Paul the Liar?

[trofimus]

Trophimus,
MSS is simply the plural abbreviation for manuscripts.

1. As to the LXX it is a CORRUPT Greek translation of the Old Testament with apocryphal books added.

2. As to the Masoretic Text (MT), it has been the standard OT text since the invention of printing. Only more recently corrupted versions of the MT have been produced, since the textual critics always seen to prefer the corrupt over the pure.

3. As to the Textus Receptus (TR), it has been the standard NT text since the invention of printing. Only more recently corrupted versions of the NT have been preferred by the textual critics, who always seem to prefer the corrupt to the pure.

4. All modern English versions of the Bible since 1881 have been based upon corrupted critical texts, so they are essentially corrupt Bibles.

5. All Reformation Bible are trustworthy, and the King James Bible has been the leading English language Bible for over 300 years.

6. As to the OP Dai3234 has provided a good response and it is quite sufficient,.

MSS is also used abbreviation for Masoretes. But yes, also for "manuscripts".

You have so many standards in your KJV.. sadly, your "standard" NT quotations of your "standard" Old testament do not match with your "standard" OT.

My "corrupted" NT matches with my "corrupted" LXX OT in almost every word.

 

[Angela53510]

Thank you. I didn't think to look at the LXX. The Hebrew uses the qal [active voice] 'when you judge'

The Greek uses κρίνεσθαί Passive Infinitive 'when you are judged'.

But it is indeed correctly quoted.

My exegetical book points to κρίνεσθαί being middle/passive in Romans 3:4. Sometimes the only way you can figure out the voice, is context. Moo, in Epistle to the Romans NICNT, notes some commentators (Käsemann) feel this is infinitive ispassive, but he falls firmly on the side of it being middle. "when you judge" as Trofimus has posted!

With regards to νικήσεις in the same verse, the NIGCT commentary lists a variation, which probably came about from dictation, as the future and Aorist forms sound very similar when dictated. Longenecker points to the Aorist as better attested, and in line with the Septuagint reading of Ps. 50:6b, but the more "difficult" reading is often the best choice. He says,

"So that you may be justified (or "shown to be righteous") when you speak (literally "your words") and will prevail, (or "be victorious") when you are judged."

In fact, he says Paul may not be literally quoting either the MT or the LXX, but Jewish proverbs or aphorisms. Kind of like when we say, "let sleeping dogs like" when there are no dogs involved!

Further, in verse 4, Longenecker believes that this quote regarding truth and lies in fact point to the Jews. Hence, God is faithful and true, and "liar" is unfaithfulness on the part of the Jews!

Paul then asks a series of rhetorical questions (notmyown got that right!) starting in verse 5a. He continues with the verse posted in the OP Romans 3:7-8, which I will post in modern English, because I don't speak 16 century English!

"For if by my lie the truth of God enhances his glory, why am I still actually being judged as a sinner? And why not say, “Let us do evil so that good may come of it”?—as some who slander us allege that we say. (Their condemnation is deserved!)" Romans 3:7-8 NET

Oh! Yes, 7-8 are totally connected, and this demonstrates the importance of context. Now, I admit, after reading all these pages, I am still not sure what the OP is about. Is the OP calling Paul a liar? Well, in fact, Paul is responding to certain criticisms that had been levelled against him and certain accusations that had been mounted against his Gentile mission by some of his Jewish Christian opponents - which criticisms and accusations, in all likelihood, had "taken on a life of their own," in their spread to Asia Minor and Greece to Rome.

Paul's response to these criticisms is in verse 8b, "Their condemnation is deserved!". These are, Paul implies, simply libellous charges based on sophistic reasoning, which show that those who mount them know nothing regarding the nature of God, the message of the gospel, or the character of those who are Christ's people.


May I point out again, the OP is using concordance word definitions and references from the Internet to form his theology. This is not good hermeneutics, and I think it has resulted in the confusing OP. Context has to always be the most important part of correctly dividing the Word, not pulling some copy and pastes from very old sources off the internet. Try and the sense of the passage from the whole paragraph, the chapter, and the entire book! Then, you might figure things out without coming to skewed or wrong conclusions, and not post here in a way that no one understands!



