Dewey Bruton’s Daniel's Timeline End Times Prophecy exposed

[zone]

I have been for two years. Same old conspiracy theory crap. Same old lies about what I believe. and same old false condemnation of things she does not know or understand.

oh. i thought your affection and appreciation was genuine for 2 years.
oh well...maybe it wasn't.

who knew?

i know it isn't now - but i must stand by my convictions concerning your bizarre beliefs.

btw:
who is ranting? who is using foul language?
who is accusing?
who is lying?
you are.

you're willing to be rude and dismissive even to others have never insulted you, and mean you no harm.
aren't you embarrassed? this is kindergarten stuff.

and this is Bible 101.

but.....i see this all the time....it'll slowly eventually dawn on you (if you are Christ's)...but you'll just slide out from under what you currently believe, never acknowledge people cared enough to show you the truth.......and put up with all this foolishness in the meantime.

I agree. but there are also things I think which will not be KNOWN as sure until they happen..

maybe you have to guess...based on newspaper headlines (?).
maybe things aren't known to you - it's because of your 'beliefs'

most christians see it already - in scripture.
God and His Plan fully revealed to His servants in and through Jesus of Nazareth.
all done, nothing left undone.

no stupid Land loose ends...no plan for jews dominating gentiles...none of that pulp fiction.

it's JESUS.

fulfilled.

I am sure the jews, who saw all the signs of Christ. thought the same way people today think of in seeing certain signs..that they explained them away symbolically. said other things, all to prove to themselves, Christ was not the messiah, because it did not fit their belief system.

But here is the difference.. Theirs cost them their salvation. Ours only cost us some arguments like we see today.. and one day we will ALL know which way God intended the truth to be, all we can do now is guess. and discuss. and if need be, agree to disagree..

this is not a salvation issue, like osme people make it out to be.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Ahh,but aren't you accusing her of the very same things that you say she is accusing you of?

What is she accusing me of? Can you show me where I have stated she believes something she does not? About the only thing I ever said is I believe her belief comes from the antijewish roman church, But I also said, that does not mean she believes this way.

Do you yourself really understand it all? If you yourself do not understand it all can you be sure that she does not understand it if she has studied it far more then you have?

1. No one should claim to understand it all
2. She studied more than me?? I have been studying this in detail for over 30 years now. I have studied ALL views, and have many views I agree in part with..
3. yes I do understand her points. they do not make sense to me. To many holes. To many things whihc do not add up. and she is making it a gospel issue,, which totally destroys any credability she may have with me to ever believe the way she does.

Also. And have agreed to disagree with her. Why will she not do the same??Instead, She unfriended me. Told me numerous times I am not her brother. And has asked me many times to stop talking to her. Which I did.. As you see, she has not responded in kind to the things she demands from me.. so Again, if she thinks this will get me to follow believe in her view. she has a sad way of trying to do it..

But the real question is,is it costing someone else their salvation? (I am not talking about yours) If so then it does become a salvation issue and that is the point.

Why would it cost someone their salvation. My view would not keep someone from Christ It states Christ paid the price in full 2000 years ago. And there is no other way to heaven but by him.

Her view states the same thing (as far as the gospel)

so neither one of our views would keep people from reaching heaven.

so what is your point?

 

[SarahM777]

EG,

Question for you. Where did Jesus say that there would be another temple? Remember Jesus had already told the Samaritan woman that one would not worship at this mountain or that mountain but we would worship in Spirit and in truth. He has implied that the temple itself would no longer be needed for worship.

When He talks to the disciples about the destruction of the temple,He shows them the buildings and says that not one stone will be left upon another and they would be thrown down. Where does He say there would be another temple? Can you show me please,because I can't find it. So if He didn't say it would be rebuilt,why didn't He say it?

Jesus doesn't say that the temple is the sign of the end,He says this is the sign of the end

[SUP]14 [/SUP]And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.

So if that is what Jesus said that is the sign of the end,how did the rest come about? Just curious.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

EG,

Question for you. Where did Jesus say that there would be another temple? Remember Jesus had already told the Samaritan woman that one would not worship at this mountain or that mountain but we would worship in Spirit and in truth. He has implied that the temple itself would no longer be needed for worship.

Who said the temple would be there for worship?

When He talks to the disciples about the destruction of the temple,He shows them the buildings and says that not one stone will be left upon another and they would be thrown down. Where does He say there would be another temple? Can you show me please,because I can't find it. So if He didn't say it would be rebuilt,why didn't He say it?

