Questions about the Holy Spirit in the Book of Acts

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C

ced747

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Hello, you'll notice that these disciples were not yet Christians but were disciples of John the baptist. That's one of the reason.
 

onlinebuddy

Senior Member
Sep 1, 2012
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Both, Mattew 28:19 and Mark 16:16 refer to the great commission of Jesus before he ascended into heaven.

The authors of Matthew and Mark were witnesses of the resurrection of Jesus Christ and his ascension into heaven. Both of them, narrate what Jesus had told them in the above verses. Both verses mention belief+baptism. The same was taught by Peter in Acts 2:38.

In Acts 16:31, Paul mentions just belief. However, the fact that the jailer was baptized that very hour of the night or "immediately," shows that Paul taught baptism.

The above passages (and others) make the following facts clear (these are my views from my Bible Study and I am open to correction):

1) Jesus commanded baptism

2) Belief and Baptism are separate actions (both being necessary).
We cannot say, "we are baptized by believing" or "we were baptized into Christ when we believed." This is just wordplay. The scripture tells us to first believe, and then get baptized. You cannot rule out either of the two. You cannot perform both together. Baptism follows belief.

2) To be baptized ( or not to be baptized) is a choice made by the believer. Whether or not he is saved depends on this choice (Mk 16:16). We must believe what the Lord says.

3) One does not have to wait, and God will not initiate the baptism. God has initiated by sending his Only Begotten Son and by sacrificing Him on a cruel cross. There is no greater action that God can take or no greater sacrifice that God can make to save us, as He has emptied himself out for us on the cross. However, it is not God's initiative that saves us. It is our response that saves us. Belief and Baptism is man's response to God's word.

4) The baptism that Jesus was talking about; the baptism that Peter preached, and the baptism that Paul administered did not come on as a surprise. These were human decisions in response to Gospel. (Now, I am not downplaying God's redemptive intervention by way of which He saves and regenerates us at baptism)

5) Nothing visibly spectacular or dramatic was promised by Jesus during the act/process of baptism, and nothing visibly spectacular happened in Acts 16:31 and the like. Off course, Jesus promised that supernatural events would follow baptism (Mark 16: 17-18). Therefore whenever something dramatically spectacular happened, it was not directly connected with the above-mentioned command of Jesus (to baptize). Such dramatic events were always connected with a specific promise made by Jesus; or they had specific purposes such as fulfilling OT prophecies; or they were loud messages from God aimed at clarifying something specific.


 

onlinebuddy

Senior Member
Sep 1, 2012
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The rest of the scripture says "That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is Spirit" showing a separation of the two births. A person is physically born into the world but they must be spiritually born. There are two births that must take place.

This does not represent water baptism, for we know we are saved by grace through faith and not works. Water does not save anyone.
Water,here, does not symbolize physical birth. Doesn't make sense.

Let's examine the verse:
Jesus told Nicodemus that one cannot enter the Kingdom of God unless he is born again. Nicodemus was confused about how one can be born again. He was referring to physical birth. We know this because he told Jesus that it was not possible for an old man to go back into his mother's womb a second time.

Then Jesus told him that to enter the kingdom, one must be born of the water and the Spirit. Now, Jesus was clearly referring to spiritual birth and not to physical birth. Jesus meant that to be born again, SPIRITUALLY, one had to be born of water and the Spirit. This shouldn't be difficult to understand. Again, water cannot mean physical birth, since Jesus was contrasting Nicodemus' thinking about physical birth and telling him that it was not physical birth that he was talking about. How could Jesus go back to talking about physical birth?

So the prerequisites for being born into the Kingdom of God ( clearly spiritual birth) are: water and spirit. Now, if water meant physical birth, then every human being (including Nicodemus) had the first prerequisite, and Jesus would not have mentioned it.

I am not arguing about the fact that "water" means water baptism. However, water cannot mean amniotic fluid either.
 
