How can this be? What did Jesus mean?

[Ahwatukee]

Good point, but while tarrying, where would he be? Somewhere other than on earth?

[SUP]23 [/SUP]Then went this saying abroad among the brethren, that that disciple should not die: yet Jesus said not unto him, He shall not die; but, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee?

Hello unobtrusive and Zen,

First of all, the scripture is not saying that John would not die. In fact, right in the scripture it tells us that it was only a rumor that John would remain alive:

"Jesus answered, “If I want him to remain alive until I return, what is that to you? You must follow me.”23Because of this, the rumor spread among the believers that this disciple would not die. But Jesus did not say that he would not die; he only said, “If I want him to remain alive until I return, what is that to you?”

Therefore, it was only a rumor that Jesus said that John would remain alive. This is not related to the issue in your original post.

 

[Ahwatukee]

"Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom." (Matthew 16:28 KJV)

I don't see how these words of Jesus could possibly relate to His 2nd advent. People don't live for 1900 years plus. Never did. Any thoughts?

You are correct in that, Jesus was not referring to His 2nd advent i.e. his return to the earth to end the age. Below is Luke's version:

"Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God.”

About eight days after Jesus said this, he took Peter, John and James with him and went up onto a mountain to pray. As he was praying, the appearance of his face changed, and his clothes became as bright as a flash of lightning."

After Jesus makes this statement, it is immediately followed by "About eight days after Jesus said this" which means the information that follows is linked to the first verse stating that "there be some standing here."

The verse continues with Jesus taking Peter, James and John up a high mountain to pray, which means that they were those of whom Jesus spoke about who would not taste of death before they see the kingdom of God.

The scripture continues with "the appearance of his face changed, and his clothes became as bright as a flash of lightning," which fulfilled the prophecy of those (Peter, James and John) who would not taste of death until they see the Son of man coming in kingdom. Peter, James and John saw a preview of Jesus in his glorified state, which was the fulfillment of the prophecy that Jesus had spoken a week prior to that event.

Those of the preterist camp and others who claim that Jesus has already returned and that end-time events have already taken place, purposely force this scripture to mean that "those who were standing there" would still be alive when Jesus returns to end the age as proof of his return in 70 AD. But the context is clear in that, "those standing there" was referring to Peter, James and John who saw the "Son of Man coming in His kingdom" i.e. Christ's transfiguration into his glorified state, which was the fulfillment of what Jesus had told them a week earlier.

 

[unobtrusive]

I think the bolded words speak a key that so many people just do not understand. I see everyday, in His kingdom being lived out around me, the Son of man coming (being and shown) so clearly and plainly.

Yes! When we see Him for who He truly is, that's when we see Him in His Kingdom. When that Happens, then we die to ourselves. Good point, and it makes sense.

 

[unobtrusive]

A simple direct scripture meaning with some context: I believe Jesus said these words to his disciples in the first year of his ministry. The disciples knew they were going to die at the hands of unbelievers for righteousness. Jesus was just saying to them that some would not die until his resurrection, into his kingdom. Then I wonder if the Kingdom is already in-place 2000 years ago, and that cannot be. I just do not know the significance of the statement for us today. It meant a great deal though to the disciples.

Now if you look at the second meaning (there are many dual meaning statements made by Jesus incidentally), Jesus is saying that when the New Jerusalem come out of heaven there will be believers that will not die a physical death. They will be resurrected on the 'fly.' Now this has more meaning for today.

BL: Both meanings are true. The first already occurred and we are now waiting on second future event.

In Christ, Always

That makes sense. Thanks.

Matthew 4:12-17
[SUP]12 [/SUP]Now when Jesus had heard that John was cast into prison, he departed into Galilee;
[SUP]13 [/SUP]And leaving Nazareth, he came and dwelt in Capernaum, which is upon the sea coast, in the borders of Zabulon and Nephthalim:
[SUP]14 [/SUP]That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Esaias the prophet, saying,
[SUP]15 [/SUP]The land of Zabulon, and the land of Nephthalim, by the way of the sea, beyond Jordan, Galilee of the Gentiles;
[SUP]16 [/SUP]The people which sat in darkness saw great light; and to them which sat in the region and shadow of death light is sprung up.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.



