Where in the New Covenant does it say...

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Jun 26, 2014
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#41
Jesus came to give new law (Mt 22:37-40, 5:23-47, 12:7-8, 19:9, 21:23-27, chp 23).


Jesus didn't have to be make the law honorable, it was honorable from the beginning
when God gave it to Moses.

Religious man made God's Law dishonorable. Today's religious man has thrown out the Law altogether. The ministry of Jesus, according to His Father, was to magnify the Law and make it honorable. Do you speak against God?
 
Jan 19, 2013
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#42
Elin said:
Jesus came to give new law (Mt 22:37-40, 5:23-47, 12:7-8, 19:9,
21:23-27, chp 23).

Jesus didn't have to
make the law honorable, it was honorable from the beginning when God gave it to Moses.
Religious man made God's Law dishonorable. Today's religious man has thrown out the Law altogether. The ministry of Jesus, according to His Father, was to magnify the Law and make it honorable. Do you speak against God?
I do not recall where such is stated in Scripture.

Please point it our for me.
 
Last edited:
T

The_highwayman

Guest
#43
A whole lot of folks need to learn about the 8 Bible covenants and their confusion would be removed.
 
Jan 19, 2013
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#44
There is nothing in the New Covenant that says I can't sleep with my step mother.
Except for the Holy Spirit who gives those in Christ to know what is wrongful.
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
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#45
Except for the Holy Spirit who gives those in Christ to know what is wrongful.
And are you saying Paul didn't have it? He said he understood what was sin by the Law.
 
Jun 26, 2014
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#46
I do not recall where such is stated in Scripture.

Please point it our for me.
This is a prophecy concerning Jesus' ministry.

Isaiah 42:21 The Lord is well pleased for His righteousness’ sake; He will magnify the law and make it honorable.
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
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#48
Except for the Holy Spirit who gives those in Christ to know what is wrongful.
So, why don't those who have the Holy Spirit all agree on what sin is? Or are you saying that only those who agree with you have the Holy Spirit. Paul didn't agree.
 
Jun 26, 2014
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#49
Except for the Holy Spirit who gives those in Christ to know what is wrongful.
Only if you walk by the Spirit will you fulfill the Father's will.
 
Jan 19, 2013
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#50
What is clear is that you're saying all those thousands of churches who have placed their faith in Jesus and believe the Bible to be true are not born again because their heart is not saying homosexuality is wrong.

Let me ask you something, how do you feel about calling Sunday the Lord's day when there is not one verse in the Bible that says Sunday is the Lord's nor does the Bible even give anyone authority to say Sunday is the Lord's day. Do you feel convicted over that? Do you feel you are following God when you do such things that are not found in the Bible? Should I say that you are not born again because you are not convicted of anything wrong?
It's plain to see that you are unaware of NT teaching on the Sabbath.

That is what the Holy Spirit gives me to know.
 
Jan 17, 2013
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#51
.

Oh my gosh, call no man father!


lol
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
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#52
It's plain to see that you are unaware of NT teaching on the Sabbath.

That is what the Holy Spirit gives me to know.
I am pretty sure that he is aware.
 
Jun 26, 2014
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#53
It's plain to see that you are unaware of NT teaching on the Sabbath.

That is what the Holy Spirit gives me to know.
Religious man made the Sabbath dishonorable and a burden, Jesus restored the Sabbath to being honorable and a delight.

Luke 13:11-17 And behold, there was a woman who had a spirit of infirmity for eighteen years, and was bowed down and could in no way lift herself up. And when Jesus saw her, He called her to Him and said unto her, “Woman, thou art loosed from thine infirmity.” And He laid His hands on her, and immediately she was made straight, and glorified God. But the ruler of the synagogue answered with indignation, because Jesus had healed on the Sabbath day, and said unto the people, “There are six days in which men ought to work; in them therefore come and be healed, and not on the Sabbath day.” The Lord then answered him and said, “Thou hypocrite! Doth not each one of you on the Sabbath loose his ox or his ass from the stall and lead him away to watering? And ought not this woman, being a daughter of Abraham, whom Satan hath bound, lo, these eighteen years, be loosed from this bond on the Sabbath day?” And when He had said these things, all His adversaries were ashamed; and all the people rejoiced for all the glorious things that were done by Him.

Religious man put a heavy burden on the people when it came to Sabbath observance. These heavy burdens didn't make the Sabbath a delight and brought dishonor to God's special day. Jesus restored honor to the Sabbath and the people rejoiced because of it. Jesus can do this because He is Lord of the Sabbath.

 
Jan 19, 2013
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#54
Elin said:
Except for the Holy Spirit who gives those in Christ to know what is wrongful.
And are you saying Paul didn't have it? He said he understood what was sin by the Law.
You are going in circles.

It's plain to see you didn't read post #34 to you where what Paul said is addressed in context.

Let's have a look at what Paul says in Ro 7.

Previous to v. 7, he states that he was alive without the law and that
when the law came he died.

Since the law was given long before Paul was even born,
and since he did not actually die,
is he speaking idiomatically?

He had not known sin but by the law.
Like a mirror reveals our natural face with its spots and blemishes,
so the Holy Spirit by the law revealed his natural sin to him (Jas 1:23-25),
gave him a knowledge of it, which led to repentance
when he compared his heart to the law.

