Really upset - tired of the discrimination

[jamie26301]

Hi fellow CCers,

I struggled to think of where to put this thread, and I thought the Family Forum was appropriate, given that this issue effects the family as a whole, those families that have members that suffer from this illness.

Anyone here have bipolar? Or some other mental illness?

Someone on Facebook posted a picture that made a judgement. It was basically poking fun at people who "make-out" in public, and the criticism is that that's rude and not of good manners. I commented that I agreed, but we shouldn't judge people's motives for what they do.

The picture didn't insinuate anything about motives. That was my mistake. I read too much into it. And I paid the price for it... I got jumped on by one women who was clearly irate and couldn't control her emotions. I had given a long speech about how people don't have a right to NOT be offended, and that it's unrealistic to expect a perfect society. I think that's the problem with a lot of Americans, especially the "mannerly" ones that look down their noses at people for being too loud or something (guilty). If someone gets really riled up over something someone does that is not the norm, first time they encounter it, then I'd say they probably expect society to be the way THEY want it to be when they go out. In other words, they expect perfection - they may say "no one's perfect" but holding a standard of mannerisms over everyone as a whole is not only demanding perfection, but is also indicative of self-righteousness.

So this friend and I start talking in PM. I had apologized to her for my triteness several times and she never said "Thank you" or "That's ok, you're only human." Maybe she appreciated my apology, but she sure didn't show it. So I asked her if she thought common sense is something everyone has, and some just chose not to use it. (She had made the case that societal manners are common sense). "Yes, everyone knows you're not suppose to shoot someone, common sense." So, I brought mental illness into the equation. What if someone can't afford their meds and are unstable at the time, and are not acting with proper manners? Are you just going to judge them as people who won't use common sense? She said that if someone with an illness can't afford meds, they should be in a "safe place," until they can prove they are better. She said she couldn't be with someone who has the potential to hurt her.

And I understand that. I understand the fear that is associated with the mentally ill. But you know, the media really feeds that fear. The truth is is that depending on the illness, someone may be dangerous UNDER CERTAIN CIRCUMSTANCES, but be stable and safe at any other time. You may not know what those circumstances are. Bipolar is somewhat unpredictable. You can have an episode even on meds. Some people with bipolar just have EXTREME mood swings, but are never dangerous. But should someone be locked away based on a label because of what MIGHT happen? And just because someone stabilizes doesn't mean they're "better." They still have the illness.

You know what really makes me upset? People point at the mentally ill and talk about them being a danger to others. The truth is, anyone is capable of anything. There were plenty of sane murderers through history. King David was a man after God's own heart, and HE murdered a man! ANYONE is capable of ANYTHING, under the right (well, technically wrong) circumstances.

Any thoughts? Anyone feel prejudiced and discriminated and misunderstood like I do? I am SOOOO blessed to have met my husband. He knows all my mental history - but he wants to be with ME. He knows that those unstable things I do are not ME. He judges me based on who I am in my heart, not on the chemical imbalances of my brain. I don't often give public thanks to God online, but I want to thank You for having such tender mercy on me, and combing through the streets and houses of a prejudiced society to find me this beautiful, compassionate man. Thank you, Lord.

 

[jamie26301]

Oh, I think I should mention that I assumed something of my friend's background that offended her, and that's what I was apologizing for. I don't want to leave out something that probably affected how she responded. That's half-truth.

 

[RedTent]

I think that it should be part of our Christian walk to give understanding to all kinds of illness, including mental. We have a personal problem understanding bipolar, would you help?

My daughter offered her home to a bipolar lady who is alone in the world and finds it hard to be both bipolar and hold down any kind of work. Now, she is homeless. We are trying to help her, but it is hard to understand. We have managed to get her better medical care and that is helping.

She now has a job on week ends. We find that she reacts to things very strongly. She loves deeply, and also feels hurts and anger deeply. Her angry thoughts seem to be the basic reason she loses her job. If her medication is right, it seems to help. She is already beginning to have angry thoughts about people she is in contact with at her job. I have been trying to convince her to give up the angers to blessing the people she is angry with, instead, thinking that the thoughts she allows also helps regulate the imbalance of the chemicals in her brain. I am basing this on tests done that indicate the relationship of chemicals, thoughts, and brain. I have had no prior experience with this disorder, what do you think?