"At hand" ἐγγίζω engízō, eng-id'-zo; from G1451; to make near, i.e. (reflexively) approach:—approach, be at hand, come (draw) near, be (come, draw) nigh.

 

[wolfwint]

"Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom." (Matthew 16:28 KJV)

I don't see how these words of Jesus could possibly relate to His 2nd advent. People don't live for 1900 years plus. Never did. Any thoughts?

Did not John saw in Revelation Jesus coming, while he was alivery?

 

[wolfwint]

Alive in mean

 

[resurrection33]

"Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom." (Matthew 16:28 KJV)

I don't see how these words of Jesus could possibly relate to His 2nd advent. People don't live for 1900 years plus. Never did. Any thoughts?

I believe heaven is what happens to our lives when we repent of our sin.

 

[MattforJesus]

"Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom." (Matthew 16:28 KJV)

I don't see how these words of Jesus could possibly relate to His 2nd advent. People don't live for 1900 years plus. Never did. Any thoughts?

The truth is many people that were alive back then did not taste of death,but are alive and among us now waiting for the kingdom of God,for the Spirit kept them alive,according to Jesus' words.

That is why some people see someone,and say,hey there is a picture of a that same person from 200 years ago,and that is because it is the same person,and many people see people that look like people that lived back at a time that normally they should not be there.

Because it is them,man,don't you get it,they have been living for hundreds of years,and it is crazy.

Mystery solved,and we got to tell the world so people stop freaking out when they think the same person has been living all those years.

Only kidding,or am I.

Luk 17:20 And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
Luk 17:21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

The kingdom of God comes without observation,for the kingdom of God is within you,and when the Spirit was poured upon those that were at the upper room at the day of Pentecost,the kingdom of God has come.

Jesus said you shall receive the Spirit,and with power,and the kingdom of God comes,and with power,for the miracles,and people being saved,that comes as a result.

Some did not die,but witnessed when the Spirit was poured upon all flesh,and Peter preaching the first message,and the Church started to pick up,and the people being saved,and the miracles that happened.

 

[unobtrusive]

Luk 17:20 And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
Luk 17:21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

The kingdom of God comes without observation,for the kingdom of God is within you,and when the Spirit was poured upon those that were at the upper room at the day of Pentecost,the kingdom of God has come.

Jesus said you shall receive the Spirit,and with power,and the kingdom of God comes,and with power,for the miracles,and people being saved,that comes as a result.

Some did not die,but witnessed when the Spirit was poured upon all flesh,and Peter preaching the first message,and the Church started to pick up,and the people being saved,and the miracles that happened.

I agree, but the first part of your post seemed really off, so I didn't quote it. Other than that, I think you are spot on brother.

 

[Zen]

Hello unobtrusive and Zen,

First of all, the scripture is not saying that John would not die. In fact, right in the scripture it tells us that it was only a rumor that John would remain alive:

"Jesus answered, “If I want him to remain alive until I return, what is that to you? You must follow me.”23Because of this, the rumor spread among the believers that this disciple would not die. But Jesus did not say that he would not die; he only said, “If I want him to remain alive until I return, what is that to you?”

Therefore, it was only a rumor that Jesus said that John would remain alive. This is not related to the issue in your original post.

Yeah I know, he said that people don't live for 1900 years and my point was that they could if it was God's will.

It would be quite hard to live that long in such a horrible world.

 

[dcontroversal]

"Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom." (Matthew 16:28 KJV)

I don't see how these words of Jesus could possibly relate to His 2nd advent. People don't live for 1900 years plus. Never did. Any thoughts?

The transfiguration on the mount where Peter, James and John witnessed him in his glory with Moses and Elijah (representatives of the LAW and Prophets)