Feb 17, 2010
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Ok I see the OLD KING JAMES SAYS... ON NONE OF THEM. That verse in afrikaans is EXACTLY the same... Nog op niemand van hulle... It means none of them or not ONE of them. it means not a single person had received the Holy Spirit YET! Play with words all you like, it means what it says... And it CLEARLY says they were baptized by a Holy Spirit fille person, yet they did not receive the Holy Spirit yet, not a single one of them.

Now about believe. Onlinebuddy you say you should be baptized AFTER you believe.... hen the disciples were with Jesus when did they believe to the measure of a mustard- seed? You see onlinebuddy your reasoning around the Gospel does not make sence to me. The apostles believed Jesus from the word GO! When Jesus came to the sea-side and he called John and James, Peter and Andrew, they immediately left their daily chores and followed Him. This they would only have done becasue God already gave them faith to follow Jesus!

When were they baptized and by whom? They beleived but they had to follow Jesus. Jesus says after He caled them He gave them power over unclean spirits, and to heal the sick... And just as we think they are believers Jesus repremanded them sharply... O ye of little faith..... ... Faith is the short word of a person that believe.... When ar we believers to the extend that we should be baptized? When are we ready to be baptized AFTER we repented? When we laid down one sin, of the sixty I have to lay down?

You see when does a person believe with his whoe heart that Jesus is the son of God? When there is still other spirit influence on that same heart? When did his disciples REALLY believe? When were his disciples BAPTIZED? Show me in scripture...And show me WHO baptized them, and TEACH THAT to the world.

The word says... Romans 1:17... The just shall live by faith.... But it also says... ALL ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness..... Who is these people that holds the TRUTH in unrighteousness? Do you think ANY person that is baptized with the Holy Spirit can hold the truth in unrighteousness? Or do you think it is the ones that are ONLY baptized in water? Why are they baptized in water and not in Holy Spirit?

Let me say again... ONLY ONE BAPTISM SAVED APERSON FROM THIS EARTH, It is the BAPTISM F THE HOLY SPIRIT. ANd you DO NOT NEED A WATER BAPTISM TO RECEIVE THIS HOLY SPIRIT BAPTISM.

HOEVER! You do need a Holy Spirit baptism to be SEALED in God, and no water baptism has EVER done that, not even in John the Baptists time! John the baptists baptism was the same as offering a lamb for sin. It only does what John said it does... I baptize you with water unto REPENTANCE.... It is the change of heart, or change of mind. And God said His sacrifice... THE LAMB will even clean our consciences, to erve the LIVING GOD! Something the blood of lambs and John the baptist baptism could not do.

Now I would like to teach you the BAPTISM GOD SPEAKS ABOUT IN EPH 4....

When Jesus send out His APOSTLES they were all filled with the Holy Spriit, and as you refer to in Acts 8 they baptized people with the Holy Spirit when they pray for them and lay hands on them. This happened on INDIVIDUALS... because we can clearly derive from that Scripture in Acts 8 that Simon the "magic man" was not baptized with the Holy Spirit. I do not think John and Peter layed hands on him. They rebuked him though...

This is the baptism the Lord send them to do... 1. God and make disciples... Teach then the Word.... 2. Baptize them in THE NAME of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit.... Baptize them in THE name ONE NAME... It will be a washing of REGENERATION... What regenerate you... The WORD OF GOD! (Titus 3:5) And the renewing of the Holy Spirit... How does God RENEW AND REGENERATE a person? By Revealing His WORd to that person, and if the person accepts, HE IS REGENERATED! And the Holy Spirit in renewed. Nothing to do with water. Hydrogyn and oxigen. Two gases making liquid... Spirit is not gas! God's Word is Spirit, not water, yet Jesus calls it LIVING WATER.
And number three.... Teach them to observe all things what I commanded you... How do they do that.... TEACH THE WORD!

I hope you can see that these three orders are actually ALL the same... They should make disciples ,baptsize them in the Name, and teach them to observe all Jesus commanded... TEACH THE WORD OF GOD TO ALL! God will do the rest.
I
 

onlinebuddy

Senior Member
Sep 1, 2012
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Cobus,
I still cannot find a bible version that says, "on ONE of them." Does your Bible say ONE of them or is this a typo? I know that you are referring to the Old KJV. I have the KJV (just KJV). Is your bible different from the KJV?


