The Dangerous CEV Bible

Enow · Mar 3, 2017

In one of the meetings of Promise Keepers' movement, they had handed out & used the CEV Bible to support this apostasy.

The KJV has Matthew 5:33-37 warning believers not to make oaths and promises that only God can keep like making yourself good or to do good. And yes, many believers used the commitment to follow Christ like a promise too.

Matthew 5:[SUP]33 [/SUP]Again, ye have heard that it hath been said by them of old time, Thou shalt not forswear thyself, but shalt perform unto the Lord thine oaths:[SUP]34 [/SUP]But I say unto you, Swear not at all; neither by heaven; for it is God's throne:[SUP]35 [/SUP]Nor by the earth; for it is his footstool: neither by Jerusalem; for it is the city of the great King.[SUP]36 [/SUP]Neither shalt thou swear by thy head, because thou canst not make one hair white or black.[SUP]37 [/SUP]But let your communication be, Yea, yea; Nay, nay: for whatsoever is more than these cometh of evil.

Jesus gave the reason in verse 36 as to why we should not be making any promises to God when we are supposed to deny ourselves, be crucified with Christ as it is He who lives in us, and follow Him, by trusting Him in us to help us to follow Him.

Luke 9:23And he said to them all, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me.

We are exhorted by Him to not make a commitment nor a promise to follow Him as we are to follow Him by faith that He will help us to follow Him.

Now may the Lord help you to see how a CEV Bible can serve an apostasy of the movement of men; and not of God.

Matthew 5:[SUP]33 [/SUP]You know that our ancestors were told, “Don’t use the Lord’s name to make a promise unless you are going to keep it.” [SUP]34 [/SUP]But I tell you not to swear by anything when you make a promise! Heaven is God’s throne, so don’t swear by heaven. [SUP]35 [/SUP]The earth is God’s footstool, so don’t swear by the earth. Jerusalem is the city of the great king, so don’t swear by it. [SUP]36 [/SUP]Don’t swear by your own head. You cannot make one hair white or black. [SUP]37 [/SUP]When you make a promise, say only “Yes” or “No.” Anything else comes from the devil. CEV

Complete opposite of what Jesus said for us NOT to do in the KJV and IN other modern Bibles.

Look at Paul's call not to be in a yoke of bondage in the KJV and see how the CEV got him promising.

Galatians 5:1Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.[SUP]2 [/SUP]Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.[SUP]3 [/SUP]For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.[SUP]4 [/SUP]Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.[SUP]5 [/SUP]For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith. KJV

If circumcision is the smallest letter of the law and yet if we do that, we are entitled to do the whole law, where do you think making a promise to God falls under when making a promise to God is the biggest letter of the law?

Galatians 5:1Christ has set us free! This means we are really free. Now hold on to your freedom and don’t ever become slaves of the Law again.[SUP]2 [/SUP]I, Paul, promise you that Christ won’t do you any good if you get circumcised. [SUP]3 [/SUP]If you do, you must obey the whole Law. [SUP]4 [/SUP]And if you try to please God by obeying the Law, you have cut yourself off from Christ and his wonderful kindness. [SUP]5 [/SUP]But the Spirit makes us sure that God will accept us because of our faith in Christ. CEV
I am aware that many men that have made a commitment to follow Christ have attended the Promise Keepers program and yet joining would testify that they have not been keeping that commitment to follow Him which is why they need that program to make 7 promises to God which they cannot keep in making themselves good or to do good.

Galatians 3:1O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?[SUP]2 [/SUP]This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?[SUP]3 [/SUP]Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?[SUP]4 [/SUP]Have ye suffered so many things in vain? if it be yet in vain.

Jesus Christ had set me free from my personal promises and my commitment to follow Christ to rest in Him & His promises to me to help me to follow Him and live as His friend. I place all my hopes on Him as my Good Shepherd in following Him.

By the grace of God I have been saved by faith in Jesus Christ as my Savior & by the grace of God I follow Him by faith in Jesus Christ as my Good Shepherd. That is the only way I can get to know Him & the power of His resurrection.

So...

If the Lord has helped you to see the truth in how a modern CEV Bible can lead and strengthen the believers in their wickedness, and you may find yourself hard pressed to reprove that false teaching of the commandments of men by your modern Bible because they use the CEV to justify it, then you can see my problem when trying to use the KJV to do the same.

