supplications before You because of our righteous deeds, but because of Your great mercies. [SUP]19 [/SUP]O Lord, hear! O Lord, forgive! O Lord, listen and act! Do not delay for Your own sake, my God, for Your city and Your people are called by Your name.”

Then we see Gods response to Daniels prayer. (I will touch on this in a bit)

So from the start, and in context, ANY interpretation which does not have Israel, the nation and the city of Jerusalem as the context, and resolution is taking Daniel 9 out of context.

Daniel 9 was not written about ANY gentile nation, Gentile kingdom, or Gentile person (we who are gentiles, this verse was not written for us, only for information, to once again, Prove God is the one and only true God who can tell the future, and the future happens exactly when, where and HOW he said it would..

I believe the 70 week prophecy was actually a continuation of God's Judgment. They never were in control of the land. They had frequent attacks with this time period. And Jesus' answer to the question of how many times should you forgive your brother, 7x70...God did say in Leviticus that if they did not repent that he would add to their punishment 7 times, They were in capitivity for 70 years, thus we have the 7x70.

Matthew 18:
[FONT=&quot]21 Then Peter came to Him and said, “Lord, how often shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? Up to seven times?”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]22 Jesus said to him, “I do not say to you, up to seven times, but up to seventy times seven.[/FONT]

NayborBear · Jun 20, 2017

Rainrider said:

You are thinking "outward", physical, Temple. Think inward Temple, sir!

Bladerunner · Jun 20, 2017

Rainrider....was going over what I had written and to my horror, a big mistake.....!!!

In the Daniel 9:26...I inadvertently placed the wrong interpretation for the last sentence where it should not have been. The interpretation was a summary for an earlier post.

Dan 9:26"......The end will come with a flood, and war and its miseries are decreed from that time to the very end."

The sentence in this case stands on its own merits. It requires no interpretation.

Blade

Bladerunner · Jun 21, 2017

Facts derived from Daniel 9: 24-26

The goals as stated in v24 have not been met in 2000 years.
The second temple and Jerusalem streets and wall were built within the 7 weeks of years. (49)
The 62 weeks of years plus the original 7 weeks (69 weeks) ended with the Messiah riding into jerusalem exactly on the day that was prophesied.
The temple was destroyed as Jesus prophesied to his disciples in Matthew 24, Mark 13, and Luke 21.
"the people of the prince, destroyed the city and the sanctuary" as was prophesied by Daniel nearly 300 years earlier (Septuagint XXL written around this time).

A fire destroyed the temple as stated in another post thereby stopping any attempt of performing an AoD.

Note: I have the details if needed but here is a summary of an attempt at the AoD prior to Nero. The message was sent to the commander who refused to do what the emperor requested. The Emperor sent word to kill the commander who refused. However , the Emperor DIED prior to the message being delivered.......DID God interfere here------I think SO!

Using some of the above facts and many others, An interim of an undetermined amount of time from week 69 and the 70th week. Thus Daniel 9:27 is in the future.

Daniel 9:27..."27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate."

Who is "he".. The definition of Antecedent (grammar) In grammar, an antecedent is an expression (word, phrase, clause, sentence, etc.) that gives its meaning to a proform (pronoun, pro-verb, pro-adverb, etc.). ... The noun her refers to and takes its meaning from Ava, so Ava is the antecedent of her.

There for "he" refers to the v26's "........the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary;...."

Now some try to place this as the Messiah but that would put him as the anti-christ role. The "prince that shall come" is one of the some 40+ designations for the Anti-Christ throughout the OT and NT.

"And he Shall confirm the covenant with many for one week"

Confirm (or enforce) a Covenant with many (Israel and Death/Hell) for 7 years. Look to Isaiah 28-15-18 for the covenant details.

The act alone starts the what is known as Daniels 70th week.

"and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease"here he (antichrist) stops the sacrifices, walks into the Holy of Holies and declares himself God....Quite a bit different then when Antiochus Epiphanes desecrated the entire temple and placed an idol of Zeus in the Holy of Holies.