Acts 8:12
12But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized , both men and women.
13Then Simon himself believed also: and when he was baptized , he continued with Philip, and wondered , beholding the miracles and signs which were done .


In v.12, the Samaritans "believed"
Does this mean that they were saved?

In v. 13, Simon himself "believed;" so was he saved?
The Holy Spirit did not fall on one of them... That means just what it says... They did not have the Holy Spirit YET! You see this is what I mean.... do we now get baptized three times? Once with water, once with the Holy Spirit then with the Holy Spirit and gifts? Come on! It says clearly that the Holy Spirit did not fall on one of them... but when John and Peter.... then Simon wanted to buy that gift of BAPTIZING WITH HOLY SPIRIT... and we know it cannot be bought. Not even Philip could baptize with Holy Spirit!

In this chapter it is clear that Baptism of Holy Spirit is the LAST step to holiness. Rebirth and glorification comes when God baptize with Holy Spirit! At the END of repentance! The End of justification. Just as Col 3 says.... Look at any of the people that received the Holy Spirit, even the Apostles, they had to WAIT till Jesus asked the Father and He Himself was glorified! Then God glorified Jesus in the apostles... John17. Jesus is glorified in ALL people that are baptized with Holy Spirit. And it is not the joke of Benni Hinn and his clowns. It is actually the Godly Holy Spirit of Jesus that comes into a person and glorifies that person for God's GLORY. That comes with a great power and a maifestation of nine gifts. 1 Cor 12. EVERY person filled with the Holy Spirit has at least one of these gifts, for ALL advantage!

My friend these people in Samaria was destined to get the Holy Spirit, that is why God send Peter and John to them to baptze them with the Spirit! Simon missed out it looks lke, because he thought money could buy Godly gifts.
Ok I see the OLD KING JAMES SAYS... ON NONE OF THEM. That verse in afrikaans is EXACTLY the same... Nog op niemand van hulle... It means none of them or not ONE of them. it means not a single person had received the Holy Spirit YET! Play with words all you like, it means what it says... And it CLEARLY says they were baptized by a Holy Spirit fille person, yet they did not receive the Holy Spirit yet, not a single one of them.

Now about believe. Onlinebuddy you say you should be baptized AFTER you believe.... hen the disciples were with Jesus when did they believe to the measure of a mustard- seed? You see onlinebuddy your reasoning around the Gospel does not make sence to me. The apostles believed Jesus from the word GO! When Jesus came to the sea-side and he called John and James, Peter and Andrew, they immediately left their daily chores and followed Him. This they would only have done becasue God already gave them faith to follow Jesus!

When were they baptized and by whom? They beleived but they had to follow Jesus. Jesus says after He caled them He gave them power over unclean spirits, and to heal the sick... And just as we think they are believers Jesus repremanded them sharply... O ye of little faith..... ... Faith is the short word of a person that believe.... When ar we believers to the extend that we should be baptized? When are we ready to be baptized AFTER we repented? When we laid down one sin, of the sixty I have to lay down?

You see when does a person believe with his whoe heart that Jesus is the son of God? When there is still other spirit influence on that same heart? When did his disciples REALLY believe? When were his disciples BAPTIZED? Show me in scripture...And show me WHO baptized them, and TEACH THAT to the world.

The word says... Romans 1:17... The just shall live by faith.... But it also says... ALL ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness..... Who is these people that holds the TRUTH in unrighteousness? Do you think ANY person that is baptized with the Holy Spirit can hold the truth in unrighteousness? Or do you think it is the ones that are ONLY baptized in water? Why are they baptized in water and not in Holy Spirit?

Let me say again... ONLY ONE BAPTISM SAVED APERSON FROM THIS EARTH, It is the BAPTISM F THE HOLY SPIRIT. ANd you DO NOT NEED A WATER BAPTISM TO RECEIVE THIS HOLY SPIRIT BAPTISM.