Well we have a few things.

1. In order for an abomination of desolation to occure, there must be a temple.. even if it is built IN UNBELIEF. Daniel 9 says the desectration of the temple happens after the one they rebuilt (2nd one) is destroyed, which we know happened in 70 AD.
2. Scripture says Jesus will rule in jersualem. is there anything wrong with him having a house where people come and worship him personally?
3. who says there will never be another temple? if the jews built one tomorrow.. does that mean it was not what was prophesied? can anyone prove it was not prophesied??

Jesus doesn't say that the temple is the sign of the end,He says this is the sign of the end

Yep, the abomination is the sign of the end.. The end that some people said happened 2000 years ago.

[SUP]14 [/SUP]And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.

So if that is what Jesus said that is the sign of the end,how did the rest come about? Just curious

what end? the end of the earth, or the end of the age?? could go either way, I do not think we can say which one with complete certainty, all we can do is insert our beliefs..

I can say this.

matt 24
[SUP]3 [/SUP]Now as He sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, “Tell us, when will these things be? And what will be the sign of Your coming, and of the end of the age?”

Scripture says it is the end of the age.. not the end of the world.. so.. even though that does not really prove it.. (need many other things to line up) You can't deny it says this.. and my belief is this biblically unsound..

 

[SarahM777]

[/COLOR]Who said the temple would be there for worship?



Well we have a few things.

1. In order for an abomination of desolation to occure, there must be a temple.. even if it is built IN UNBELIEF. Daniel 9 says the desectration of the temple happens after the one they rebuilt (2nd one) is destroyed, which we know happened in 70 AD.
2. Scripture says Jesus will rule in jersualem. is there anything wrong with him having a house where people come and worship him personally?
3. who says there will never be another temple? if the jews built one tomorrow.. does that mean it was not what was prophesied? can anyone prove it was not prophesied??



Yep, the abomination is the sign of the end.. The end that some people said happened 2000 years ago.


[/FONT]

what end? the end of the earth, or the end of the age?? could go either way, I do not think we can say which one with complete certainty, all we can do is insert our beliefs..

I can say this.

matt 24
[SUP]3 [/SUP]Now as He sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, “Tell us, when will these things be? And what will be the sign of Your coming, and of the end of the age?”

Scripture says it is the end of the age.. not the end of the world.. so.. even though that does not really prove it.. (need many other things to line up) You can't deny it says this.. and my belief is this biblically unsound..

Why else does one build a temple? Does one just build a temple for looks or does it usually have another purpose? Name one temple that has never been used for worship.

Where does Daniel say there will be two temples? He talks about one,so where does he talk about another one?

UMM,where did God say He wanted man to build a temple in the first place? God has said He does not live in buildings made by human hands.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Why else does one build a temple? Does one just build a temple for looks or does it usually have another purpose? Name one temple that has never been used for worship.

ok.. then but this is different than buidling a temple for man to be made right with God is it not? What temple ever made man right with God?

Where does Daniel say there will be two temples? He talks about one,so where does he talk about another one?

1. He says one will be rebuilt, then utterly destroyd
2. he says AFTER the one is destroyed. a prince will commit an abomination which causes desolation.

There has to be a temple in order for their to be an abomination. thus there has to be two temples. Unless we twist the timeline of denials prophesy.

UMM,where did God say He wanted man to build a temple in the first place? God has said He does not live in buildings made by human hands.

lol.. Why did David want to build him a temple? and what Did God promise he would do for him?

 

[SarahM777]

[/COLOR]ok.. then but this is different than buidling a temple for man to be made right with God is it not? What temple ever made man right with God?



1. He says one will be rebuilt, then utterly destroyd
2. he says AFTER the one is destroyed. a prince will commit an abomination which causes desolation.

There has to be a temple in order for their to be an abomination. thus there has to be two temples. Unless we twist the timeline of denials prophesy.




lol.. Why did David want to build him a temple? and what Did God promise he would do for him?

How is it different? (You're not making sense here)

Again show me where in Daniel he says there will be two temples. He talks about one not two. Anything else is trying to make Daniel say something he doesn't say. He specifically says THE TEMPLE. He is only seeing one. Not once does he say there will be two temples.

What does that have to do with God saying He did not live in a house made by human hands?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

How is it different? (You're not making sense here)

Again show me where in Daniel he says there will be two temples. He talks about one not two. Anything else is trying to make Daniel say something he doesn't say. He specifically says THE TEMPLE. He is only seeing one.

