Where did different races come from?

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Kavik

Senior Member
Mar 25, 2017
793
158
43
#21
K...,

You need to explain your thought here.
I'll try.

What do I mean by not taking a literal reading of the early chapters of Genesis?

Probably not the best or most concise explanation, but the best way I can put it is this….

Every culture has its creation stories –how the world “as we know it” came into being. Why certain things are the way they are. How certain things came into being, or became our common traditions/practice. The list goes on and on. Those stories from other cultures that are different from ours, we tend to refer to as ‘myths’, which carries the connotation something not to be taken/read as literal.

The early chapters of Genesis just happen to be the creation story as related and passed down by those ancient Semitic people who eventually became to be called the Jews, and by eventual extension, to what we know as Christianity.

Creation stories are, by their very nature, highly allegorical and figurative. They are also typically full of symbolic meaning. As such, it is difficult to regard them as relating absolute or literal stories.

If, for example, we all still practiced say the religion of the ancient Germanic people, we would adhere to those creation stories associated with that tradition. They would be as real to us as the stories in Genesis. If that were the case, we’d regard Genesis as “Jewish mythology”, and hold it in the same regard as we do “Norse mythology”.

I believe that the creation stories of Genesis can only be taken as being allegorical and figurative; as others have pointed out, the discrepancies outweigh a literal reading.

For example, God created the world – to me, the reason Genesis has it as seven days has more to do with how this ancient culture explained the way they reckoned time than anything else. How long it took, in a way, is sort of irrelevant. If this ancient Semitic culture reckoned a period of ten days rather than seven, I have no doubt that we’d be reading a slightly different account in Genesis, showing God creating the world in ten days rather than seven.

It’s not widely known, but there are actually a few creation stories that pre-date Genesis which are alluded to in other parts of the Bible (Isaiah, Job, Psalms). Here’s an interesting article from a periodical (?) out of Israel called “Haaretz” (the ads are a pain, but the article is quite interesting):

https://www.haaretz.com/jewish/.premium-where-did-creation-story-come-from-1.5404560

The bottom line here is that these are creation myths – not literal stories.
 

Dude653

Senior Member
Mar 19, 2011
12,312
1,039
113
#22
Genetic mutations and migration to other climates.
the first humans on Earth were most likely dark-skinned.
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
10,684
794
113
#23
Genetic mutations and migration to other climates.
the first humans on Earth were most likely dark-skinned.
Or most likely blond, blue-eyed with light skin :) And by the influence of sun they got darker and darker in next generations.
 
D

Depleted

Guest
#24
I have recently decided to read the Bible front to back, to familiarize myself with Gods word. I still have my daily and nightly devotionals, this is just something I personally wanted to do. On to my question... when God flooded the earth the only human survivors were, Noah, his wife and his sons. Do we all exist because of noah’s Family? If so where do different races come into the picture. I’m not doubting the word, this was just the 1st thing that popped into my head. Any explanation would be greatly appreciated.
There aren't different races. There is only human. Sure, there are differences within the human race, but I hate that scientists call us different races.

And, sure, we have different characteristics depending on where we come from, but we are one and the same. This is proven by the ability to have children who can have children. If a horse and donkey are used to create a mule, the mule is usually sterile. If a lion and tiger mate, the liger is sterile. That we can mate and our offspring can mate, says we are the same species.

Why such vast changes? I think a lot of it had to do with Adam and Eve. They were different. They were complete. Every possible differences in genes was in them, so when they had children the differences came through. And the differences kept coming through until it was a vast society. Somewhere down the line, (Adam was dead only 50 years before Noah was born), a bunch of those genes inhabited Noah's kids. And, as life got crowded for that family again, their children's children left the area to form new communities. Adam Clarke says there were 17 generations between Noah and Abraham. (People lived much longer back then, so generations were every 100 years.) In that space of time, humans crossed the globe. Even evolutionists scientists believe this. The ones who came to what is now the Americas are now called The Clovis People.

