Idolatry in the house of the Lord these days

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chubbena

Guest
#61
There's a rather big difference between Orthodox and Roman Catholics.
Regardless, Orthodox contradict the teaching of Yeshua in this:
The supreme expositors of the Scriptures are the divinely inspired Fathers of the Church, whether the Greek Fathers or Latin Fathers, Syriac Fathers or Slavic Fathers. Their place in the Orthodox religion cannot be challenged. Their authority cannot be superseded, altered or ignored.

How sad!
 
Oct 16, 2013
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#62
These are not the disciples of Messiah




Well i must agree with u.Pope of Rome and R Catholic Church as schismatics are deeply in heresy.As i have stated many times Pope of Rome is indeed first and greatest Protestant.
 
Oct 16, 2013
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#63
There's a rather big difference between Orthodox and Roman Catholics.
Regardless, Orthodox contradict the teaching of Yeshua in this:
The supreme expositors of the Scriptures are the divinely inspired Fathers of the Church, whether the Greek Fathers or Latin Fathers, Syriac Fathers or Slavic Fathers. Their place in the Orthodox religion cannot be challenged. Their authority cannot be superseded, altered or ignored.

How sad!

How great were Holy Fathers when they kept us in truth!Those were monks and Patriarchs who all of them were in ONE TRUTH which is Holy Spirit in Christ Church!Challenge them,i have nothing against it,u won't be the 1st and the last,but remember very well that they won heresy of their time with TRUTH,not lies or conspiracy!Challenge them all,they all teaching the same things with different words and languages and u are disunited,u are ones against others,and my Holy Fathers were they Slav or Syrian,Greek or American in newest time,they are in perfect communion!That is unity in Holy Spirit my friend!And I love to read them,because their words are words of Heavenly Wisdom,words of Holy Spirit!
Remember that,it is very easy to check.
And this,in Orthodoxy never any letter was changed or twisted,never reformed NOR it will ever be!
 
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chubbena

Guest
#64
Have you read this: Matthew 23:9 do not call anyone on earth 'father,' for you have one Father, and he is in heaven.
 
Oct 16, 2013
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#65
Long time ago answered question.Father have many areas where it can be used.Your biological father,your spiritual father which is your Priest,Holy Fathers who are not God of course but fathers of Church-those who leading Church,and in this verses Father was used in meaning of God as your creator.
Here my friend,and please don't use those shortly trick questions.
 
Oct 14, 2013
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#66
How great were Holy Fathers when they kept us in truth!Those were monks and Patriarchs who all of them were in ONE TRUTH which is Holy Spirit in Christ Church!Challenge them,i have nothing against it,u won't be the 1st and the last,but remember very well that they won heresy of their time with TRUTH,not lies or conspiracy!Challenge them all,they all teaching the same things with different words and languages and u are disunited,u are ones against others,and my Holy Fathers were they Slav or Syrian,Greek or American in newest time,they are in perfect communion!That is unity in Holy Spirit my friend!And I love to read them,because their words are words of Heavenly Wisdom,words of Holy Spirit!
Remember that,it is very easy to check.
And this,in Orthodoxy never any letter was changed or twisted,never reformed NOR it will ever be!
Could you explain Monks as their relationship with the ONE TRUE AND LIVING GOD Thanks
 
Oct 16, 2013
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#67
Could you explain Monks as their relationship with the ONE TRUE AND LIVING GOD Thanks
John 17:13-16 I am coming to you now, but I say these things while I am still in the world, so that they may have the full measure of my joy within them. I have given them your word and the world has hated them, for they are not of the world any more than I am of the world. My prayer is not that you take them out of the world but that you protect them from the evil one. They are not of the world, even as I am not of it.
It should be noted that monachos(Greek word) is a word that had to be forged especially to name the then new phenomenon of men living solitarily in the Egyptian desert. The phenomenon came to an abrupt rise in the 3rd century AD, when thousands of Egyptians, mostly men, set out to the deserts of Nitria, southwest of the city of Alexandria, in order to imitate the life of St. Anthony, the first Christian monk. Monks usually live in a monastery following a single rule and governed by an abbot. Monasteries can be organized as Cenobiums, where all live together, pray together, and share everything; or they can be more disjointed with the monks only coming together for Sunday services. A monk who lives alone, away from society and sometimes also from all other monks, is called an Anchorite or Hesicaste (also called a hermit).Orthodox monks lead very strict lives. It is their overriding purpose to pray for the world and the salvation of all mankind. Monks and nuns do not, in general, do social work or teach school, but leave this for lay people to work out their salvation. Monks are spiritual warriors using prayer and discipline in order to conquer their own shortcomings. It is for this reason that Bishops are almost always chosen from the ranks of monks.
 
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chubbena

Guest
#68
Long time ago answered question.Father have many areas where it can be used.Your biological father,your spiritual father which is your Priest,Holy Fathers who are not God of course but fathers of Church-those who leading Church,and in this verses Father was used in meaning of God as your creator.
Here my friend,and please don't use those shortly trick questions.
Do you know Christians have only one priest who is Yeshua? Do you know there's only one Holy Father who is God?
 
