Not By Works

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A

Ariel82

Guest

yes, this is where legalism wants to tear us down, That's why I am so passionate against it. I know I get out of hand sometimes, but it is a dangerous thing, it keeps many people out of heaven, and keeps many of Gods children from growing.
You know I had a dream years ago of demons driving people to work work work. Keeping folks so busy, they never stopped and pray. They never rested or spent time being with God.

I watch some people work work work for money and buy things as if they can find happiness and joy in material possessions but they have maybe an hour to actually enjoy any of it,

Some parents rush rush rush through life from soccer games, to ballet to baseball to band but do they spend one hour just talking and listening to their kids?

Sometimes more activity isn't the answer.

Sometimes God just wants us to rest and spend time with Him. Just enjoy the blessings God has given us. Be content and thankful.

We are talking about the good gifts God gives us. Today, it's that God gives us peace,

The Bible story is when Jesus calmed the storm on the sea of Galilee.

Have you ever had times you totally freak out and cry to God in fear "Save me Lord, don't you care that I am going to drown!" and you hear in your heart "O ye of little faith" before God calms the storm and gives you peace?

Anyway, bedtime.

Hope you have a blessed night and that everyone remembers we have a savior that can calm any storm.
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
Not really.

Lets be honest us men have to be very careful when it comes to women folk.

"Does this dress make My bum look big" My wife asked.
Turns out my response "No it's all the cake and chocolate you eat that does that" wasn't acceptable.

one morning she said to me as looking in the mirror in our bedroom "I look so old, I've got wirnkles and things are sagging and then she turned to me and looked at me.

Having already learned my lesson I slid under the duvet and prayed silently for the rapture to occur RIGHT NOW.
You could say that she still has the same beautiful and loving spirit that she had when you first meet and that's why you loved her in the first place. That to you, she is still beautiful and that you thank God He has blessed you with her Every day.


Or something like that,

It works better if you don't snicker afterwards.
 
W

willybob

Guest
Found a good explanation of SANCTIFICATION for those reading along...



What is Sanctification?


The definition, which fits nicely with what the Bible teaches, is that it means to be set apart for holy use. It also means to make holy or to purify. This is exactly the goal of every believer in Christ. Like the Old Testament Temple vessels used by the priest, these were to be used for holy purposes and to be pure and to glorify God.

Today, Christians have been regenerated by the Holy Spirit and our bodies are the temple of God in which dwells the Holy Spirit and our bodies are vessels to be used for a holy or pure purpose for the glory of God. The origin of this word is from the Latin “sanctus” which means holy or to consecrate. The suffix of “tion” in sanctification is the ongoing or continuing process of this becoming holy. It is a progressive holiness and growing in purity and it takes a lifetime. We are being perfected and this perfection takes time and patience.

I thank God that He is patient with me in this process. We can not see much of our own progress until we start looking back at last year, and the year before and then ten years ago. There should be noticeable differences in a person’s life that are tangible evidences of growth.


I believe true character is revealed when no one is watching. If you can imagine that you are a parent and you leave your teenager at home; what that teenager does at home alone is a revelation of their true character. It is not so much what we do when others are watching but what we do when nobody is watching. What people think of us when they see our actions is what we might think we are truly like and it’s probably the way people think we are. When we are alone and only God is watching is the true test of who we are.


Joseph’s Sanctification

What is Sanctification
The Bible teaches that sanctification means to be set apart for holy use.

Joseph is an excellent example of the process of sanctification. Joseph was treated unfairly when his brothers sold him into slavery. He would later end up in prison through no fault of his own. His character was revealed when he refused to blame God and turn bitter while languishing in prison for many years. Joseph was in charge of Potiphar’s house. Potiphar was the Captain of Pharaoh’s Guard. Next to the Pharaoh, this was probably the greatest position of power in all of Egypt. Potiphar trusted Joseph enough to leave him in charge of his entire household (Gen 39:5) and when Potiphar’s wife tried to seduce him, Joseph refused.

Potiphar must have had a beautiful wife and this lady had to have had great riches. When she tried to grab Joseph to lie with her, he not only ran but he ran so fast he left his cloak. He left his cloak but kept his character. When fighting temptations to sin, the Christian can do one of two things; fight or flight. That is, we can resist temptation and fight it through prayer or we can take flight.