 

[Angela53510]

I know quite a bit about bipolar disorder. I used to go into bipolar forums and depression forums and minister to the people. I also have studied it, and my daughter worked in a psychiatric hospital to put herself through university, she gave me her mental health books, and we talked about the cases. She is now a social worker.

I think it is wonderful you have a husband who loves you and supports you. Support means everything, especially in a marriage.

I also hate the stigma of mental illness. I met many friends in the bipolar forums and added them to FB. They have never done or said anything to make me fear or mistrust them. I understand, that sometimes when the disease is at one extreme end or another, people do things that are confused, because the brain is not working properly. But that does not mean God does not love them, or that people should be afraid of them.

It also sounds to me like your friend has some issues, and over-reacted totally to what you did. You apologized, and it sounds like the apology was not accepted. So let go of this person and move on.

I hope you are taking your medications, and I would recommend Julie Fast's and John D. Preston's books "Living with Bipolar Disorder" and "Living with Someone with Bipolar Disorder." They are excellent books for both the person and the spouse to read, and some very concrete tips for understanding and living with this disease.

In the mean time, I think you did all that you could, and she was too quick to blame the disease, instead of misunderstanding.

God bless you, and I pray you will continue on this walk with Christ. I do believe he can help you with your disorder, but never forget to work with your doctor and your family and friends.

 

[tenderhearted]

I had a similar issue happen in the past and I was really in a rough place in my life. I was also pregnant and very hormonal. At the time, I was angry at people for a lot of painful things that happened to me in the past. Anyway, there were a few Christian friends that I voiced my frustration to. I voiced that I felt angry with the body of Christ in general and these women took what I said very personal. I tried to apologize and explained that the issue that I was having was not about them. I also explained that I was in a rough place. Basically their reaction toward me was judgement and criticism. They were very unforgiving toward me. It was hard to swollen because what I needed the most was love and compassion and I received judgement. Anyway, I gave it to God and I knew he forgive me, but the hardest thing was letting go of the feeling of condemnation. Also, realizing that even though people expect perfection from me-- I don't have to live up to their approval because God approves of me. It's a process.

 

[hattiebod]

Take captive your thoughts....you are free... your are beautiful, wonderfully made, planned, chosen....How could you be doomed? to mental illness if you have the supernatural life of Christ in you? and loving sisters and brothers around you to hold you up...find a church where you are valued. Stop thinking of what you are not...start thinking of what you are and can be. Read the Word. If we believe Christ is all He is...then all is possible? God Bless you and I shall pray we will come together to protect , love, uplift and value you. You area precious loved daughter of christ. <><

 

[jamie26301]

She now has a job on week ends. We find that she reacts to things very strongly. She loves deeply, and also feels hurts and anger deeply. Her angry thoughts seem to be the basic reason she loses her job. If her medication is right, it seems to help. She is already beginning to have angry thoughts about people she is in contact with at her job. I have been trying to convince her to give up the angers to blessing the people she is angry with, instead, thinking that the thoughts she allows also helps regulate the imbalance of the chemicals in her brain. I am basing this on tests done that indicate the relationship of chemicals, thoughts, and brain. I have had no prior experience with this disorder, what do you think?

I'm sorry that your friend is struggling so. I know what it's like to exhibit extreme emotions.

DISCLAIMER: I'm not a doctor. The following are my personal feelings and observations on the matter, but they may not be reflective of research and statistics. Angela, since you've done so much research, I'd like your thoughts on how close they are to the mark.

I think it's important to note that there are varying degrees of Bipolar, and two main types. I suppose the simplest way to put it is that Bipolar I is so severe that it requires hospitalization, and Bipolar II is abnormal swings in mood but not so severe as to interrupt with day to day functioning. It sounds like maybe she has Bipolar I, OR she could have Bipolar II, but not the discipline to control it. Now, I'm not as educated on it as I should be, but I know from my own experience that many of the stereotypes are simply not true. It is not true that all people with Bipolar are emotionally roller coaster riding people. Since I've found stability, and the right meds, my emotions have been normal for the typical young adult. You wouldn't know I had bipolar, unless I told you. Another misconception is that people forget their manias, they totally black out. Not always - I remember most of all my manias: what I did, who I saw, where I went, and what was said.

