U.S. Supreme Court declines stay 4 clerk refusing to issue gay marriage certificates

[crossnote]

No For one I have no issue if people are persecuted in federal jobs for not following the SCOTUS ruling. I will have a problem if they start targetting individual pastors or churches.

If enough Christians are forced out of employment, who will pay for the pastor and church expenses?

You mention, "I will have a problem if they start targeting individual pastors or churches"; you do realize it is the individuals that make up the churches don't you?

If governmental employers can let go persons for deeply held religious convictions how much more will the private sector be able to do so since the Federal government has set the standard.

 

[Yeraza_Bats]

...and undone by the supremes...

Matthew 19:4-6 (KJV)
4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,
5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?
6 Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.

...but God WILL have the Last Word

One argument that the homosexual movement uses often is that "Christ never spoke out against homosexuality", haha this verse here clearly states the opposite. Thanks for this :3

 

[Viligant_Warrior]

Well crossnote, If Davis had been a once married only for the past 30 years taking this stand...

Do you realize you have just expressed unforgiveness and arrogance in one simple sentence?

Have you ever done something that was beyond question against the word of God, but continued to uphold the teachings of the Gospel and His word? When you sin, do you throw up your hands and say, "Oh, well, that's it! I no longer have a witness for Christ, so I just better shut up, crawl in a hole, and hope the world doesn't notice me."

I'm guessing the answer is "No!" Sin is sin, you're right. But forgiveness is forgiveness, and you have no right to judge her. Her marriages were at least biblical, and since you don't have a clue as to why they ended, your judgment is misplaced. The marriages she stands against cannot even pretend to be biblical!

So why do you want Davis to do that? Why do you think she can't be forgiven for her divorces and has no voice against gay, lesbian, etc. marriage? Trust me, Gurl, if you can have a voice, so can she! Because just like me, you're no better than her. So knock it off.

 

[crossnote]

One argument that the homosexual movement uses often is that "Christ never spoke out against homosexuality", haha this verse here clearly states the opposite. Thanks for this :3

Yes, and if the homosexual is Jewish remind them of this one...

Genesis 2:23-24 (KJV)
23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.
24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.

 

[Nautilus]

If enough Christians are forced out of employment, who will pay for the pastor and church expenses?

You mention, "I will have a problem if they start targeting individual pastors or churches"; you do realize it is the individuals that make up the churches don't you?

If governmental employers can let go persons for deeply held religious convictions how much more will the private sector be able to do so since the Federal government has set the standard.

No one pays for our pastor. He has his own job. And the majority of jobs don't involve things that for most christians would present a conflict of interests in the first place.

 

[BarlyGurl]

Do you realize you have just expressed unforgiveness and arrogance in one simple sentence? Expounding on your reading comprehension problem again? Oh wait, hijacking a PORTION of my comment to contort it for your agenda to besmirch me.... that is what your doing.

Have you ever done something that was beyond question against the word of God, but continued to uphold the teachings of the Gospel and His word? When you sin, do you throw up your hands and say, "Oh, well, that's it! I no longer have a witness for Christ, so I just better shut up, crawl in a hole, and hope the world doesn't notice me." Yes, and no... I REPENT.

I'm guessing the answer is "No!" Sin is sin, you're right.NO, WRONG guess! and NO actually SIN is not just sin, But forgiveness is forgiveness, and you have no right to judge her I am plainly INSTRUCTED by God to JUDGE ALL THINGS, that is the difference between you and I... I understand the distinction between JUDGING ETERNALLY and JUDGING SITUATIONS... clearly, you are wrongly judging ME in my motive, intent and action by wrong PRESUMPTIONS whilst telling me I have no right to JUDGE.... <it would be funny if the issue were not so serious>! Her marriages were at least biblical, YOU presume AGAIN, oh wait no you mean merely male/female... Gotchya. and since you don't have a clue as to why they ended, your judgment is misplaced Since her "marriages" have NO BEARING on my stance... it looks like the one with mis-placed judgement is YOU. The marriages she stands against cannot even pretend to be biblical! She can stand against gay-unions and SHOULD, she cannot assert she is not REQUIRED to do her JOB because her affixing her name to the document is somehow giving her personal endorsement and APPROVAL of the union.... WHICH IS EXACTLY WHAT SHE HAS INDICATED! Conversely, IF her signature identifying her as THE OFFICIAL CLERK was indeed a PERSONAL ENDORSEMENT AND APPROVAL for every "record" she ever witnessed then she has an awful lot document RETRACTING to do over the last 27 years in order to OBEY GOD'S LAWS and NOT MAN'S. She clearly thinks she is far more important than she is, and you apparently agree with her grandiose sense of self importance

So why do you want Davis to do that? Why do you think she can't be forgiven for her divorces and has no voice against gay, lesbian, etc. marriage? Never said any such thing, YOU accuse me of saying that! Trust me HA HA HA, trust YOU after this incident demonstrating your POOR READING COMPREHENSION and Slanderous attack upon me personally for offenses fabricated IN YOR IMAGINATION... nope not trusting you... no way!, Gurl, if you can have a voice, so can she! Because just like me, you're no better than her. So knock it off.