James said when we are tempted we must resist the devil and he will flee from us (James 4:7) but Paul said we must flee from sexual temptation, indicating we shouldn’t just resist but run (1 Cor 6:18)!


Can you imagine how hard it was for Joseph to resist this urge, day after day? This temptation must have gone on for many days, remember, Potiphar‘s wife had to be one of the most beautiful women of Egypt. At times like these, the work of the Holy Spirit is indispensable, able to convict us of things that we know are clearly wrong. Not only did Joseph not want to violate God’s law but he said, “How then could I do such a wicked thing and sin against God” (Gen 39:9)?

Joseph thought about God when he was tempted and that is sanctification at work. When Joseph refused to give into temptation, he sanctified God’s Name by his doing what was right. When we glorify God in our bodies, we are being sanctified and we glorify God by our decisions to not sin against Him. In this case, Joseph sanctified the name of God, even in private, where there would have been no eyewitnesses.

Joseph’s refusal to sin and his fleeing temptation is the perfect model of holiness and it is how we can also avoid sin. This is the process of sanctification. That is exactly the way the Holy Spirit works in us today in sanctifying us. He tells us when something is wrong, and if we are in a compromising situation we should run, just like Joseph did.


God the Holy Spirit tells us when something isn’t quite right. He tells us when we are not in a good situation and it is often that quiet, still small voice much like the human conscience. Life is not fair and during such times our growing in holiness or sanctification can be increased. Even when we are in the will of God, there will be times of injustice, like when Joseph was unfairly thrown into prison.

We can justify our sin more easily in times like these and in times of prosperity. What is really pleasing to God is when we do justly when no one is watching and still do so when we are suffering unjustly.


Your Sanctification is the Will of God

God’s ultimate aim is for us to be sanctified and grow in holiness, but unless you are regenerated or born again, you have no hope to be sanctified because sanctification takes the power of the Holy Spirit. It is impossible by human effort. Paul says that “…the sinful nature desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the sinful nature.

They are in conflict with each other, so that you do not do what you want” (Gal 5:17). What is God’s will for your life? To be sanctified and to grow in holiness for God says, “Be holy because I, the LORD your God, am holy” (Lev 19:2). Paul knew this as he wrote, “It is God’s will that you should be sanctified: that you should avoid sexual immorality” (I Thess 4:3). This is exactly why “he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. In love” (Eph 1:4).
How to be Sanctified


As stated earlier, we must be regenerated by the Holy Spirit. We must place our trust in Christ to save us and have faith in the Savior. If our trust and faith is in our self, in our own works, then we will fail miserably. How does this happen then except by the will of God and by His power, for “you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God” (1 Cor 6:11).

The key portion of that is “by the Spirit of our God.” It’s not something you do by superhuman effort but by the power of the Holy Spirit and we were justified and “have been made holy through the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ once for all” (Heb 10:10). I don’t see anything about me and my efforts here but we do see in Joseph’s example that he did have to flee temptation and resist evil, so it’s not like we don’t participate in the process at all. It does take time to grow in holiness so don’t expect it to happen overnight (2 Pet 3:18).


Paul writes, “Not that I have already obtained all this, or have already arrived at my goal, but I press on to take hold of that for which Christ Jesus took hold of me. Brothers and sisters, I do not consider myself yet to have taken hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead, I press on toward the goal to win the prize for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus” (Phil 3:12-14).

Listen to what Paul had to contribute toward his attaining holiness and how he had to be proactive: He pressed on, he had a goal, he took hold, he forgot the past, and he strained toward it. Those are all the things that he did and Joseph did too. You don’t fall into sanctification, you cooperate with the Holy Spirit and you participate with Him in the process.

We see that it involves “sanctification in the Spirit” (1 Pet 1:2) and it is “sanctification by the Spirit“ (2 Thess 2:13) that “he might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word” (Eph 5:26). The “washing of water with the word” is a direct reference to the Word of God, the Bible.