It is different to live in Africa, then it is to live in Ireland. More direct sunlight, and so pigmentation changes. Noses changed. Foreheads change. Cheekbones change. All in direct relationship to how to survive, and then thrive, in that particular climate. It is also different from Africa and Ireland, than to live in the steppes in central Asia, or the islands in eastern Asia. Very different for the ones who set off and landed on Australia, or who crossed the Bering Bridge to the Americas. More generations. The ones who had the proper bone structure and pigmentation could have survived longer. Or, maybe it's just that Jane and John (the couple that moved to a new region) were similar looking and had the same kind of offspring.

I am one of six children. We all have Dad in common. Four of us have one mom and the other two have another mom. Either which way, both moms had poker-straight brown hair, brown eyes, were the same height, (5' 6"), the same weight issues, and very similar features. (Dad was attracted to a type. lol) Dad had curly black hair, hazel eyes, 5'10", and could eat like a horse and never gain weight.

The kids? Five had/have dark hair. One is blond. Everyone of us has straight hair. Only one of us eats like a horse without gaining weight. Our heights ranged (hey, the older ones are getting older now, so we're shrinking lol) from 5'9" to 6'1", and the 5'9"er is my sister. Three of us have brown eyes, one has hazel, (he-who-can-eat-like-a-horse), and two have blue eyes. (Blue eyes are a recessive gene too. Out of all the parent's families, only one of them had a blue-eyed parent. All other grandparents had brown eyes. Go figure.) And the nose! Oi vey on the nose! Both moms had cute little button noses, although a little wide. Dad has a honking long nose. Two got stuck with the honking-long, three got button noses, and then there is me. I got the wide part of the button noses along with the honky-long nose, so now I get honking-long and fat nose. lol

This is just one 20-year generation of change. There were 17 100-year generations of change between the time of Noah and Abraham. Enough to fill the world!
 

Kavik

Senior Member
Mar 25, 2017
793
158
43
#25
Too late to edit my previous post, but....

I meant to add that Genesis itself contains two very different versions of the creation account - woven together over time into one literary work.

One account is very structured and organized, the other, not so much. each account refers to the deity with a different name.

The difference in the accounts seem to reflect the ways the original authors conceptualized God.

See: https://www.bibleodyssey.org/en/passages/related-articles/two-creations-in-genesis
 
D

Depleted

Guest
#26
I'll try.

What do I mean by not taking a literal reading of the early chapters of Genesis?

Probably not the best or most concise explanation, but the best way I can put it is this….

Every culture has its creation stories –how the world “as we know it” came into being. Why certain things are the way they are. How certain things came into being, or became our common traditions/practice. The list goes on and on. Those stories from other cultures that are different from ours, we tend to refer to as ‘myths’, which carries the connotation something not to be taken/read as literal.

The early chapters of Genesis just happen to be the creation story as related and passed down by those ancient Semitic people who eventually became to be called the Jews, and by eventual extension, to what we know as Christianity.

Creation stories are, by their very nature, highly allegorical and figurative. They are also typically full of symbolic meaning. As such, it is difficult to regard them as relating absolute or literal stories.

If, for example, we all still practiced say the religion of the ancient Germanic people, we would adhere to those creation stories associated with that tradition. They would be as real to us as the stories in Genesis. If that were the case, we’d regard Genesis as “Jewish mythology”, and hold it in the same regard as we do “Norse mythology”.

I believe that the creation stories of Genesis can only be taken as being allegorical and figurative; as others have pointed out, the discrepancies outweigh a literal reading.

For example, God created the world – to me, the reason Genesis has it as seven days has more to do with how this ancient culture explained the way they reckoned time than anything else. How long it took, in a way, is sort of irrelevant. If this ancient Semitic culture reckoned a period of ten days rather than seven, I have no doubt that we’d be reading a slightly different account in Genesis, showing God creating the world in ten days rather than seven.

It’s not widely known, but there are actually a few creation stories that pre-date Genesis which are alluded to in other parts of the Bible (Isaiah, Job, Psalms). Here’s an interesting article from a periodical (?) out of Israel called “Haaretz” (the ads are a pain, but the article is quite interesting):

https://www.haaretz.com/jewish/.premium-where-did-creation-story-come-from-1.5404560

The bottom line here is that these are creation myths – not literal stories.
That doesn't work. The Bible is a book about God inspired by God. So to think the beginning is a myth is to believe God started by telling us a lie.

In which case, why believe the rest?
 