Back to square one, In your belief, he spoke of one

In my belief, he spoke of two.

in your interpretation. he went forward in time up to 70 ad, then back again to Christ (has to in order for there to be just one temple)

In my belief, everything he said happens in sequential order. thus there has to be two temples.

again, it all falls on how we interpret the passage

What does that have to do with God saying He did not live in a house made by human hands?

What does that have to do with answering the question of what temple was ever built which helped remove the sin of any man woman or child who ever lived? and why david wanted to build a temple.

 

[SarahM777]

Sorry EG

Here is Daniel 9

[SUP]20 [/SUP]While I was speaking and praying, confessing my sin and the sin of my people Israel and making my request to the Lord my God for his holy hill— [SUP]21 [/SUP]while I was still in prayer, Gabriel, the man I had seen in the earlier vision, came to me in swift flight about the time of the evening sacrifice. [SUP]22 [/SUP]He instructed me and said to me, “Daniel, I have now come to give you insight and understanding. [SUP]23 [/SUP]As soon as you began to pray, a word went out, which I have come to tell you, for you are highly esteemed. Therefore, consider the word and understand the vision:
[SUP]24 [/SUP]“Seventy ‘sevens’[SUP][c][/SUP] are decreed for your people and your holy city to finish[SUP][d][/SUP] transgression, to put an end to sin, to atone for wickedness, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the Most Holy Place.[SUP][e][/SUP]
[SUP]25 [/SUP]“Know and understand this: From the time the word goes out to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until the Anointed One,[SUP][f][/SUP] the ruler, comes, there will be seven ‘sevens,’ and sixty-two ‘sevens.’ It will be rebuilt with streets and a trench, but in times of trouble.[SUP]26 [/SUP]After the sixty-two ‘sevens,’ the Anointed One will be put to death and will have nothing.[SUP][g][/SUP] The people of the ruler who will come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come like a flood:War will continue until the end, and desolations have been decreed.[SUP]27 [/SUP]He will confirm a covenant with many for one ‘seven.’[SUP][h][/SUP] In the middle of the ‘seven’[SUP][i][/SUP]he will put an end to sacrifice and offering. And at the temple[SUP][j][/SUP] he will set up an abomination that causes desolation, until the end that is decreed is poured out on him.[SUP][k][/SUP]”[SUP][l]


Where is the first and where is the second temple in here? Where does he talk about two destructions?[/SUP]

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Sorry EG

Here is Daniel 9

[SUP]20 [/SUP]While I was speaking and praying, confessing my sin and the sin of my people Israel and making my request to the Lord my God for his holy hill— [SUP]21 [/SUP]while I was still in prayer, Gabriel, the man I had seen in the earlier vision, came to me in swift flight about the time of the evening sacrifice. [SUP]22 [/SUP]He instructed me and said to me, “Daniel, I have now come to give you insight and understanding. [SUP]23 [/SUP]As soon as you began to pray, a word went out, which I have come to tell you, for you are highly esteemed. Therefore, consider the word and understand the vision:
[SUP]24 [/SUP]“Seventy ‘sevens’[SUP][c][/SUP] are decreed for your people and your holy city to finish[SUP][d][/SUP] transgression, to put an end to sin, to atone for wickedness, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the Most Holy Place.[SUP][e][/SUP]
[SUP]25 [/SUP]“Know and understand this: From the time the word goes out to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until the Anointed One,[SUP][f][/SUP] the ruler, comes, there will be seven ‘sevens,’ and sixty-two ‘sevens.’ It will be rebuilt with streets and a trench, but in times of trouble.[SUP]26 [/SUP]After the sixty-two ‘sevens,’ the Anointed One will be put to death and will have nothing.[SUP][g][/SUP] The people of the ruler who will come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come like a flood:War will continue until the end, and desolations have been decreed.[SUP]27 [/SUP]He will confirm a covenant with many for one ‘seven.’[SUP][h][/SUP] In the middle of the ‘seven’[SUP][i][/SUP]he will put an end to sacrifice and offering. And at the temple[SUP][j][/SUP] he will set up an abomination that causes desolation, until the end that is decreed is poured out on him.[SUP][k][/SUP]”[SUP][l]


Where is the first and where is the second temple in here? Where does he talk about two destructions?[/SUP]

lol. Ok. thats your interpretation.

Here is mine.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]“Know and understand this: From the time the word goes out to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until the Anointed One,[SUP][f][/SUP] the ruler, comes, there will be seven ‘sevens,’ and sixty-two ‘sevens.’