Oct 16, 2013
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#69
The innermost spiritual sense of Orthodox Monasticism is revealed in joyful mourning. This paradoxical phrase denotes a spiritual state in which a monk in his prayer grieves for the sins of the world at at the same time experiences the regenerating spiritual joy of Christ's forgiveness and resurrection. A monk dies in order to live, he forgets himself in order to find his real self in God, he becomes ignorant of worldly knowledge in order to attain real spiritual wisdom which is given only to the humble ones.Since the early years of the Christian era, Christians have been called by Christ Himself to life in the world without being of the world (John 17:13-16). They are distinct from the world, because of their special conduct and their exemplary ethical life. When, toward the middle of the second century of the Christian era, Christian life reached a low ebb, some Christians, both men and women, reacted to this by raising their own personal standards of austere Christian life. They practiced chastity, celibacy, poverty, prayer and fasting (Justin, I Apology 15:6; Athenagoras, Apology 33; and Galenus, De Sententiis Politiae Platonicae). These people considered themselves Christians selected to live the life of angels (Matt. 22:30). They lived by themselves or in special houses as a community. At about the middle of the third century, they began fleeing the world and going to the desert, where they established permanent habitations, whether by themselves or in small groups. They are known as the "anchorites" (from anachoresis: departure, flight); the hermits (from eremos: desert); and the monastics (from monos: alone, for a monastic "lives in the presence of God alone"). A good example of an anchorite monk is Saint Anthony the Great, who fled the world [c. 285] and established himself in the desert of Middle Egypt. Many people imitated his example; they went and lived close to him, thus "populating the desert" (Troparion of St. Anthony). These monks lived by themselves in huts and small houses to form a village called "lavra" (later the concept of "lavra" develops, as we will see). St. Anthony is considered the Father of Orthodox monasticism, for his kind of monasticism, that of "living alone with God as his only companion" remained the most cherished monastic ideal for the monks of the Eastern Orthodox Church throughout the ages.
 
Oct 16, 2013
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#70
Do you know Christians have only one priest who is Yeshua? Do you know there's only one Holy Father who is God?
Yes i know,as i have told u,we do not worship our Holy Fathers as God,they are Fathers of the Church,not Creator!


The earliest organization of the Christian churches in Palestine was similar to that of Jewish synagogues, who were governed by a council of elders (presbyteroi). In Acts 11:30 and 15:22, we see this collegiate system of government in Jerusalem, and in Acts 14:23, the Apostle Paul ordains elders in the churches he founded. Initially, these presbyters were apparently identical with the overseers (episkopoi, i.e., bishops ), as such passages as Acts 20:17 and Titus 1:5,7 indicate, and the terms were interchangeable.Shortly after the New Testament period, with the death of the Apostles, there was a differentiation in the usage of the synonymous terms, giving rise to the appearance of two distinct offices, bishop and presbyter . The bishop was understood mainly as the president of the council of presbyters, and so the bishop came to be distinguished both in honor and in prerogative from the presbyters, who were seen as deriving their authority by means of delegation from the bishop. The distinction between presbyter and bishop is made fairly soon after the Apostolic period, as is seen in the 2nd century writings of St. Ignatius of Antioch , who uses the terms consistently and clearly to refer to two different offices (along with deacon ).
The Orthodox Church often refers to presbyters in English as priests (priest is etymologically derived from the Greek presbyteros via the Latin presbyter). This usage is seen by some Protestant Christians as stripping the laity of its rightful priestly status, while those who use the term defend its usage by saying that, while they do believe in the priesthood of all believers, they do not believe in the eldership of all believers.
 
Oct 16, 2013
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#71
Do you know Christians have only one priest who is Yeshua?
As Lord Jesus Christ serv Liturgy in Heavenly Church as High Priest the same is with Priest in Church on Earth.The Divine Liturgy is on the same way celebrated one Heavens and earth,that is the case in Orthodoxy,Heavens on earth!Priest in Church is Icon or Jesus Christ!
 
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chubbena

Guest
#72
As Lord Jesus Christ serv Liturgy in Heavenly Church as High Priest the same is with Priest in Church on Earth.The Divine Liturgy is on the same way celebrated one Heavens and earth,that is the case in Orthodoxy,Heavens on earth!Priest in Church is Icon or Jesus Christ!
I urge you to read the letter to the Hebrews particularly chapter 9.
Please also read 1 Timothy chapter 2 particularly verse 5 - For there is one God and one mediator between God and mankind, the man Christ Jesus.
 
Oct 31, 2011
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#73
I don't think that orthodox, Catholics, or St Anthony, etc. is the issue. The issue is idolatry in our churches. There are many statues and images of Christ in our churches. The people who put these in the church say that doesn't mean they worship these images.