The three and one half year (half of 7 years) begins the time period known and told to us by Jesus in Matthew 24 as the Great Tribulations. Here, Satan is thrown out of heaven, the Harlot will be killed by the 10 kings (The City (RCC city) will be destroy over night) and Satan overtakes the body of the antichrist (much like a demon would) until all goes wrong for them.. Prior to this time, If the antichrist body was overtaken it was by demons. It really does not say on this topic.

".......and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate."

There is an allusion in Daniel 9:27 to the AoD that happened in 167BC by Antiochus Epiphanes. But that is another story. The fact that "he" will cause the cessation of sacrifices and oblations tells us that the third temple will be rebuilt int eh future.

Jesus' tells his disciples in Mat 24 15-21 : 1. Daniel wrote the Daniel...(implied). 2. Daniel was a prophet and 3. The AoD that Daniel speaks of will happen in the future.

NO, the AoD did not happen in 70AD.

RainRider, you may ask any questions you have. I will not place restrictions on you.

I would suggest you read "The Coming Prince" By Sir Robert Anderson (.99Cents for kindle ebooks at amazon---Free apps).

J7 · Jun 21, 2017

The Holy Place is Jerusalem.

The Roman Standards were placed all over it. The standard included an image of the emperor who was worshipped as God. That was the "Emperor Cult" started by Caesar.

This is hotly undisputed amongst most serious scholars, so be aware that ideas like the temple not being destroyed because the Wailing Wall still exists are very contentious, which is a polite way of saying rubbish.

Luke says:
20 [FONT=&quot]“When you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then know that its desolation has come near.

[/FONT]No problems there. There were several legions sent by the way.

Matthew says:
15 [FONT=&quot]“So when you see the desolating sacrilege standing in the holy place, as was spoken of by the prophet Daniel (let the reader understand),

[/FONT]The Roman Armies were the desolating sacrilege. The Holy place is Jerusalem.

There should be no confusion about this.

Here.

[FONT=&quot]Psalm 2:6[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]“I have set my king on Zion, my holy hill.”
[FONT=&quot]Psalm 87:1[/FONT]
[ Psalm 87 ] [ The Joy of Living in Zion ] [ Of the Korahites. A Psalm. A Song. ] On the holy mount stands the city he founded;
[FONT=&quot]Isaiah 52:1[/FONT]
[ Let Zion Rejoice ] Awake, awake, put on your strength, O Zion! Put on your beautiful garments, O Jerusalem, the holy city; for the uncircumcised and the unclean shall enter you no more.

[/FONT]

J7 · Jun 21, 2017

From revelationrevolution:

The Roman ensigns were military standards similar to flags today. What is interesting about the Roman ensigns was that along with the eagle, a symbol of Rome, was often placed an image of the reigning emperor. These ensigns served as idols or objects of worship to the Roman military. In The Wars of the Jews, the Romans were said to have acted out their worship of the beast by offering sacrifices to Vespasian’s image on the ensigns.
This outward display of emperor worship was not uncommon in Rome. Emperor worship began in Rome as early as Julius Caesar, the first head of the beast. The first temples were erected for emperor worship during Augustus’ reign, the second head of the beast, and this practice continued throughout the reigns of each head of the leviathan. One example of empåeror worship is found in the writings of Dio Cassius. Here Tiridates, the king of Armenia, fell at the feet of Nero and is recorded saying, “I have come to thee, my god, to worship thee as I do Mithras.”

referenced from Suetonius Lives of the Twelve Caesars 3.48, 4.14; Tacitus The Histories 4.62,1.41.

So both Josephus and Suetonius confirm that the Roman Ensign, which was all over Jerusalem after Titus sacked the city, was an object of worship. Caesar had declared himself God incarnate, and subsequent Caesars were viewed as the supreme deity, Jupiter even.

miknik5 · Jun 21, 2017

Does anyone believe that the covenant mentioned in Daniel 9 has to do with allowing the rebuilding of the temple?

Bladerunner · Jun 21, 2017

Bookends said:

[FONT="]“Seventy weeks[[URL="https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Daniel+9&version=NKJV#fen-NKJV-22013a"]a[/URL]] are determined[/FONT]
[FONT="]For your people and for your holy city,[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#000000][FONT="]To finish the transgression,[/FONT]
[FONT="]To make an end of[[URL="https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Daniel+9&version=NKJV#fen-NKJV-22013b"]b[/URL]] sins,[/FONT]
[FONT="]To make reconciliation for iniquity,[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#000000][FONT="]To bring in everlasting righteousness,[/FONT]
[FONT="]To seal up vision and prophecy,[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#000000][FONT="]And to anoint the Most Holy.