(the time was literally fulfilled in Jesus triumphant entry on the donkey)

It will be rebuilt with streets and a trench, but in times of trouble.

It would be rebuilt while Isreal is still under Gentile rule, which was literally fuflilled, also took 7 weeks to rebuild)

[SUP]26 [/SUP]After the sixty-two ‘sevens,’ the Anointed One will be put to death and will have nothing

Literally fulfilled, after the 69 weeks, Jesus was killed but not for himself. for all of us.

The people of the ruler who will come will destroy the city and the sanctuary.

Fulfilled in ad 70. almost 40 years AFTER the 69th week was fulfilled (thus we already have a gap of time in the 70 weeks)

Continuing IN SEQUENCE OF EVENTS

The end will come like a flood:War will continue until the end, and desolations have been decreed.

Since the destruction of the city and sanctuary, the place has been under numerous wars. Under complete desolation, up even intl today.

[SUP]27 [/SUP]He will confirm a covenant with many for one ‘seven.’

(in your interpretation, we now go back to Christ. In my interpretation, this occures during the wars and desolations. in your interpretation this is Christ, in my interpretation, it is the prince who is to come, from the people who destroyed jerusalem (rome))


In the middle of the ‘seven’ he will put an end to sacrifice and offering. And at the temple[SUP][j][/SUP] he will set up an abomination that causes desolation,

What temple? the temple was destroyed in 70 AD by this princes people. thus unless it was rebuilt, even if for the wrong reasons, there can be no abomination of desolation.

until the end that is decreed is poured out on him.[SUP]"[/SUP]

notice the word him here. who is him? Jesus (as in your interpretation" or the prince of Rome who confirmed a covenant with the many, then broke this covenant midway through the week? And what is poured out on him. It states the abomination of desolation will remain until the end that is decreed is poured out on him..


Again, as I said, it all depends on HOW one interprets it.

now again I ask, why did David ask to build a temple. why? and why did God allow it? so they could be saved by this temple?

 

[OneChrist116]

Hey brother read the bible.1 Peter 4:17 states For it is time for judgment to begin with God's household; and if it begins with us, what will the outcome be for those who do not obey the gospel of God? or 1 Corinthians 5:12 states For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge? So your statement of not judging holds no water my brother. We are called to restore brothers from sin those that are spiritual with gentleness and kindness and to mislead Gods sheep is not something that should be taken likely. Oh and also sign of a false prophet he charges for His prophecy. So tell me where in Gods word did any prophet ever charge for what God was saying. Nope never.

 

[OneChrist116]

hey Brother read 1 Peter 4:17 and 1 Corinthians 5:12 and tell me if were not to judge those in the house of God

 

[SarahM777]

lol. Ok. thats your interpretation.

Eg,

Where did God ever tell us that we are to have our OWN interpretations of scripture? Does He not tell us to lean not on own own understanding?

Do you know why God did NOT want them to build the temple in the first place? Do you understand what He was trying to show them with the tabernacle? Do you understand that God was showing them He was not bound to a place but that He would be with them wherever they went. Do you understand that when they built the temple it became an IDOL and it allowed people to put God in a box. The temple itself became greater then God. Why do you think God allowed it to be destroyed not once but TWICE? Do you think God really wants them to build another one or will it be an act of rebellion?
Will God see it as they are obeying Him or will He see it as a slap in His face,if they chose once again to do the sacrifices after He sent the LAST and perfect sacrifice?

What does God's promises to David have to do with God not wanting the temple built in the first place? Remember He warned the Israelites about seeking a king also,do you think maybe God had already given them a clue as to how bad our choices can go,even though He allows it?

 

[RachelBibleStudent]

rachel -

did all these things refer to Jesus?
and did He accomplish them?

To finish the transgression Isaiah 53:5; Hebrews 10:12-14
To make an end of sins Hebrews 9:26
To make reconciliation for iniquity Rom. 5:10; Heb. 10:17
To bring in everlasting righteousness II Cor. 5:21
To seal up the vision and prophecy Matthew 5:17
To anoint the Most Holy Luke 4:18; Acts 10:38

The prophecy concerning the time measure of the 70 weeks or 490 years is completely fulfilled and is a matter of Biblical historical record.

end of controversy for me, really.

i don't find these as simple as you find them...

'to finish the transgression'...i'm not sure what that means...it sounds like something only jesus could do...but i don't know if that is past or future...

'to make an end of sins'...jesus did this on the cross...

'to make reconciliation for iniquity'...jesus did that on the cross too...

