Those Who Deny Sin in a Believer
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So holiness is a done deal for all Christians. But it takes a little longer for some than for others 
Its not unusual for this dumb sheep to go astray as such and then find that My shepherd has to come and find me and carry me back, notice I say carry and not drag.
I remember once when I was praying and lamenting at my stupidity I really felt God say to me.
"Bill you walk your dog, with your dog. You have a lead that extends so you allow the dog walk further on the lead, when he does he wanders off the path you are walking on and sniffs here, digs there he goes places you don't want him to, yet you give him the freedom in the hope that when you say no he will listen and come on the path with you. When he doesn't you bring that lead back in"
"Bill that is a bit like you and me, I have given you freedom, we walk and then you wander off the path I will pull you back in. One thing you need to know is THAT I HOLD THE LEAD AND I WILL NEVER LET GO OF IT"
I am thankful for my shepherd, I am thankful that when I use my freedom in the wrong way/don't listen (and please note I do not and never use it as an excuse to sin) he pulls me back in, doesn't smack my backside and makes me feel safe walking alongside him.
You see the thing is I couldn't imagine life without God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit and God knows that, even when I do wrong and worry he is going to say "That's it I've had enough you are no longer my child"
No he reassured me with his words.
I would never cast my dog out because he went somewhere I didn't want him to go.
And I'm sure my shepherd would never do the same to this dumb old sheep which is me.
Amazing Grace how sweet that sound, that saved a wretch like.
I once was lost but now I'm found, was blind but now I see.
I just want to rephrase if I can
Amazing Grace how sweet that sound that saved a wretch like me, warts and all,
After reading basic heresy and failure in the fundamentals of walking with Christ and the
teaching of the church, most should spend a lot more time reading and understanding
the new testament. Just set aside some time and read 4 chapters in one go, understanding
all the words and their implications. After a month doing this once a day, many issues
and ideas will be straightened out.
A lot of people are listening to sermons and applying their own logic with a little
cross-referencing and simply not dwelling on the word. The word is very clear on certain
points and until it goes truly into ones heart, a lot of stuff sounds fine and probably ok,
when actually it is wrong and very off beam.
Israel on their return to Jerusalem where shocked when they started to read Gods word,
and saw what it actually said. So that is my challenge to people here, because it has
enlightened my soul greatly.
teaching of the church, most should spend a lot more time reading and understanding
the new testament. Just set aside some time and read 4 chapters in one go, understanding
all the words and their implications. After a month doing this once a day, many issues
and ideas will be straightened out.
A lot of people are listening to sermons and applying their own logic with a little
cross-referencing and simply not dwelling on the word. The word is very clear on certain
points and until it goes truly into ones heart, a lot of stuff sounds fine and probably ok,
when actually it is wrong and very off beam.
Israel on their return to Jerusalem where shocked when they started to read Gods word,
and saw what it actually said. So that is my challenge to people here, because it has
enlightened my soul greatly.
L
It is most certainly a worthy endeavor to understand the Bible and it's content, and we can learn much from it. Remember that the disciples and the apostles had the Spirit and the undeniable evidence of God to guide them. We have exactly the same thing. Their journey and growth, or lack of it for some them is historically documented in the Bible for us to be able to reference for our own edification and confirmation.
Amen! 1 Corinthians 2:11 - For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God. 12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God. 13 These things we also speak, not in words which man's wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual. 14 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
W
We need to hear more from you mister.
And I will add, that we are witnessing believers quenching the Spirit in today's world. They are so focused on their own way and their own "fruits" that they have the Spirit quenched to the point that they can't hear the spiritual.
I know it's like beating a dead horse, But it is what is going on in this age.
And I will add, that we are witnessing believers quenching the Spirit in today's world. They are so focused on their own way and their own "fruits" that they have the Spirit quenched to the point that they can't hear the spiritual.
I know it's like beating a dead horse, But it is what is going on in this age.
L
I respectfully disagree. The real problem is that people, once they are saved for a little while stop trusting in what was accomplished for them. They believe, receive but then are eventually being led back to a place of condemnation, repentance and obedience to a levitical lite life. Then the focus becomes what they are doing for God and not what the Almighty did for them. Reading helps, but if I were stranded without a Bible I have the Holy Spirit indwelling in me, I have full confidence that He is able to guide me without words.
Amen...well said. They exchange Christ's work for their own work of self-righteousness/holiness and thus pervert the gospel of the grace of God and also hinder others from trusting in Christ alone. They are attempting to accomplish by their own self-effort and will-power what Christ has already done in His work on the cross and resurrection.
It is called a works-based righteousness which is a false gospel and actually is denying the Lord Himself. They are replacing the grace of God in Christ for their own attempts of righteousness.
