The finished work of the cross ?

[followjesus]

When Jesus said "It is finished" and went to sleep, I believe His most direct reference was being spoken to the Father that He had accomplished all He was sent to do without fail, also refering to His prayer about alowwing the cup to pass from Him were it the will of the Father. Of course it was the will of the Father for Him to drink the cup.

This said, Jesus Christ is our Example. He was chided for working on the Sabbath, to which He replied His Father was working therefore He must work also for He always did what the Father did.

Jesus is our Example, although I do maintain the Seventh Day as the true seventh day, I can do anything that is good any day of the week as long as it honors God.

The reason I add this Biblical teaching to the "It is Finished" title is so the family keeps in mind we have not finished if we are following the Example of Christ, for He has yet to returne with justice in His Hand.. Until then, we have all God gives us to do until the King comes to reign......otherwise we are attempting to reign without the King present.

Praise God; He is worthy, not us........amen.

I really agree with that Good stuff. thank You for sharing that !! as Christians were always following Jesus, thats what Christians are followers Of the Lord and His example. God bless you !!

 

[mailmandan]

im not implying anything im saying thats part of it sure. Just equally as much as the teachings and commands of Jesus Christ. the gospel starts when Jesus is born, ends when He is taken up to Heaven, and is spread by His apostles. but its not an implication its what Jesus Christ says

So the gospel to you is everything written in the 4 gospels and obeying the gospel is perfectly obeying every command written in the 4 gospels? I guess Paul forgot to mention that in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 and Romans 1:16.

I just choose to believe My Lord and savior.

How did Jesus become your Lord and Savior and if you were standing at the gates of heaven right now and the Lord Jesus Christ asked you why He should let you into heaven, what would be your EXACT answer?

so maybe Jesus is implying something that you dont agree with

Straw man argument.

but naw im just saying clearly the gospel is found from the beginning of matthew and continues until the end of John. everything in it. the death and resurrection included. Just dont omit the rest is the difference, i dont ignore Gods word, because paul wrote epistles back to the churches already established to correct sertain beliefs.

It sounds like you are confusing the 4 gospels (Matthew, Mark, Luke, John) with the specific gospel message (death, burial and resurrection of Christ) which is the power of God unto salvation for everyone who BELIEVES.. (1 Corinthians 15:1-4; Romans 1:16). Which explains why you add works to the gospel. I've heard people call the entire Bible the gospel and I've heard Mormons call the Bible and the book of Mormon together the "fullness of the gospel."

right lol that describes a genuine believer that they obey the commandments of Jesus and recieve the Holy spirit, you got that correct. would you say that a believer needs to be genuine ? i would think its just what it is. if you admit that describes a genuine believer whats the issue or difference? there isnt one shouldnt we all be genuine believers? so we have genuine salvation?

There are two groups people who call Jesus Lord. Genuine believers (Christians) and those who merely "profess" to be Christians (nominal Christians). Not everyone who claims to be a Christian truly is born again. There is a mixture of wheat and tares found in professing Christianity. The sheep are identified as genuine believers and the goats are identified as those who are not genuine believers. There are obviously people who are "religious" but not right with God and are merely Christians "in name only." Such people never genuinely trusted in Christ's finished work of redemption as the ALL-sufficient means of their salvation. Jesus NEVER knew such people, as we see in Matthew 7:22-23.

i would conclude that we probably should Just accept the gospel, founf from matthew 1:1 - the last verse in John. the 4 accounts of the gospel. and simply Believe Jesus pretty simple rather than saying " thats the essence of" or " thats descriptive of" it seems maybe you think to say something one way , and then say ot a different way changes the meaning or something im not sure.

We should absolutely accept the truth written in the 4 gospels yet we must also rightly divide the word of truth when reading the NT and not confuse DESCRIPTIVE passages of Scripture with PRESCRIPTIVE passages of Scripture or else we end up perverting the gospel of Christ by teaching salvation by works.

Yeah i never menton "salvation by works" thats Just a phrase the gog believers use whn someone says whats in the gospel Like " Jesus said we need to obey Him" then ....": thats salvation by works" comes never from me, but like i said from those who learn the gog from current day "authors selling books" gotta make them appealing to the world in order to sell them....so yeah i dont even mention salvation by works its more the gog crowd phrase. Im a gopel of the Kingdom of God believer. not a grace revolution believer. big difference.

So your gospel is - "we must perfectly obey Jesus or else and salvation is based on the merits of our obedience/works" and you say that is not salvation by works? So what is the difference between the gospel of the kingdom and the gospel of grace? Are you Jewish? As we move forward from the Old Testament to the time of Christ's earthly ministry, we see that Jesus Christ, John the Baptist, and the twelve apostles preached the gospel of the kingdom to Israel. This was not the gospel of grace that we later see preached by the Apostle Paul to the churches, which was still a mystery (Ephesians 3:1-7). Paul preached that Jesus Christ died for our sins, was buried and rose from the dead, but during Christ's earthly ministry, no one was preaching that message. It had not even happened yet.