When Moses returned from his 40 days on Mt Sinai he found that the people had made golden calves so they would have something to look at as they thought of their God. They were so used to having an image to look at, they were not able to picture an invisible spirit as God, and they told Moses so. They said they knew the golden calf wasn't God, it just helped them worship God. Scripture said that was wrong to do.

If instructions came from God then, and God is eternal and does not change over time, then the same instructions from God should be looked on today.
 
Oct 16, 2013
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#74
Maybe u have to read those scriptures that i have posted in my 1st post about priest.
And u say man Jesus Christ?What man!?
 
Oct 16, 2013
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#75
I don't think that orthodox, Catholics, or St Anthony, etc. is the issue. The issue is idolatry in our churches. There are many statues and images of Christ in our churches. The people who put these in the church say that doesn't mean they worship these images.

When Moses returned from his 40 days on Mt Sinai he found that the people had made golden calves so they would have something to look at as they thought of their God. They were so used to having an image to look at, they were not able to picture an invisible spirit as God, and they told Moses so. They said they knew the golden calf wasn't God, it just helped them worship God. Scripture said that was wrong to do.

If instructions came from God then, and God is eternal and does not change over time, then the same instructions from God should be looked on today.
If u are noticed,and i believe u are,invisible God from Old Testament became very visible Godman in New Testament.If u say that visible God cannot be painted on Icons then u directly denie incarnation of God in form of man whose name is Jesus Christ and u are immediately condemned by 8th Ecumenical Council.Do not play with Icons and Crosses as some idols!
 
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chubbena

Guest
#76
Yes i know,as i have told u,we do not worship our Holy Fathers as God,they are Fathers of the Church,not Creator!


The earliest organization of the Christian churches in Palestine was similar to that of Jewish synagogues, who were governed by a council of elders (presbyteroi). In Acts 11:30 and 15:22, we see this collegiate system of government in Jerusalem, and in Acts 14:23, the Apostle Paul ordains elders in the churches he founded. Initially, these presbyters were apparently identical with the overseers (episkopoi, i.e., bishops ), as such passages as Acts 20:17 and Titus 1:5,7 indicate, and the terms were interchangeable.Shortly after the New Testament period, with the death of the Apostles, there was a differentiation in the usage of the synonymous terms, giving rise to the appearance of two distinct offices, bishop and presbyter . The bishop was understood mainly as the president of the council of presbyters, and so the bishop came to be distinguished both in honor and in prerogative from the presbyters, who were seen as deriving their authority by means of delegation from the bishop. The distinction between presbyter and bishop is made fairly soon after the Apostolic period, as is seen in the 2nd century writings of St. Ignatius of Antioch , who uses the terms consistently and clearly to refer to two different offices (along with deacon ).
The Orthodox Church often refers to presbyters in English as priests (priest is etymologically derived from the Greek presbyteros via the Latin presbyter). This usage is seen by some Protestant Christians as stripping the laity of its rightful priestly status, while those who use the term defend its usage by saying that, while they do believe in the priesthood of all believers, they do not believe in the eldership of all believers.
But you are ruled by them and that interpretation of the Bible must through them.
Shortly after the New Testament period? We are in the New Testament period!
None of the New Testament churches in the Bible had the hierarchy your church has. In fact, quite a few were at home (See Romans 16). Do you see that?
 
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chubbena

Guest
#77
Maybe u have to read those scriptures that i have posted in my 1st post about priest.
And u say man Jesus Christ?What man!?
So your church didn't teach you the letter to the Hebrews and 2 Timothy? It's about time to read because what you quoted has become history.
 
Dec 21, 2012
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#78
So,Church and Jesus Christ are 2 different things in sense what Jesus Christ teach and what Church teach?
It is two different things when the Roman Catholic Church says come to their church for life when Jesus said come to Him for life. All invitations Jesus had given for eternal life was to Himself by believing in Him that we are saved because He is our Saviour. Trust is the basis for all relationships and we are living this reconciled relationship with God thru Jesus Christ... not thru a church. We are to have fellowship with the Son in the assembly, but nowadays, the church is assembling for something else in His name and serving the glory of that something else instead of the Son which means it is an antichrist.

The call is to return to our first love since the Son of God is the Bridegroom after all.
 
Oct 16, 2013
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#79
Again i must disappoint u.Of course that Orthodox Church perfectly understand meaning of verse that u have mentioned.But what u do not understand is why Church must have priest,what is connection between Jesus Christ as Priest and man as priest in Church.That u can understand this fact,literally reading of Bible won't help u and that is why u have to read Holy Fathers of Church,history of Church and those verses that i have gave u.
 
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jordy1984

Guest
#80
I have been involved in my life with Roman Catholics and no them very well can I just say that the message of roman Catholicism is a message of good works will get you to heaven and not resting on the finished work of Christ.may I say you need to study what is happening when your taking part in the communion , the actual body and blood of Christ ?again this is an unbiased view.