Grace = Salvation.

Chinekwu · Oct 9, 2013

Now I'm even more confused...Jesus presents us Holy and blameless(sinless) before God and THEN we become born again and filled(baptized) with the Holy Spirit? What about all of the accounts of people being filled in the book of Acts and such? They believed and repented and BAM, right on the spot they recieved the baptism of the Holy Spirit. Did Jesus present them to God literally perfect right then and there? Again I think the issue is WHEN this 'presenting' happens...when does Jesus present us before the Father? You say He does so in this life IF we are made perfect first in order to be made perfect...I dont get it. Be perfect in order to be made perfect....?

We are not perfect yet when you repent and are baptized you are made clean, you have made your heart ready to receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. Even after receiving the Holy Ghost you must strive daily for perfection because only God is perfect. The Holy Ghost gives us the power to accomplish that. We still must follow after God's commandments which are not grievous. It is a continued daily renewing of our minds. You have to allow the Holy Ghost to change you and teach you, you have to learn to communicate daily with God, realize that only after you relinquish your will to God's will can you know peace. It is very much a one day at a time, with daily study of His word, keeping God first and foremost in your life. Don't be focused on others faults, look to Jesus as the one with all the answers to every problem you might encounter. Be a bold witness to others, that is one of the powers the Holy Ghosts gives you. When needed discuss your problems with your pastor for they watch for your soul. (Hebrews 13:17 KJV)

Here are some scripture that helps explain the salvation plan Jesus gave us:

" I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish." Luke 13:3 (KJV)

" For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death." 2 Corinthians 7:10 (KJV)

"He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned." Mark 16:16 (KJV)

"Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God." John 3:5 (KJV)

"For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence." Acts 1:5 (KJV)

"Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life." Romans 6:4 (KJV)

"Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:" Matthew 28:19 (KJV)

"Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole." Acts 4:10 (KJV)

"Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved." Acts 4:12 (KJV)

"Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call." Acts 2:38-39 (KJV)

Repent= saying your sorry and ask for forgiveness then TURN AWAY from sin (Death, a death of an old life/of sin)
*If you are really sorry and turn away from sin, resolving never to do those things again, you are ready for baptism.
Baptism= full water immersion (Burial, you are buried with Christ, born again of the water)
*Baptism comes from the Greek word baptizo, which means to dip, plunge, immerse, or be overwhelmed.
Holy Ghost= Baptism of the Holy Ghost, The Comforter, Spirit of Truth (Resurrection, you are now born again of the Spirit)
*The baptism of the Holy Ghost, with the evidence of speaking other tongues, identifies us with Christ in His resurrection. (Romans 6:5 & Romans 8:11 KJV)

After following the steps of salvation (Death, Burial, & Resurrection) that Jesus gave us we are to strive for perfection, we are given the tools to accomplish that by the infilling of the Holy Ghost, and with the Holy Ghost we have the power to overcome the world as Jesus did. It is evident that man must become holy in order to attain fellowship with God. Holiness is a condition of the heart. It is a sum total of our attitudes and consecrations toward God. Therefore we must take heed of our attitudes and motives as we strive to be holy. We must manifest Christ-like attitudes.
*Just as Jesus Christ experienced death, burial, and resurrection in providing our salvation, we experience a type of death, burial, and resurrection in receiving salvation through the steps of repentance, baptism in Jesus name, and the infilling of the Holy Ghost. We are "in Christ" (1 Corinthians 12:13 KJV) and Christ is "in us" (Colossians 1:27 KJV). What a glorious privilege to know the truth!

Thank you for taking the time to read and I hope bringing forth these scriptures can help bring some understanding.
Take Care and God Bless!

You said it all,RaneyMarie...you took the words right out of my mouth!! God bless you

Cobus · Oct 9, 2013

Chinekwu I see in your doctrine there are TWO BAPTISMS.... But God says there is ONE... now which one is it God says ONE BAPTISM? What Baptism is the ONE BAPTISM God speaks of in Eph 4?

Can you please share how this ONE BAPTISM God speaks of happens. And WHEN does it happen? Or WHO baptizes with what on this ONE BAPTISM...