Knock it off??? YOU are the one who is FABRICATING the purported "offense" you are so dramatically "chastening" me about... so who should "knock it of"? Davis is a record's clerk, her signature is not a personal endorsement or approval of any single transaction, liscense or document she has affixed her signature to for the last 27 years, now that the laws have changed, deciding she is CONDONING or APPROVING of gay marriage in general or any particular union is WRONG thinking on her part, she cannot REFUSE to do her job on the basis of argument. It is arrogant and her multiple "marriages" only heighten her personal hypocrisy regarding the matter for the "LEFT" to exploit... WHICH THEY HAVE!!!

 

[crossnote]

No one pays for our pastor. He has his own job. And the majority of jobs don't involve things that for most christians would present a conflict of interests in the first place.

Does your pastor have a conscience or is he exempt from losing his job for standing on Christian principles?
The 'majority' of jobs is dwindling.

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

SCOTUS is not God Nautilus anymore than the Soviet politburo was. When human institutions become so corrupt they begin persecuting moral people for not following their instructions to engage in or facilitate gross immorality, there is a problem.

No For one I have no issue if people are persecuted in federal jobs for not following the SCOTUS ruling. I will have a problem if they start targetting individual pastors or churches.

 

[Nautilus]

Does your pastor have a conscience or is he exempt from losing his job for standing on Christian principles?
The 'majority' of jobs is dwindling.

He sells car insurance I think. So yeah seems pretty safe there. Unless they magically invent cars that run on aborted fetuses, Im not sure when his faith would come up.

 

[PennEd]

Here is the moment brothers and sisters! A Christian(not in IRAN) is actually jailed for refusing to marry homosexuals!!!! Let's remember Acts 5:40-42!!!

Ky. clerk jailed for refusing to issue marriage licenses

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

^ Desdichado will appreciate this one.

 

[Desdichado]

^ Desdichado will appreciate this one.

Indeed, comrade.

 

[Viligant_Warrior]

EXCLUSIVE: Kentucky Clerk: 'This is a fight worth fighting'

UPDATE: A federal judge has ordered a defiant Kentucky clerk to jail after she refused to issue marriage licenses to gay couples.

U.S. District Judge David Bunning told Rowan County Clerk Kim Davis she would be jailed until she complied with his order to issue the licenses. Davis said "thank you" before she was led out of the courtroom by a U.S. marshal. She was not in handcuffs.

Bunning also warned deputy clerks around the state that they could suffer the same fate should they refuse to issue marriage licenses to gay couples.

Davis has refused to issue marriages licenses for two months since the Supreme Court legalized gay marriage. She argues that her Christian faith should exempt her from signing the licenses.

The cheering you hear in the distance is the LGBT crowd celebrating their first of many victories over Christianity. These will come in spite of Supreme Court Justice Anthony Kennedy's "defense" of faith-based convictions in the majority opinion legalizing gay marriage.

Supreme Court decision Obergfel v. Hodges: Page 27 -- (p. 32 of .pdf file)

Finally, it must be emphasized that religions, and those who adhere to religious doctrines, may continue to advocate with utmost, sincere conviction that, by divine precepts, same-sex marriage should not be condoned. The First Amendment ensures that religious organizations and persons are given proper protection as they seek to teach the principles that are so fulfilling and so central to their lives and faiths, and to their own deep aspirations tocontinue the family structure they have long revered. The same is true of those who oppose same-sex marriage for other reasons.

So, one might ask Judge Bunning, "What happened? You didn't read the opinion? It's inconvenient to your liberal-judge advocacy?"

Or the Kennedy opinion was merely lip-service to appease the "stupid Christians?" Yeah, that's it.

 

[Viligant_Warrior]

Have you ever done something that was beyond question against the word of God, but continued to uphold the teachings of the Gospel and His word? When you sin, do you throw up your hands and say, "Oh, well, that's it! I no longer have a witness for Christ, so I just better shut up, crawl in a hole, and hope the world doesn't notice me." Yes, and no... I REPENT.

Then you have experience at it. Good. Do it again. And BTW, WTMIL.

 

[crossnote]

The first few trickles.