It is called a works-based righteousness which is a false gospel and actually is denying the Lord Himself. They are replacing the grace of God in Christ for their own attempts of righteousness.
Interesting. But you are saying if I understand it right, God has done something for
us which if we loose focus becomes we doing something for God.
There is another scenario, we enter communion with God, daily and this becomes
our life, expressing His love through all of our actions and He transforms us through
our obedience and His grace into His likeness.
us which if we loose focus becomes we doing something for God.
There is another scenario, we enter communion with God, daily and this becomes
our life, expressing His love through all of our actions and He transforms us through
our obedience and His grace into His likeness.
The Holy Spirit transforms us as we behold the goodness/glory of the Lord as in a mirror. It is the Holy Spirit that transforms us outwardly to reflect who we already are in Christ - in the new creation and we participate in this with Him - for it is God who is at work in us both to will and to do of His good pleasure. 2 Cor. 3:17-18 & Phil. 2:13
The obedience that we have is to the faith which is believing in Christ's work on the cross and resurrection.
Keeping our eyes on Jesus makes us able to walk in this life supernaturally. Peter walking on the water is a perfect type of the true Christian life. As long as he kept his eyes on Jesus and saw Jesus walking on the water - he did too. Once he started to look at the circumstances around him - he faltered and yet Jesus still reached down and saved him.
The obedience that we have is to the faith which is believing in Christ's work on the cross and resurrection.
Keeping our eyes on Jesus makes us able to walk in this life supernaturally. Peter walking on the water is a perfect type of the true Christian life. As long as he kept his eyes on Jesus and saw Jesus walking on the water - he did too. Once he started to look at the circumstances around him - he faltered and yet Jesus still reached down and saved him.
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I do like this non-active transformation theory, but it is just an attempt to say
our behaviour and changes to it have no effect on our relationship with God.
It is believed behaviour is linked to legalism and legalism to the death of the gospel,
while all along the gospel has grown and born fruit through the centuries despite
mans sinful behaviour.
I would hold it is this change in our behaviour and heart which is the whole reason
for the cross and faith, without which we are doomed to death and destruction.
our behaviour and changes to it have no effect on our relationship with God.
It is believed behaviour is linked to legalism and legalism to the death of the gospel,
while all along the gospel has grown and born fruit through the centuries despite
mans sinful behaviour.
I would hold it is this change in our behaviour and heart which is the whole reason
for the cross and faith, without which we are doomed to death and destruction.
Just to add to the mystical and not obedience route to being like Christ, I noticed after
40+ years of faith the proponents are still going from teacher to teacher preaching the
basics of faith and still not knowing which issue is the issue and which is not.
Funny because God says, 1 sin, 2 communion with Him.
Now on the sin issue, ignored because it is dealt with though it still dominates their
lives, and communion with Christ, is somewhat unknown, because loving ones enemy when you
do not like them is impossible. So this great superspiritual facade is just a mirage, smoke screen
for the guilt they feel which they just cannot resolve. They could in Christ if they would believe.
L
Our relationship with God has absolutely nothing to do with our behaviour, if it did He wouldn't be God. Our relationship with Him is only possible because of Him and what He has done. He is the Almighty. I don't want to be more like Christ, God didn't make me to be more like Him, he made me to be me. He made me so that he could have a personal relationship with me, so that he could walk with me, see things through my eyes, speak with people through my mouth, touch things I touch so that I can reflect Him, as me, not as Him. This whole be like Christ stuff is crazy. He is God. I will never get close to that, it is failure from the outset. Good luck with that one. Transformation in me occurs when I focus on Him and His work, not through rote memorization or religious activity or any activity of mine. When I am free from all of that He can complete the work in me that He started. I did nothing. I live my life with God, and He lives with me.
I hear what you are saying, but we are having a miss-communication. Everyone stays their
unique personality and style, but gains the insight, love and serving heart of Christ.
And if you think being like Christ is crazy, Paul and Jesus talked about it.
Paul says follow his example and he follows Christs and Jesus says be one with
Him. Paul says we should think like Christ and have the same attitude to things
that He had.
Now if you truly want to know Jesus as your Lord you need to know His will and
desires and why they are so good.
Now I have found many of the ideas the Lord brings to us grow and develop as
we spend time in His word. So I suggest you do more of this.
unique personality and style, but gains the insight, love and serving heart of Christ.
And if you think being like Christ is crazy, Paul and Jesus talked about it.
Paul says follow his example and he follows Christs and Jesus says be one with
Him. Paul says we should think like Christ and have the same attitude to things
that He had.
Now if you truly want to know Jesus as your Lord you need to know His will and
desires and why they are so good.
Now I have found many of the ideas the Lord brings to us grow and develop as
we spend time in His word. So I suggest you do more of this.