If we NEED to be dumped in a lake or sea or pool or river... how many people did Jesus SUBMERGED in water? NONE! Nope my dear Crocs are made to dunk people in water.... God baptize in HIS NAME... ONE NAME of the FATHER YHVH, the SON Yeshuah Ha Messheach, and the Holy Spirit (Christ Jesus) In ONE NAME.... In Truth, in LIVING WATER, and IN WORD... ONE PLACE GOD BAPTIZES.... IN HIS WORD!!!!

Let me assure you if God baptize you in HIS WORD, the person that comes out from that LIVING WATER, is transformed in the EXACT IMAGE of Christ Jesus.... As Holy as Powerful and as GODLY FAMILY as Jesus Himself was and is... That is a BAPTISM to go too! And it is free and it happens EVERYWHERE ALL THE TIME....

Hope you go for the BAPTISM IN THE NAME OF THE LORD JESUS CHRIST.... Jesus is THE WORD OF GOD... His Truth is HIS SON AND HIS WORD.... BE baptized in it... HAVE QUIET TIME WITH GOD IN HIS WORD AND HE WILL SUBMERGE YOU IN TRUTH... WOW!

Bookends · Oct 9, 2013

Cobus said:

I answered this many times over. God defines a saint when He sees the blood of Jesus as the substitute for their sin. Then a saint goes on to be perfected, this is the work of the Holy Spirit in the Saint guiding them to righteousness, an on going process where we learn to be obedient, our transformation. Transformation is gradual change as God works within their life on earth. Saints are not fully sinless until we are glorified at Christ's 2nd coming in which we will receive a incorruptible body.

Bookends · Oct 9, 2013

Romans 9:31-32

[SUP]31 [/SUP]but Israel [Cobus], pursuing the law of righteousness, has not attained to the law of righteousness.[SUP][/SUP] [SUP]32 [/SUP]Why? Because they [he] did not seek it by faith, but as it were, by the works of the law.[SUP][/SUP] For they [he] stumbled at that stumbling stone.

Cobus · Oct 9, 2013

Bookie, I have ALWAYS shown you the verses when I make a statement. I would like you to show me where God looks at the BLOOD of JESUS! Please just show me the verse... You say God defines a saint when He sees the blood of Jesus... I ask why should God look at the blood of Jesus if God has the power to MAKE a saint? All God has to do to make a saint, is : MAKE A SAINT... God can seperate a man from sin and sin from a man IN A SECOND... and Look God just made a saint.... His Son already paid the dept, so all God has to do is SEPERATE the man from sinand sin from the man....

Why look at the blood? God DOES not look at the blood, he LOOKS AT THE HEART AND SOUL OF A MAN,,,, NO BLOOD of Jesus even CLOSE.... This thing of God looking at the blood of His son is so twisted... Where is it in the Bible! PLEASE show me. GOD LOOKING AT THE BLOOD AND THEN DEFINE A SAINT.... MAn the Saint is CLEANSED by the Blood. ALREADY clean... God does not wear blood-glasses... I CANNOT find that scripture and I searched for a whole ten seconds, before i realized.... WHY WOULD GOD NEED BLOOD GLASSES? HE does not have to wear HOLY Glasses to see a sinner holy, just make the sinner holy. And finish!

Bookie do NOT RUN like other people... SHow me the verse where God looks at the BLOOD off Jesus.... I have ALWAYS shown you the verse when I make statement... Come on stand up for the BLOOD of JESUS GOGGLE people!

Cobus · Oct 9, 2013

Bookends said:

First mistake.... Cobus does not pursue the LAW of RIGHTEOUSNESS, but the SPIRIT OF RIGHTEOUSNESS... And the SPIRIT ALWAYS ATTAIN the righteousness of God wich is WAY higher than the LAW WAY higher...

I seek it not by faith, but by a HUNGER and a THIRST that GOD HAS IMPLANTED IN ME... If you want to call this hunger and thirst FAITH, Good call it faith... But GD GAURENTEES that .... Blessed are the ones that hunger and thirst after righteousness: FOR THEY SHALL BE FILLED...Cobus SHALL BE FILLED, God Already decided that.