Meds do help a lot, but it can take a long time to find which meds work. Another thing to note is that taking medication doesn't guarantee that you won't become unstable, especially if you're just starting to experiment to see what works. The other thing is that just because a doctor has labeled you "bipolar," doesn't mean that you suddenly have the potential of being the next ax murderer, or some non-sense like that. Some people with bipolar DO dangerous things, or have thoughts of hurting themselves or other people. But I personally think morals would play into that as well. A person with a high morality might carry that with them into their manias, and not do harmful things. A good documentary you might like if you have Netflix is called Of Two Minds. They cover many people with Bipolar at varying levels. One man was about to commit suicide by jumping off a bridge, and you know why he stopped? He thought "If I jump, I'll cause an accident (cars below) and possibly get someone else killed too." So yes, I think the general morality and feelings of respect for other people you have when your stable will step into your episodes with you.

I personally think, from my own experience, that personality has a lot to do with it. If you're strong willed or rebellious in nature, someone might have a much harder time talking you into going to a hospital or seeking help. If your will is more subdued and submissive, like me, people will probably have an easier time talking you into doing things that are helpful. I've been talked into "the best decision" several times. I am Bipolar I. I really need my meds. If I forget my morning meds, my husband has noted that I tend to be more hyper than usual. This poses a real scare in the event that I should get pregnant (I am taking precautions though) I would have to go completely off ALL of them for the safety of the baby. Good for the baby - could be really bad for me, and depending on the instability, bad for the baby as well.

Also, having someone in your life that you trust, and makes you feel comfortable and has a calming effect on you, can be really beneficial. I feel my husband helps me stay stable, because he's very affectionate (as I am too) and that has a very calming effect on me. He's also very honest, and will tell me if I am getting too high-strung. Which is one of the reasons I've been away for a few days.

As far as your friend is concerned, there IS some use in her consciously thinking on good thoughts. I regret to tell you, though, that going from an angry state of mind to a peaceful one is not like flipping a switch. Especially if there are no meds aiding in this. I HAVE talked myself down from a mania before - I was all alone in my apartment and about to go over the edge, when I saw the word "mania" as a keyword at the top of the page (in a dictionary). I realized that I was climbing and I decided to put everything away, and lie down calmly. That was easier for me then than in the past, because I had the past manias to process in my mind and I'd think "I'm not going through that again." I've been away from CC for two days, BECAUSE I was getting stressed by the responses to some of my posts. Stress is probably enemy #1, with lack of medication following close behind. People with bipolar are not made of glass - I've heard of doctors who are bipolar. BUT it helps to keep stress levels as low as possible. When I had my first mania, the doctor told me to stop all extracurricular activities (I was still in middle school at the time).

It can be very hard to understand someone with bipolar. You may think "why can't she just get a grip on herself?" I remember being told several times through the years "you can just talk yourself out of it - you don't need all these meds." But that is a normal person's subjective experience. One of our flaws as humans (I'm guilty of this too) is that we think everyone else will/should have the same experience/feelings of the same event we went through. For example, I know one Christian who swears that if I read the Bible in "spiritual order" - like she did - that I will most certainly come to her own understanding of it. Some people with bipolar say they love their highs, because it helps them get a lot done and it makes them feel good - they don't care about being socially acceptable. Some people say when they're depressed, in a real low, they feel weight on them, and it feels literally impossible to get out of bed. Others who are high, quite literally lose control of themselves - they end up traveling to places they wouldn't ordinarily do, or spending more money than they have, or become destructive of property (that's me, sometimes). I know this from experience. Different people with bipolar have different backgrounds, different triggers, different severities - so it's hard for me to give concrete advice based on what you've given me.

Also remember this, and this is KEY: She MAY have been misdiagnosed. Bipolar is a trigger-happy diagnosis, and I firmly believe that many who are diagnosed with it, may not even have it. The thing is that it takes time, often, to see someone's cycle through their highs and lows, and therefore have concrete evidence for a diagnosis. One thing you might want to try is some anger management materials. That helped me, with my rage. A good, short little book is Anger and Unforgiveness - a biblical strategy to conquer destructive reactions, by Dr. Linda Mintle. Don't be afraid to look at secular materials as well. Telling yourself things like "people don't have to live up to MY unrealistic expectations" can really help calm anger, sometimes.

Many people with bipolar play the victim, I think. I've gone to a page on Facebook about bipolar, and there was a question posed as to what your favorite curse words were. I was the only one not slinging curse words around, and I said it makes us look ignorant, and only reinforces the stigma that we can't control our emotions. Boy, did they jump on me! One even suggested that I probably wasn't even bipolar! One said I obviously know nothing about bipolar. Because they've bought into the notion that because they have this illness, they have absolutely no control over their emotions and can use the illness for an excuse for whatever wrong they do. Now, it's harder for some than others. I realize it's hard, and I KNOW it is - I've been there. But we DO have some control over our emotions. I'm sure Angela can vouch for that.