We can all agree these six things are fulfilled in the 70th week:

1. To finish the transgression- Paul says:

Colossians 2:13 "[/FONT]13 [FONT="]And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having [/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#b22222][FONT="]forgiven you all trespasses[/FONT][FONT="],

1 Thessalonians 2 14-16 "[/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#000000][FONT="]14 For you, brethren, became imitators of the churches of God which are in Judea in Christ Jesus. For you also suffered the same things from your own countrymen, just as they did from the Judeans, [/FONT][FONT="][/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#000000][FONT="]15 who killed both the Lord Jesus and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they do not please God and are contrary to all men, [/FONT][FONT="][/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#000000][FONT="]16 forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they may be saved, [/FONT][FONT="]so as always to fill up [I]the measure of their sins;[/I][/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#000000][FONT="] but wrath has come upon them to the uttermost.

{The transgressions of the Jewish nation was filled up, killing Jesus and their unbelief was the tipping point, thus they could no long add to it, they were finished adding to it. No more sins could be added to provoke God to act His final judgment upon them}

The author of Hebrews says;

Hebrews 9:15 "[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#000000][FONT="][/FONT][FONT="][FONT=Arial][B]15 [/B][/FONT]And for this reason He is the Mediator of the new covenant, by means of death, [/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#b22222][FONT="]for the redemption of the transgressions under the first covenant[/FONT][FONT="], that those who are called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance.

{Not only did the Jews fill up the cup of wrath of God, but also God provided once and for all a way to receive redemption of the sins from the 1st covenant (physical Israel as God's people/economy). There is by no other means to receive forgiveness for Israel's (the people) past sins but through the work of Jesus on the Cross}

Jesus said in Matthew 23:29-32 "[/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#000000][FONT="]29 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! Because you build the tombs of the prophets and adorn the monuments of the righteous, [/FONT][FONT="][FONT=Arial][B]30 [/B][/FONT]and say, ‘If we had lived in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.’[/FONT][/COLOR][FONT="]31 “Therefore you are witnesses against yourselves that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets. 32 Fill up, then, the measure of your fathers’ guilt.

{Jesus is telling the Jewish rulers to FILL UP, the measure of their father's sin - how? by committing one more murder, putting their true King on the cross}

2. To make an end of sins;

John the Baptist says in John 1:29 "29 The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him, and said, “Behold! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!

{If your in Christ, it's as if all your sins have been taken away past, present and future. God has forgotten them as far as the east is from the west. He has put an end to your sin.}

Paul says in Romans 5:20-21 "20 Moreover the law entered that the offense might abound. But where sin abounded, grace abounded much more, 21 so that as sin reigned in death, even so grace might reign through righteousness to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

{Where death reigned once because of sin, Eternal life reigns now through the grace God has showed by allowing His son to be the only one perfect sacrifice}

Romans 6:14 Paul says "14 For sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under law but under grace.

The author of Hebrews quotes Jeremiah 31:33-34 says, making the point that Christ's death perfects the sanctified (Hebrews 10:17-18) " 17 then He adds, “Their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more.” [FONT="][/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#000000][FONT="]18 Now where there is remission of these, there is no longer an offering for sin.

{Sounds like to me that Christ put an end to sins}

[/FONT][FONT="]3. To make reconciliation for iniquity;

Paul says in 1 Corinthians 5:19 "[/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial][B]19 [/B][/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#000000]that is, that [/COLOR][COLOR=#B22222]God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself[/COLOR][COLOR=#000000], not imputing their trespasses to them, [/COLOR][COLOR=#B22222]and has committed to us the word of reconciliation[/COLOR][COLOR=#000000].[/COLOR]

[COLOR=#000000]{and}[/COLOR]

[COLOR=#000000]Romans 5:11 "[/COLOR][COLOR=#000000] [/COLOR][COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial][B]11 [/B][/FONT]And not only [I]that, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom [COLOR=#b22222]we have now received the reconciliation[/COLOR].

