Jesus' wife gospel.

[pickles]

One has to realise that there will always be such claims, and wether proved or not, we walk by faith, not flesh.
There will be times to come where many false claims will be made, I do wonder just how proved these worldly claims will be or how real?
What matters is that one lives by faith, so when such so called evidence comes, we will not falter.
Faith, hope and love, these are the three things that last!

God bless
pickles

 

[JaumeJ]

With whatever respect is due, this question belongs in an atheist or agnostic room. The participants here are reputed to believe the Holy Scriptures. For me, the subject of the question is frankly repugnant.

 

[Cobus]

Just to teach the young ones the truth about God's gift to couples.... Read 1 Corinthians 7. It is all about questions the people had about holy matrimony...or this thing a MAN and a VIRGIN can have. Firstly IT IS GOOD FOR A MAN NOT TO TOUCH A WOMAN... But if the man urges to strong, LET HIM HAVE A WIFE!... This is the only way babies should be made.... A man and his WIFE.

Now what if the man can control his urges... Remain UNMARRIED! Best thing. Second best thing... Marry the virgin but let her remain a virgin..... Third best thing... Marry the virgin and make her a woman, "giving out in marriage". Anything else is NOT GOOD!

What would Jesus have done... the BEST... He did not even had urges, because he had ABSOLUTE CONTROL OVER EVERYTHING!

My message to Satan... You are really a feeble and pethetic person to think you can fool God's people. Go away you rubbish!

 

[moment_of_faith]

2 Timothy 4:3 For a time is coming when people will no longer listen to sound and wholesome teaching. They will follow their own desires and will look for teachers who will tell them whatever their itching ears want to hear. 4 They will reject the truth and chase after myths.

 

[kenisyes]

Very good point. Jewish men were permitted to marry at 12 or 14 (can't remember), and certainly expected to have wives by the age of 20, the age one is ready for military service. The next age brackets are traditionally 30 for a priest and 40 for an elder.
A priest could only have one wife, and Y'Shua has a virgin bride set aside for that.

Excellent analysis, Wolfinoxhide, but it leaves unanswered the part of my question about how He explained His lack of a wife at say age 25. To say He is a priest and is waiting until age 30 to claim His bride would contradict the intentions of His statement in John "my time has not yet come" to His mother, and after the transfiguration "tell no one..." He was not of a priestly family, at least not obviously, and it could even be alleged He was conceived out of wedlock. Even at the beginning of His preaching at age 30, many had doubts that He had what it took to become an elder, and thought He was just crazy.

 

[chasten]

Idk. I dont think this 'wife' is Mary Magdelene though. Mary Magdelene was married to Jebedee. The only way they wouldnt have BOTH been stoned to death, is if Jebedee died. And Magdelene, James, and Joseph, her two sons were all his disciples, Im sure if he had died, or gotten sick, Jesus would have healed him, or brought him back, like Lazarous. And him being so close to their family, Im sure if that had happened it would have been recorded in the bible. I mean, why record people whos lives were healed by Jesus, that were just friends, and then leave out such important, and key characters such as Jebedee and Mary Magdelene, and sons? So I think he probably intends to take a wife at some point, but I dont think it was her. And the way the news makes it sound, it puts context like in the future. My wife will be...Not, my wife is... Just my take on the whole thing.

 

[carolineh]

come to think of it the papyrus could have belonged to Jesus Barrabus

 

[Photoss]

I think this 'find' will go about as far as the Gospel of Judas did a few years back...

 

[WolfInOxHide]

Excellent analysis, Wolfinoxhide, but it leaves unanswered the part of my question about how He explained His lack of a wife at say age 25. To say He is a priest and is waiting until age 30 to claim His bride would contradict the intentions of His statement in John "my time has not yet come" to His mother, and after the transfiguration "tell no one..." He was not of a priestly family, at least not obviously, and it could even be alleged He was conceived out of wedlock. Even at the beginning of His preaching at age 30, many had doubts that He had what it took to become an elder, and thought He was just crazy.

Well I don't know why He would have waited until 30 unless it's because from His POV, He couldn't find His betrothed until He began His ministry, but it's interesting to note that a priest "must" be the husband of one wife by torah, and at the time He started His ministry, about age 30, or sooner, I would say He became at least spiritually betrothed to the church to be.

The bible says He was "about to be 30" at the start of the story, and it could have been that He was not yet considering Himself as a Priest when He made the statement "my time has not yet come" and did that early miracle anyway, in keeping with the 5th commandment, to honor His mother's request.

He was from a Priestly family if you count His mother's family, i.e. Zacharias, at the least.

What is it you were saying about the transfiguration though? I'm missing that one.

 

[lost1972]

it's nothing but yet another false teaching, the end times are coming and you will see plenty more of these ,look at the situation in the middle east,things are accelerating, just make sure you are right with the Lord and don't worry about this junk. every time a thread with an obvious false teaching in the title gets posted it shows up in search engines and makes others wonder

 

[Wonderland]

What if Jesus did have a wife? Does that really change anything? Not really. My faith is still secure in his death and resurrection. I don't think he had a wife, but I wouldn't stake my salvation on it, nor would I get into an argument about it. There is no way to prove that he didn't...

Let it go and focus on the important stuff. It's really not a big deal.

 

[ozell]

What do you guys think about all these hype about the discovery of the papyrus scrap in which they claim that Jesus speaks of his own wife and appears to confirm her role as a recognised disciple.
It has been scrutnized by scholars across the world, however the Harvard professor who studied the papyrus claims it is authentic and can change the role of women in the church.