It also helps to have a sense of humor about it. I had a period of extreme paranoia where I thought there were many conspiracies going on against me. Now today, when something happens that I'm not pleased with, I say "It's a conspiracy! They came out with all these flavors of potato chips AFTER I could no longer eat a whole bag and not gain a pound, just to persecute me!" I say that in public, and people smile and/or laugh, but only my husband is in on the joke. I can laugh about the illness, but the fact that people pre-judge me on that alone, is no laughing matter.

It also sounds to me like your friend has some issues, and over-reacted totally to what you did. You apologized, and it sounds like the apology was not accepted. So let go of this person and move on.

Well, no, she didn't acknowledge the apology - NO ONE on that thread did. And they preach to ME about manners?

I hope you are taking your medications, and I would recommend Julie Fast's and John D. Preston's books "Living with Bipolar Disorder" and "Living with Someone with Bipolar Disorder." They are excellent books for both the person and the spouse to read, and some very concrete tips for understanding and living with this disease.

Yes, I take my medications, and actually, I'm fortunate in that I don't take a ton of meds. And I would most certainly look into collecting these books for my reading list. Thank you!

In the mean time, I think you did all that you could, and she was too quick to blame the disease, instead of misunderstanding.

Well, really, no one should have to apologize for stating an opinion. The thing I did wrong was assume she had an open personality and assuming something about her past, even though it was a good reflection on her. She told me I needed to be more open (usually when people say that, what they really mean is "agree with me") but the reality was she was not open to my opinion, either. The fact is that I AGREED with the position of the post, I was just throwing in another perspective.

God bless you, and I pray you will continue on this walk with Christ. I do believe he can help you with your disorder, but never forget to work with your doctor and your family and friends.

Of course. I'm not one of those if-God-can't-take-care-of-me-then-nobdy-can types that refuse to take meds. I've gone off meds before - yeah, I'll never do that again.

I had a similar issue happen in the past and I was really in a rough place in my life. I was also pregnant and very hormonal. At the time, I was angry at people for a lot of painful things that happened to me in the past. Anyway, there were a few Christian friends that I voiced my frustration to. I voiced that I felt angry with the body of Christ in general and these women took what I said very personal. I tried to apologize and explained that the issue that I was having was not about them. I also explained that I was in a rough place. Basically their reaction toward me was judgement and criticism. They were very unforgiving toward me. It was hard to swollen because what I needed the most was love and compassion and I received judgement. Anyway, I gave it to God and I knew he forgive me, but the hardest thing was letting go of the feeling of condemnation. Also, realizing that even though people expect perfection from me-- I don't have to live up to their approval because God approves of me. It's a process.

Yes, I totally understand; I have several so-called "Christians" on my ignore list. Just added one today, actually. I haven't got time for being exposed to judgement even FOR JUST questioning a SIDE DOCTRINE that means nothing in salvation. I know there is debate about what side doctrines are meaningful to the point they must be dogmatically taught and enforced, but I'm not going to read post after post from these people attacking the authenticity of my faith because I question what those doctrines are. Disagree with me; that's fine. Passively dub me a "freak" for JUST questioning and stirring discussion about something - well, I'm sorry, but that's just not the spirit of Christ, and I haven't no time to read those bigoted posts.

I've had situations where I offended people when I was manic, apologized later, and they never voiced forgiveness. Get this: one of those girls was someone who was a PSYCHOLOGY major. According to another friend of mine, this person was ridiculing me in class - while I was laid up in the hospital! She allegedly told people that I acted that way because I was "mad that they wouldn't become Christians." Maybe she has forgiven me since then, but it goes to show just how ignorant people are even when THAT IS THEIR FIELD. Just like these people who are diagnosed with bipolar who say I must not be bipolar because I can control my swearing. MADNESS. People don't understand their own illness, probably because they never researched it. Angela, BRAVO for taking it upon yourself to learn about it.