[/I]4. To bring in everlasting righteousness;

Paul says to the Corinthians (1 Cor. 1:30) "[/COLOR][COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial][B]30 [/B][/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#000000]But of Him you are in Christ Jesus, who became for us wisdom from God—[/COLOR][COLOR=#B22222]and righteousness and sanctification and redemption
[/COLOR]
[COLOR=#000000]{And}[/COLOR]

[COLOR=#000000]Romans 3:21-22 "[/COLOR][COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial][B]21 [/B][/FONT]But now the [COLOR=#b22222]righteousness of God[/COLOR] apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, [/COLOR][COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial][B]22[COLOR=#b22222] [/COLOR][/B][/FONT][COLOR=#b22222]even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all[/COLOR][COLOR=#b22222][[/COLOR][URL="https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Romans+3&version=NKJV#fen-NKJV-28014h"]h[/URL]] who believe.

5. To seal up vision and prophecy;

Jesus says in Luke 24:44 "44 Then He said to them, “These are the words which I spoke to you while I was still with you, that all things must be fulfilled which were written in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms concerning Me.”

{and}

Luke 21:21-23 "21 Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let those who are in the midst of her depart, and let not those who are in the country enter her. 22 For these are the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. 23 But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! For there will be great distress in the land and wrath upon this people.

{also)

In 2 Corinthians paul says (2 Cor. 1:20) "20 For all the promises of God in Him are Yes, and in Him Amen, to the glory of God through us.

{What promises? ALL promises, must include promises made to Abraham}

6. And to anoint the Most Holy;

The author of Hebrews says (Hebrews 4:21-24) "21 Then likewise he sprinkled with blood both the tabernacle and all the vessels of the ministry. 22 And according to the law almost all things are purified with blood, and without shedding of blood there is no remission.[/FONT]
[h=3]Greatness of Christ’s Sacrifice[/h][FONT="][FONT=Arial][B]23 [/B][/FONT]Therefore [I]it was necessary that the copies of the things in the heavens should be purified with these, but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. [/I][I][FONT=Arial][B]24 [/B][/FONT][COLOR=#b22222]For Christ has not entered the holy places made with hands, [I]which are copies of the true, but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us;

[/I][/COLOR][/I]{Christ entered the true Most Holy place and anoint it with His blood, which fulfilled what the earthly copy projected with the priesthood of Aaron and the earthly temple.}

It really baffles me how anyone could say the 70th week of Daniel has not been fulfilled. Paul, Jesus, John and the Hebrew author says they have!!! To inject and gap period between the 69th and 70th week is man projecting his own interpretation to make his end-time eschatological system work. These first six things are said to be completed in the 70th week as Daniel stated, therefore all the other things have to be fulfilled as well. Perhaps the destruction of the city was not included in the 70 weeks (although the decree was made by Jesus), however, it was direct consequence which followed after and directly related to the prophecy.[/FONT][/COLOR][/QUOTE]

[COLOR="#0000CD"]Bookends...You are reading Paul and his teachings all wrong..Just look at Israel yourself.... can you not make a decision? Is Israel still sinning.......I thinK so....DUH How about the fact that they are righteous now days,,,,,, OR maybe their transgressions against GOD/Jesus....... Yeah buddy,,,,I see that they (the nation) have come around to believe that Jesus is their messiah and have thrown Judism, the Talmud out the door. What about the "Annointing of the Holy of Holies..... Yeah they sure did annoint it in 70 AD,,,Burnt it to the Ground.......

Your Suppositions HOLD NO WATER. You are dangerously close to calling God a Liar... Rem...these are HIS WORD and HIs name is the WORD OF GOD

As a preterist, you are trying hard to maintain your beliefs in that doctrine....There is a better way, simply shed the Preterist view for the Pre-millinneum Pre-Trib version and you will find out that every thing fits like a glove...You will no longer have to twist what Paul or anyone has said to the Baby Christians of that time period to fit your worldview.

Dan. 9

Senior Member

Banned

Senior Member

Senior Member

Banned

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

eternally-gratefull

Guest

Senior Member

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy

Senior Member

Senior Member

Banned

Banned

Senior Member

Senior Member