When we read the Bible on a regular basis, this allows the Holy Spirit to sanctify us by the power that is in the Word. Remember there is real power in the active, living, sharper-than-a-two-edged-sword Word (Heb 4:12). It washes us…cleanses us…and gives us access to the power of the Holy Spirit which is the same power of God that raised Christ from the dead!


Conclusion


Sanctification takes a lifetime. We will never be completely perfected until that day of His return. We must resist temptation, flee from sin, press on, take hold, have a goal, strain toward, and read the Word of God. These allow the Holy Spirit to work in us, with us, and through us by cooperating and being proactive to avoid sinning against God.

We are told to be a living sacrifice. The only problem with being a living sacrifice is that it can crawl off the altar. Paul gives us a fitting conclusion: “I urge you, brothers and sisters, in view of God’s mercy, to offer your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and pleasing to God—this is your true and proper worship. Do not conform to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to test and approve what God’s will is—his good, pleasing and perfect will” (Rom 12:1-2).


Read more: What is Sanctification? A Bible Study

very good Fran, :eek: .... and I can attest that God doesn't set aside sinners for His use, one must purify himself as the apostle James said, making himself fit for the Masters use....
 
May 12, 2017
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very good Fran, :eek: .... and I can attest that God doesn't set aside sinners for His use, one must purify himself as the apostle James said, making himself fit for the Masters use....
This happens at conversion, because positional righteousness is not personal performance, but a position and gift given at conversion along with salvation....
 
Dec 12, 2013
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This happens at conversion, because positional righteousness is not personal performance, but a position and gift given at conversion along with salvation....

Amen...ole spongebob misses the mark like an archer with curved arrows and no vanes.....his working for sinless perfectionist dogma reeks.....
 

slave

Senior Member
Mar 20, 2015
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After reading all this ...all I can say is...... Salvation is Gift ...Not a Reward
Revelation 3:21 - He who overcomes, I will grant to him to sit down with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne.

1 John 5:4 - For whatever is born of God overcomes the world; and this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.

From beginning "have been saved through faith" (Ephesians 2:8) to end "receiving the end of your faith--the salvation of your souls" (1 Peter 1:9) salvation is by grace through faith and is not by works.

(1 Corinthians 1:30):

"Of (God) are ye of Christ Jesus, who became wisdom to us from God, both Righteousness and Sanctification; and Redemption."

God has not given us righteousness, He gives Christ to us since Christ is our righteousness. God has not given us sanctification, He has given us Christ because Christ is our sanctification. God has not given us redemption, He gives us Christ because Christ is our redemption. God has not given us wisdom, He gives us Christ in as much as Christ is our wisdom. It is for this reason that we say, God's Christ is God's everything. God's Christ is God's entity and province; aside from Him God has neither entity nor province.

I would suppose that if God came and told us in person today that He will make the Lord Jesus our justifier you would indeed say, "He indeed is our justifier." But according to Paul's writing here God has not made the Lord Jesus our justifier. God causes Him to be our justification. Is this not awesome news? Christ is our righteousness.

Neither does God say here, thru Paul, that the Lord Jesus is to be our sanctifier. Instead, he says that the Lord Jesus is sanctification. Christ does not come to sanctify us, He comes to be Himself our sanctification. Our sanctification is not a thing, an action, or a behavior. Our sanctification is a person; that being Jesus Christ, whom will proceed at finishing His work in us and thru us.

Nor does God assert that the Lord is our
redeemer, but He says that the Lord is our redemption. Does this sound foreign to your ears? For Paul does not say that God has set the Lord Jesus to be the redeemer, he declares instead that the Lord Jesus is redemption.

I thank God every day that Christ is our redemption as well as our redeemer. He is our sanctification as well as our sanctifier. He is our righteousness as well as our justifier. He is our wisdom as well as the one who makes us wise.

Thank God then that Jesus is both our Savior as well as our salvation. (Psalms 27:1). That which God gives us is the Lord Jesus Himself whom will carry out His Father's will in us and thru us. (If) our will aligns with His..

"Lord, lay us bare. May this be the day of exposure to many people, that we may see ourselves as You see us. May Your ray of light strike us which will uncover all falsehood and distinguish Yourself from all substitutes. Bless Your own Word, and glorify Your name; In the name of the Lord Jesus...AMEN."