John the Baptist preached the gospel of the kingdom, which was, "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand" (Matthew 3:2). In Mark 1:14-15, we read - "Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God, And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel." This gospel of the kingdom which Jesus Christ preached was the same message that John the Baptist preached: "From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand" (Matthew 4:17).

Jesus Christ sent the twelve disciples to preach only to Israel in Matthew 10:5-7, we read - "These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not: But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand." The disciples were specifically told to go only to the people of Israel, and they were not preaching the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ.

i choose to believe Jesus, the gog chooses to explain why He was wrong about salvation or why it doesnt apply to christians.

You choose to believe YOUR interpretation of what Jesus said. Jesus was not wrong about anything and He clearly explained about how we are saved in John 3:15,16,18; 5:24; 6:29,40,47; 11:25,26.

One is Life according to Jesus, the other is the way accoprding to the serpent, i choose Jesus, always have and will.

Those who choose Jesus do not add works to the gospel of grace.

ive often noticed you guys really are more critics and explain why scripture is just way off, rather than talking aboutthe scriptures. so its hard to discuss with those of the gog for me, 2 different faiths.

I talk about the scriptures.

I woulkd just encourage you guys to go to the 4 gospels and see if the gog teaches anything even similar, and make sure to believe it all and remember its the Word of God, coming from Jesus the savior, His Only begotten. or if you believe "Jesus is God" thats even more of a reason to believe and acceot His words.

Rather than focusing only on the 4 gospels, you need to read the entire NT. We are under the New Covenant, in case you did not realize that.

He teaches pretty straight forward about His Kingdom and salvation and all. you wiull find that Paul, woasnt making uo His own Gospel, was simply spreading the 4 gospels. thats why there is so much to make clear about repentance and living upright Lives doing good works.

In regards to the gospel that Paul preached (which was still a mystery until Jesus revealed it to Paul). Galatians 1:11 - For I would have you know, brethren, that the gospel which was preached by me is not according to man. 12 For I neither received it from man, nor was I taught it, but I received it through a revelation of Jesus Christ. So are you trusting in your best efforts to live an upright life and do good works as the means of your salvation? OR are you trusting in the death, burial and resurrection as the ALL-sufficient means of your salvation? All I keep hearing from you is WORKS.

I recently noticed some try to make being born again not a part of the gospel as well....that could be the issue. Gotts be born again, thats what pauls talking about with "new creation" being born again happens How Jesus said is does......id first leanr the gospel and then go to pauls words.

So how do you believe that we are born again? John 3:3 - Jesus answered and said to him, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God." 4 Nicodemus said to Him, "How can a man be born when he is old? He cannot enter a second time into his mother’s womb and be born, can he?" 5 Jesus answered, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of God." Works-salvationists interpret verse 5 as, "unless one is water baptized he cannot enter the kingdom of God." What say you?

His epistles werent what founded any churches, He sent those back to churches founded on the gospel, and then was correcting things they were doing and believing wrong. its not a good idea to try to be saved by only pauls words cant understand them until the gospel is accepted. then they are pretty clear and youll realize how essential Jesus words are.

I accept the words of Paul, I believe the gospel, I accept the words of Jesus and I'm not mixed up about works. If this applies to you as well, then why all the disagreements?

 

[UnderGrace]

If you've got grace.

Yes a comedian on board.....we can definitely use it from time to time!

 

[mailmandan]

It is a reference to this :
30 So when Jesus had received the sour wine, He said, “It is finished!” And bowing His head, He gave up His spirit. John 19:30.

It is also reference to doctrines which teach that Jesus Christ did all the work on the cross, by suffering and shedding His blood, that is necessary for our salvation. Human beings cannot add to this finished work of the cross

Amen! Romans 3:24 - Being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.

 

[followjesus]

Amen! Romans 3:24 - Being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.

whats the Next verse say there? something about sins that are past ?

romans 3:25 "Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God"

 

[Leena4]

Christianity is simply about the love of God for us. As John 3:16 says that God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, whosoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
We have to understand that God doesn't force us to do anything. He has given us free will - we can either choose to serve him or not. When we do decide to follow him, we believe that Jesus (son of God) died on the cross for our sins, and the sins that we have committed in the past and will commit in the future - as long as we repent , he will remember it no more (Hebrews 8:12).
Also once you are christian, you want to serve the Lord, and will start to dislike sin as this doesn't please God. However, if do intentionally sin, trample over his blood, you will be punished (Hebrews 10:29), unless of course you truly repent.