HOEVER! You do need a Holy Spirit baptism to be SEALED in God, and no water baptism has EVER done that, not even in John the Baptists time! John the baptists baptism was the same as offering a lamb for sin. It only does what John said it does... I baptize you with water unto REPENTANCE.... It is the change of heart, or change of mind. And God said His sacrifice... THE LAMB will even clean our consciences, to erve the LIVING GOD! Something the blood of lambs and John the baptist baptism could not do.

Now I would like to teach you the BAPTISM GOD SPEAKS ABOUT IN EPH 4....

When Jesus send out His APOSTLES they were all filled with the Holy Spriit, and as you refer to in Acts 8 they baptized people with the Holy Spirit when they pray for them and lay hands on them. This happened on INDIVIDUALS... because we can clearly derive from that Scripture in Acts 8 that Simon the "magic man" was not baptized with the Holy Spirit. I do not think John and Peter layed hands on him. They rebuked him though...

This is the baptism the Lord send them to do... 1. God and make disciples... Teach then the Word.... 2. Baptize them in THE NAME of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit.... Baptize them in THE name ONE NAME... It will be a washing of REGENERATION... What regenerate you... The WORD OF GOD! (Titus 3:5) And the renewing of the Holy Spirit... How does God RENEW AND REGENERATE a person? By Revealing His WORd to that person, and if the person accepts, HE IS REGENERATED! And the Holy Spirit in renewed. Nothing to do with water. Hydrogyn and oxigen. Two gases making liquid... Spirit is not gas! God's Word is Spirit, not water, yet Jesus calls it LIVING WATER.
And number three.... Teach them to observe all things what I commanded you... How do they do that.... TEACH THE WORD!

I hope you can see that these three orders are actually ALL the same... They should make disciples ,baptsize them in the Name, and teach them to observe all Jesus commanded... TEACH THE WORD OF GOD TO ALL! God will do the rest.
I
Cobus,
In one of your earlier posts (quoted above) you wrote "on one of them." That's why I asked. Now I know that it was a typo and you meant "on none of them"

BTW, Where can I get the Old KJV online?
Also, what's so special about the Afrikaans Bible?
 
Feb 17, 2010
3,620
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Onlinebuddy, I am sorry if one typo error made you misuderstand me, yet they both actully means exactly the same. This is the first time I made a typing error and yet I am perfectly right still. My friend what I love about Acts 8 and that they did not receive the Holy Spirit when they believed and recieved the Word from Philip, is the way their experience are similar to mine. And actually proves the whole Gospel of God!

What is so special about the Afrikaans Bible... Well the 1930 Afrikaans translation was funded by our Bible printers to translate the same manuscripts as the Old King James version scholars used. The Canon manuscripts... In the Afrikaans Bible is says in Afrikaans what I will try to translate best to my ability.... This is the whole Holy Scripture, that comtains all the Canon-books of the Old and New Testament. Translated from the original languages...

Now the result of the translation by a score of scholars in the Old King James, and the result of these worldwide scholars that translated the Afrikaans Bible, are amazingly similar. It is a great revelation that two groups of people doing translations from the same manuscripts 300 years apart, can be so precise in result. There are VERY few differences. And if we really look at the message and the Gospel in both Bibles, they are actually saying the SAME thing.

My frien you will do good to study the Word with the Lord's Spirit as your teacher. He might even give you the gift of knowledge and then you will know ALL revelaed secrets that were even hid for great men like Daniel. May the God of Truth reveal His truth to you. I pray God that he will SHOW you all the Truth, so thet you will teach His Truth and that you will know Him and you will be set FREE in His Truth. Amen!
 
F

feedm3

Guest
If your studying scripture then you are learning from the "Lord's Spirit". The Holy Spirirt is the reason we have a bible - II Tim 3:16. Why would we need the "gift of knowledge" that was for a time when they did not have the "Complete" revelation from God, and we now do?

Peter said "we have all things that pertain to life and godliness". The word of God is "perfect", complete, and inspired. He does not give another revelation, other than what we can read in scripture.


