gay adoption

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Sharp

Senior Member
May 5, 2009
2,565
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#21
If I had a child and gave it up for adoption, I would rather the child lived in a crowded eastern european orphanage than in a mansion with two gay men.
 
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Ancilla

Guest
#22
One more thing, what makes you think that a homosexual couple will be a more stable environment than a stable heterosexual couple? I think that you will find quite the opposite.
It's not. I thought I made that clear. Let me put it this way. When you look at the big stats on heterosexual families, the families are pretty broad. They can include 19 year old parents who only got married because they got pregnant but they really have no buisness raising a child. But their aren't any 19 year old gay couples with kids. But, like I said, if you are to factor out the heterosexual couples who had babies before they were ready (which is not an issue for gay couples which is what's giving them the statistical advantage) then there isn't a difference.
 
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charisenexcelcis

Guest
#23
I agree about the difficulty of parental rights. Part of the problem is that we have moved the questions regarding homosexuality out of the debate on morality. Do you believe that homosexuality is morally right?
 
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Ancilla

Guest
#24
If I had a child and gave it up for adoption, I would rather the child lived in a crowded eastern european orphanage than in a mansion with two gay men.
Have you ever been to such a place? I had friend who went to a Romanian orphanage for a mission and it was horrific. She said there was one kid who'd sit in the corner and eat concrete. It makes me sad that you'd rather have that for a baby then in a family where they're taught that homosexuality is not a sin. God did not intend for children to be raised in orphanages when there are families available.
 
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charisenexcelcis

Guest
#25
Again, I am curious what your sources are. I agree that we cannot on the one hand refuse to adopt children to homosexual couples, but on the other hand refuse to adopt children. As for me, domestic adoption agencies would turn me down due to my age. Isn't that interesting. I have many friends who have adopted children both domestic and foreign. Have you ever considered adopting a child?
 
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Ancilla

Guest
#26
I am interested where you get your statistic from? How was the the study conducted and did it only deal with the issue of second generation homosexuality?
My sociology of the family course in university. Because gay families are on the rise, sociologists are very interested in their effects. Where do you get your statistics?
 
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charisenexcelcis

Guest
#27
Also, we need more loving individuals to work as foster parents. Often children in the foster care system are not, at the time, adoptable. We need to fix this also, or we will be hypocrites.
 

Sharp

Senior Member
May 5, 2009
2,565
20
38
#28
Have you ever been to such a place? I had friend who went to a Romanian orphanage for a mission and it was horrific. She said there was one kid who'd sit in the corner and eat concrete. It makes me sad that you'd rather have that for a baby then in a family where they're taught that homosexuality is not a sin. God did not intend for children to be raised in orphanages when there are families available.

Two gay men living together is not a family. Its an abomination. Yes I'd rather have my baby eating Romanian concrete than living with two gay men.
 
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charisenexcelcis

Guest
#29
Thirty years of ministry, including the last seven years working in a population that is about forty per cent homosexual. What was the course textbook?
 
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Ancilla

Guest
#30
Also, Fetal Alcohol Syndrome is caused by prenatal conditions.
That's right. If a woman is an alcoholic she might (hopefully) realize that she can't raise a child and give it up for adoption. However, the fetal alcohol child I used to work with lived with her mom and very abusive extended family for years before she was taken into the custody of children's aid and then spent the years between foster homes, jail and the streets. My heart bled for her because she so desperately needed a stable home.
 
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Ancilla

Guest
#31
I agree about the difficulty of parental rights. Part of the problem is that we have moved the questions regarding homosexuality out of the debate on morality. Do you believe that homosexuality is morally right?
You're obviously not talking to me because I made it clear where I stand in my first post. Let me restate it incase you didn't read my first post carefully. It's not that I don't think homosexuality is wrong, what I think is that there are worse things for society that Christians are turning a blind eye to because they're too busy campaining against gay rights to notice the suffering of children.
 
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Ancilla

Guest
#32
Again, I am curious what your sources are. I agree that we cannot on the one hand refuse to adopt children to homosexual couples, but on the other hand refuse to adopt children. As for me, domestic adoption agencies would turn me down due to my age. Isn't that interesting. I have many friends who have adopted children both domestic and foreign. Have you ever considered adopting a child?
Have I considered adopting a child??? Right now I don't have the means to adopt a kitten, let alone a child. And as far as single people adopting older children, I've heard of people doing it but at my age that would not be wise. As for adopting an older child when I am married with the means, of course I have, whoever welcomes a child in the name of Jesus welcomes Jesus.
 
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charisenexcelcis

Guest
#33
I am talking to you and I think you are making some important statements, calling attention to things that have been too long ignored. Our actions must be more than words. And stating that "It's not that I don't think homosexuality is wrong" is not taking a stand on that question, it is simply removing it from the argument. Assuming that you believe that homosexuality is immoral, do you believe that adoption can be refused on moral basis?
 
