Salvation includes deliverance “from the wrath to come”
- Thread starter Nehemiah6
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lol, well give us a break Locutus the YLT translation wasn’t even published until 1862 so from the first century it said "there will be a resurrection"(Catholic) or "there shall be a resurrection"KJV so from Youngs interpretation (1862) till now(2017) is only 155 years since it was decided to say it said "about to be"...
Aint it great to not be one of those who had only the old translation instead of us who lived in the last 155 years since Young determined that instead of those millions who live in the past 1900 years?
All of them had the Greek texts sosandso - the translators hid the truth behind their futurist theology.
But that said, even in the KJV imminence is stamped all over the pages of the NT.
Only preconceptions and false expectations makes "at hand" and "shortly come to pass" events hundreds of years into the future.
But that said, even in the KJV imminence is stamped all over the pages of the NT.
Only preconceptions and false expectations makes "at hand" and "shortly come to pass" events hundreds of years into the future.
lol, in post #300 you coined the phrase "ignoring INSPIRED text" and now you say "the translators hid the truth"(gotta make up your mind Locutus,lol)...
Any way though go backwards in 1862 what do you think the literacy rate was in the world? How many of them do you think could read Greek? Then in 1762,and 1662? Imagine that you were born in 752ad and you as with the vast majority could not even read or write and so you just went to Church and the priest(or who could read) read it out loud to everyone.
So can you read the Greek text Locutus,are you sure that Young is reading it out loud to you correctly? lol, agreed more with you when you said it was "inspired text" in post #300 it made me think that the Holy spirit had taken care of it's meaning for the 1900 or so years before Young.
It's the modern days where we pick and choose which interpretation supports our theology,so to speak that is I was in my 20's before I even knew that there was another book called the bible other than the KJV. Not that I am knocking any of the others it's just that until then I didn't realize there was commas in different places or wrong words and such. lol,bare in mind though another guy will probably pull out another translation and tell us that his is the one that's correct instead of either of ours.
Any way though go backwards in 1862 what do you think the literacy rate was in the world? How many of them do you think could read Greek? Then in 1762,and 1662? Imagine that you were born in 752ad and you as with the vast majority could not even read or write and so you just went to Church and the priest(or who could read) read it out loud to everyone.
So can you read the Greek text Locutus,are you sure that Young is reading it out loud to you correctly? lol, agreed more with you when you said it was "inspired text" in post #300 it made me think that the Holy spirit had taken care of it's meaning for the 1900 or so years before Young.
It's the modern days where we pick and choose which interpretation supports our theology,so to speak that is I was in my 20's before I even knew that there was another book called the bible other than the KJV. Not that I am knocking any of the others it's just that until then I didn't realize there was commas in different places or wrong words and such. lol,bare in mind though another guy will probably pull out another translation and tell us that his is the one that's correct instead of either of ours.
Actually I was pointing out to AB that I quoted to him Young's literal translation of Acts 24:15 a long time ago and that he keeps ignoring and trying to wrestle his way out of the implications of the text.
Mello in Greek means something is impending, on the point of happening "about to be".
Acts 11:28 And there stood up one of them named Agabus, and signified by the Spirit that there should be (mellein) great dearth throughout all the world: which came to pass in the days of Claudius Caesar.
Young's - and one of them, by name Agabus, having stood up, did signify through the Spirit a great dearth is about to be throughout all the world -- which also came to pass in the time of Claudius Caesar --
Mellein is used in the exact same sense as in Acts 24:15
Had Luke not mentioned that this came to pass I'm sure the futurists would be looking for this "should be" great dearth somewhere tied to the 21st century.
Mellien can't be used for something hundreds of years later.
It is inspired, except when it's translated incorrectly, then it those places it's the word of men
I like the KJV, but when I became aware of some of the translation issues I adjusted my thinking, some translations I prefer how they've translated a particular verse over another, sometimes I use the NIV, and then the NASB.
Mello in Greek means something is impending, on the point of happening "about to be".
Acts 11:28 And there stood up one of them named Agabus, and signified by the Spirit that there should be (mellein) great dearth throughout all the world: which came to pass in the days of Claudius Caesar.
Young's - and one of them, by name Agabus, having stood up, did signify through the Spirit a great dearth is about to be throughout all the world -- which also came to pass in the time of Claudius Caesar --
Mellein is used in the exact same sense as in Acts 24:15
Had Luke not mentioned that this came to pass I'm sure the futurists would be looking for this "should be" great dearth somewhere tied to the 21st century.
Mellien can't be used for something hundreds of years later.
It is inspired, except when it's translated incorrectly, then it those places it's the word of men
I like the KJV, but when I became aware of some of the translation issues I adjusted my thinking, some translations I prefer how they've translated a particular verse over another, sometimes I use the NIV, and then the NASB.
Brother MarcR,
Thank you,
Notice the Rev 12:2 scripture that I mentioned.
In this passage there is the woman and the dragon with 7 heads and 10 horns.
The woman is seen with the dragon waiting for the child to be born.
This has been pointed out many times, by brother Ahwatukee, that the woman is Israel.
And the children are the stars. (12 tribes, implied?)
----
So now take that same understanding, of what the stars represent, and apply it to the 6th seal.
We would apply it to mean that the stars are Israel, and that it is Israelites whose lights (to the world through the Word of God) in the sky are gone dark.
When it says that they fall, they are either dead, or fallen from their position close to God, or both.
----
Continuing that line of thought, the stars that fall in Matt 24:29, are Israelites.