16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works


If scripture is able to make us "perfect" or "complete" as this word means. Then we have no need for a "gift of knowledge", because we already have the word that is able to make us perfect.

We do not need the gift of knowledge that was for the early church, to understand God's word. Even back when this was being done, not everyone received the gift of knowledge, only some. IF that true today, then only those who receive the gift of knowledge can understand the Bible. IF thats the case then the word of God is not able to make any perfect, just some.

If one studies the Bible, and reads all the passages concerning "repentance", "faith", etc, they easily conclude that these are essential in salvation. Yet when it comes to baptism, which is commanded clearly, examples given, and explicitly said to "save us" and "washes away sin" though the blood of Christ, yet these are rejected?

It seems one who rejects this is not being lead by the Spirit, because the Spirit commands baptism as we all can so easily read.

The ONLY reason so plain a thing is baptism, being rejected, is an attempt to remain consistent within the "faith only" doctrine. That is not a reason to reject scritpture, and is error, and leading many away from the Lord.
 
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Sep 16, 2012
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I been baptized in water and by the power of the holy spirit. Yayyyy I don't need to find correction nor be corrected about this because I believe. If you believe that your way of baptism is right and our way is wrong then don't feel condemned. I mean wouldn't we all fall into the category of baptism in the holy spirit.

Btw It wouldn't Matter to me what colour Jesus is or isn't.( Unless you lay claim to have seen him? ) Cause i can tell you now Not one of us have seen him. It's hysterical when someone pulls the race card about Jesus. Blessings and all. Remember unless you are born of water and spirit you cannot enter the kingdom of God.
 
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onlinebuddy

Senior Member
Sep 1, 2012
1,115
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Cobus,
In one of your earlier posts (quoted above) you wrote "on one of them." That's why I asked. Now I know that it was a typo and you meant "on none of them"

BTW, Where can I get the Old KJV online?
Also, what's so special about the Afrikaans Bible?
Onlinebuddy, I am sorry if one typo error made you misuderstand me, yet they both actully means exactly the same. This is the first time I made a typing error and yet I am perfectly right still. My friend what I love about Acts 8 and that they did not receive the Holy Spirit when they believed and recieved the Word from Philip, is the way their experience are similar to mine. And actually proves the whole Gospel of God!
No Cobus, they meant different things. I'm not trying to make an issue of it. Just want to clarify myself.

You had earlier written, "The Holy Spirit did not fall on ONE of them." (So it sounded like the Holy Spirit fell on everyone except for on ONE of them.) Later you wrote, "....on NONE of them" (which made sense). So there is a difference.

I therefore inquired whether your Bible really said, "ONE of them" or was it a typing mistake. Now I know that it was a typing mistake. So no issues. Let's move on.
 

onlinebuddy

Senior Member
Sep 1, 2012
1,115
24
38
What is so special about the Afrikaans Bible... Well the 1930 Afrikaans translation was funded by our Bible printers to translate the same manuscripts as the Old King James version scholars used. The Canon manuscripts... In the Afrikaans Bible is says in Afrikaans what I will try to translate best to my ability.... This is the whole Holy Scripture, that comtains all the Canon-books of the Old and New Testament. Translated from the original languages...

Now the result of the translation by a score of scholars in the Old King James, and the result of these worldwide scholars that translated the Afrikaans Bible, are amazingly similar. It is a great revelation that two groups of people doing translations from the same manuscripts 300 years apart, can be so precise in result. There are VERY few differences. And if we really look at the message and the Gospel in both Bibles, they are actually saying the SAME thing.
Thanks for sharing this
 

onlinebuddy

Senior Member
Sep 1, 2012
1,115
24
38
If your studying scripture then you are learning from the "Lord's Spirit". The Holy Spirirt is the reason we have a bible - II Tim 3:16. Why would we need the "gift of knowledge" that was for a time when they did not have the "Complete" revelation from God, and we now do?

Peter said "we have all things that pertain to life and godliness". The word of God is "perfect", complete, and inspired. He does not give another revelation, other than what we can read in scripture.