 

[John_agape]

Hi Jamie. The problem with discrimination is that it hurts. Sticks and stones can hurt my bones, but words hurt my soul. Those that are cranky like in the case you mentioned are suffering from their own twisted souls. We need to get a perspective that pulls us away from these sick attitudes and focus on Christ. We are pilgrims on this earth, heading for the promised land, the heavenly kingdom. These poor souls that get some perverse joy out of being nasty are the inhabitants of this secular place we do not call home.

Being rejected or otherwise discriminated against is something most of us deal with from time to time. I find, when I get hurt, I need to consciously think about Jesus. When He hung on the cross He said, "Father forgive them for they now not what they do." This helps me. I don't have to defend myself, even though I feel strongly that I want to. They don't understand, and I am grateful and thankful that I do.

I was diagnosed as Bipolar II, but I am not. I have an ADHD personality. Not a disorder.

I call it my Attention Distractible Hyperfocusing Dysregulation. I can be easily distracted, and in certain situations I can hyperfocus incredibly well. I can't choose to be in one mode or the other, hence dysregulation. But I can choose a lifestyle and environments that lets me hyperfocus while avoiding unnecessary attention distractions.

My Grandmother and her sister were also ADHD personalities, kind of runs in the family. When I was still a pre-teen, she told me that there was nothing wrong with me, I was just different to my classmates. That was the foundation I built my coping strategies on. I developed them intuitively and had a successful life. That success came to an end when my job moved from a quiet environment to an open-plan-office. There I tried to be like the others, after all they all seemed to cope quite fine.

This led to a serious nervous breakdown or burnout, as in burned to a frazzle. It was in trying to get my life back again that the Bipolar wrong diagnosis came up. It was also then that I discovered this ADHD thing.

It took some time, but now I have a lifestyle and live in an environment that suits my personality.

Extrapolating from me and my solution, I was wondering something about Bipolar. Since there have been geniuses and great artists with Bipolar or Bipolar like symptoms, is it possible to live with bipolar by rolling with the waves? I mean to be active, creative and inventive while on the up, and then pull back somewhere quiet while on the down side?

 

[CRC]

“Spiritual Words” for the Mentally Distressed
MENTAL problems afflict even some faithful servants of God. And while at times it may be necessary and appropriate for distressed ones to seek professional help, they can also benefit from the assistance and encouragement of the Christian congregation. For example, when the faithful Christian Epaphroditus became severely depressed, fellow believers in Philippi were exhorted not to ignore his distress but to “give him the customary welcome in the Lord with all joy; and keep holding men of that sort dear.”—Philippians 2:25-29.
Christians today are likewise under obligation to “keep comforting one another” and to “support the weak.” (1 Thessalonians 5:11, 14) Christian Shepherds should take the lead in this regard.—Isaiah 32:2.

 

[Camarasaurus]

If I may speak from the perspective of a child of a Bi-polar parent. I grew up with a father who was bi-polar - and this was in the days when there was NO MEDICATION for them! He went through several rounds of mental hospital stays, and of electric-shock therapy - was mis-diagnosed as Schizophrenic, and years of other humiliations at the hands of the so-called "experts" of his day - before he (by miraculous circumstances) came in contact with a doctor who was doing trial studies on Lithium. Finally, he found something that truely helped him, and he was stable from then on - as long as he was on his meds; which he was faithful to take. I believe the fear of having to go through the hell he did before the meds motivated him to do so.

I tell you this because comparing my fathers experience (and or whole family) back then to today, and the new meds and more open awareness of bi-polar disorder - there is a world of difference!

There still is - and always will be - those who are unkind and uninformed and rude to the mentally ill. It's part of their fear and lack of experience and understanding. I have even seen mental health professionals who treated my father horribly because of their being just plain clueless! Amazing, but true!

Me and my siblings grew up always feeling we could not let anyone know we came from a home where there was mental illness - and to this day we still aren't open about it. People will look at US and think -"Are THEY going to go crazy also?"

It's part of society to fear what one does not understand. It's a "survival instinct" that can be a real hassle, but it is very common.

I encourage you to let the cluelessness in others pass. Getting upset with it will only add to your stress levels and be a continual frustration. People on the internet are notorious for being rude and saying things they would never say to your face, but because of their anonymity online feel free to let it fly! Blow them off and ignore them - trying to apologize for an honest mistake only makes them feel they have more power over you, and they will often go in for the attack. It isn't worth the hassle to deal with them. IGNORE THEM.

Take care, and God bless! (((hugs)))

 

[Jeshuvan]

YOU r not single.You r part of a marriage 2 Christ,Amen