The GREAT DEBATE

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Aug 2, 2009
24,581
4,269
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#81
I missed the debate...only heard the last 10 minutes or so on the radio. Sounded like the Donald was doing a pretty good job of criticizing Hillary's record as secretary of state. I will watch the whole thing soon on youtube (or wherever its available). Thanks for reading.. :)


Hey if Trump wins, should we call him "The Don" :rolleyes:
(reference to The Godfather movie starring Marlon Brando)
 
Last edited:
Mar 2, 2016
8,896
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#83
I think Hillary is correct in not cutting taxes for businesses.
We're already in a lot of debt, and taxes are a way for a Country to get money.


But I agree with Trump on racial divisions and law and order
We are not in debt because business's aren't taxed enough....we are in debt because politicians treat our treasury like their personal piggy bank.
 
Feb 7, 2015
22,418
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#85
A lesson in economics using beer
Here's another one of those spam emails that say something cute, or important, or idiotic. I enjoyed this one, it explains in simple terms the injustice of the graduated tax system. I'm sure some people will complain that it oversimplifies and that the analogy breaks down or doesn't fit, but I think its simple presentation fits VERY well. Graduated taxes penalize the successful, and that is essentially unjust. When we all get a tax reduction, it is entirely fair that those who PAID more get a bigger benefit from cuts. Those who argue otherwise are using Marxist ethics which are BANKRUPT and ethically and morally WRONG. You know, wicked, evil, bad for humanity. Really.
--------------------------
Suppose that every day, 10 men go out for beer and the bill for all 10 comes to $100. If they paid their bill the way we pay our taxes, it would go something like this:

The first 4 men (the poorest) would pay nothing.
The fifth would pay $1.
The sixth would pay $3.
The seventh would pay $7.
The eighth would pay $12.
The ninth would pay $18.
The tenth man (the richest) would pay $59.

So, that's what they decided to do. The 10 men drank in the bar every day & seemed quite happy with the arrangement, until one day, the owner threw them a curve. 'Since you are all such good customers, he said, 'I'm going to reduce the cost of your daily beer by $20. Drinks for the 10 now cost just $80.

The group still wanted to pay their bill the way we pay our taxes so the first 4 men were unaffected. They would still drink for free. But what about the other 6 men - the paying customers? How could they divide the $20 windfall so that everyone would get his 'fair share?' They realized that $20 divided by 6 is $3.33. But if they subtracted that from everybody's share, then the fifth man & the sixth man would each end up being paid to drink his beer. So, the bar owner suggested that it would be fair to reduce each man's bill by roughly the same amount, & he proceeded to work out the amounts each should pay.

And so:
The fifth man, like the first 4, now paid nothing (100% savings).
The sixth now paid $2 instead of $3 (33%savings).
The seventh now paid $5 instead of $7 (28%savings).
The eighth now paid $9 instead of $12 (25% savings).
The ninth now paid $14 instead of $18 (22% savings).
The tenth now paid $49 instead of $59 (16% savings).

Each of the 6 was better off than before. And the first four continued to drink for free. But once outside the restaurant, the men began to compare their savings.

'I only got a dollar out of the $20', declared the sixth man. He pointed to the tenth man,' but he got $10!'

'Yeah, that's right', exclaimed the fifth man. 'I only saved a dollar, too. It's unfair that he got 10 times more than me!'

'That's true!!' shouted the seventh man. Why should he get $10 back when I got only 2? The wealthy get all the breaks!'

'Wait a minute,' yelled the first 4 men in unison. 'We didn't get anything at all. The system exploits the poor!'

The 9 men surrounded the tenth and beat him up. The next night the tenth man didn't show up for drinks, so the 9 sat down & had beers without him. But when it came time to pay the bill they discovered something important. They didn't have enough money between all of them for even 1/2 of the bill!

That, boys & girls, journalists & college professors, is how our tax system works. The people who pay the highest taxes get the most benefit from a tax reduction. Tax them too much, attack them for being wealthy & they just may not show up anymore. In fact, they might start drinking overseas where the atmosphere is somewhat friendlier.