God says I SHALL NEVER STUMBLE NEVER... God called me to be RIGHTEOUS and the THIRST AND THE HUNGER FOR IT SHALL BE FILLED, and then I gave DILIGENCE TO MAKE MY CALLING AND ELECTION SURE: FOR IF I DO THESE THINGS, I SHALL NEVER FALL!!!! Read it in 2 Peter 1:10.... NEVER FALL, NEVER STUMBLE.... NEVER BE TOSSED TO AND FRO BY FALSE DOCTRINE TEACHINGS AND TEACHERS.... God's Kingdom is PERFECT and SOLID and SECURE and HOLY and IN HIS CONTROL. Even when I join it, IT WILL STILL BE PERFECT.

Bookie it is a great Gospel is it not?

notuptome · Oct 9, 2013

Cobus said:

So how do you reconcile what is written here in ch 3 with what was written in ch 1? John says if we say we have no sin we are liars. Believers sin but confess those sins to Christ and seek forgiveness. Ch 3 describes those who sin and express no guilt over the sin. We are not like Cain who would not repent when God confronted him about his sin.

If you are going to cite scripture make certain you understand the context of what is being taught or you will risk error. You do seem to get things wrong because you do not study what you say. You rely on the word perfect in an English context when many times in the bible you must know the underlying context. Perfect is not always without fault or flaw but mature or complete. If you are going to pose as a teacher learn the subject material in depth or sit back and let another teach while you learn.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

duewell · Oct 9, 2013

even the most terrible sinful things that can happen, can still be used by God to bring about what God desires from the situation. even when you are surrounded by a sinful society that puts you to death, God can bring about what God desires from the situation. that's one power of God. to take a sinful action and cause it to serve Gods desires.

the people who crucified Jesus were sinning. they were certainly not trying to help God. yet all of their sinful actions that led Jesus to being crucified only cemented salvation for humanity. the sinful actions of those around Christ and the things they did to the son of God, did not work against Gods plan, it fulfilled it.

its like playing chess against God. it cant be done. before you have moved a single piece any action you might take has already been planned for and countered. even if you try to cheat at the game,"sinning". God is still going to win the game. anything we do can be adapted into Gods plan. regardless of our intentions. God knew adam and eve would eat from the tree before it was even planted. salvation for eating from the tree was planned before the tree was even planted.

those who deny God and revel in their sins are in for a rude awakening. they will see how everything they have done still serves God. because they are unrepentant of their sins they are punished. those who accept God and are repentant of their sins, will see how everything they have done still serves God. because they are repentant of their sins they are forgiven.

God can do all things, no purpose of God can be thwarted. i often end my threads with mark 4 v 11-13
lets take a quick look at verse 12

12 so that they may be ever seeing but never perceiving and ever hearing but never understanding otherwise they might turn and be forgiven!

thats the kingdom of God, every person who has born and died on earth has always experienced the kingdom of God. they do not perceive or understand it because they are blinded by sin. they take bits and pieces of it to their garden for their own sinful purpose never understanding what they are eating. when we confess and ask Jesus for help, everything changes. the chocolate i made for myself now has become a new taste, it taste of the chocolate made for Gods purpose. then we understand we never even had chocolate before. never heard a song before never read a book before never experienced anything before we asked Jesus for help. once we do all those past things we thought we experienced take on new meaning and understanding.

imagine my surprise as a child when i learned that kermit the frog wasnt talking to me it was jim henson. imagine my shock as an adult when i learned that jim henson wasnt talking to me it was the Holy Spirit. then i heard it in everyone and everything around me. regardless of what the artist thought they were singing about became a new song sung by the Spirit serving Gods purpose in understanding things instead of what it used to be. serving my purpose of understanding.

duewell
mark 4 v 11-13

JDecree · Oct 9, 2013

Cobus said:

Your doctrine kills faith by telling us all "YOU ARE NOT THERE YET! IT WILL BE THE HARDEST THING YOU EVER DO AND YOU MIGHT NOT MAKE IT IN THE END! ONLY TIME WILL TELL!

" How is that supposed to cause me to be filled with joy in the LORD all my days? How is that a good news message? It kills faith by putting us ALL in a state of condemnation until that day you speak of is achieved. I dont know about you but that sounds pretty dire and hopeless to me. You might want to be careful leaving the house...or going down some stairs...or eating too many greasy cheeseburgers in case you die before you reach that perfection.