 

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
Nov 24, 2013
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No one runs from true love.

Fran
Yes. I know what you're saying.
John 6:68

Stones:
Joh 6:68 Simon Peter answered him, "Lord, to whom would we go? You have the words of eternal life.

Ok..

Fran:
But I know persons that have. For different resons. But then I have to hear they were never saved to begin with. They sure seemed saved.

Stones:

Unlike Ariel, I do believe this parable explains your questioning.

Mat 13:3 Then he began to tell them many things in parables. He said, "Listen! A farmer went out to sow.
Mat 13:4 As he was sowing, some seeds fell along the path, and birds came and ate them up.

Mat 13:5 Other seeds fell on stony ground, where they did not have a lot of soil. They sprouted at once because the soil wasn't deep.
Mat 13:6 But when the sun came up, they were scorched. Since they did not have any roots, they dried up.

Mat 13:7 Other seeds fell among thorn bushes, and the thorn bushes grew higher and choked them out.

Mat 13:8 But other seeds fell on good soil and produced a crop, some 100, some 60, and some 30 times what was sown.

Life situations will eventually expose the heart. And in another place the Word says they left because they weren’t of us. Many reasons why this happens. Some are good at acting…and even the world can have good morals.

Somebody must of hurt you really bad.

Fran:
How do you explain 2 Peter 2:20-22

Stones:

Peter is speaking of false prophets and teachers who have heard the gospel, possibly was baptized in water, but never had a heart change. They are confusing the believers with their heresies. So this is a specific situation that Peter is addressing.

One can hear the gospel, believe but not receive with a repentant heart from sin. The ground of our heart has to be prepared for the seed to take root. And He does know who are His. It will eventually happen because I know the hound of Heaven and His ways. He will not lose His own. Even if it’s on the death bed.


False Prophets and Teachers
2Pe 2:1 Now there were false prophets among the people, just as there also will be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies and even deny the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction on themselves.
2Pe 2:2 Many people will follow their immoral ways, and because of them the way of truth will be maligned.

This is a letter and the third chapter is a separate letter. A whole new dynamic in this letter.


Fran:
How do you explain Hebrews 6:4-6

Heb 6:1 Therefore, leaving behind the elementary teachings about the Messiah, let us continue to be carried along to maturity, not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead actions, faith toward God,
Heb 6:2 instruction about baptisms, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment.
Heb 6:3 And this we will do, if God permits.
Heb 6:4 For it is impossible to keep on restoring to repentance time and again people who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have become partners with the Holy Spirit,
Heb 6:5 who have tasted the goodness of God's word and the powers of the coming age,
Heb 6:6 and who have fallen away, as long as they continue to crucify the Son of God to their own detriment by exposing him to public ridicule.
Heb 6:7 For when the ground soaks up rain that often falls on it and continues producing vegetation useful to those for whom it is cultivated, it receives a blessing from God.
Heb 6:8 However, if it continues to produce thorns and thistles, it is worthless and in danger of being cursed, and in the end will be burned.
Heb 6:9 Even though we speak like this, dear friends, we are convinced of better things in your case, things that point to salvation.
Heb 6:10 For God is not so unjust as to forget your work and the love you have shown him as you have ministered to the saints and continue to minister to them.
Heb 6:11 But we want each of you to continue to be diligent to the very end, in order to give full assurance to your hope.
Heb 6:12 Then, instead of being lazy, you will imitate those who are inheriting the promises through faith and patience.

Don’t fall away from the good news of the gospel and turn back to the law. Speaking to Jewish believers.


Fran:
How do you explain all the exhortations in the N.T. to HOLD FAST, CONTINUE IN, IF, IF, IF we do ...

I'll get quotes if you need them, but it's getting late here...

One...

2 Peter 1:5-10


Stones:
2Pe 1:3 His divine power has given us everything we need for life and godliness through the full knowledge of the one who called us by his own glory and excellence.
2Pe 1:4 Through these he has given us his precious and wonderful promises, so that through them you may participate in the divine nature, seeing that you have escaped the corruption that is in the world caused by evil desires.
2Pe 1:5 For this very reason, you must make every effort to supplement your faith with moral character, your moral character with knowledge,

All is within when we are filled with Holy Spirit. Peter is just encouraging.
.