David R. Kamerschen, Ph.D.
Professor of Economics, University of Georgia
For those who understand, no explanation is needed.
For those who do not understand, no explanation is possible.

 
T

TemporaryCircumstances

Guest
#86
How about the government not spending so much?

Spend less, you need to collect less taxes.

------

When a company has to pay more, the customer has to pay more. Why? The company just passes the cost onto the customer.

In addition, having to pay higher taxes means the company is less likely to hire more people. Why? They have to use that money to pay taxes.
I don't think the government needs to spend as much, that's true.
But taxes still need to be in place, and a reasonable amount.
Because the fact still remains that even if the government stops wasting money on so many things we are still in debt.

That's true, the customer does have to pay more. But we are so drowned in debt that it needs to be fixed somehow and if people need to pay more money for that then (shrugs)
I don't think taxes need to be drastically high. But not too low. We can't really afford that.
 
T

TemporaryCircumstances

Guest
#87
A lesson in economics using beer
Here's another one of those spam emails that say something cute, or important, or idiotic. I enjoyed this one, it explains in simple terms the injustice of the graduated tax system. I'm sure some people will complain that it oversimplifies and that the analogy breaks down or doesn't fit, but I think its simple presentation fits VERY well. Graduated taxes penalize the successful, and that is essentially unjust. When we all get a tax reduction, it is entirely fair that those who PAID more get a bigger benefit from cuts. Those who argue otherwise are using Marxist ethics which are BANKRUPT and ethically and morally WRONG. You know, wicked, evil, bad for humanity. Really.
--------------------------
Suppose that every day, 10 men go out for beer and the bill for all 10 comes to $100. If they paid their bill the way we pay our taxes, it would go something like this:

The first 4 men (the poorest) would pay nothing.
The fifth would pay $1.
The sixth would pay $3.
The seventh would pay $7.
The eighth would pay $12.
The ninth would pay $18.
The tenth man (the richest) would pay $59.

So, that's what they decided to do. The 10 men drank in the bar every day & seemed quite happy with the arrangement, until one day, the owner threw them a curve. 'Since you are all such good customers, he said, 'I'm going to reduce the cost of your daily beer by $20. Drinks for the 10 now cost just $80.

The group still wanted to pay their bill the way we pay our taxes so the first 4 men were unaffected. They would still drink for free. But what about the other 6 men - the paying customers? How could they divide the $20 windfall so that everyone would get his 'fair share?' They realized that $20 divided by 6 is $3.33. But if they subtracted that from everybody's share, then the fifth man & the sixth man would each end up being paid to drink his beer. So, the bar owner suggested that it would be fair to reduce each man's bill by roughly the same amount, & he proceeded to work out the amounts each should pay.

And so:
The fifth man, like the first 4, now paid nothing (100% savings).
The sixth now paid $2 instead of $3 (33%savings).
The seventh now paid $5 instead of $7 (28%savings).
The eighth now paid $9 instead of $12 (25% savings).
The ninth now paid $14 instead of $18 (22% savings).
The tenth now paid $49 instead of $59 (16% savings).

Each of the 6 was better off than before. And the first four continued to drink for free. But once outside the restaurant, the men began to compare their savings.

'I only got a dollar out of the $20', declared the sixth man. He pointed to the tenth man,' but he got $10!'

'Yeah, that's right', exclaimed the fifth man. 'I only saved a dollar, too. It's unfair that he got 10 times more than me!'

'That's true!!' shouted the seventh man. Why should he get $10 back when I got only 2? The wealthy get all the breaks!'

'Wait a minute,' yelled the first 4 men in unison. 'We didn't get anything at all. The system exploits the poor!'

The 9 men surrounded the tenth and beat him up. The next night the tenth man didn't show up for drinks, so the 9 sat down & had beers without him. But when it came time to pay the bill they discovered something important. They didn't have enough money between all of them for even 1/2 of the bill!

That, boys & girls, journalists & college professors, is how our tax system works. The people who pay the highest taxes get the most benefit from a tax reduction. Tax them too much, attack them for being wealthy & they just may not show up anymore. In fact, they might start drinking overseas where the atmosphere is somewhat friendlier.