It goes like this:
The bad news: you have broken all of God's laws and deserve to be punished.
The good news: Jesus came and lived a perfect life and fulfilled all of God's commandments and became sin on the cross so that any who believe in Him can have eternal life and spend eternity with Him in His kingdom.
More bad news: but you must become as perfect as Him before He will allow you to enter. Nobody will be able to help you get there because there are only about 20 people who have been made perfect in the world right now and they are hiding. Your entire family will perish. You *might* make it though. Maybe. Every pastor, every church goer, every reformer, everybody will go to Hell.
BUT ARENT YOU EXCITED??!!! NOW GO AND FULFIL THE COMMAND TO REJOICE IN THE LORD in spite of the fact that everything around you, and even you yourself are dead and condemned at the moment!

Cobus said:

So you experienced a bad church where they were mean to somebody and therefore nobody is a Christian. Sounds like an atheist argument to me. Many churches are a mess. Not a big news flash. Spend an hour looking just at the first page of topics on the bible study forum here.

Cobus said:

Nobody says He CANT remove sin from you, the disagreement is on WHEN! You ask "why would you not want that??" who says I dont? If I didnt want that I wouldnt be talking to you. I AM SICK OF MYSELF. Every day I hurt somebody. Every day I sit here in my stupid little office and do nothing to help people. Tempted every day to go back to smoking. To lust. You ask me to somehow just attain the very thing I have been hoping for for 5 years. Your message changes nothing about how I will live. It would be a gift of God which I cant make Him give. Why has He not given it to you yet? WHAT ARE YOU DOING WRONG? WHY DONT YOU JUST HAVE IT YET? You are 56 years old. Not that much time left my friend.

Cobus said:

Mmm-hmm the classic means of manipulation. Place your beliefs on par with Jesus' teachings then imply that by rejecting you, I am then rejecting the LORD. I have seen it 100 times. I know you dont realize you are doing it and I dont hold you accountable. If I sound angry about all of this, I am. I AM TIRED. Everybody has their little answers that all conflict and I need the truth. My family is perishing, I am. I need to know how to help them. Please LORD Jesus PLEASE help us.

Cobus said:

There it is again. MIGHT be. Well ok I'll just wait in sheer terror and see some day. Maybe I will have lived my whole life and died and be standing before God before I will have that answer. I'll just wait here. FUNNY, I dont see that in my bible. I see men WHO STILL NEEDED TO GROW IN HOLINESS speaking of how they HAVE eternal life and how the HAVE BEEN saved.

Cobus said:

That will never stop. That is all it has been from the beginning. First it was the sabbath. Then it was unclean meats. Then it was the feasts and tzit tzits and growing my beard out and building a suka. Then it was calvinism. Then it was sinless perfection. Good thing I am on CC to clear everything right up. :-/

Anyway I thank you for expending so much energy trying to help but you will find it very lonely on your path. MAYBE we will meet in His Kingdom some day. Nobody knows but Him.

Cobus · Oct 9, 2013

Roger, The whole Bible has only a discription of TWO COCEPTS... One is telling you where the unsaved go and what they do. And the other CONTEXT is to show how God saves, and what these people do and where they go... There are only TWO roads in the Bible. The one is a cotext (content of information) of how to get to hell.... And the OTHER is the WAY God saves ALL from going to hell. This content of information (context) describes God's will.

You ask how 1 John 1 and 1 John 3 comes together. Oh thank you for asking. And I will show you what God showed me in 1 John 1 with reference to 1 John 3....

1 John 1: 8 9 and 10... Please just remember 1 John 1 starts with this statement... that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ.

Here John has ALREADY put himself and the other Godly men in the catagory of the people BORN OF GOD. If John says his fellowship is with the Father, and with His Son, then the Father and the son is IN John, and John in them. No person will be in the Father and the Son, if that person is not made PERFECTLY one WITH GOD. And ALL who is made perfectly ONE with God is made so by the ONE SEED, ONE HOLY SPIRIT, that God PUTS IN THEM ALL, and THAT SPIRIT CANNOT SIN, IT IS THE HOLY SPIRIT.... That is why God ADDED the TRULY.