D

Depleted

Guest
#27
Too late to edit my previous post, but....

I meant to add that Genesis itself contains two very different versions of the creation account - woven together over time into one literary work.

One account is very structured and organized, the other, not so much. each account refers to the deity with a different name.

The difference in the accounts seem to reflect the ways the original authors conceptualized God.

See: https://www.bibleodyssey.org/en/passages/related-articles/two-creations-in-genesis
No. It doesn't. It tells of creation. And then starts again at Man. (And starts again at the generations of Man too, considering your indoctrination site didn't even notice that.)

You're a bit too old to keep drinking the Kool Aid.
 

Kavik

Senior Member
Mar 25, 2017
793
158
43
#28

It is different to live in Africa, then it is to live in Ireland. More direct sunlight, and so pigmentation changes. Noses changed. Foreheads change. Cheekbones change. All in direct relationship to how to survive, and then thrive, in that particular climate. It is also different from Africa and Ireland, than to live in the steppes in central Asia, or the islands in eastern Asia. Very different for the ones who set off and landed on Australia, or who crossed the Bering Bridge to the Americas. More generations. The ones who had the proper bone structure and pigmentation could have survived longer. Or, maybe it's just that Jane and John (the couple that moved to a new region) were similar looking and had the same kind of offspring.

I believe Darwin would call this "evolution of species". The mutation of a species to adapt to its particular climate/environmental surroundings.
 

Noose

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2016
5,096
932
113
#29
Too late to edit my previous post, but....

I meant to add that Genesis itself contains two very different versions of the creation account - woven together over time into one literary work.

One account is very structured and organized, the other, not so much. each account refers to the deity with a different name.

The difference in the accounts seem to reflect the ways the original authors conceptualized God.

See: https://www.bibleodyssey.org/en/passages/related-articles/two-creations-in-genesis
Nope.
The whole bible/the main theme is about man's fall and how he's reconciled back to God. So, whenever you read the bible, just know that it's about man and being reconciled.
Genesis starts out wide (Universe) and quickly narrows down to man and then the main theme is carried forward from that point on. There are no two accounts of creation, the so called second account is just the narrowing down to the main theme but it may appear to some, that some events are being repeated.

Genesis starts out with universe, then Earth (earth is part of the universe as well as home of man) then the things on Earth that make life possible (stars/moon/sun/animals/other life/time & seasons), then the second account goes back to the responsibility that was given man and how he failed.
 
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Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,454
12,937
113
#30
One of the many reasons why the creation stories of Genesis cannot be read/taken literally.
If you fail to take the narratives in Genesis about Creation and the Flood as literal and historical, you will never understand the Gospel or Bible truth. The book of Genesis did NOT have multiple authors creating myths and legends. The Bible is Divinely inspired from Genesis to Revelation. However, spiritual truths can only be discerned by those who have been born of the Spirit and have the indwelling Holy Spirit.
 

Kavik

Senior Member
Mar 25, 2017
793
158
43
#31
See the actual article I reference for details -

Chapters 1 and 2 of Genesis are two are very different accounts of the same creation story; originally recounted by at least two distinct individuals.

They may contradict each other here and there, but I'm not suggesting one is 'more correct' than the other - simply stating that the same story has been retold from many sources over time. It seems that when it was finally committed to writing, two variations of the story were prevalent - both were woven into a single narrative.
 

Kavik

Senior Member
Mar 25, 2017
793
158
43
#32
See the actual article I reference for details -

Chapters 1 and 2 of Genesis are two are very different accounts of the same creation story; originally recounted by at least two distinct individuals.

They may contradict each other here and there, but I'm not suggesting one is 'more correct' than the other - simply stating that the same story has been retold from many sources over time. It seems that when it was finally committed to writing, two variations of the story were prevalent - both were nicely woven into a single narrative.

Similar to the nativity narratives - two different accounts, but in today's culture, they're frequently combined/woven into one scenario. e.g. the three wise men never made it to the manger, but there they are in most nativity creche scenes. Bad comparison perhaps, but same general idea - the weaving of what is clearly two different literary accounts into one.

I'm not suggesting it somehow 'lessens' God, it's just how man has related this particular account over time.
 