David R. Kamerschen, Ph.D.
Professor of Economics, University of Georgia
For those who understand, no explanation is needed.
For those who do not understand, no explanation is possible.

Is it a book?
 
T

TemporaryCircumstances

Guest
#88
We are not in debt because business's aren't taxed enough....we are in debt because politicians treat our treasury like their personal piggy bank.
Alrighty,
I agree, yes.
But I am curious on how you stand on getting out of debt.
I am sincerely curious.
Educate a young soul :)
 
T

TemporaryCircumstances

Guest
#89
A lesson in economics using beer
Here's another one of those spam emails that say something cute, or important, or idiotic. I enjoyed this one, it explains in simple terms the injustice of the graduated tax system. I'm sure some people will complain that it oversimplifies and that the analogy breaks down or doesn't fit, but I think its simple presentation fits VERY well. Graduated taxes penalize the successful, and that is essentially unjust. When we all get a tax reduction, it is entirely fair that those who PAID more get a bigger benefit from cuts. Those who argue otherwise are using Marxist ethics which are BANKRUPT and ethically and morally WRONG. You know, wicked, evil, bad for humanity. Really.
--------------------------
Suppose that every day, 10 men go out for beer and the bill for all 10 comes to $100. If they paid their bill the way we pay our taxes, it would go something like this:

The first 4 men (the poorest) would pay nothing.
The fifth would pay $1.
The sixth would pay $3.
The seventh would pay $7.
The eighth would pay $12.
The ninth would pay $18.
The tenth man (the richest) would pay $59.

So, that's what they decided to do. The 10 men drank in the bar every day & seemed quite happy with the arrangement, until one day, the owner threw them a curve. 'Since you are all such good customers, he said, 'I'm going to reduce the cost of your daily beer by $20. Drinks for the 10 now cost just $80.

The group still wanted to pay their bill the way we pay our taxes so the first 4 men were unaffected. They would still drink for free. But what about the other 6 men - the paying customers? How could they divide the $20 windfall so that everyone would get his 'fair share?' They realized that $20 divided by 6 is $3.33. But if they subtracted that from everybody's share, then the fifth man & the sixth man would each end up being paid to drink his beer. So, the bar owner suggested that it would be fair to reduce each man's bill by roughly the same amount, & he proceeded to work out the amounts each should pay.

And so:
The fifth man, like the first 4, now paid nothing (100% savings).
The sixth now paid $2 instead of $3 (33%savings).
The seventh now paid $5 instead of $7 (28%savings).
The eighth now paid $9 instead of $12 (25% savings).
The ninth now paid $14 instead of $18 (22% savings).
The tenth now paid $49 instead of $59 (16% savings).

Each of the 6 was better off than before. And the first four continued to drink for free. But once outside the restaurant, the men began to compare their savings.

'I only got a dollar out of the $20', declared the sixth man. He pointed to the tenth man,' but he got $10!'

'Yeah, that's right', exclaimed the fifth man. 'I only saved a dollar, too. It's unfair that he got 10 times more than me!'

'That's true!!' shouted the seventh man. Why should he get $10 back when I got only 2? The wealthy get all the breaks!'

'Wait a minute,' yelled the first 4 men in unison. 'We didn't get anything at all. The system exploits the poor!'

The 9 men surrounded the tenth and beat him up. The next night the tenth man didn't show up for drinks, so the 9 sat down & had beers without him. But when it came time to pay the bill they discovered something important. They didn't have enough money between all of them for even 1/2 of the bill!

That, boys & girls, journalists & college professors, is how our tax system works. The people who pay the highest taxes get the most benefit from a tax reduction. Tax them too much, attack them for being wealthy & they just may not show up anymore. In fact, they might start drinking overseas where the atmosphere is somewhat friendlier.

David R. Kamerschen, Ph.D.
Professor of Economics, University of Georgia
For those who understand, no explanation is needed.
For those who do not understand, no explanation is possible.