Longenecker, Richard N, The Epistle to the Romans. The New International Greek Testament Commentary, NIGTC pgs 342-351

Moo, Douglas, The Epistle to the Romans, The New International Commentary on the New Testament, NICNT, pgs, 185-196

 

[Angela53510]

One last thing, MT is the abbreviation for Masoretic Text in any kind of commentary or Bible. MSS means "manuscripts" plural.

Trofimus already posted this above, but it bears repeating! I spent a long time trying to figure out WHICH manuscripts the various posters were talking about, and finally realized the abbreviation was wrong. Sheesh!

 

[breno785au]

Paul the liar.
In Romans 3:7 Paul says.' For if in my lie the truth of God abounded to His glory, why am I yet judged as a sinner?"(Rom 3:7 LITV-TSP)​

​

So once again I ask, "what was Paul's lie?"​

​

Let's start in verse 3:5 this time.​

​

Paul through the Spirit includes himself in his statement in verse five when he says, But if our unrighteousness (our lie vs. 4; our unfaithfulness; vs. 3). He is states, (speaking as a man) even through our unrighteousness; our lie; our unfaithfulnes the righteousness of God (the oracles; the Holy Writ; that to which we can be justified (upright) in our words, and we overcome in our being judged. vs.4 ) still got commended; exhibited. ​

So is GOD unrighteous exhibiting wrath against those who choose to live thusly?​

​

In verse six he answers emphatically in collation with what he previously said in verse four, "That You should be justified (upright) in Your words, and will overcome in Your being judged". He answers, "Let it not be; Otherwise, how will God judge the world?"​

​

Then in verse seven he connects what he is about to say with the Greek word "gar" to what was previously stated. This word is a primary particle; to which assigns reason (Strong's #1063) to things previously stated. More often translated "for". ​

​

So he is continuing his argument from man's perspective (vs.5 ). Reiterating what he said corporately in verse 5, but this time he is speaking in the first person. He says, "For if in my lie (my unrighteousness; my unfaithfulness through not adhering to all that which is given in the Holy Writ) the truth of God abounded to His glory, why am I yet judged as a sinner?" ​

​

And not (as we are wrongly accused, and as some report us to say), Let us do bad things so that good things may come, ( in other words why not just continue on the same course of unrighteous, unfaithfulness because the oracles; the Holy Writ; GOD's righteousness is still getting commended; promoted). And then emphatically to the man argument because GOD will judge the world (vs. 6). He condemns such thinking by saying, "The judgment of whom is just."​

​

This is not the only place I have tried to share this. So with that being said. In trying to see someone else's argument I looked in a few reference books. Interestingly enough I could not find anything to support their argument. But to my glee I did find citations to support what was given to me. Here they are.​

​

Henry Alford’s The Greek New Testament​

Romans 3:7​

7.] This follows (connected by γάρ) upon Rom_3:6, and shews that the supposition if carried out, would overthrow all God’s judgment, and (Rom_3:8) the whole moral life of man. How shall God judge the world? FOR, if the truth (faithfulness) of God abounded (was manifested, more clearly established) by means of my falsehood (unfaithfulness), to His glory (so that the result has been the setting forth of His glory), why any longer (ἔτι, this being so,—assuming the premises) am I also (i.e. as well as others,—am I to be involved in a judgment from which I ought to be exempt) judged (to be judged,—the pres. expressing the rule or habit of God’s proceeding) as a sinner?​

​

Clarkes Commentary​

Romans 3:7​

​

Jew. For if the truth of God, etc. - But to resume my reasoning (Rom_3:5): If the faithfulness of God in keeping his promise made to our fathers is, through our unfaithfulness, made far more glorious than it otherwise would have been, why should we then be blamed for that which must redound so much to the honor of God?​

​

From Expositor's Greek New Testament​

​

....A Jew is the speaker, or at all events the Apostle speaks in the character of one: “if my unbelief does magnify His faithfulness, is not that all that is required? Why am I, too, like the rest of the world, whose relation to God is so different, and whose judgment is so necessary, still brought into judgment?”...​

​

From Vincent Word Studies​

Lie (ψεύσματι)​

​

Only here in the New Testament. The expression carries us back to Rom_3:4, and is general for moral falsehood, unfaithfulness to the claims of conscience and of God, especially with reference to the proffer of salvation through Christ.​

​

​

From the Cambridge Bible for Schools and Colleges​

Romans 3:7​

​

For if, &c.] Here St Paul takes up the Opponent on his own ground; speaking as a human being whose sin (e.g. a falsehood) serves to make God’s truth “abound to His glory;” i.e. be more largely manifest in a way to win Him fresh praise:—in such a case is not Paul, is not A, B, or C, equally entitled with the Jewish opponent to be excused penalty?—In the Gr. of the clause “why am I yet, &c.,” the word “I” is strongly emphatic; I also; i.e. “I, as well as my opponent.”—“Why am I yet, &c.:”—i.e. “after the recognition of the effect of my sin on the advancement of God’s glory.”—“By my lie;” lit. in my lie; i.e. “on occasion of it, in connexion with it.”​

​

John Wesley’s Explanatory Notes​

Romans 3:7​

But, may the objector reply, if the truth of God hath abounded - Has been more abundantly shown. Through my lie - If my lie, that is, practice contrary to truth, conduces to the glory of God, by making his truth shine with superior advantage. Why am I still judged as a sinner - Can this be said to be any sin at all? Ought I not to do what would otherwise be evil, that so much "good may come?" To this the apostle does not deign to give a direct answer, but cuts the objector short with a severe reproof.​

​

May GOD bless and keep you and keep us in HIS Way; Jesus Christ!! Happy Thanksgiving!!!​

Please don't take one single verse and rip it right out of its context. It dishonours the author.

 

[NayborBear]

i don't follow how Ishtar eggs are legalism . . ?

It is legalism, when one worships a false god, or lesser god, thinking they are worshiping Jesus Christ. Accepting Jesus, getting baptized, and wondering "Where is this gift of the Holy Spirit?" So? They go and quit drinking, quit smoking, etc. etc. in the hopes of making themselves a worthy vessel for the Holy Spirit. In so doing these efforts befitting filthy rags, they are enticing the Holy Spirit to come into them! This is an illusion, by the enemies of God, in which ishtar is only one! Should God, wish His Holy Spirit into a believer? It doesn't matter what habits you dabble in. Because it's like BAM! "Hello there young man!" "You wanna keep trying to learn My Way/s, from these sheep-skinned blind shephards?" "Or, you want Me to teach you?" And, I would rather imagine, much the same scenario was what Paul experienced. And they why he went studying under 'ol "what's his name " for 3 years er so, before he started doing his efforts for Jesus' Church.

 

[Bladerunner]

Paul the liar.
In Romans 3:7 Paul says.' For if in my lie the truth of God abounded to His glory, why am I yet judged as a sinner?"(Rom 3:7 LITV-TSP)​

​

So once again I ask, "what was Paul's lie?"​

​

Let's start in verse 3:5 this time.​

​

Paul through the Spirit includes himself in his statement in verse five when he says, But if our unrighteousness (our lie vs. 4; our unfaithfulness; vs. 3). He is states, (speaking as a man) even through our unrighteousness; our lie; our unfaithfulnes the righteousness of God (the oracles; the Holy Writ; that to which we can be justified (upright) in our words, and we overcome in our being judged. vs.4 ) still got commended; exhibited. ​

So is GOD unrighteous exhibiting wrath against those who choose to live thusly?​

​

In verse six he answers emphatically in collation with what he previously said in verse four, "That You should be justified (upright) in Your words, and will overcome in Your being judged". He answers, "Let it not be; Otherwise, how will God judge the world?"​