'to bring in everlasting righteousness'...if that refers to the righteousness we get by faith then jesus did that on the cross...but i cannot rule out that it might be referring to eternal righteousness in the new heaven and new earth...

'to seal up the vision and prophecy'...i don't know what this means either...i do know that not -all- prophecy was fulfilled by jesus at his first coming...unless this refers only to specific old testament prophecies...

'to anoint the most holy'...this happened when jesus returned to heaven...

 

[Saved_Forever]

i don't find these as simple as you find them...

'to finish the transgression'...i'm not sure what that means...it sounds like something only jesus could do...but i don't know if that is past or future...

'to make an end of sins'...jesus did this on the cross...

'to make reconciliation for iniquity'...jesus did that on the cross too...

'to bring in everlasting righteousness'...if that refers to the righteousness we get by faith then jesus did that on the cross...but i cannot rule out that it might be referring to eternal righteousness in the new heaven and new earth...

'to seal up the vision and prophecy'...i don't know what this means either...i do know that not -all- prophecy was fulfilled by jesus at his first coming...unless this refers only to specific old testament prophecies...

'to anoint the most holy'...this happened when jesus returned to heaven...

Read post 42 again. There is an answer there for you.

 

[Saved_Forever]

Daniel's Timeline Is correct! The Great Tribulation of 3 1/2 years is here! Please visit: Life After Death: Us Forever
Jesus Is Coming Soon!

Sounds awful short. Tell me. Since 70 AD and now, has there NOT been any prophecies fulfilled? Are you, personally, (NOT YOU ZONE, so stay out of it. This is not a question to you) awaiting for a 7 year tribulation or something?

Just trying to get some insight to what you think.

Thanks!

 

[zone]

Sounds awful short. Tell me. Since 70 AD and now, has there NOT been any prophecies fulfilled? Are you, personally, (NOT YOU ZONE, so stay out of it. This is not a question to you) awaiting for a 7 year tribulation or something?

Just trying to get some insight to what you think.

Thanks!

no...sorry. i won't stay out of it, since you referred a poster to post 42 for the "answer"....and that post is MORE MAGIC 70TH WEEK dome of the rock is abomination of desolation GARBAGE.

Dan 9:25- 26 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times. And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

The only one of the four decrees that ordered the rebuilding of Jerusalem that included rebuilding the wall is the one issued by Artaxerxes in 444/445BC (seeNeh2). There are 483 days in 69 weeks (7x69=483). But Christ was not killed (cut off) 483 literal days after the restoration order so these days can not be literal days. Could they be years? Let’s have a look and see if it works. Let’s start at 444BC and proceed 483 years into the future and we come to 39AD. Nope doesn’t look like a fit, but wait a minute wasn’t a year to Daniel 360 days? Isn’t our calendar based on 365 ¼ days per year? So if Daniels years are 360 days and our calendar is based on 365 ¼ days we must convert Daniel’s years to fit our calendar. We could figure out how many days are in 483 of Daniels years and then divide that number by 365 ¼ to find out how many of Daniels year fit our calendar or we could make it simple by multiplying 483 x .9857 (coversion factor) to see how many of our calendars years they equal. 483 x .9857 = 476.09 which when rounded to whole years would be 476, so lets see how that fits. So let’s try again starting at 444BC and proceeding 476 years into the future takes us to 32AD. Bingo we have a fit, there you have it proof that a prophetic day is equal to a year!

NO, NO BINGO.
NO FIT.

the prophecy was seventy weeks of YEARS.

a week is period of 7 years.

70 - 7s.

Daniel 9 IS FULFILLED.
the 70th week was a "week" of 7 years exactly like the other 69.

Jesus came an ministered for 3.5 years and was cut off.

The Jews heard the Gospel proclaimed to them, then the Gospel went to the gentiles.

and the decree of the desolation of Jerusalem uttered by Christ while He sat overlooking Jerusalem (due to the Abominations committed before Jesus came - their corruption of God's Law based on their ABOMINABLE ORAL TRADITIONS WHICH CAME FROM BABYLON - including the witchcraft and sorceries they committed; Herod's abominations of killing the High Priests and calling himself god; king of the jews; not to mention the PRIMARY ABOMINATION OF THE CONSPIRACY WITH ROME TO KILL JESUS - THEIR SAVIOR); the continuing murder and persecution of the faithful jews, the disciples of Christ; and the continuing revolutionary wars with abominations committed by the zealots.......