We may fail. We may sin. We may walk away for a time. But, He never does.

Why do you concentrate on failure? We walk by faith in Him and His Spirit He has given.

Like I said previously. I think someone hurt you bad…and failed you.

It’s a tough thing to deal with. But, we can with His help.
 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
1,370
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(1 Corinthians 1:30):

"Of (God) are ye of Christ Jesus, who became wisdom to us from God, both Righteousness and Sanctification; and Redemption."

God has not given us righteousness, He gives Christ to us since Christ is our righteousness. God has not given us sanctification, He has given us Christ because Christ is our sanctification. God has not given us redemption, He gives us Christ because Christ is our redemption. God has not given us wisdom, He gives us Christ in as much as Christ is our wisdom. It is for this reason that we say, God's Christ is God's everything. God's Christ is God's entity and province; aside from Him God has neither entity nor province.

I would suppose that if God came and told us in person today that He will make the Lord Jesus our justifier you would indeed say, "He indeed is our justifier." But according to Paul's writing here God has not made the Lord Jesus our justifier. God causes Him to be our justification. Is this not awesome news? Christ is our righteousness.

Neither does God say here, thru Paul, that the Lord Jesus is to be our sanctifier. Instead, he says that the Lord Jesus is sanctification. Christ does not come to sanctify us, He comes to be Himself our sanctification. Our sanctification is not a thing, an action, or a behavior. Our sanctification is a person; that being Jesus Christ, whom will proceed at finishing His work in us and thru us.

Nor does God assert that the Lord is our
redeemer, but He says that the Lord is our redemption. Does this sound foreign to your ears? For Paul does not say that God has set the Lord Jesus to be the redeemer, he declares instead that the Lord Jesus is redemption.

I thank God every day that Christ is our redemption as well as our redeemer. He is our sanctification as well as our sanctifier. He is our righteousness as well as our justifier. He is our wisdom as well as the one who makes us wise.

Thank God then that Jesus is both our Savior as well as our salvation. (Psalms 27:1). That which God gives us is the Lord Jesus Himself whom will carry out His Father's will in us and thru us. (If) our will aligns with His..

"Lord, lay us bare. May this be the day of exposure to many people, that we may see ourselves as You see us. May Your ray of light strike us which will uncover all falsehood and distinguish Yourself from all substitutes. Bless Your own Word, and glorify Your name; In the name of the Lord Jesus...AMEN."



do you mean after accept Jesus, no matter we do, we go to heaven?

it doesn't matter if we rob that bank every day, kill every day as long as we believe that God give Christ as our righteousness we go to heaven?
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
56,531
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Romans 8
[video=youtube;i867dGtkIFo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i867dGtkIFo[/video]
 

slave

Senior Member
Mar 20, 2015
6,307
1,097
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Originally Posted by slave

(1 Corinthians 1:30):
"Of (God) are ye of Christ Jesus, who became wisdom to us from God, both Righteousness and Sanctification; and Redemption."

God has not given us righteousness, He gives Christ to us since Christ is our righteousness. God has not given us sanctification, He has given us Christ because Christ is our sanctification. God has not given us redemption, He gives us Christ because Christ is our redemption. God has not given us wisdom, He gives us Christ in as much as Christ is our wisdom. It is for this reason that we say, God's Christ is God's everything. God's Christ is God's entity and province; aside from Him God has neither entity nor province.

I would suppose that if God came and told us in person today that He will make the Lord Jesus our justifier you would indeed say, "He indeed is our justifier." But according to Paul's writing here God has not made the Lord Jesus our justifier. God causes Him to be our justification. Is this not awesome news? Christ is our righteousness.

Neither does God say here, thru Paul, that the Lord Jesus is to be our sanctifier. Instead, he says that the Lord Jesus is sanctification. Christ does not come to sanctify us, He comes to be Himself our sanctification. Our sanctification is not a thing, an action, or a behavior. Our sanctification is a person; that being Jesus Christ, whom will proceed at finishing His work in us and thru us.

Nor does God assert that the Lord is our
redeemer, but He says that the Lord is our redemption. Does this sound foreign to your ears? For Paul does not say that God has set the Lord Jesus to be the redeemer, he declares instead that the Lord Jesus is redemption.

I thank God every day that Christ is our redemption as well as our redeemer. He is our sanctification as well as our sanctifier. He is our righteousness as well as our justifier. He is our wisdom as well as the one who makes us wise.

Thank God then that Jesus is both our Savior as well as our salvation. (Psalms 27:1). That which God gives us is the Lord Jesus Himself whom will carry out His Father's will in us and thru us. (If) our will aligns with His..

"Lord, lay us bare. May this be the day of exposure to many people, that we may see ourselves as You see us. May Your ray of light strike us which will uncover all falsehood and distinguish Yourself from all substitutes. Bless Your own Word, and glorify Your name; In the name of the Lord Jesus...AMEN."

do you mean after accept Jesus, no matter we do, we go to heaven?

it doesn't matter if we rob that bank every day, kill every day as long as we believe that God give Christ as our righteousness we go to heaven?
No...you missed the point rather well.
 
Apr 30, 2016
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You could say that she still has the same beautiful and loving spirit that she had when you first meet and that's why you loved her in the first place. That to you, she is still beautiful and that you thank God He has blessed you with her Every day.


Or something like that,

It works better if you don't snicker afterwards.
BillG doesn't snicker Ariel.
He has a dry sense of humor.
You should get used to it, you'd enjoy it.

You know, like you just got through writing a Whole page of how we should enjoy things.
Enjoy your Brother Christians. It could be fun sometimes.
 
Apr 30, 2016
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This misses the mark by about 10 light years, denies verb tense, denies verbiage, denies the very definition of the words inspired, denies the New Covenant and reduces the work of Jesus on our behalf to a freak side show in the carnival of works and self justification for salvation......tragically I might add....
Good Morning cutie,

So tell me this:

How come verb tense, verbiage, and definition of words, is only important to OSAS'ers??

How come those who believe in loss of salvation need only to read the words simply stated in the bible?

Hmmm.......

Oh. And calling the crucifixion a "side show" is probably blasphemous.
 
Apr 30, 2016
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No...you missed the point rather well.
Hey Slave,

I got your message.
No problem with all you said.

However, you're telling Jackson 123 that he missed the point.
BUT, what HE said is true too.

Care to address that?
If I rob, and kill, but accepted Jesus at some altar call years before...
Am I still saved???

It's a valid question that deserves to be answered.
Of course, MY answer would be NO.
 
Feb 24, 2015
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yes, this is where legalism wants to tear us down, That's why I am so passionate against it. I know I get out of hand sometimes, but it is a dangerous thing, it keeps many people out of heaven, and keeps many of Gods children from growing.
This sounds so profound and real, you could almost believe, except.

What matters in life? Words or actions or both?

So someone says I am this type of person because I say all the things that correspond with
that type of individual. Another says, I may get the words wrong, but look at how I behave
I am that type of person because of my behaviour.

Now Jesus says we need both the words, the meaning, the intention, and the actions that
prove we mean what we say and we have actually understood it and put it into action.

Legalism is about pretending to be something one is not, by appearing to be one way but
actually behind the scenes failing and in our hearts not being concerned.

Now think a little from Gods perspective. Who is true and who is false? Who has understood
the principles and who has missed the mark?

So many here claim the Kingdom is just about faith or belief. They go so far that only faith is
enough to prove you have come into the Kingdom.

Except if you are in the Kingdom your life should show it. If one lives like the world except for
statements of faith in Christ, how is this not just hypocracy, and superficial religion?

So much of scripture can be interpreted the way you want to. It comes down to a few key
verses or ideas. The key verses are Jesus leads us to fulfill the law, literally to walk in obedience
to it. And with your heart in the right place this is not a burden.

And my friend if you feel this a burden, your heart is not in the right place.
Please tell me which of the 10 commandments is hard to keep? Where do you fail? And why?
Bring this to the Lord is repentance and faith and you will find victory.

Now the argument used to be it was easy to obey the headline commandments, but the more
detailed issues were the problem. This has now disappeared because the speaker had never really
gone through the 10 commandments in detail and started to look at what righteousness really is.

“Come now, let us reason together,” says the Lord.
“Though your sins are like scarlet, they shall be as white as snow;
though they are red as crimson, they shall be like wool.
If you are willing and obedient, you will eat the good things of the land;
but if you resist and rebel, you will be devoured by the sword.”
For the mouth of the Lord has spoken.
isaiah 1:18-20

God is a God of reason, discussion, understanding, mercy and forgiveness.
Gods way is in our hearts response, willing and obedient.
 
Feb 24, 2015
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Romans 8
Do we walk according to the Spirit or to the flesh?

We only have this choice if we have the Holy Spirit within us.
We have no condemnation if we walk according to the Spirit.

The mind governed by the flesh is hostile to God; it does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so.
rom 8:7

So many testify as to the impossibility of following Gods law.
This is true if you walk according to the flesh and not the Spirit.

For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live.
Rom 8:13

To walk according to the Spirit is to walk according to victory in Christ, walking
righteously.

How is it the clear teaching of Paul about victory and power is turned into failure
and defeat, and only if you admit defeat are you truly spiritually mature?

What is also staggering, is these defeatest claim true spiritual authority and only
they truly know Christ, and to teach and preach Pauls word is sending people to
hell.
 

Katy-follower

Senior Member
Jun 25, 2011
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Hey Fran, First let me say that sometimes we get so wrapped up with the passion of our thoughts, and the desire to have the other person see it our way, that we forget that primarily we are called to love one another. Without that, as 1 Corinthians 13 tells us, EVERYTHING else is worthless. So I do love you Fran, and am certain others here do as well.

I don't think you're post here is terribly off the mark. We DO get a new heart. We don't have our lost heart fixed. And that's really the point. Following Christ is natural for His children. It's who we are. We don't have to force it. It's innate in the new creation we have become.

An apple tree will naturally bear apples. It does not have to work at what it does naturally.

It's so important that we realize that OUR FRUITS (of the Holy Spirit) result in good works, and that good works NEVER result in bearing fruit. Getting that backwards, I believe, is what is at the heart of those who want to receive the fruits by doing their work.

The reason I mentioned the Bible translation, is because the verse you emphasized had a clearly different meaning than every other translation I could find, Here it is again:

"UNLESS YOU DO EVEN BETTER THAN THE PHARISSES IN THE MATTER OF LIVING RIGHTEOUSLY, YOU WILL KNOW NOTHING ABOUT ENTERNG THE KINGDOM.
Mathew 5:20"

Can you tell me what translation that is from? Be blessed, and have a great day.
Great post! I can't give you another rep. Grrr :(

Also like that bit about the apples :)

And just like a dead tree with dead roots is just that... dead, and cannot produce anything. Just as those that bear fruit are those He prunes, so that they may bear more. Those are the ones that belong to Him (His children), not the dead trees and dead branches. He doesn't prune that which is dead. A person needs to be made alive in Christ first.

So then, how do good trees that are pruned by Him then become dead trees with dead roots?!!
 

Katy-follower

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Jun 25, 2011
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He believes that Christians should follow the Sabbath from Friday night until Saturday and if not - then we have fallen for the deception of Babylon
That sounds like he's a seventh day adventist then, as they believe Sunday worship is the mark of the beast.
 

Katy-follower

Senior Member
Jun 25, 2011
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Wheat does not become tares
Sheep do not become goats
Good trees do not become bad/dead trees

Someone born of the Spirit does not become unborn of the Spirit. In the same way that you can't climb back in your mother's womb and become unborn physically.
 

Katy-follower

Senior Member
Jun 25, 2011
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I'm only up to page 658 and now I have to sleep, lol.

Tough keeping up with this thread!
 

Katy-follower

Senior Member
Jun 25, 2011
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God is going to hold us accountable for what we believe, not for what some man taught us, If the men we follow are wrong, We do not get a get out of hell card, We will go to hell, not because that man taught us wrong, but because we do not test the spirit to see if he was truthful or not.
Blind leaders of the blind... both will fall in a ditch (Matthew 15:14)

No doubt there will probably be many on judgment day pointing fingers at their false teachers.