In the law the Holy Spirit mirrored to him that, even without any sinful act,
concupiscence (lust) in the heart was sinful.
The Holy Spirit made him aware in the law of his indwelling sin, which he knew nothing of before.
Unregenerate (natural) Paul had been blind regarding his original corruption,
and he remained in the dark until the Holy Spirit by the law showed it to him when he was reborn.
The Holy Spirit showed Paul in the law what sin really is, how it is exceedingly sinful (v.13).

For while Paul was a Pharisee, he was very sure in his confidence of his goodness ("I was alive").
But in reality he was without the law, he did not understand its spiritual meaning,
it was in his head, but not in his heart, he had a mental apprehension of it,
but there was no power of it in his heart.

But when he was reborn, "the commandment came" in its power to his heart, not just to his head,
"sin revived," appeared, the Holy Spirit showed him what he had never seen before in sin,
his naturally (unregenerate) corrupt bias toward it,
"and I died," the Holy Spirit convincing him with such power that Paul, the obedient Pharisee,
was not righteous, but just the opposite, in a state of sin, and in spiritual death because of that sin.


So powerful was this revelation by the Holy Spirit to Paul that it stood his former theology on its head.

We can see this in his presentation of it in Ro 3:10-20, 5:18-19, 7:7-13, 8:7-8; Eph 2:1, 3, 5; Col 2:13.

So Ro 7 is idiomatically dealing with the unregenerate Pharisee Paul
before he was born again (regenerated) by the Holy Spirit,
who then revealed to him by the law his previous original innate corruption,
indwelling sin, and natural bias toward it,
which is why we have such strong presentation of man's innate corruption in Paul's writings.

This is in no way contrary to the Holy Spirit giving you to know in your heart what is wrongful.

In fact, rather than being contrary to what Paul said, it is a powerful example of just that.
 
Jan 19, 2013
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#55
This is a prophecy concerning Jesus' ministry.

Isaiah 42:21 The Lord is well pleased for His righteousness’ sake; He will magnify the law and make it honorable.
Thanks.

And did he not by his perfect obedience to it because he was born under it?

But those in Christ are not under the law, they are under grace, to which the law is subordinate.
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
11,365
186
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#56
You are going in circles.

It's plain to see you didn't read post #34 to you where what Paul said is addressed in context.

Let's have a look at what Paul says in Ro 7.

Previous to v. 7, he states that he was alive without the law and that
when the law came he died.

Since the law was given long before Paul was even born,
and since he did not actually die,
is he speaking idiomatically?

He had not known sin but by the law.
Like a mirror reveals our natural face with its spots and blemishes,
so the Holy Spirit by the law revealed his natural sin to him (Jas 1:23-25),
gave him a knowledge of it, which led to repentance
when he compared his heart to the law.

In the law the Holy Spirit mirrored to him that, even without any sinful act,
concupiscence (lust) in the heart was sinful.
The Holy Spirit made him aware in the law of his indwelling sin, which he knew nothing of before.
Unregenerate (natural) Paul had been blind regarding his original corruption,
and he remained in the dark until the Holy Spirit by the law showed it to him when he was reborn.
The Holy Spirit showed Paul in the law what sin really is, how it is exceedingly sinful (v.13).

For while Paul was a Pharisee, he was very sure in his confidence of his goodness ("I was alive").
But in reality he was without the law, he did not understand its spiritual meaning,
it was in his head, but not in his heart, he had a mental apprehension of it,
but there was no power of it in his heart.

But when he was reborn, "the commandment came" in its power to his heart, not just to his head,
"sin revived," appeared, the Holy Spirit showed him what he had never seen before in sin,
his naturally (unregenerate) corrupt bias toward it,
"and I died," the Holy Spirit convincing him with such power that Paul, the obedient Pharisee,
was not righteous, but just the opposite, in a state of sin, and in spiritual death because of that sin.


So powerful was this revelation by the Holy Spirit to Paul that it stood his former theology on its head.

We can see this in his presentation of it in Ro 3:10-20, 5:18-19, 7:7-13, 8:7-8; Eph 2:1, 3, 5; Col 2:13.

So Ro 7 is idiomatically dealing with the unregenerate Pharisee Paul
before he was born again (regenerated) by the Holy Spirit,
who then revealed to him by the law his previous original innate corruption,
indwelling sin, and natural bias toward it,
which is why we have such strong presentation of man's innate corruption in Paul's writings.

This is in no way contrary to the Holy Spirit giving you to know in your heart what is wrongful.

In fact, rather than being contrary to what Paul said, it is a powerful example of just that.
Alas, I think we shall never agree and arguing is pointless. So I propose that we agree to disagree, agreeably.
 
Jan 19, 2013
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#57
So, why don't those who have the Holy Spirit all agree on what sin is?
Can you give specific kinds of examples of what you mean?

Or are you saying that only those who agree with you have the Holy Spirit.
Paul didn't agree.
Paul didn't agree what?
 
Jan 19, 2013
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#59
Elin said:
It's plain to see that you are unaware of NT teaching on the Sabbath.

That is what the Holy Spirit gives me to know.

I am pretty sure that he is aware.
Your methodology betrays your religious persuasion.

If he refers to deity, I agree.
 
Jan 19, 2013
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#60
Elin said:
It's plain to see that you are unaware of
NT teaching on the Sabbath. That
is what the Holy Spirit gives me to know.
Jesus restored honor to the Sabbath and the people rejoiced because of it.
Jesus can do this because He is Lord of the Sabbath.
There is also more NT teaching on the Sabbath after Jesus ascended.