The truth of the matter is that God's Word is full of mysteries. In the book of Genesis - the genealogy actually has a secret message - see below: This is just amazing - The bible is God breathed - and this proves it, as this is hidden in the old testament. Also the the story of Abraham and Isaac is also a foreshadowing that blood of the sinless can be used for remission of sins. Another fact is that where Isaac was put on the altar to be sacrificed - that is where Jesus died on the cross - Now isn't that amazing!

Genesis 5
The Composite List

Now let's put it all together:

Hebrew English
Adam Man
Seth Appointed
Enosh Mortal
Kenan Sorrow;
Mahalalel The Blessed God
Jared Shall come down
Enoch Teaching
Methuselah His death shall bring
Lamech The Despairing
Noah Rest, or comfort.
That's rather remarkable:

Man (is) appointed mortal sorrow; (but) the Blessed God shall come down teaching (that) His death shall bring (the) despairing rest.

Here's the Gospel hidden within a genealogy in Genesis!
A Hidden Message:: The Gospel in Genesis – Chuck Missler – Koinonia House

 

[mailmandan]

whats the Next verse say there? something about sins that are past ?

romans 3:25 "Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God"

Are you implying that the blood of Christ is only good for the remission of sins in the past, but not the present or the future? What does Acts 13:39 says? - and by Him everyone who believes is justified from all things from which you could not be justified by the law of Moses.

 

[miknik5]

Are you implying that the blood of Christ is only good for the remission of sins in the past, but not the present or the future? What does Acts 13:39 says? - and by Him everyone who believes is justified from all things from which you could not be justified by the law of Moses.

He is trying to sanctify himself
He is trying to become a "little god"

 

[valiant]

whats the Next verse say there? something about sins that are past ?

romans 3:25 "Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God"

He is referring to all the sins since Adam. Then he goes on to speak of the present time.

 

[mailmandan]

He is trying to sanctify himself
He is trying to become a "little god"

That is really bizarre! Where do these people come from?

 

[followjesus]

Are you implying that the blood of Christ is only good for the remission of sins in the past, but not the present or the future? What does Acts 13:39 says? - and by Him everyone who believes is justified from all things from which you could not be justified by the law of Moses.

not implying anything at all, just trying to get through to you that one scripture at a time causes serious misunderstanding.


for those who accept the actual Gospel His sacrifice along with His Word is plenty. Because Jesus teaches us about forgiveness for sins ahead. He forgave our opast to bring us to God, and teaches us the new covenant very simply forgiveness for today and tomorrow you will find taught in Jesus teachings...which you said you accept

matthew 6:14-15 " For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you: 15But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.


So there is no implication of anything theres Just the truth of the Gospel, that is all of the things written in the gospel begins with Jesus birth, ends with Jeus ascention to Gods Right Hand and includes everything Jesus taught and all the events in the 4 accounts of the Gospel. such as the above principle repeated several times By Jesus who you say you accept His words, so then it seems as if we forgive those who sin against us, God will forgive our sins according to the Blood of His Son Jesus. in that way sure His blood is sufficient. Not for those who reject His gospel though.

Luke 6:37-38 "Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven: 38Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.

Since you accept Jesus words, you should understand im not " implying anything its Just what the Lord Jesus Christ taught His disciples. apparently according to Jesus, his blood covers those who Hear and keep His word. because they understand thier past sins have been forgiven, and also understand that the gospel is as Much the word of God, as it is the " cross"

mark 1:1 "The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God;

Luke 6:46-49 "And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?

47Whosoever cometh to me, and heareth my sayings, and doeth them, I will shew you to whom he is like: 48He is like a man which built an house, and digged deep, and laid the foundation on a rock: and when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently upon that house, and could not shake it: for it was founded upon a rock.

49But he that heareth, and doeth not, is like a man that without a foundation built an house upon the earth; against which the stream did beat vehemently, and immediately it fell; and the ruin of that house was great.

the cross forgave our past and brought us into a relationship with God through the actual gospel His Word Given through His Son.

 

[followjesus]

He is referring to all the sins since Adam. Then he goes on to speak of the present time.

its always you guys tryong to explain whats there, but never do actually have any scripture to support yur explaination.

here it is again in Hebrews

Hebrews 9:15 "And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

it seems His death, was for the forgiveness of sins behind, those sins repented of and left behind with the first testament or what you probably call " first covenant" notice Jesus is the mediator of the new testament? and this is what He says about forgiveness of sins

matthew 6:14 -15 "For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you: 15But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

<< Jesus words, you know the mediator of the new testament? who died to forgive our past Lives of sin, and taught us How to be forgiven for the sins ahead. seems that its pretty wise to believe what Jesus said because He was preaching the Gospel

Luke 4:18 "The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,"


seems as if His words are pretty important part of the Gospel, but....thats Just for those who accept His word because thoer faith is supposedly in Him

Luke 6:46-49 "And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?