If you want me to show you how SPECIAL a Godly Job it was to make John and all the others in the “OUR FELLOWSHIP” It is the MESSAGE I am trying to relate to you for a few years now, the SAME GOOD MESSAGE Jesus taught, and ALL THESE FELOLWSHIP people taught, I will put it in two little words .... BE PERFECT!

With all my heart I believe ALL who have TRULY FELLOWSHIP WITH THE FATHER AND THE SON, ARE BORN OF GOD! And because of this they CANNOT SIN! Jesus said in John 17... That they may be PERFECTLY ONE, they in me and I in them... John 17. John is IN CHRIST, and CHRIST (The SEED) is IN HIM.... And in them is NO SIN! That is why John wrote... THAT WE MAY ALSO HAVE FELLOWSHIP WITH HIM (THEM) AND CHRIST...

Now that we know, John is already one with the SEED in him and BORN of GOD, John is going to share with us HOW WE DO GET TO HAVE FELLOWSHIP...

1 John 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
We already know John CANNOT sin so why would he make this statement. Of coarse John has no sin. He is already forgiven, and sin removed from him and BORN OF GOD and CANNOT sin. BUT! If John does what EVERY other Godly man did, Jesus, Paul, Peter, James, ALL Godly men, did one this right through the Bible.... They humbled THEMSELVES to the LEVEL of the people that they preached too! God , OUR GREAT GOD, humbled HIMSELF TO BE A MAN OF FLESH to bring us this MESSAGE I AM TEACHING YOU TODAY! God humbled HIMSELF to be man and say... BE PERFECT! And we want to throw it back in His face? WOW!

John ALREADY made distinction between himself and the ones that HAVE FELLOWSHIP WITH GOD, and the ones HE PREACH TOO... He said THAT YOU ALSO MAY HAVE FELLOWSHIP WITH US... So the WE is not as you and SEPECIALLY “ETERNAL GREATFUL” believes... This WE IS HUMBLING and includes the ones that still NEED TO FELLOWSHIP WITH JOHN AND GOD...

Well here is John the BORN OF GOD humbling himself to say... Not one of you (us or we, if he humbles himself to their level) can say he has no sin, so he has no need to do the next verse... 9.

9. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

AH!!!! Why do John have to confess sin if he already has fellowship? In 1 John 3 he is going to make the BOLD Truth in the fellowship with God there IS NO SIN COMMITTED... That will contradict ALL he wrote... So AGIAN, this WE is for the ones that HAS NOT YET GOT FELLOWSHIP, those that still SIN...

BUT now we are ging to bring 1 John 3 in as well for ALL of 1 John 1... If we CONFESS our sin... Is this not what the WHOLE Bible teaches how we get RID OF THE SIN IN OUR LIVES? Show me repentance WITHOUT confession... There is none... Confession is a STEP OF REPENTANCE... And REPENTANCE CLEANSE US... PURIFIES us... Look what 1 John 3 says.. And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure. We can ONLY purify through the BLOOD of Jesus... REPENT! Confess, and get purified! What is this hope in us? To be made to have FELLOWSHIP with God.... To be SONS OF GOD! ONE WITH GOD. Do you see how 1 John 1 and 1 John 3 comes together? Same this said in BOTH CHAPTERS...

So now we do CONFESS and what happens.... GOD CLEANSE US FROM ALL UNRIGHTEOUSNESS! How ? Explained in 1 John 3.... All who has hope cleanse themselves as HE IS CLEAN, And hhow clean is that... EVEN AS HE IS PURE... AS CLEAN AS GOD... but does it STAY that clean or will we FALL AGAIN... NOPE... Jesus says He will FORGIVE, and HE WILL... 1 John 3:5... And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.

Jesus was manifested to TAKE AWAY OUR SIN, AND PUT US IN HIMSELF... AND LOOK!!!!!!!!!! IN HIM IS NO SIN.... Do you see that when Jesus forgives, HE TAKE AWAY AND PUT YOU IN HIM? FELLOWSHIP WITH HIM AND FATHER GOD, MEANSE IN US IS NO SIN, BECAUSE WE ARE IN HIM. And TRULY there are NO SIN IN HIM! AND ALSO NO SIN IN US... HIS SEED IS IN US! If we are PURE AS HE IS PURE. And we get that way to CONFESS!!!! AND HE FORGIVES AND CLEANSE!!!