I know that only God can cause the increase in using only the KJV Bible, but with all those modern Bibles out there that support the works of darkness in one form or another, it is no wonder to me why faith is hard to find in these latter days.

Can you win converts by the modern Bibles? Yes.

Can you reprove ALL of the works of darkness that is so dominating in these latter days by those same modern Bibles? No.

If you fail to see the point.... then I leave you to God on this issue.

Locutus · Mar 3, 2017

Enow said:

Matthew 5:[SUP]33 [/SUP]Again, ye have heard that it hath been said by them of old time, Thou shalt not forswear thyself, but shalt perform unto the Lord thine oaths:[SUP]34 [/SUP]But I say unto you, Swear not at all; neither by heaven; for it is God's throne:[SUP]35 [/SUP]Nor by the earth; for it is his footstool: neither by Jerusalem; for it is the city of the great King.[SUP]36 [/SUP]Neither shalt thou swear by thy head, because thou canst not make one hair white or black.[SUP]37 [/SUP]But let your communication be, Yea, yea; Nay, nay: for whatsoever is more than these cometh of evil.

Matthew 5:[SUP]33 [/SUP]You know that our ancestors were told, “Don’t use the Lord’s name to make a promise unless you are going to keep it.” [SUP]34 [/SUP]But I tell you not to swear by anything when you make a promise! Heaven is God’s throne, so don’t swear by heaven. [SUP]35 [/SUP]The earth is God’s footstool, so don’t swear by the earth. Jerusalem is the city of the great king, so don’t swear by it. [SUP]36 [/SUP]Don’t swear by your own head. You cannot make one hair white or black. [SUP]37 [/SUP]When you make a promise, say only “Yes” or “No.” Anything else comes from the devil. CEV

Both sayeth the same self thing - thou art not so brighteth art thou.

trofimus · Mar 3, 2017

I think you have a gift seeing apostasy in everything

maxwel · Mar 3, 2017

The CEV is probably fine if you want a paraphrased bible, which is also more "gender sensitive."

Personally, I've never been able to recommend a paraphrased bible to anyone.
And if you're so squeamish that pronouns frighten you... maybe you shouldn't be reading the bible at all.

It's not a witch hunt to just admit that not all translations are created equally.
But people are certainly free to read whatever they like.

Enow · Mar 3, 2017

[QUOTE=Locutus;3002483]Both sayeth the same self thing - thou art not so brighteth art thou.[/QUOTE]

So says the Starship Captain under the oath of Starfleet. You would not see any difference.

Titus 1:[SUP]15 [/SUP]Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled.[SUP]16 [/SUP]They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

Here is what Jesus was talking about as to why both O.T. & N.T. says that to be under the New Covenant, no believer should be making any promises that only God can finish as we are to cease from our works to rest in Him in doing His.

Numbers 30:[SUP]2 [/SUP]If a man vow a vow unto the Lord, or swear an oath to bind his soul with a bond; he shall not break his word, he shall do according to all that proceedeth out of his mouth.

Ecclesiastes 5:[SUP]4 [/SUP]When thou vowest a vow unto God, defer not to pay it; for he hath no pleasure in fools: pay that which thou hast vowed.[SUP]5 [/SUP]Better is it that thou shouldest not vow, than that thou shouldest vow and not pay.[SUP]6 [/SUP]Suffer not thy mouth to cause thy flesh to sin; neither say thou before the angel, that it was an error: wherefore should God be angry at thy voice, and destroy the work of thine hands?[SUP]7 [/SUP]For in the multitude of dreams and many words there are also divers vanities: but fear thou God.

Jesus said in the KJV, that of old times, people performed their oaths to the Lord; and then said not to, not even to swear at all either, putting down the swearing to perform the oath as well as making the oath, because now it is God's turn; not man's.

If it is not YOU who live but Christ Who lives in you, then shouldn't His promises be enough in being your Good Shepherd in helping you to live as His in following Him?

Those who make commitments to follow Christ and to make promises in making themselves good & to do good works are departing from that faith in Him alone in being able as our Good Shepherd.

Matthew 15:[SUP]7 [/SUP]Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying,[SUP]8 [/SUP]This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me.[SUP]9 [/SUP]But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.[SUP]10 [/SUP]And he called the multitude, and said unto them, Hear, and understand:[SUP]11 [/SUP]Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man...................[SUP]18 [/SUP]But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man.[SUP]19 [/SUP]For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies: [SUP]20 [/SUP]These are the things which defile a man:.............