--
Try applying that line of thought to all the symbolic passages in the Rev. and Bible, Matt 24, Lk 21, Mk 13, day of the lord.
Thank you,
Notice the Rev 12:2 scripture that I mentioned.
In this passage there is the woman and the dragon with 7 heads and 10 horns.
The woman is seen with the dragon waiting for the child to be born.
This has been pointed out many times, by brother Ahwatukee, that the woman is Israel.
And the children are the stars. (12 tribes, implied?)
----
So now take that same understanding, of what the stars represent, and apply it to the 6th seal.
We would apply it to mean that the stars are Israel, and that it is Israelites whose lights (to the world through the Word of God) in the sky are gone dark.
When it says that they fall, they are either dead, or fallen from their position close to God, or both.
----
Continuing that line of thought, the stars that fall in Matt 24:29, are Israelites.
--
Try applying that line of thought to all the symbolic passages in the Rev. and Bible, Matt 24, Lk 21, Mk 13, day of the lord.
That is frequently true.
Here, these OT prophets (700-800 BC) are speaking about the "day of the Lord", referring to the end times, and it still has not happened. Even if you insist the "day of the Lord" happened in 66-70 AD, that is still 700-800 years AFTER those prophecies were spoken.
Isaiah 13:
6) Wail, for the day of the Lord is near; it will come like destruction from the Almighty.
Isaiah 29:
17) Is it not yet a very little while, and Lebanon shall be turned into a fruitful field, and the fruitful field shall be esteemed as a forest?
Isaiah 51: (NIV)
5) My righteousness draws near speedily, my salvation is on the way, and my arm will bring justice to the nations. The islands will look to me and wait in hope for my arm.
Zeph 1:
14) The great day of the LORD is near, it is near, and hasteth greatly, even the voice of the day of the LORD: the mighty man shall cry there bitterly.
Joel 1:
15) Alas for that day! For the day of the Lord is near; it will come like destruction from the Almighty.
Joel 2:
1) Blow the trumpet in Zion; sound the alarm on my holy hill. Let all who live in the land tremble, for the day of the Lord is coming. It is close at hand—
Joel 3:
14) Multitudes, multitudes in the valley of decision! For the day of the Lord is near in the valley of decision.
There are others (Obadiah and Haggai).
God's use of "near", "hastily", "coming soon", etc, is just the way He chose to speak at times, in both the OT and NT.
Here, these OT prophets (700-800 BC) are speaking about the "day of the Lord", referring to the end times, and it still has not happened. Even if you insist the "day of the Lord" happened in 66-70 AD, that is still 700-800 years AFTER those prophecies were spoken.
Isaiah 13:
6) Wail, for the day of the Lord is near; it will come like destruction from the Almighty.
Isaiah 29:
17) Is it not yet a very little while, and Lebanon shall be turned into a fruitful field, and the fruitful field shall be esteemed as a forest?
Isaiah 51: (NIV)
5) My righteousness draws near speedily, my salvation is on the way, and my arm will bring justice to the nations. The islands will look to me and wait in hope for my arm.
Zeph 1:
14) The great day of the LORD is near, it is near, and hasteth greatly, even the voice of the day of the LORD: the mighty man shall cry there bitterly.
Joel 1:
15) Alas for that day! For the day of the Lord is near; it will come like destruction from the Almighty.
Joel 2:
1) Blow the trumpet in Zion; sound the alarm on my holy hill. Let all who live in the land tremble, for the day of the Lord is coming. It is close at hand—
Joel 3:
14) Multitudes, multitudes in the valley of decision! For the day of the Lord is near in the valley of decision.
There are others (Obadiah and Haggai).
God's use of "near", "hastily", "coming soon", etc, is just the way He chose to speak at times, in both the OT and NT.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipe...xy._LXVI_4499.jpg/250px-P._Oxy._LXVI_4499.jpg this is written in Alexandrian text type Greek can you make out any of the words in it? I've been working on this since around 2005 when it first hit the www and I can read all but a few things,the Nomina Sacra type abbreviations are difficult.
Why I ask is that there are 14400, Greek professors on the internet forums well until there’s actually a fragment of Greek someones asking them about then they thin out. Bare in mind though that I consider mine own self a "preschooler" at Greek but then again I could read this for you. You interpret a line and I'll interpret the next and we'll work our way right through it,deal?
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipe...xy._LXVI_4499.jpg/250px-P._Oxy._LXVI_4499.jpg
ok,from the forth line from the top you see what looks like "TOOP" it is "TO" #3588 meaning "the" and then you see "OP" which is the first two letters of the Greek word "Oros" #3735 meaning "Mount" which are the 10th and 11th words in the KJV of Revelation 14:1 corresponding to;
"And I looked and, lo a lamb stood on THE MOUNT Sion..." so 10th word --->TO OP<--- (first two letters of "oros" the 11th word. You choose any of the other lines "you next",lol
ok,from the forth line from the top you see what looks like "TOOP" it is "TO" #3588 meaning "the" and then you see "OP" which is the first two letters of the Greek word "Oros" #3735 meaning "Mount" which are the 10th and 11th words in the KJV of Revelation 14:1 corresponding to;
"And I looked and, lo a lamb stood on THE MOUNT Sion..." so 10th word --->TO OP<--- (first two letters of "oros" the 11th word. You choose any of the other lines "you next",lol
I should have included this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nomina_sacra for the "second line" human being but it's genitive possessive...