Now the NEXT WE that John will use is ONLY THE ONES THAT ARE IN GOD!!!!! The ones that HAS FELLOWSHIP.... The ONES that did purify themselves as HE IS PURE.... and God ALLOWED THE PURE PERSON IN TO FELLOWSHIP.... This WE are WHOSOEVER IS BORN OF GOD... IT IS NOT A PERSON THAT STILL NEED TO CONFESS!!!!!

This verse is for the ones that HAS FELLOWSHIP WITH GOD... verse 10...
If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

Now that these people are TRULY BORN OF GOD and they CANNOT sin, they speak to people that still has no fellowship, do you think these non fellowship sinners will notice the HOLY SINLESS LIFE these holy people live? YES they will NEVER see them sin, and they will ask.... DO YOU SIN, HAVE YOU EVER SINNED? Did John sin, EVER? YES! God says ALL have sinned and fall short of the GLORY... but John is now in that GLORY, He has fellowship IN GLORY with GOD. So that simply means John did what HE PREACH NOW.... John did sin and he would not say... I have not sinned, so I need not confess... John did confess and God did forgive and cleanse John from all unrightousness, and God did take away his sin and God did put His Seed in John in the place of sin. And yet John had sinned before all this. So John CANNOT SAY HE HAVE NOT SINNED.... And look... God’s WORD IS IN JOHN... What is God’s WORD.... GOD SAID IN THE BEGINNING WAS THE WORD AND THE WORD WAS GOD... God is in JOHN!

Did 1 John 1 and 1 John 3 come together for you now my friend. I pray God will REVEAL this to you. Love you my friend, and the ONLY reason I do this, is to encourage you to BELIEVE God still make people ONE WITH HIM! If that is not perfection here on earth there is no perfection here on earth. But if God do make us One with Him, how can God still be pure, if we are the sin in Him? So god CANNOT allow a sinner into Him, then GOD will lie to say.... THERE IS NO SIN IN HIM... That is why God FIRST cleanse us FROM ALL UNRIGHTEOUSNESS... SIN IS unrighteousness... And God says... Those that are righteous are righteous as HE IS RIGHTOUES, and he just said IN HIM IS NO SIN! Then ther is ASLO NO SIN IN THEM THAT HAVE FELLOWSHIP........

RickShafer · Oct 9, 2013

Yea.....grace equals salvation.....what's the prob.?
- - Unless you are claiming the reactionary works of a race(human); who are so totally fallen from the holiness of God, but that they somehow could right themselves by their own doing. - But then, that's not grace. (That's works)

Cobus · Oct 10, 2013

JDecree, I do not know how to break up your post as you do mine, it works well... So I will just have to do it my old fashioned way and try to answer you fully.

It was NEVER my intention to hurt any person with what I believe. But what if my salvation is in the fact that I have to PREACH 1 JOHN 3:9 to the whole world? What if preaching what I believe is the SMALL THING God trusted me with? God says if I am not true to the SMALL things he trust me with how will I be true to the BIG THINGS? What if God gave me this message to FAITHFULLY preach, UNTIL THE END, and THEN HE WILL SAVE ME? Would you still advize me to STOP because it hurts the sinners?

I will ask you this... Do you think My words to you HURT GOD? Do you think for me to STRONGLY say what GOD SAID IN HIS WORD will hurt God? If it does I am like Job.... MAY I RATHER NEVER HAVE BEEN BORN! But!!! What if I obey you, and start to lie again about the FAKE JOY AND PEACE I HAD IN THE CHURCH, and throw 1 John 3:9 out of my doctrine... Do you think I can continue in sin and still be OK FOR GOD! Sin was NEVER OK FOR GOD.... That is why HE JUSTIFIES US.... TO GET RID OF SIN IN US. But you do not believe this do you? You think God only will remove you from sin and sin from you in the AFTER LIFE....