47Whosoever cometh to me, and heareth my sayings, and doeth them, I will shew you to whom he is like: 48He is like a man which built an house, and digged deep, and laid the foundation on a rock: and when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently upon that house, and could not shake it: for it was founded upon a rock.

49But he that heareth, and doeth not, is like a man that without a foundation built an house upon the earth; against which the stream did beat vehemently, and immediately it fell; and the ruin of that house was great.


seems like the difference there between a foundation, and no foundation would be to hear and Keep Jesus word......whoch of course He was preaching the Gospel, the new testament. but it takes a person accepting Gods word and not preaching from a book of revolutionary " grace"

 

[followjesus]

That is really bizarre! Where do these people come from?

they are disciples of Jesus Christ who hear His word and believe it rather than those who work hard to omit His Word from the gospel which He was annointed to preach.

Luke 1:1-4 " Forasmuch as many have taken in hand to set forth in order a declaration of those things which are most surely believed among us, 2Even as they delivered them unto us, which from the beginning were eyewitnesses, and ministers of the word; 3It seemed good to me also, having had perfect understanding of all things from the very first, to write unto thee in order, most excellent Theophilus, 4That thou mightest know the certainty of those things, wherein thou hast been instructed.


"the Gospel according to Luke"

apparently Luke was explaining the account of the true Gospel beginning at the birth Of Jesus Christ, and ending at His ascention.....including all that is in between.

and of Course mark agrees in "the gospel according to Mark" v1

seems the gospel was recorded in full by 4 witnesses, who were led of the Holy spirit to write the accounts of the things christians are to believe.

Matthew 5:11-12 "Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. 12Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you.

 

[followjesus]

He is trying to sanctify himself
He is trying to become a "little god"

romans 12:1 "I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.

John 17:17 "Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

1 thessolonians 4:2-8 "For ye know what commandments we gave you by the Lord Jesus. 3For this is the will of God, evenyour sanctification, that ye should abstain from fornication: 4That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honour; 5Not in the lust of concupiscence, even as the Gentiles which know not God:

6That no man go beyond and defraud his brother in any matter: because that the Lord is the avenger of all such, as we also have forewarned you and testified.7For God hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness. 8He therefore that despiseth, despiseth not man, but God, who hath also given unto us his holy Spirit.

2 thessolonians1:8-9 " In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: 9Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

 

[Issachar92]

1 Corinthians 15:1-4 thats all.

 

[followjesus]

1 Corinthians 15:1-4 thats all.

sure if a person wants to believe thats all thats written, which omits the gospel of Jesus Christ.

apparently mark didnt get it nor luke, nor Jesus, but only pauls corrective letter sent back to corinthians,, and only 3 verses apply. thats exactly what the world teaches it seems like. but it sems like paul has a lot to say about the words Of Jesus Christ the actual Lord.

1 timothy 6:3-5 "If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness; 4He is proud, knowing nothing, but doting about questions and strifes of words, whereof cometh envy, strife, railings, evil surmisings, 5Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself.

or in other words Better Words

matthew 7:21-27 "Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

24Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock: 25And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.

26And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand: 27And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it."


the reason paul said " FIRST OF ALL" is because theres more to it, and the death and resurrection is supposed to bring a persons heart to the Gospel of Gods Kingdom. thats How those couple verses " save" we dont omit everything because of them, we are supposed to accept Jesus word because of them. to try to be saved through thinking the cross omits anyything is not a wise way to think, its purpose, His purpose in Dying on the cross was to win our hearts so that we could them acceopt His words and be annointed with the holy spirit through His word. Gotta believe Jesus because He died and rose again, there is no other form of Christianity or no other Gospel than that Which God annopinted Jesus to preach, and then sent the disciples to go spread to the world. peter was preaching the death and resurrection well before paul was see acts 2. when paul was still persecuting the christians, peter was already preaching Jesus death and resurrection as well as His Gospel ministry as He was told to do there is no Gospel if we dont accept the Words and ministry of Jesus Christ, all the things He said of obeying His commands all apply, the cross should make a person obedient willingly because He died in order to save our souls, its not meant to give us a reason to omit all he said those two things make the gospel His death , resurrection and ascention to Gods Right Hand......and all He taught to His disciples. that is the gospel.

matthew 28:18-20 " And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. 19Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: 20Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

^^^^ thats as much a part of the gospel as any other event, including the death and resurrection thats meant to give us acceptance of Gods Word from His only Son who suffered so greatly to give us Hope and bring us back to God.

its never wise to take a verse or two and claim thats all that exists because it omits the rest of Gods Word.