​

Then in verse seven he connects what he is about to say with the Greek word "gar" to what was previously stated. This word is a primary particle; to which assigns reason (Strong's #1063) to things previously stated. More often translated "for". ​

​

So he is continuing his argument from man's perspective (vs.5 ). Reiterating what he said corporately in verse 5, but this time he is speaking in the first person. He says, "For if in my lie (my unrighteousness; my unfaithfulness through not adhering to all that which is given in the Holy Writ) the truth of God abounded to His glory, why am I yet judged as a sinner?" ​

​

And not (as we are wrongly accused, and as some report us to say), Let us do bad things so that good things may come, ( in other words why not just continue on the same course of unrighteous, unfaithfulness because the oracles; the Holy Writ; GOD's righteousness is still getting commended; promoted). And then emphatically to the man argument because GOD will judge the world (vs. 6). He condemns such thinking by saying, "The judgment of whom is just."​

​

This is not the only place I have tried to share this. So with that being said. In trying to see someone else's argument I looked in a few reference books. Interestingly enough I could not find anything to support their argument. But to my glee I did find citations to support what was given to me. Here they are.​

​

Henry Alford’s The Greek New Testament​

Romans 3:7​

7.] This follows (connected by γάρ) upon Rom_3:6, and shews that the supposition if carried out, would overthrow all God’s judgment, and (Rom_3:8) the whole moral life of man. How shall God judge the world? FOR, if the truth (faithfulness) of God abounded (was manifested, more clearly established) by means of my falsehood (unfaithfulness), to His glory (so that the result has been the setting forth of His glory), why any longer (ἔτι, this being so,—assuming the premises) am I also (i.e. as well as others,—am I to be involved in a judgment from which I ought to be exempt) judged (to be judged,—the pres. expressing the rule or habit of God’s proceeding) as a sinner?​

​

Clarkes Commentary​

Romans 3:7​

​

Jew. For if the truth of God, etc. - But to resume my reasoning (Rom_3:5): If the faithfulness of God in keeping his promise made to our fathers is, through our unfaithfulness, made far more glorious than it otherwise would have been, why should we then be blamed for that which must redound so much to the honor of God?​

​

From Expositor's Greek New Testament​

​

....A Jew is the speaker, or at all events the Apostle speaks in the character of one: “if my unbelief does magnify His faithfulness, is not that all that is required? Why am I, too, like the rest of the world, whose relation to God is so different, and whose judgment is so necessary, still brought into judgment?”...​

​

From Vincent Word Studies​

Lie (ψεύσματι)​

​

Only here in the New Testament. The expression carries us back to Rom_3:4, and is general for moral falsehood, unfaithfulness to the claims of conscience and of God, especially with reference to the proffer of salvation through Christ.​

​

​

From the Cambridge Bible for Schools and Colleges​

Romans 3:7​

​

For if, &c.] Here St Paul takes up the Opponent on his own ground; speaking as a human being whose sin (e.g. a falsehood) serves to make God’s truth “abound to His glory;” i.e. be more largely manifest in a way to win Him fresh praise:—in such a case is not Paul, is not A, B, or C, equally entitled with the Jewish opponent to be excused penalty?—In the Gr. of the clause “why am I yet, &c.,” the word “I” is strongly emphatic; I also; i.e. “I, as well as my opponent.”—“Why am I yet, &c.:”—i.e. “after the recognition of the effect of my sin on the advancement of God’s glory.”—“By my lie;” lit. in my lie; i.e. “on occasion of it, in connexion with it.”​

​

John Wesley’s Explanatory Notes​

Romans 3:7​

But, may the objector reply, if the truth of God hath abounded - Has been more abundantly shown. Through my lie - If my lie, that is, practice contrary to truth, conduces to the glory of God, by making his truth shine with superior advantage. Why am I still judged as a sinner - Can this be said to be any sin at all? Ought I not to do what would otherwise be evil, that so much "good may come?" To this the apostle does not deign to give a direct answer, but cuts the objector short with a severe reproof.​

​

May GOD bless and keep you and keep us in HIS Way; Jesus Christ!! Happy Thanksgiving!!!​

To call Paul a Liar is to call GOD a LIAR! Paul only wrote what God Inspired Him to write.

I think you had better rethink your position here,,,,

 

[SovereignGrace]

It is generally considered the responsibility of the writer to make himself understood.

The responsibility of communication falls to the writer, not the reader.

If I write something which people cannot follow, I always assume it's my responsibility to make it more clear.

Something to consider.

Not its not the writer's responsibility to make him/herself clear. They expect us to all have decoder rings. Every time I use mine I get...

 

[SovereignGrace]

Soooooo...if we "follow" Paul we fall into a legalistic ditch? lolzzzz...

What I find odd is this. Some ppl elevate Paul's writings, and I have witnessed it on other sites. This is the first site I have where ppl are trying to undermine its authority.

 

[Dan58]

Its up to us to correctly put into context what the author is saying, anyone can be called a liar when we don't correctly interpret the message.

Jesus said; "Whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also" (Matthew 5:39)
Jesus said; "Why smitest thou me?" (John 18:23)
Was he a liar or hypocrite for not just turning the other cheek?

Jesus said; "Love your enemies, bless them that curse you" (Matthew 5:44)
Jesus said; "Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do" (John 8:44)
Not exactly blessing the Pharisees and Jews here... But not lying either

 

[followjesus]

Paul the liar.
In Romans 3:7 Paul says.' For if in my lie the truth of God abounded to His glory, why am I yet judged as a sinner?"(Rom 3:7 LITV-TSP)​

​

So once again I ask, "what was Paul's lie?"​

​

Let's start in verse 3:5 this time.​

​

Paul through the Spirit includes himself in his statement in verse five when he says, But if our unrighteousness (our lie vs. 4; our unfaithfulness; vs. 3). He is states, (speaking as a man) even through our unrighteousness; our lie; our unfaithfulnes the righteousness of God (the oracles; the Holy Writ; that to which we can be justified (upright) in our words, and we overcome in our being judged. vs.4 ) still got commended; exhibited. ​

So is GOD unrighteous exhibiting wrath against those who choose to live thusly?​

​

In verse six he answers emphatically in collation with what he previously said in verse four, "That You should be justified (upright) in Your words, and will overcome in Your being judged". He answers, "Let it not be; Otherwise, how will God judge the world?"​

​

Then in verse seven he connects what he is about to say with the Greek word "gar" to what was previously stated. This word is a primary particle; to which assigns reason (Strong's #1063) to things previously stated. More often translated "for". ​

​

So he is continuing his argument from man's perspective (vs.5 ). Reiterating what he said corporately in verse 5, but this time he is speaking in the first person. He says, "For if in my lie (my unrighteousness; my unfaithfulness through not adhering to all that which is given in the Holy Writ) the truth of God abounded to His glory, why am I yet judged as a sinner?" ​

​

And not (as we are wrongly accused, and as some report us to say), Let us do bad things so that good things may come, ( in other words why not just continue on the same course of unrighteous, unfaithfulness because the oracles; the Holy Writ; GOD's righteousness is still getting commended; promoted). And then emphatically to the man argument because GOD will judge the world (vs. 6). He condemns such thinking by saying, "The judgment of whom is just."​

​

This is not the only place I have tried to share this. So with that being said. In trying to see someone else's argument I looked in a few reference books. Interestingly enough I could not find anything to support their argument. But to my glee I did find citations to support what was given to me. Here they are.​

​

Henry Alford’s The Greek New Testament​

Romans 3:7​

7.] This follows (connected by γάρ) upon Rom_3:6, and shews that the supposition if carried out, would overthrow all God’s judgment, and (Rom_3:8) the whole moral life of man. How shall God judge the world? FOR, if the truth (faithfulness) of God abounded (was manifested, more clearly established) by means of my falsehood (unfaithfulness), to His glory (so that the result has been the setting forth of His glory), why any longer (ἔτι, this being so,—assuming the premises) am I also (i.e. as well as others,—am I to be involved in a judgment from which I ought to be exempt) judged (to be judged,—the pres. expressing the rule or habit of God’s proceeding) as a sinner?​

​

Clarkes Commentary​

Romans 3:7​

​

Jew. For if the truth of God, etc. - But to resume my reasoning (Rom_3:5): If the faithfulness of God in keeping his promise made to our fathers is, through our unfaithfulness, made far more glorious than it otherwise would have been, why should we then be blamed for that which must redound so much to the honor of God?​

​

From Expositor's Greek New Testament​

​

....A Jew is the speaker, or at all events the Apostle speaks in the character of one: “if my unbelief does magnify His faithfulness, is not that all that is required? Why am I, too, like the rest of the world, whose relation to God is so different, and whose judgment is so necessary, still brought into judgment?”...​

​

From Vincent Word Studies​

Lie (ψεύσματι)​

​

Only here in the New Testament. The expression carries us back to Rom_3:4, and is general for moral falsehood, unfaithfulness to the claims of conscience and of God, especially with reference to the proffer of salvation through Christ.​

​

​

From the Cambridge Bible for Schools and Colleges​

Romans 3:7​

​

For if, &c.] Here St Paul takes up the Opponent on his own ground; speaking as a human being whose sin (e.g. a falsehood) serves to make God’s truth “abound to His glory;” i.e. be more largely manifest in a way to win Him fresh praise:—in such a case is not Paul, is not A, B, or C, equally entitled with the Jewish opponent to be excused penalty?—In the Gr. of the clause “why am I yet, &c.,” the word “I” is strongly emphatic; I also; i.e. “I, as well as my opponent.”—“Why am I yet, &c.:”—i.e. “after the recognition of the effect of my sin on the advancement of God’s glory.”—“By my lie;” lit. in my lie; i.e. “on occasion of it, in connexion with it.”​

​

John Wesley’s Explanatory Notes​

Romans 3:7​

But, may the objector reply, if the truth of God hath abounded - Has been more abundantly shown. Through my lie - If my lie, that is, practice contrary to truth, conduces to the glory of God, by making his truth shine with superior advantage. Why am I still judged as a sinner - Can this be said to be any sin at all? Ought I not to do what would otherwise be evil, that so much "good may come?" To this the apostle does not deign to give a direct answer, but cuts the objector short with a severe reproof.​

​

May GOD bless and keep you and keep us in HIS Way; Jesus Christ!! Happy Thanksgiving!!!​

Bro i think if you would look at what paul is saying, and interpret it within the context provided in the scripture it will make sense, look first at the subject of what paul is talking about

What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision? 2Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God. 3For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect?
4God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.
5But if our unrighteousness commend the righteousness of God, what shall we say? Is God unrighteous who taketh vengeance? (I speak as a man) 6God forbid: for then how shall God judge the world? 7For if the truth of God hath more abounded through my lie unto his glory; why yet am I also judged as a sinner? 8And not rather, (as we be slanderously reported, and as some affirm that we say,) Let us do evil, that good may come? whose damnation is just.9What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;"
Paul is not confessing to a lie, he is speaking concepts to the readers, speaking as a man like we might converse i might use a phrase like " hey you know if i lie, and it makes you look truthful....then why is it a bad thing? Good resulted because you look truthful....so why am i the bad guy liar thats judged? speaking figuratively and sometimes even rhetorically to express a concept to people who didnt yet understand these things.... several concepts actually in these verses.....

9What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;


God bless you in the Lord Jesus Christ

 

[posthuman]

Saul, called Paul.



it's not my opinion that the OP is challenging the authority of any of the scriptures Paul wrote.