= END OF 70TH WEEK.

all this other stuff is sleight-of-hand, and a lethal cocktail cooked up by Zionists to make Islam and the DOR the fall-guy.

it's disgraceful what you guys have done.

Now that we have established that 457 is an incorrect start date let’s look at those first seven weeks and see where they actually take us. Once again starting at 444 and going 49 (49 of Daniels 360 day years = 48.3 years as used by the calendars history is recorded in) of Daniels years into the future 444 – 48.3 = 395.7 which rounds to 396. 396 was the year that Malachi was inspired to write the last book of the Old Testament. "The Scripture to the Jews was complete, and no more was written until the New Testament era! So Old Testament vision and prophecy were indeed 'sealed up'. As one dear Rabbi lamented in about 200 BC, 'The Holy Spirit has departed from Israel,' and until this very day, the Jews, as a nation, have not been permitted to see any further. The Lord has blinded their eyes so they could not recognize Jesus as their Messiah (Romans 11:8, 2 Corinthians 3:15)

I’ll leave it to the reader to decide should we use the only restoration decreee recorded in the Old Testament that matches the Scriptural requirement of rebuilding the wall or should we use Zone’s start date even though that decree does not meet the Scriptural requirement that includes rebuilding the wall? As for me I’ll stick with the decree that meets the Scriptural requirements laid out in Daniel’s prophecy that include rebuilding the wall “even in troublous times”.

No it wasn’t 70AD for 70AD to meet the Scriptural requirement it would have to be “great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be”

Mat 24:15-22 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains: Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house: Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes. And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day: For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

While the events of 70AD were certainly horrific Jerusalem was not left desolate nor do we have an abomination that is still standing from those events. Could the blasphemous Islamic structure on the temple mount be THE abomination of desolation "spoken of by Daniel the prophet" that was "set up" (or "placed") to "stand" in the holy place?
Daniel 12:11 And from the time [that] the daily [sacrifice] shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, [there shall be] a thousand two hundred and ninety days.
(Tanach) - Daniel 12:11 And from the time the daily sacrifice was removed and the silent abomination placed, is one thousand, two hundred, and ninety.
Mark confirms it to be "standing" and tells us that the abomination is an "it":
Mark 13:14 But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains:
Luke tells us that it is Jerusalem that is desolated, in his parallel verse:
Luke 21:20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh 21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains...
All three apostles also confirm something about the timing, because we find it is written about a future event as in "... ye shall see...", so we can conclude that it was to be an abomination, associated with the desolation of Jerusalem, in the future to the time at which Jesus delivered this discourse, even though it was "spoken of by Daniel the prophet" well over 500 years prior to when Jesus delivered this Olivet Discourse
.
Jerusalem was compassed with armies on many occasions after the discourse was delivered including 70 AD, 132, 639, 1099, 1187, 1948, 1967 and indeed even as of this writing. In 70 AD, a million Jews were killed, and an already long desolate temple was torn down. Jesus had declared almost 40 years earlier: Matt 23:38 "Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.", in part because the Pharisees had made "...the word of God of none effect through your tradition..." (Mark 7:13), a condition in which we seem to find much of today's church. If the temple had not already been rendered desolate as Jesus' declaration above would seem to suggest, then it was certainly rendered desolate through Jesus' shed blood on the Cross, almost 40 years before the temple was torn down in 70 AD. That is also why "...the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom..." after Jesus had "...yielded up the ghost..." on the Cross (Matt 27:50-51). In 70 AD the Christians escaped, and were saved from the slaughter of the Romans, not even desolating the Christian community.

Though a significant and horrific event in 70 AD, the Roman Gentiles came back to slaughter another 600,000-750,000 Jews less than 65 years later, in the Bar Kokhba revolt of 132-135 AD.
Later in the Olivet Discourse we find:
Luke 21:24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
So Luke gives us another historical time pin. It would seem problematic indeed to suggest that the "times of the Gentiles" were fulfilled in 70 AD since the Roman Gentiles came back for a double dip of Jewish slaughter less than 65 years later. Let alone the list of Gentile armies from throughout the Christian era listed earlier. Blessedly, as Daniel's "times" seem to demonstrate - both mathematically and textually - the "times of the Gentiles" were fulfilled in 1967, when the Jews were restored to power and control of Jerusalem for the first time in over 2500 years. We read "... when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people..." - the end of the scattering of the power of the Jews - the only "holy people" of Daniel's day.