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charisenexcelcis

Guest
#34
Have I considered adopting a child??? Right now I don't have the means to adopt a kitten, let alone a child. And as far as single people adopting older children, I've heard of people doing it but at my age that would not be wise. As for adopting an older child when I am married with the means, of course I have, whoever welcomes a child in the name of Jesus welcomes Jesus.
I'm glad that you are keeping that in mind for the future. You are obviously a compassionate person and will undoubtedly make a fine parent (mother?).
 
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Ancilla

Guest
#35
Also, we need more loving individuals to work as foster parents. Often children in the foster care system are not, at the time, adoptable. We need to fix this also, or we will be hypocrites.
You're totally right. And you're right that not all foster kids are up for adoption. I had a question on a test in college about what kids in the system were adoptable and I'll admit I drew a blank. But it's not just that we need Chrisitans who are willing to open their hearts and their homes, we need to petition the government that these services should not just be an after thought or something they can cut back on funding to when they're looking to cut taxes of the top 1% because they helped get them elected. But what gets me going is that such behaviour from the government is ok with so many Christians provided that the politians take certain positions on abortion and homosexuality. It just seems like children in foster care just don't seem to be important to most Christians, and that's just terrible because we know that the heart of Jesus breaks for suffering children.
 
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charisenexcelcis

Guest
#36
You're totally right. And you're right that not all foster kids are up for adoption. I had a question on a test in college about what kids in the system were adoptable and I'll admit I drew a blank. But it's not just that we need Chrisitans who are willing to open their hearts and their homes, we need to petition the government that these services should not just be an after thought or something they can cut back on funding to when they're looking to cut taxes of the top 1% because they helped get them elected. But what gets me going is that such behaviour from the government is ok with so many Christians provided that the politians take certain positions on abortion and homosexuality. It just seems like children in foster care just don't seem to be important to most Christians, and that's just terrible because we know that the heart of Jesus breaks for suffering children.
I agree. Children are a priority. Unfortunately, the funding from government often reflects the attitude of some parents toward their own children--feed 'em, house 'em, send them on their way.
 
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charisenexcelcis

Guest
#37
I have to go now, but it has been nice talking to you. Hope to have many fruitful conversations.
 
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Ancilla

Guest
#38
I am talking to you and I think you are making some important statements, calling attention to things that have been too long ignored. Our actions must be more than words. And stating that "It's not that I don't think homosexuality is wrong" is not taking a stand on that question, it is simply removing it from the argument. Assuming that you believe that homosexuality is immoral, do you believe that adoption can be refused on moral basis?
Like I said before, I believe that God does not people in same sex marriages. The Bible's clear that same sex is wrong. However, you're not making it clear who you mean can refuse adoption. A Christian adoption agency shouldn't accept same sex parents as potential adopters. I had a Christian friend who was raped and got pregnant and she only interviewed Christian, same-sex married couples as adopters. However, if we're talking about the government, they shouldn't be able to deny adoption to same sex couples unless they have hard evidence that the child would be much worse off with them than with the birth parents or in foster care. In fact, I don't think the government should be passing laws against behaviour simply because it's immoral. I think people should be free to make moral choices without the fear of reparation from the government. To do so would be a slippery slope towards Iran after the revolution where the oppressive government would arrest people for doing things contrary to Islamic teachings such as drinking alcohol or women showing their hair. I do think that the government should act in a way that facilitates a just and stable society. Murder isn't illegal because it's morally wrong, is illegal because if it wasn't we'd have a very unjust and unstable society. So, when everything that's immoral is illegal you have Iran. When everything that's bad for society is illegal, you have Nazi Germany. The trick is to find a balance between liberty and justice.
 
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Ancilla

Guest
#39
I'm glad that you are keeping that in mind for the future. You are obviously a compassionate person and will undoubtedly make a fine parent (mother?).
Thanks. Yeah, I want to be a mommy. But not until I married to the right guy and we're ready.

The other thing that bothers me is that when non-Christians see us trying to prevent gay adoption they see bigitory. You know and I know that our opposition to homosexuality has nothing to do with homophobia or xenophobia or anything like that, but non-Christians often see it that way. When Christians look to change their own behaviour rather than looking to the government to change the behaviour of others than non-Christians will be able to see who Jesus really is.
 
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Ancilla

Guest
#40
Thirty years of ministry, including the last seven years working in a population that is about forty per cent homosexual. What was the course textbook?
It's at my parents house on the other side of the country, so I don't know off hand. Those stats were from an article we read on gay families which is also at my parents house (and will likely be thrown out to make room for my sister's stuff because she's moving to Africa) so I don't have their citations. If you're really interested go to a university library, then search the academic journals for studies on same sex families. I'm sure there are plenty.
 
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