Paul through the Spirit

yeah i call him Paul too.

contextually, in Romans, the case that all mankind - Paul/Saul included - is guilty of sin and that no one can stand before Him apart from grace through faith: no flesh is justified by works; all have sin. the lie? sin itself is the lie; the lie is that anyone is not guilty or has excuse. the original lie, metastasized in every human. and any contradiction of that gospel, which is that Jesus the Christ has freely given this mercy, is an instance of that lie, accusing God of evil.

 

[lightbearer]

To call Paul a Liar is to call GOD a LIAR! Paul only wrote what God Inspired Him to write.

I think you had better rethink your position here,,,,

I never called him a liar. He did.

 

[preacher4truth]

What I find odd is this. Some ppl elevate Paul's writings, and I have witnessed it on other sites. This is the first site I have where ppl are trying to undermine its authority.

There have been a few anti-Pauline nut jobs on here. They show how he "contradicts" Jesus, and that he "lied" about his testimony because his "story changed" in front of Agrippa (iirc).

And behold, we have an OP that says Paul lied, and all the commentators he quoted "agree with him." Um. Never mind.

 

[preacher4truth]

I never called him a liar. He did.

But, you did:

Paul the liar....to my glee I did find citations to support what was given to me.

And now you're bearing false witness on what God said.

 

[Bogadile]

What I find odd is this. Some ppl elevate Paul's writings, and I have witnessed it on other sites. This is the first site I have where ppl are trying to undermine its authority.

I think why people elevate Paul's writings is the idea that he was the apostle to the gentiles and brought the new covenant gospel message to us.
So people consider him to be 'our apostle' which is why he is elevated.

 

[lightbearer]

I never called him a liar. He did.

In other words God called Paul a liar because God through Paul had Paul write that he lied. Paul prior to the Gospel had been in unbelief through sin. He was living the life of a hypocrite as was most of Israel. They had been intrusted the oracles of GOD and were not living up to the standard to which they put forth. In living this lie the Oracles of GOD; HIS Truth still got commended; shared. So the truth of GOD still abounded to GOD's glory even though they were living in unrighteousness. For a little leaven leavened the whole. For there were none righteous; not one. For all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of GOD.

Thanks be to the Heavenly FATHER that we through Christ are no longer held in the captivity of sin and death. He has lead captivity (sin) captive and gave gifts unto men. For now the righteousness of GOD is manifested (made apparent) being witnessed (shared) by the Law and the Prophets. Even the righteousness of God which is through faith of Jesus Christ into all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: For that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death. For we are dead nevertheless we live yet not us but Christ liveth in us and the life we now live in the flesh we live by the Faith of Jesus Christ.

Not Faith in; but by the Faith of Jesus Christ. What saith it? The word (Christ from above) is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach and that is the Gospel.

No longer under the schoolmaster (the law). For we have become that which we beheld through the body of Christ. The commandments; HIS Word (Christ) having been placed in our hearts and minds. We have become a new creature.

We are the new ministration. No longer through the Tables of stone but through the fleshly tables of the heart by the finger of GOD. For it is GOD that works in us both to will and do HIS good pleasure. Christ in us the hope (expectation) of Glory; GOD!

This is the righteousness of GOD that is manifested (made apparent) This the Faith to which we Speak. And that my friends is the Gospel!

 

[lightbearer]

But, you did:



And now you're bearing false witness on what God said.

Please don't do that. Though not easily understood. There is a lot between them quotes. The citations themselves don't bare witness to the witness that you are sharing against me.

 

[Bogadile]

Please don't do that. Though not easily understood. There is a lot between them quotes.

Peter said Paul wrote some things hard to be understood but I consider Paul to be very clear compared to your writings

 

[lightbearer]

Peter said Paul wrote some things hard to be understood but I consider Paul to be very clear compared to your writings

Outside of the commentary in the op your comment is unwarranted and rather wanting. If you have an issue with something that has been posted; Then ask.

 

[Bogadile]

Outside of the commentary in the op your comment is unwarranted and rather wanting. If you have an issue with something that has been posted; Then ask.

I have said what is my problem. The problem is I simply cannot understand what you are saying.

What is it that you are saying Paul was lying about?