Kavik

Senior Member
Mar 25, 2017
793
158
43
#33
Sorry - Ignore post 31 - hit the wrong button.
 

Enoch987

Senior Member
Jul 13, 2017
317
15
18
#34
Highly questionable in less than 5,000 years?

Obviously not everybody got wiped out in Noah's Flood
which has more to do with Mesopotamia and the generations of Adam.
Not the entire global Earth.
Mr. Waggles, How long does the Bible say the Flood lasted? 370 days after the rain started. There were 40 days of rain and the fountains of the deep opening up. The waters stayed on the earth for 150 days. These 150 days include the 40 days of rain. 370 days is a long time for a local flood.
By the wayside, in an earlier post you posited Nahor was born 1948 years after Adam's creation.
My comment is Nahor Sr. age of begatting (29) times Terah's age of begatting (70) = 2030 as does the 2nd repeat of the crown of life math based on Rev. 2:10 (1/3.5 divided by 95) which has Methuselah's age of begetting and death in the middle of the answer. Methuselah died in the year of the Flood. Do you choose to doubt the long lives too?

How do these numbers relate to Noah's Flood. I'm glad you asked.
The first day of the 10th month when the tops of the mountains are seen is the 223rd day of the Flood after the rain started and it is the 230th day after Noah's family of 8 entered the Ark. The number 23 represents Jesus in the Bible.
The 17th generation Serug lived for 230 years.
Jesus resurrected on the 17th day of the Jewish year.
When Noah was 230, Methuselah was 599 (in his 600th year) which is the same age as Noah when the Flood started.

Now berate me for not responding solely to the opening comment of this thread and I will repent in sack cloth and ashes (not really).
 

MarcR

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2015
5,486
183
63
#35
I believe that they all come directly from Noah and his wife.

Specifically the Negro people are descended from Ham and the Asiatic and Pacific Island races seem to be descended from Shem.
 

MarcR

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2015
5,486
183
63
#36
See the actual article I reference for details -

Chapters 1 and 2 of Genesis are two are very different accounts of the same creation story; originally recounted by at least two distinct individuals.

They may contradict each other here and there, but I'm not suggesting one is 'more correct' than the other - simply stating that the same story has been retold from many sources over time. It seems that when it was finally committed to writing, two variations of the story were prevalent - both were woven into a single narrative.
Chapters 1 and 2 are NOT different accounts. Chapter 1 looks at creation in its entirety and is primarily concerned with process. Chapter 2 focuses on the creation of man on the 6th day; and is primarily concerned with relationships.

Hebrew grammar makes it impossible to view them as separate accounts.
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
10,684
794
113
#37
I believe that they all come directly from Noah and his wife.

Specifically the Negro people are descended from Ham and the Asiatic and Pacific Island races seem to be descended from Shem.
We see almost no change in races appearance for 2000 years. Asians are still asians and Negro are still Negro, Europeans still look like Europeans.

So, its quite hard to believe that after flood, all races evolved into such various forms in so short time. But it depends on what is your datation of flood.

What is also interesting to me - how various blood types evolved?
 
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Ezekiel8

Senior Member
Oct 26, 2017
403
8
0
#38
Yes all the original races come from Noah's sons. The differences arise later on in the three sons of Noah and then afterwards furtherly by their children. Genesis 10 and 11 are the table of nations, and the foundation lines of today's races and their history. This is the overview of all the races and all the nations and who they are and where they came from and where they went and what they did; that all is a subject called history. Though the Bible mostly focuses on the race of Israel through the book of Genesis one can see in a general sense easily the origin points of race and how they developed into the races and nations and cultures which are talked about throughout the whole Bible and which morphed and became the kingdoms and empires of those times and even the nations and states of today. If one thinks about it, the book of Genesis is pretty well named.
 

MarcR

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2015
5,486
183
63
#39
We see almost no change in races appearance for 2000 years. Asians are still asians and Negro are still Negro, Europeans still look like Europeans.

So, its quite hard to believe that after flood, all races evolved into such various forms in so short time. But it depends on what is your datation of flood.

What is also interesting to me - how various blood types evolved?

I agree with you; but what you say seems to support my statement.
 
Nov 23, 2016
510
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#40
If I had to venture a guess, I'd say from the Olympics :confused: