When did baptizing show up in the Bible?

[Depleted]

I know the servants of the Pharisees got upset with John for baptizing people when he wasn't the Messiah, Elijah, or a prophet, but it just dawned on me, (or I'm having an elongated senior moment), when did baptizing even become a thing? I know ceremonial washing was really important, but I thought it was that -- washing yourself carefully and privately, (or semi-privately, depending how busy the nearby stream or spring was that day.) But this is someone else intentionally wetting or dunking with no scrubbing involved.

I did check Strong's Concordance, and no such word as "baptize" in the OT, so how did the servants even have a word for this? Why wasn't it just plain weird to them? Kind of like telling people to look at what's coming and proving it by putting drops in their eyes to see better.

AND, why wasn't John a prophet? He was announcing the Messiah is here. Isn't that what prophets do -- herald the Christ's coming?

 

[BeyondET]

When Eijiah started baptizing in the wilderness.

 

[FeedtheMachine]

I know the servants of the Pharisees got upset with John for baptizing people when he wasn't the Messiah, Elijah, or a prophet, but it just dawned on me, (or I'm having an elongated senior moment), when did baptizing even become a thing? I know ceremonial washing was really important, but I thought it was that -- washing yourself carefully and privately, (or semi-privately, depending how busy the nearby stream or spring was that day.) But this is someone else intentionally wetting or dunking with no scrubbing involved.

I did check Strong's Concordance, and no such word as "baptize" in the OT, so how did the servants even have a word for this? Why wasn't it just plain weird to them? Kind of like telling people to look at what's coming and proving it by putting drops in their eyes to see better.

AND, why wasn't John a prophet? He was announcing the Messiah is here. Isn't that what prophets do -- herald the Christ's coming?

Interesting question about baptism, I am also curious about this now.

As for John not being a prophet? Jesus referred to him as a prophet: "And as they departed, Jesus began to say unto the multitudes concerning John, What went ye out into the wilderness to see? A reed shaken with the wind? But what went ye out for to see? A man clothed in soft raiment? behold, they that wear soft clothing are in kings' houses. But what went ye out for to see? A prophet? yea, I say unto you, and more than a prophet." - Matthew 11:7-9

 

[prove-all]

1Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that
all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;

2And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
3And did all eat the same spiritual meat;

4And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of
that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.

 

[loveme1]

In the Old Testament they annointed their head with oil.

 

[notuptome]

Jewish tradition held that washing was an example repentance and part of the cleansing needed to approach Jehovah God.

You have to ask yourself why was Jesus baptized by John? Why did the High Priest wash before he entered the holy of holies one time a year to sprinkle blood on the altar?

Shadows of the blood of Christ and the washing of regeneration through the Holy Spirit.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[prove-all]

The Passover pictures the death of Christ
for the remission of sins that are past (Romans 3:25).

And, as the Israelites went out with a high hand (Numbers 33:3),
in great exultation and elation over their deliverance from bondage,
so does the newly begotten Christian start out his Christian life

But they did not get far until Pharaoh pursued after them. If Egypt is a type
of sin, then surely Pharaoh must picture Satan; the army of Egypt, Satan’s demons.

The devil and sin immediately pursue after the newly begotten son of God.
as soon as the Israelites saw this great army pursuing them, they lost their
courage. Fear came over them. They began to grumble and complain.

They saw it was impossible for them to get away from Pharaoh and his army,
because he was too powerful for them. And they were helpless.

So it is with us. notice the message of God to them through Moses:

“Fear ye not, stand still, and see the salvation of the [Eternal]for the Egyptians …
ye shall see them again no more for ever. The [Eternal] shall fight for you”

Helpless, we are told to stand still, and see the salvation of the Lord.
He shall fight for us. We cannot conquer Satan and sin, but He can.


It is the risen Christ—our High Priest—who will cleanse us—sanctify us
—deliver us—who said He would never leave us nor forsake us!

The angel that had gone before, showing the Israelites the way, now went
behind them, getting between them and their enemy, protecting them.


And then God parted the waters of the Red Sea. “[A]nd the waters were a wall
unto them on their right hand, and on their left”

In Isaiah 55:1 and John 7:37-39, the waters are a symbol of the Holy Spirit.

The living waters of God are a wall to us, on our right hand and on our left,
guiding us in the true path, making the path, protecting us in it.

-

the feast of Unleavened Bread, as well as the Passover,
was ordained and established forever, prior to the Old Covenant.

 

[FeedtheMachine]

1Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that
all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;

2And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
3And did all eat the same spiritual meat;

4And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of
that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.