So what is a false witness? Jesus explained it;

John 5:[SUP]31 [/SUP]If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true.

John 7:[SUP]18 [/SUP]He that speaketh of himself seeketh his own glory: but he that seeketh his glory that sent him, the same is true, and no unrighteousness is in him.

To seek your glory as a Promise Keeper ( a work of the law btw ) and/or to seek your glory as keeping that commitment to follow Christ ( which many religious people can boast in ) is a false witness.

John 3:[SUP]28 [/SUP]Ye yourselves bear me witness, that I said, I am not the Christ, but that I am sent before him.[SUP]29 [/SUP]He that hath the bride is the bridegroom: but the friend of the bridegroom, which standeth and heareth him, rejoiceth greatly because of the bridegroom's voice: this my joy therefore is fulfilled.[SUP]30 [/SUP]He must increase, but I must decrease.

You cannot bear witness of Him and yourself for that would still make you a false witness. It is either one or the other in seeking the glory thereof.

Your promises & your commitments speaks of you. Your faith in Jesus Christ & all His promises to us speaks of Him. It can only be one or the other. If you do both, religious people will praise you; not God, because even by God's words, it gives the credit to you as your promises and your commitments are the works of your hands; not God's.

You either live by faith in Jesus Christ as your Good Shepherd in helping you to follow Him or you are resorting to your own power under the law & thus voiding faith in Him as being able to by Himself.

Dino246 · Mar 3, 2017

Enow said:

Firstly, your assertion that the CEV supports the "complete opposite" of the KJV is silly and groundless. Your hyperbole only make you sound like a windbag.

Secondly, it's not "an apostasy". Please go and learn what the word actually means, and how to use it properly.

Thirdly, Matthew 5:33-37 says nothing about promises or oaths "that only God can keep like making yourself good or to do good". That is your eisegesis.

Fourthly, regarding your statement, "Jesus gave the reason in verse 36 as to why we should not be making any promises to God when we are supposed to deny ourselves...", no, He didn't. He said, "for you cannot make one hair of your head white or black." More eisegesis.

Any version of the Bible can be used to support something unbiblical. The King James Bible was used to support and defend slavery. I strongly suspect that the Promise Keepers were far more concerned about getting the Bible into the hands of men than in defending a practice (the making of promises) which might be criticized.

Enow · Mar 3, 2017

Dino246 said:

I suppose namecalling is your only resort now.

Standing apart from the truth is what apostasy means.

It is hardly differentiating from " You cannot make one hair white or black" in verse 36. Thus Who can? God can. So.. do not make any promises that only God can do and finish. Confirm the word with Him; don't take my word for it.

Since scripture cannot go against scripture, then the message in the Luke's reference does tie in with His message in Matthew 5:33-37. It is one and the same truth; we are to live by faith; not by trying to keep promises as if that is the power for living the christian life.

The only contention there is.... all contentions against the KJV has not been about supporting any false teaching or apostasy of the days we are living in whereas modern Bibles are.

Dino246 · Mar 3, 2017

Enow said:

I wasn't namecalling; if I were, I would have written, "You are a windbag". That is not what I wrote. I wrote that your use of hyperbole makes you sound LIKE a windbag. You can take the admonishment as corrective, or ignore it, and be ignored.

Enow said:

Apostasy:

an act of refusing to continue to follow, obey, or recognize a religious faith
abandonment of a previous loyalty

Source: https://www.merriam-webster.com/dic...campaign=sd&utm_medium=serp&utm_source=jsonld

I bolded the words in the definition. In both parts, a defined starting point is foundational. I welcome you to quote your definition from a standard dictionary.

Enow said:

I understand what you're getting at, and I think it's a good point, but it doesn't follow from Matthew 5, so your assertion that the CEV is a bad translation because of this does not follow.

You are making a doctrinal statement using the KJV of several passages, but comparing it with the CEV of one passage. That is a common tactic of KJV-only proponents, and it is logically flawed.

Enow said:

So you're deflecting the charge that the KJV was used to support slavery instead of admitting it? Well then, your assertions about other translations are now moot, because you won't deal with the proverbial log in your own eye.

Go ahead, carefully craft your assertions to make the KJV look good and others look bad. A little fact checking will expose your reasoning.