Jerusalem was temporarily desolated in 70 AD, again in 132 AD, and conquered again in 639 AD when Khalifah Omar marched into town during the Islamic First Jihad. The church was alive and well since history tells us that Bishop Sophronius was compelled to show Khalifah Omar around town. History has shown that nothing was more physically or spiritually desolating to Jerusalem than 1100 years of Islamization and accompanying exile of Christians and Jews. By the early 1800's there were just 550 residents. This is why the historical record of Jerusalem in first quarter of the 19th century is sketchy and anecdotal at best.

In "A History of the Jews" Paul Johnson writes on page 321: "Between 1827 and 1839, largely through British efforts, the population of Jerusalem rose from 550 to 5,500 and in all Palestine it topped 10,000 - the real beginning of the Jewish return to the Promised Land. In 1838 Palmerston appointed the first western vice-consul in Jerusalem, W.T. Young, and told him 'to afford protection to the Jews generally'."

see?
the only way you guys make this work is the corruption of the BLINDING of Romans 9-11....you drag it forward beyond Acts when it was CLEAR what the fullness of the gentiles inclusion MEANT - the fulfilling of the promise to Abraham!......and you pretend that jews who are HOSTILE to the Gospel and Christianity are innocent of anything they do because GOD IS RESPONSIBLE FOR IT ALL BY BLINDING THEM. you have made GOD THE AUTHOR of the evil committed by unbelievers in the Middle East!

you have "History has shown that nothing was more physically or spiritually desolating to Jerusalem than 1100 years of Islamization and accompanying exile of Christians and Jews."

REALLY?

the Conspiracy to Crucify the Lord of Glory WAS NOT MORE physically or spiritually desolating to Jerusalem?
the refusal of Israelites to enter the ONLY COVENANT AND PLAN GOD PROVIDED FOR THEM - their refusal to accept the Redeemer was not desolating?

GOD HIMSELF IS AGAINST YOU ON THAT.

He LEVELED IT TO THE GROUND IN 70AD.

the ONLY place "Islam" ("Ishmael") is mentioned in the New Testament is when JERUSALEM and it's apostate inhabitants are compared to HAGAR AND ISHMAEL:

Galatians 4:26
25Now this Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia and corresponds to the present Jerusalem, for she is in slavery with her children. 26But the Jerusalem above is free; she is our mother. 27For it is written, "REJOICE, BARREN WOMAN WHO DOES NOT BEAR; BREAK FORTH AND SHOUT, YOU WHO ARE NOT IN LABOR; FOR MORE NUMEROUS ARE THE CHILDREN OF THE DESOLATE THAN OF THE ONE WHO HAS A HUSBAND."

 

[Saved_Forever]

no...sorry. i won't stay out of it, since you referred a poster to post 42 for the "answer"....and that post is MORE MAGIC 70TH WEEK dome of the rock is abomination of desolation GARBAGE.




NO, NO BINGO.
NO FIT.

the prophecy was seventy weeks of YEARS.

a week is period of 7 years.

70 - 7s.

Daniel 9 IS FULFILLED.
the 70th week was a "week" of 7 years exactly like the other 69.

Jesus came an ministered for 3.5 years and was cut off.

The Jews heard the Gospel proclaimed to them, then the Gospel went to the gentiles.

and the decree of the desolation of Jerusalem uttered by Christ while He sat overlooking Jerusalem (due to the Abominations committed before Jesus came - their corruption of God's Law based on their ABOMINABLE ORAL TRADITIONS WHICH CAME FROM BABYLON - including the witchcraft and sorceries they committed; Herod's abominations of killing the High Priests and calling himself god; king of the jews; not to mention the PRIMARY ABOMINATION OF THE CONSPIRACY WITH ROME TO KILL JESUS - THEIR SAVIOR); the continuing murder and persecution of the faithful jews, the disciples of Christ; and the continuing revolutionary wars with abominations committed by the zealots.......

= END OF 70TH WEEK.

all this other stuff is sleight-of-hand, and a lethal cocktail cooked up by Zionists to make Islam and the DOR the fall-guy.

it's disgraceful what you guys have done.





see?
the only way you guys make this work is the corruption of the BLINDING of Romans 9-11....you drag it forward beyond Acts when it was CLEAR what the fullness of the gentiles inclusion MEANT - the fulfilling of the promise to Abraham!......and you pretend that jews who are HOSTILE to the Gospel and Christianity are innocent of anything they do because GOD IS RESPONSIBLE FOR IT ALL BY BLINDING THEM. you have made GOD THE AUTHOR of the evil committed by unbelievers in the Middle East!

you have "History has shown that nothing was more physically or spiritually desolating to Jerusalem than 1100 years of Islamization and accompanying exile of Christians and Jews."