1 Corinthians 10 ... sorry... just for those who want to read it (you hadn't given where in Scripture this is found)

 

[hornetguy]

There are a lot of opinions, and theories being mentioned, but I believe Lynn wanted to know when was "baptism" first mentioned in the Bible.

Not a ceremonial cleansing, or hand washing, but when was it first mentioned as being part of a cleansing or purification... as "immersion", which is, after all, the definition of the word...

Did I miss the point of your question, Lynn?

Personally, I don't remember any mention of "baptism" before the story of John.... I'm not saying it didn't happen before then, but I don't remember any Biblical mention of it...

 

[BeyondET]

There are a lot of opinions, and theories being mentioned, but I believe Lynn wanted to know when was "baptism" first mentioned in the Bible.

Not a ceremonial cleansing, or hand washing, but when was it first mentioned as being part of a cleansing or purification... as "immersion", which is, after all, the definition of the word...

Did I miss the point of your question, Lynn?

Personally, I don't remember any mention of "baptism" before the story of John.... I'm not saying it didn't happen before then, but I don't remember any Biblical mention of it...

Upon reading I've found something interesting about the word baptism

English noun “baptism” and the Greek noun βαπτισμός is the noun טְבִילָה (tevila), which is related to the verb טָבַל (taval), essentially meaning “to dip.”

 

[NayborBear]

There are a lot of opinions, and theories being mentioned, but I believe Lynn wanted to know when was "baptism" first mentioned in the Bible.

Not a ceremonial cleansing, or hand washing, but when was it first mentioned as being part of a cleansing or purification... as "immersion", which is, after all, the definition of the word...

Did I miss the point of your question, Lynn?

Personally, I don't remember any mention of "baptism" before the story of John.... I'm not saying it didn't happen before then, but I don't remember any Biblical mention of it...

....And ya probably won't either, HG. Although, I am by no means any type of authority, biblical, or otherwise rolleyes...I remember reading somewheres, about this small quiet group of people, who called themselves "Essenes", who, it seems, lived a rather communal type lifestyle, long, well not really long, but before Jesus was born from the virgin Mary, who, it seems, had been "commissioned by God?", for lack of a better way in describing it, or perhaps just felt like they had been charged, or it was "their" way, of holding to "disciplines", that had gone apostate from the Torah? But, anyways, they had some type of ceremony, that involved "immersion". It had to be held in a running stream of "clean" water. The Essenes, it seems, also, were involved in "preserving" the Biblical texts, in a "style" that "locked in" the actual records, in such a way, that any minute changes TO the texts, could be spotted immediately. They even may have been called "Mazorites", as the name of these texts were oft times referred to as "Mazoretic Texts". anyways, I digress. But these Essenes, were the first time I had ever read of any kind of "immersion", and, probably the where, this "rite of passage" stems from.

 

[hornetguy]

....And ya probably won't either, HG. Although, I am by no means any type of authority, biblical, or otherwise rolleyes...I remember reading somewheres, about this small quiet group of people, who called themselves "Essenes", who, it seems, lived a rather communal type lifestyle, long, well not really long, but before Jesus was born from the virgin Mary, who, it seems, had been "commissioned by God?", for lack of a better way in describing it, or perhaps just felt like they had been charged, or it was "their" way, of holding to "disciplines", that had gone apostate from the Torah? But, anyways, they had some type of ceremony, that involved "immersion". It had to be held in a running stream of "clean" water. The Essenes, it seems, also, were involved in "preserving" the Biblical texts, in a "style" that "locked in" the actual records, in such a way, that any minute changes TO the texts, could be spotted immediately. They even may have been called "Mazorites", as the name of these texts were oft times referred to as "Mazoretic Texts". anyways, I digress. But these Essenes, were the first time I had ever read of any kind of "immersion", and, probably the where, this "rite of passage" stems from.

That sounds correct.... I have read "reports" from people who say that Jewish tradition included a ceremonial dipping under, or immersion in water for various reasons. I don't know if that is correct, or not, but I suspect it is.

That is why I think that the men and women at Pentecost KNEW what Peter meant, when he told them to repent, and be immersed for the forgiveness of sins... the Ethiopian eunuch knew what Philip had meant when he taught repentance and baptism... on and on.

 

[garee]

[h=2]1.When did baptizing show up in the Bible? [/h]I know the servants of the Pharisees got upset with John for baptizing people when he wasn't the Messiah, Elijah, or a prophet, but it just dawned on me, (or I'm having an elongated senior moment), when did baptizing even become a thing? I know ceremonial washing was really important, but I thought it was that -- washing yourself carefully and privately, (or semi-privately, depending how busy the nearby stream or spring was that day.) But this is someone else intentionally wetting or dunking with no scrubbing involved

.

Remembering as a Senior moment that without parables, using the things seen to give us a spiritual understanding of the eternal things of God, not seen….. it is a ceremonial law that governs ceremonies as shadows used in parables. And not a moral law to govern morality. I will use John 3:25 as the foundation. To try an offer what that kind of baptism (washing )means.

Then there arose a question between some of John's disciples and the Jews about purifying. And they came unto John, and said unto him, Rabbi, he that was with thee beyond Jordan, to whom thou barest witness, behold, the same baptizeth, and all men come to him. Joh 3:25

John from the tribe of Levi, the kingdom of Priests used to represent one born again.In that way all Christian are considered a kingdom of priest after the order of Levi.

John as a official officiator is ceremonially baptized Christ from the tribe of Judas before he enters his priestly duties. He then being baptized by John could be an officiator in the same way Using H20 to signify the sprit not seen the washing away of our sins.

It comes from a personal desire and is not an outward evidence a person has the Spirit of Christ by which all Christian men are born again from above. This can be seen with the first two (Aarons sons) who were shown as not being faithful an offered unauthorized fire. They were burned up while their priestly garment did not even have a sent of smoke.

I did check Strong's Concordance, and no such word as "baptize" in the OT, so how did the servants even have a word for this? Why wasn't it just plain weird to them? Kind of like telling people to look at what's coming and proving it by putting drops in their eyes to see better.

To baptize is to apply the water of the word as the doctrines of God that do fall as rain, coming down from heaven as the same kind of washing husbands are to wash their wives with .the "doctrines of God".

Give ear, O ye heavens, and I will speak; and hear, O earth, the words of my mouth. My doctrine shall drop as the rain, my speech shall distil as the dew, as the small rain upon the tender herb, and as the showers upon the grass: Deu 32:1

AND, why wasn't John a prophet? He was announcing the Messiah is here. Isn't that what prophets do -- herald the Christ's coming?

A prophet is anyone who declares the will of God.which today now that we have the perfect/whole with no laws mising by which we could know Him more adequately it is limited to as it is written we are not to add by going above that as it is written

.John was a prophet in the same way as Rehab or your own self when you do hold out the gospel of our salvation you are prophesying.

Today when a person does have a desire to be baptized they do ceremonially enter the priesthood of believers typified as Levites.

1Co 4:8 Now ye are full, now ye are rich, ye have reigned as kings without us: and I would to God ye did reign, that we also might reign with you.

 

[stonesoffire]

1Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that
all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;

2And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
3And did all eat the same spiritual meat;

4And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of
that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.

Did they know that or is Paul looking back and explaining? This is a good thread. I've never considered where it started but I know the Jews value it greatly. It's a change of heart to them, or washing off the old.

 

[Meggido]

Noah and the ark---


1 Peter 3.19-21
[SUP]19 [/SUP]in which also He went and made proclamation to the spirits now in prison, [SUP]20 [/SUP]who once were disobedient, when the patience of God kept waiting in the days of Noah, during the construction of the ark, in which a few, that is, eight persons, were brought safely through the water. [SUP]21 [/SUP]Corresponding to that, baptism now saves you—not the removal of dirt from the flesh, but an appeal to God for a good conscience—through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

 

[stonesoffire]

....And ya probably won't either, HG. Although, I am by no means any type of authority, biblical, or otherwise rolleyes...I remember reading somewheres, about this small quiet group of people, who called themselves "Essenes", who, it seems, lived a rather communal type lifestyle, long, well not really long, but before Jesus was born from the virgin Mary, who, it seems, had been "commissioned by God?", for lack of a better way in describing it, or perhaps just felt like they had been charged, or it was "their" way, of holding to "disciplines", that had gone apostate from the Torah? But, anyways, they had some type of ceremony, that involved "immersion". It had to be held in a running stream of "clean" water. The Essenes, it seems, also, were involved in "preserving" the Biblical texts, in a "style" that "locked in" the actual records, in such a way, that any minute changes TO the texts, could be spotted immediately. They even may have been called "Mazorites", as the name of these texts were oft times referred to as "Mazoretic Texts". anyways, I digress. But these Essenes, were the first time I had ever read of any kind of "immersion", and, probably the where, this "rite of passage" stems from.

I read about this on a website but the writer wasn't calling this practice of the Essenes, but the Nazarenes. Stating too that Jesus actually was of this sect, along with the disciples...and they were looking for Messiah to appear which is why they left their work and began to follow so quickly.

That the name Nazarene's mean't more than just He came from Nazaroth.

Just reporting what I read. Not my opinion.

Also...some baptized daily ...forgot that.

 

[Depleted]

There are a lot of opinions, and theories being mentioned, but I believe Lynn wanted to know when was "baptism" first mentioned in the Bible.

Not a ceremonial cleansing, or hand washing, but when was it first mentioned as being part of a cleansing or purification... as "immersion", which is, after all, the definition of the word...

Did I miss the point of your question, Lynn?

Personally, I don't remember any mention of "baptism" before the story of John.... I'm not saying it didn't happen before then, but I don't remember any Biblical mention of it...

Yeah, that's what I mean. Like the word pharmicia meant magic, and now it means drugs, so folks back-storied drugs as magic. But it was the other way around. I was curious how this word "baptize" got understood before this moment, instead of back-storying the word into meaning something.

And you hit the same spot I have, so, maybe it's not a senior moment. (I haven't remembered it yet, so probably not a senior-moment thing. lol)

 

[Depleted]

....And ya probably won't either, HG. Although, I am by no means any type of authority, biblical, or otherwise rolleyes...I remember reading somewheres, about this small quiet group of people, who called themselves "Essenes", who, it seems, lived a rather communal type lifestyle, long, well not really long, but before Jesus was born from the virgin Mary, who, it seems, had been "commissioned by God?", for lack of a better way in describing it, or perhaps just felt like they had been charged, or it was "their" way, of holding to "disciplines", that had gone apostate from the Torah? But, anyways, they had some type of ceremony, that involved "immersion". It had to be held in a running stream of "clean" water. The Essenes, it seems, also, were involved in "preserving" the Biblical texts, in a "style" that "locked in" the actual records, in such a way, that any minute changes TO the texts, could be spotted immediately. They even may have been called "Mazorites", as the name of these texts were oft times referred to as "Mazoretic Texts". anyways, I digress. But these Essenes, were the first time I had ever read of any kind of "immersion", and, probably the where, this "rite of passage" stems from.

Everything I remember of the Essenses:
-- They did have their own peculiar beliefs. I don't remember if they were adherent to the OT or not. A bit of a funky feeling about them, so I'm thinking they had most of it right, but had some funk going along with the right.

-- They had a big library with a lot of books (scrolls.) Somewhere in the first century BC some major catastrophe was coming. (I don't know if anyone knows for sure what it is, but some think war, and others think flood.) So they moved much of their library into big jars and stored the jars into nearby caves. Whatever happened wiped them out, so no one ever went back for the scrolls. Today we call them the Dead Sea Scrolls.

Not much memory of who they were, but maybe this helps fill out more of what you know. They were definitely the ones who proved the OT was in tact before Christ came.

 

[Depleted]

Noah and the ark---


1 Peter 3.19-21
[SUP]19 [/SUP]in which also He went and made proclamation to the spirits now in prison, [SUP]20 [/SUP]who once were disobedient, when the patience of God kept waiting in the days of Noah, during the construction of the ark, in which a few, that is, eight persons, were brought safely through the water. [SUP]21 [/SUP]Corresponding to that, baptism now saves you—not the removal of dirt from the flesh, but an appeal to God for a good conscience—through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

I am going with there is plenty of evidence in the NT for the use of baptism, but that all came about because Jesus approved it. What made it so normal that no one thought John the Baptist was doing some kind of new, weird thing even before Jesus went to a wedding in Cana though?

 

[Miri]

I think it's the original symbolic meaning which might be the clue.

So for example the holy communion was a replacement for pass over.

Baptism may have been the replacement for all that ceremonial washing in
the lathe in front of the temple. Whereby people tried to make themselves clean.

Like Jesus was the replacement for the sacrifices.

Its interesting that the theme of passing through fire and water is repeated in the
bible. Here is an example. I realise the context may imply something different, but
fire and water are often mentioned together.



Isaiah 43:1-2 NKJV
[1] But now, thus says the LORD, who created you, O Jacob, And He who
formed you, O Israel: "Fear not, for I have redeemed you; I have called
you by your name; You are Mine. [2] When you pass through the waters,
I will be with you; And through the rivers, they shall not overflow you.
When you walk through the fire, you shall not be burned, Nor shall the flame scorch you.




Refiners fire burning away the dross, cleansing water purifying, maybe it's always been
that way.