Enow · Mar 8, 2017

Dino246 said:

The use of the word "LIKE" is void when you cite it like this ( note how I use the word like too )

In other words, my hyperbole does not make me sound like anything else when it only does that.. sound like a windbag is making me out to be a windbag. I used that hyperbole... therefore only a windbag would say that. No matter how you slice it.. you are addressing me and not the topic.

We can agree to disagree, but if you wish to avoid the appearance of name calling, just address the topic.

Unimpressive. Even Strong's Concordance has to define the Greek word by how it is used in the verse, and it does not always do that either. Example: Christ being defined as the Anointed One. When used in scripture Christ also refers to deity because denying Jesus is the Christ is also denying the Father just as the rock was Christ ( 1 Corinthians 10:4 ) as Rock is always referring to deity in the Psalms.

https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?qs_version=KJV&quicksearch=rock+Lord&begin=23&end=23

And Peter confessed Jesus as the Christ, the Son of the living God is the Rock that Jesus was building on; not Peter.

Proof that this is correct application is by looking up pneuma in the Greek word where it can refer to the Holy Spirit, but other things as well.

So how pneuma is used in a verse dictates its meaning because it does not always refers to the Holy Spirit as the case is true for John 6:63 and 2 Corinthians 3:6 in most but not all modern Bibles when they in error, capitalized spirit in those verses when it as not about the Holy Spirit at all.

But again, you probably do not even see this contention at all which is why I shall pray for you that the Lord may be peradventuring to see the truthin in His words for the message that He wants us to have in these latter days when faith is hard to find.

If circumcision is the smallest letter of the law and if you do that, you are entitled to do the whole law; what do you think making a promise to God is, but the biggest letter of the law? Why do people think they are not under the law when they make promises but yet they agree doing circumcision puts them under the law/

There are more scriptural truth about any one being under the law of finishing that promise, and not leaving it undone that proves the CEV has it wrong and teaching bondage to believers to be under the law.

Jesus was talking about how His people would perform their oaths to the Lord; and the He went so far as to say don't even swear at all when making an oath either because it puts the believer under the law to do all of it; God cannot help him to do it when it is his promise as per His words in Numbers 30:2. A believer's promise or commitment to follow Him is a work of His hands as God said in Ecclesiastes 5:4-7 and since it is not we who live but Christ in us.... then how can we make promises that are His to keep as Jesus explained why in Matthew 5:36 when He said "you cannot make one hair white or black". Who makes our hair white or black? God. Our Creator can only do His work in us and through us which is why the just shall live by faith.

Gnosticism do not have to change the whole Bible to suit their false teachings. They only need to change enough of it to have their followers refer to those verses to support their false teachings.

So the CEV had changed it even more as all modern Bibles will not support that change to be about making promises at all, but most modern Bibles has Matthew 5:33-37 to be about not making promises that only God can keep, providing the Lord helps them see that as it is the same in the KJV. Most people think it is about not swearing when Jesus began with how people performed their oaths to the Lord, and so it is about making oaths, and Jesus included the swearing by it because oath makers use that as a means to declare how serious they were in finishing it; thus all of the flesh.

That is why Jesus and James were against "swearing an oath" because the oath is about man's will power & merit in that under the law, if they fail to finish it, they will be judged by it.

Which is why no one will be justified by the deeds of the law and why we need to be identified as His not by the works of the law but by the faith in Jesus Christ apart from the law.

And just how does the other Bibles avoid Leviticus 25:44-46? There is no way modern Bibles cannot say the same thing as the KJV does. Any one reading this can see that for themselves at this link comparing with other modern Bibles.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Leviticus 25:44-46&version=KJV;NIV;NASB;ESV;NLT

Feel free to prove that modern Bibles do not support slavery as you seem to believe that the KJV is alone in this.

As it is, pot calling kettle black.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+Peter+2:18&version=KJV;NIV;NASB;ESV;NLT

Dino246 · Mar 8, 2017

Enow, "peradventuring" is not a word, because "peradventure" is not a verb. As to the rest, I'll deal with it when I see fit and have the time.

hornetguy · Mar 8, 2017

I first thought this was going to be a really short thread... then I realized you had no intention of doing what you stated you would do.

I'm curious... what will be the next windmill you tilt against.... women wearing pants, perhaps?

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The Dangerous CEV Bible

Enow

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Locutus

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trofimus

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maxwel

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Enow

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Dino246

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Enow

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Dino246

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Enow

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Dino246

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hornetguy

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