REALLY?

the Conspiracy to Crucify the Lord of Glory WAS NOT MORE physically or spiritually desolating to Jerusalem?
the refusal of Israelites to enter the ONLY COVENANT AND PLAN GOD PROVIDED FOR THEM - their refusal to accept the Redeemer was not desolating?

GOD HIMSELF IS AGAINST YOU ON THAT.

He LEVELED IT TO THE GROUND IN 70AD.

the ONLY place "Islam" ("Ishmael") is mentioned in the New Testament is when JERUSALEM and it's apostate inhabitants are compared to HAGAR AND ISHMAEL:

Galatians 4:26
25Now this Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia and corresponds to the present Jerusalem, for she is in slavery with her children. 26But the Jerusalem above is free; she is our mother. 27For it is written, "REJOICE, BARREN WOMAN WHO DOES NOT BEAR; BREAK FORTH AND SHOUT, YOU WHO ARE NOT IN LABOR; FOR MORE NUMEROUS ARE THE CHILDREN OF THE DESOLATE THAN OF THE ONE WHO HAS A HUSBAND."

You see? That's why nobody likes you. Not when asked but when told, you can't keep your mouth shut and intrude into a conversation that CLEARLY does not belong to you. You have a nasty habit of spoiling other people's party. It is amazing to me that you can get away with this garbage and the moderators allow you to act like this.

I didn't ask you yet you walk into somebody's personal conversation when you are SPECIFICALLY not invited! First off, it's rude. Second, I don't care what you think about my question because I didn't ask you and third, you are harassing all the members here with your crude and child like stupid hateful comments! Again, it's amazing that somehow you have a special pass that not many people have here on this forum to bash other people and have no guilt doing it.

You know virtually nothing about the Bible. You're to me, are just like the Saudi Arabians! Do it my way or I'll scold you in some way!

To any moderator reading this.....When are you going to take some action and pipe this thing down? It's annoying and very frustrating or are you going to sit idly by and let it continue?

 

[john832]

Just because one says they are my brothers and sisters does not make them one. (I had to learn that in a very hard way from someone who was very close to me)

Hmmm, reminds me of this...

1Jn 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

And this...

2Ti 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Eg,

Where did God ever tell us that we are to have our OWN interpretations of scripture? Does He not tell us to lean not on own own understanding?

I could say the same to you. This is an invalid argument. I am not leaning on my own understanding. I have studied this topic in great detail over 20 years now.

Do you know why God did NOT want them to build the temple in the first place? Do you understand what He was trying to show them with the tabernacle? Do you understand that God was showing them He was not bound to a place but that He would be with them wherever they went. Do you understand that when they built the temple it became an IDOL and it allowed people to put God in a box. The temple itself became greater then God. Why do you think God allowed it to be destroyed not once but TWICE? Do you think God really wants them to build another one or will it be an act of rebellion?

1. God allowed them because King David wanted to. He did it in honor of his beloved.
2. Yes, It was destroyed because of the sin of the people, and in accordance with lev 26.
3. It was rebuilt because God said it would happen (so your whole argument just went away)
4. It never saved anyone when it was first built, or rebuilt. Or even when it is rebuilt again, which could start at any day (everything is in place)
5. Building it is not the issue, Prophesy is. God said they would rebuilt it once, Why not again? It never had a thing to do with salvation anyway, so again, this makes your points mute.

Will God see it as they are obeying Him or will He see it as a slap in His face,if they chose once again to do the sacrifices after He sent the LAST and perfect sacrifice?

it would be a slap in his face. WHy do you think the prince is able to commit the abomination? if they were following God. the prince would not even be able to enter the temple. Because according to Lev 26, If they repent, and follow God. He promises them peace!

What does God's promises to David have to do with God not wanting the temple built in the first place?

Oh But God loves to give us the desires of our heart.It gives him great pleasure.

Remember He warned the Israelites about seeking a king also,do you think maybe God had already given them a clue as to how bad our choices can go,even though He allows it?

What does this have to do with prophesy? Prophesy is God telling us what will happen. Not what he wishes happened. God did not want the destruction of 70 AD to occure. Whe know this, because Jesus said, If you only knew what day this was (which if they had listened to the prophesy, they would know it was the end of the 69th week to the day) he would have held them as a mother holds her children (protected them, even through his death) but since they did nit, it will be hidden from them.

So again, Your points make no sense.