Jesus wife is his church

this should be what the text is talking about

any knowledgeable christian know that Jesus was not married and his wife is the church

 

[A-Omega]

Jesus is literally the Bishop of the true Christian church.

A bishop must be the husband of one wife. (see how these rules have much greater significance than we think?).

The church is the bride of Christ.


Not to mention that the document is a Gnostic text. The Gnostics were not Christians any more than the Mormons are today. They may use the same names (Jesus, Mary Magdalene, etc.) but it is a completely different religion altogether.

 

[kenisyes]

wolfinoxhide, first, can you give me a reference on the priest MUST be husband of one wife? I'm trying to settle another issue in my own mind that that will apply to. I need to check the Hebrew and the relevant Talmud passages. I don't remember it exactly that way when I read it last.

My point about the transfiguration is that Jesus did not wish His full anointing to be shared with people at that time. If He was reticent about it then, He would certainly have been reticent about it some years earlier.

My specific question concerns Jesus' communication about Himself to neighbors, friends, etc. from about age 16 on. They would say, why don't you have a wife? He cannot say "because I am a priest of the new covenant", unless He wishes to contradict the intention of His later statements I mentioned. (He wanted to keep it secret for years to come at that age.) He cannot say "I am a priest because of my maternal grandfather", since they would say "what are you doing as a carpenter? Why aren't you off studying Talmud with the rabbis?" and would also say "you were born in sin, since your mother was not married to Joseph your father, and that makes you unfit to serve". As excellent and as correct as your logic is, and as certain as I am that He Himself knew it, I cannot see what He would have said to explain Himself, and the Jewish matchmaker culture would probably have kicked in, and they would start leaning on Joseph to arrange a marriage.

 

[WolfInOxHide]

a reference on the priest MUST be husband of one wife

As far as the "one" count, as far as I know, we only have one reference in new testament, but it's from the synogogue's star pupil of torah:

1 Tim 3:2
"A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach"

We make a lot of errors reading the bible as if it were written in english and with modern expression of point. In greek, "must" doesn't mean "if / then / must." Some also read that as "preacher" or "deacon."
He wasn't creating "bishop", he was fresh out of the synagogue and meeting Y'Shua, the high Priest.

And while torah doesn't say "only one", leviticus reiterates the "must" with the usage of "shall" which also presents an idea of imminence.

Leviticus 21:13
"And he shall take a wife in her virginity."

Also somewhere in Ezekiel

That's about as good as I can do, it seems also like one of the OT source texts may say "one virgin", but don't take that unless you find it for yourself, because I might be remembering wrong.

What would He have said to others to explain not getting physically married? Probably something mysterious like "Don't you know I must be about my Father's work?"
Or maybe like "Don't you know that a priest must only have one wife?" -not trying to put words in His mouth, just imagining the man like the rest of us.

I just can't mentally make Him having a physical wife a part of the story. I even think He could have married Mary M. if He had wanted to, maybe even considered it, but if He loved her that way, I think He would rather have spared her becoming a widow.

 

[lost1972]

why does everyone think that Jesus would have followed the rules, he MADE the rules, he would have been considered radical back then, why would anyone think he would have had to follow mans rules and somehow be required to marry? his purpose in life didn't require getting married, his job was to shake things up and change everything permanently, he had enough to do with taking on the sins of the world to have concern for marriage
.

 

[kenisyes]

Wolfinoxhide, thanks. I had some time today and looked it up. The Talmud I suspect, derives the "only one" part from the absence of a plural ending on the word wife (Jewish interpretation laws: every jot and tittle of Torah counts). The verb "take" is in imperfect aspect, thus stating what the regular practice is to be: high priests are married, as a matter of law. (Recall Hebrew has no future tense until way later in history.) Technically also, there is an untranslated word in Hebrew yod-qoph-chet, it says in "the stalk" (according to Jastrow) of her virginity, and is interpreted as slightly before she is ready for marriage. Undoubtedly refers to Jesus coming for us while we were still in bondage to sin, and not ready for Him.

It does not seem applicable to the question I was trying to resolve, which is the three NT passages vs. church practice. The Timothy passage you quoted states it for bishops, later deacons, and Titus echoes it for bishops. Both bishops and deacons cannot have been considered high priests, so Paul is not simply applying Leviticus, as I had hoped I would find. (In fact, the Didache says the wandering apostles/prophets were considered the "high" priests, not the elected overseers and appointed deacons.) The context makes it clear that it is for respectability and ability to serve the church proven by the organization of the home. As you say, Paul was just meeting Y'Shua, not creating an office of bishop. My question that I was researching concerns that every denomination interprets this passage differently, and I was hoping to settle the issue.

He certainly did not love Magdalene that way. Personally, I have often fancied that He was married as a teenager, and wife died in childbirth or a fire, or raid. I guess they left it out so He could be all things to all people?

 

[WolfInOxHide]

He certainly did not love Magdalene that way. Personally, I have often fancied that He was married as a teenager, and wife died in childbirth or a fire, or raid. I guess they left it out so He could be all things to all people?

Well, bottom line is what would it change? The media is screaming like "divinity of Christ is on the brink of being proven false once and for all" - That is their goal here, to break the cornerstone however possible.
Even just to keep it in question is sufficient.

They could go back in a time machine and film a wedding banquet and it wouldn't change a thing about how to repent and enter the kingdom.

I think He has one virgin bride, "clothed in sackcloth longing for the husband of her youth."
Humble yet priceless.

 

[kenisyes]

I believe we have 100% agreement, wolfinoxhide.