 

[atwhatcost]

Actually Vili, You seem to have a reading comprehension problem and while you are FALSELY PRESUMING I sanction same sex marriage... I will STAND FIRMLY in position regarding both my opinion of the scenario presented AND my biblically grounded belief. IF you want to assert yourself as standing IN PLACE OF this Davis woman... then I guess you would be the SAME kind of hypocrite she is. SO I assert you are WRONGLY looking down your nose and JUDGING ME for making the distinction between her "faith claims" and the separate "same sex marriage" issue.... which was based on HER OWN WORDS... not some vague media interpretation of the entire matter.

Let me get your position straight. The thing you hold against her is the amount of times she has been married, right? Guess what. Every one of those marriages was before she became a believer. So, God can forgive, but you cannot?

You know why this lady is good? Because she does understand God forgives even when we make humongous, sinful mistakes by marrying the wrong people or marrying from a gut or loin reaction. This is the part the American media even admits occasionally, but you refuse to see.

So, I bring this to you here, where at least broken people won't waste their time seeking advice from people like you. Stay away from the Family Forum, because it is quite obvious you believe that people must first repent to God, and then repent to you.

Honestly? You have, repeatedly, set yourself up as judge and jury after God's judgement, and the misery you spread here you also spread on the Family Forum.

If it's a choice between your way or the highway, I'll take the highway. But I don't have to, because I have the only Way. Something you could use a bigger dose of, given it's too often about what you think is right before bothering with annoying little facts!

 

[Viligant_Warrior]

and since you don't have a clue as to why they ended, your judgment is misplaced.

Since her "marriages" have NO BEARING on my stance... it looks like the one with mis-placed judgement is YOU.

This is completely disingenuous. Your laughable response, using your cute blue font to respond, made me momentarily lose sight of this comment. How can you make such a blatantly audacious claim when, in post #37, you clearly said this:

Well crossnote, If Davis had been a once married only for the past 30 years taking this stand... admittedly I would be more supportive and willing to consider that "she never fully considered the issue until homo-marriage was legalized"... my perspective would be different, perhaps not entirely accurate, but different.

So her marriages play no part in your stance? Either you fail to follow the topic, or you lied. I frankly don't know which, nor do I care.

 

[BarlyGurl]

Let me get your position straight. The thing you hold against her is the amount of times she has been married, right? Guess what. Every one of those marriages was before she became a believer. So, God can forgive, but you cannot?

You know why this lady is good? Because she does understand God forgives even when we make humongous, sinful mistakes by marrying the wrong people or marrying from a gut or loin reaction. This is the part the American media even admits occasionally, but you refuse to see.

So, I bring this to you here, where at least broken people won't waste their time seeking advice from people like you. Stay away from the Family Forum, because it is quite obvious you believe that people must first repent to God, and then repent to you.

Honestly? You have, repeatedly, set yourself up as judge and jury after God's judgement, and the misery you spread here you also spread on the Family Forum.

If it's a choice between your way or the highway, I'll take the highway. But I don't have to, because I have the only Way. Something you could use a bigger dose of, given it's too often about what you think is right before bothering with annoying little facts!

OH LOOK.... atwhat is addressing me while making presumptive argument with herself.... A_G_A_I_N!!! You do this frequently I have noticed... and not just with me.

 

[BarlyGurl]

This is completely disingenuous. Your laughable response, using your cute blue font to respond, made me momentarily lose sight of this comment. How can you make such a blatantly audacious claim when, in post #37, you clearly said this:

So her marriages play no part in your stance? Either you fail to follow the topic, or you lied. I frankly don't know which, nor do I care.

Disingenuous???? I give you an AWARD for being so incorrigibly OBSTINATE in your presumptions that YOU COMPLETELY FAIL to be able to accurately follow my comments.... AFTER walking into the thread and making your first erroneous presumptive Judgment. I haven't lied... you are merely attempting to vilify me personally. YOUR inability to accurately follow my commentary falls ON YOU... It has been brought to my attention that at least a FEW plainly understood what I was communicating. YOU have made no effort to ask for CLARIFICATION... rather hurled false presumptions and railing accusations... MOst recently ALLEDGING I LIED. That's all on YOU vili.... God is watching and he will judge between ME and YOU. I am done addressing you entirely... other than to report any further personal attack... which I have pointed out already.

 

[AgeofKnowledge]

'Rampant Injustice' Documentary - The IRS And DOJ Raid Small Businesses With Paramilitary, Gestapo Style Tactics:

"Between 2009 and 2011, IRS audits against small businesses increased 32%. Federal warrants against businesses have also increased substantially with many of the raids conducted by SWAT teams.

Among the hundreds of businesses raided by the IRS and Department of Justice, using paramilitary, gestapo like tactics, was Mountain Pure Water Bottling Company and Duncan Outdoors, Inc., both situated in Arkansas and Gibson Guitar located in Tennessee. Their stories are profiled in the documentary which has been up on YouTube since October 31 of last year. The abusive targeting practices of the IRS toward conservative organizations have finally made the news, but these stories need exposure too."