16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works


If scripture is able to make us "perfect" or "complete" as this word means. Then we have no need for a "gift of knowledge", because we already have the word that is able to make us perfect.

We do not need the gift of knowledge that was for the early church, to understand God's word. Even back when this was being done, not everyone received the gift of knowledge, only some. IF that true today, then only those who receive the gift of knowledge can understand the Bible. IF thats the case then the word of God is not able to make any perfect, just some.
My frien you will do good to study the Word with the Lord's Spirit as your teacher. He might even give you the gift of knowledge and then you will know ALL revelaed secrets that were even hid for great men like Daniel. May the God of Truth reveal His truth to you. I pray God that he will SHOW you all the Truth, so thet you will teach His Truth and that you will know Him and you will be set FREE in His Truth. Amen!
Cobus, I have been brought up to believe just as Feedm3 has written in his post (quoted above). However, if the word of knowledge is available today, I would ask God for it, as I need help understanding many things in the Bible.
 

onlinebuddy

Senior Member
Sep 1, 2012
1,115
24
38
If one studies the Bible, and reads all the passages concerning "repentance", "faith", etc, they easily conclude that these are essential in salvation. Yet when it comes to baptism, which is commanded clearly, examples given, and explicitly said to "save us" and "washes away sin" though the blood of Christ, yet these are rejected?
At the moment, my Bible tells me that baptism is necessary for salvation. I pray that God will reveal to me if I am wrong. Meanwhile, I will continue to believe in the written word, because the written word can be read, heard and taught.


It seems one who rejects this is not being lead by the Spirit, because the Spirit commands baptism as we all can so easily read.

The ONLY reason so plain a thing is baptism, being rejected, is an attempt to remain consistent within the "faith only" doctrine. That is not a reason to reject scritpture, and is error, and leading many away from the Lord.
The "faith only" doctrine survives on the premise that water baptism=john's baptism, and that since John's baptism is invalid today, water baptism is not necessary. If one removes this premise and goes through the Book of Acts, it becomes obvious that baptism means water baptism, and is necessary.
 
F

feedm3

Guest
I agree 100%. Anyone that thinks water baptism is John's baptism, they need to read Acts 19:1-f.
 

onlinebuddy

Senior Member
Sep 1, 2012
1,115
24
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Ok I see the OLD KING JAMES SAYS... ON NONE OF THEM. That verse in afrikaans is EXACTLY the same... Nog op niemand van hulle... It means none of them or not ONE of them. it means not a single person had received the Holy Spirit YET! Play with words all you like, it means what it says... And it CLEARLY says they were baptized by a Holy Spirit fille person, yet they did not receive the Holy Spirit yet, not a single one of them.
Can you please explain why they did not receive the Holy Spirit despite being baptized? (This was my opening question on this thread.)

Acts 8:
12But when they believed Philip 17preaching the good news about the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, they were being 18baptized, men and women alike.


Some questions about the above passage:
1) How were they baptized? water?
2) Was this John's baptism?
3) Were the Samaritans saved when they believed?


Acts 8
17Then they 26began laying their hands on them, and they were 27receiving the Holy Spirit.


4) Did Peter and John baptize them with the Holy Spirit? In other words, was this the Baptism of the Holy Spirit?
5) At what point were they saved? When they believed, when they were baptized or when they received the Holy Spirit?
 

onlinebuddy

Senior Member
Sep 1, 2012
1,115
24
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Now about believe. Onlinebuddy you say you should be baptized AFTER you believe.... hen the disciples were with Jesus when did they believe to the measure of a mustard- seed? You see onlinebuddy your reasoning around the Gospel does not make sence to me. The apostles believed Jesus from the word GO! When Jesus came to the sea-side and he called John and James, Peter and Andrew, they immediately left their daily chores and followed Him. This they would only have done becasue God already gave them faith to follow Jesus!

When were they baptized and by whom?
I


Cobus,
When, according to you, were the 12 disciples (apostles) of Jesus saved?