And that was very useful thank you Willie
 
Jan 24, 2009
1,601
31
48
#90
That's true, the customer does have to pay more. But we are so drowned in debt that it needs to be fixed somehow and if people need to pay more money for that then (shrugs)
I don't think taxes need to be drastically high. But not too low. We can't really afford that.
To start fixing the problem, we have to first stop overspending.

The country adds about $1 million every minute to our debt.

They talk about "balancing the budget" in politics. If they do that, then spending and tax collection is equal...they balance.

That doesn't happen. It's talk but doesn't happen.
 
T

TemporaryCircumstances

Guest
#91
To start fixing the problem, we have to first stop overspending.

The country adds about $1 million every minute to our debt.

They talk about "balancing the budget" in politics. If they do that, then spending and tax collection is equal...they balance.

That doesn't happen. It's talk but doesn't happen.
Okay,
So stop the overspending, and useless spending
Keep taxes at a reasonable amount, not too low or high

Correct?
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#92
So whens trumps numbers keep improving ..all the people that say Trump lost the debate ...will say what? The debate was not important ?
 
U

Ultimatum77

Guest
#93
Yayyyy
(Throws a party)
Oy I'm so weird lol

Thanks for reading it and helping me out!
No problem :) I got up early today around 6:30 just to listen to the debate #dedication ;) And I listened to the whole thing very closely...it did not have much subject matter and Lester Holt was a complete a-hole....not very substantive for material more just entertainment......no discussion about healthcare, abortion, internet rights/UN taking over the internet on OCt 1st via IKON/censorship)........
 
T

TemporaryCircumstances

Guest
#94
To start fixing the problem, we have to first stop overspending.

The country adds about $1 million every minute to our debt.

They talk about "balancing the budget" in politics. If they do that, then spending and tax collection is equal...they balance.

That doesn't happen. It's talk but doesn't happen.
And when the budget is balanced it helps with our debt?
 
T

TemporaryCircumstances

Guest
#95
No problem :) I got up early today around 6:30 just to listen to the debate #dedication ;) And I listened to the whole thing very closely...it did not have much subject matter and Lester Holt was a complete a-hole....not very substantive for material more just entertainment......no discussion about healthcare, abortion, internet rights/UN taking over the internet on OCt 1st via IKON/censorship)........
I think the word healthcare was only said once by Mr. Trump the whole debate Lol

This one was okay.
I watched some of the Republican debates and their topics were
Oy...there's nothing to explain that.
Those were painful
 
Jan 24, 2009
1,601
31
48
#96
Okay,
So stop the overspending, and useless spending
Keep taxes at a reasonable amount, not too low or high

Correct?
I kinda like the idea of a flat tax.

We'll all give a certain % and the government has to learn to work with it.

If they claim to need more, then the people have to authorize it, after they are informed of what the government is going to use it for.
 
M

Mitspa

Guest
#97
I don't think the government needs to spend as much, that's true.
But taxes still need to be in place, and a reasonable amount.
Because the fact still remains that even if the government stops wasting money on so many things we are still in debt.

That's true, the customer does have to pay more. But we are so drowned in debt that it needs to be fixed somehow and if people need to pay more money for that then (shrugs)
I don't think taxes need to be drastically high. But not too low. We can't really afford that.
The ONLY TIME in our recent economic times..that we have ever been near a balanced budget was when we have a expanding economy and that only happens when we have lower taxes and less government restrictions ... Even Bill Clinton used to know that.
 
T

TemporaryCircumstances

Guest
#98
I kinda like the idea of a flat tax.

We'll all give a certain % and the government has to learn to work with it.

If they claim to need more, then the people have to authorize it, after they are informed of what the government is going to use it for.
Alright,
Hang in there with me lol

I think that sounds like a wonderful idea on paper.
But, what I think would happen is people would get mad at the government for things that cost money that they what fixed but the government claims they don't have enough money
 
T

TemporaryCircumstances

Guest
The ONLY TIME in our recent economic times..that we have ever been near a balanced budget was when we have a expanding economy and that only happens when we have lower taxes and less government restrictions ... Even Bill Clinton used to know that.
Oy
Alright fine lol
Would you care to explain how?