(I will answer some of your other questions in this post later)
 

onlinebuddy

Senior Member
Sep 1, 2012
1,115
24
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Another question for you Cobus:
What must I do to be baptized by the Holy Spirit?
 

onlinebuddy

Senior Member
Sep 1, 2012
1,115
24
38

Now about believe. Onlinebuddy you say you should be baptized AFTER you believe.... hen the disciples were with Jesus when did they believe to the measure of a mustard- seed? You see onlinebuddy your reasoning around the Gospel does not make sence to me. The apostles believed Jesus from the word GO! When Jesus came to the sea-side and he called John and James, Peter and Andrew, they immediately left their daily chores and followed Him. This they would only have done becasue God already gave them faith to follow Jesus!

When were they baptized and by whom? They beleived but they had to follow Jesus. Jesus says after He caled them He gave them power over unclean spirits, and to heal the sick... And just as we think they are believers Jesus repremanded them sharply... O ye of little faith..... ... Faith is the short word of a person that believe.... When ar we believers to the extend that we should be baptized?


Cobus,
If we want to know how to be saved, we must not compare ourselves to the 12 Apostles. They were THE APOSTLES and they believed before the New Covenant came into effect. Rather, we must read the commands of Jesus regarding baptism, and study how his apostles went about obeying that command.

The bible never tells us everything. It only tells us what is necessary. If Jesus himself was baptized and overlooked his disciples as they baptized others, it would seem absurd that they were themselves not baptized. Anyway, let's not come to any conclusions about the disciples' baptism. It doesn't matter. They walked with Jesus, and I'm sure Jesus took care of them. We, who are born under the New Covenant, must be concerned about how to obey the commands of God in the New Covenant. That's what God expects from us: that we read His word and obey it. The Book of Acts very well describes how the apostles went about baptizing people. There are many other things that may confuse us; however the baptism part is very clear.

Faith (belief) has many levels. In order to be ready to be baptized one requires to have just a basic level of faith, enough to believe in Jesus as his Lord and Saviour. That's it.

We must not confuse basic faith in Jesus (required for salvation) with faith of a mustard seed (that is required to do amazing works). I hope that answers your question.
 

onlinebuddy

Senior Member
Sep 1, 2012
1,115
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Quoting what I said in another thread about Judas...



Scripture reveals to us that Judas was never saved. We can assume that before the betrayal he was immersed in water just like the disciples?

As I said earlier, water does not save. It's an act of obedience, an outward display of what's already happened inwardly. The thief was saved, not by being immersed in water (but yes, if he had the chance to be immersed in water he would've been)

Hope I don't sound like a hypocrite here. I've not yet been water baptized myself (note: I will do at some point, just haven't done it yet).

And no - if I die tomorrow I'm not going to hell, because I am saved by the blood of Jesus and have the Holy Spirit dwelling in me ;) :)
==========================================================

Hope I don't sound like a hypocrite here. I've not yet been water baptized myself (note: I will do at some point, just haven't done it yet).
No. You're not at all sounding like a hypocrite. You were good enough to take the time to answer my question to the best of your knowledge, and in an attempt to help me understand. Water baptism is entirely your choice. But I do not understand, dear sister, why one would wait? What for?

In the verse below, Ananias (on the instruction from the Lord Jesus himself) instructed Saul not to delay his water baptism (and washing away of his sins) any longer. Notice that Saul had believed and repented as well; however, he was instructed to get baptized.
Acts 22:16
16And now what are you waiting for? Get up, be baptized and wash your sins away, calling on his name.'

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And no - if I die tomorrow I'm not going to hell, because I am saved by the blood of Jesus and have the Holy Spirit dwelling in me ;) :)
The jailer was someone who could be sentenced to death the very next morning. On Paul's advice, he got baptized. He and his entire household believed in Jesus. They could have said the same thing you're saying (about being baptized later and about not going to hell if they died). However, they had learned the importance of baptism from the Apostle Paul himself

Acts 16:
33And he took them that very hour of the night and washed their wounds, and immediately he was baptized, he and all his household.