Now there is NO proof of that in the Bible! There is NO proof that God doe the seperation in the AFTERLIFE. It is done here, BY US! Not by God! Seperation of GOOD and EVIL is done here and WE DO THE SEPERATION... It is OUR Choice.... God gives us a gate to pass OUT!

Here is the TRUTH and you will SEE it for the FIRST TIME MAYBE, but here is the TRUTH.... WE ARE ALL IN THE CIRCLE OF SIN!!!!! ALL OF US... but we do not HAVE TO REMAIN THERE!!!!! God gives a WAY OUT OF SIN.

A vision I had explains it all!!!!!
I saw a huge circle... life on earth and al people in this sinful world.... Then there are these MANY GATES that are the peramiter of the circle.... Churches of men.... All the world churches... with huge billboards and advertising their Gospel to GOD. I remembered the tall man in a grey suit entering into one of these gates.... FULL GOSPEL OF JESUS was on the big bord of the church. Written in big white letters with a dove flying over the cross..... So this man entered all clean and spic and span polished... Then I looked as others go into other gates...

Walking through the croud.. millions of people I saw the man in the grey suit FALL BACK in the ring... Back where HE STARTED.... Oh he cleaned his suit and comb his hair and then wetn into another gate, to FALL BACK in the circle again....
Then I saw this old wooden gate. Small and narrow and not even noticable if you do not SEEK gates... I saw a man walk in there. He was just a normal man and as I could see, a sad figure.... This man went in and I spend much time seeking the man, t see if HE FELL BACK IN THE CIRCLE.... then I recognised theperson that also watched the man enter... I walked up to this person and asked him... Did you see that man again? And he said... Oh I saw a few people enter into that GATE but not one of them ever returned... Then he said MANY try to enter but few succeed... I looked at the MAN SPEAKING TO ME... And HE did not BELONG IN THAT CIRCLE....

As he walked off, I suddenly realized... That man came a LONG way from this gate to LEAD ME TO THE GATE... And I knew.... HE IS THE LORD JESUS CHRIST. He came a long way through the millions of people to LEAD ME to this gate.... I am standing by the gate, and I wonder.... SHOULD I ENTER? Should I try! Why do I not just walk up and open the gate and ENTER....

Do you see the WHOLE GOSPEL of Jesus in this? I hope so, because I know, if I enter into that gate, I will NEVER FALL BACK IN THE RING... NEVER! Oh God may send me bac to bring others to the gate, but will it REALLY be me? Or will it be the JESUS IN ME...

That is how FINAL the seperation is.... That gate is not in the AFTER LIFE, It is a GATE out of this SINFUL LIFE, into A HOLY LIFE! I believe this with my WHOLE HEART... That Jesus that came to CALL me and LEAD me, is NOT THE ONLY ONE IN THE CROWD....

Oh the Word of God is so deep and so GODLY with MANY EAVENLY WISDOM.... How will you and I EVER get to spiritual things is the FLESH THINGS like sin in us are our main concern? My friend let us just give God the GLORY that we do talk to eachother.....
One of my closest fellow disciples just came to my office for a cup of coffee and a chat about God and His Word... And I told him about you and our friendship. And this vision of mine... And I had this feeling that I MAY NOT STOP TO TEACH YOU ABOUT PERFECTION... You asked...COBUS WHY ARE YOU NOT THERE YET YOURSELVE... I had an answer, but I did not want it to be ARROGENT or that i think HIHLY OF MYSELF... but God said I should tell you why, and then Niel came and said EXACTLY what God said.... Confirmation?, Well I said to Niel, thank you for being OBEDIENT and came over for coffee and said what you had to say about me and JDecree...

My friend if I had passed through the gate, there would not have been a Cobus to talk too today... But if God wants you to hear this message he would have sent another one with the SAME MESSAGE, so obviously you are to be introduced to the TRUTH! I think you should see me as a BLESSING and not as a CURSE... I tell you what GOD TOLD ME! I have not ventured one millimeter out of God’s Truth. You know Jdecree, i aid to Niel.... If only the man can look in my eyes and heart and soul.... I wish we will meet and walk a ways with eachother.... It will be like two men FOLOWING JESUS...

JDECREE! I really am sorry if my Godly hope on HOLINESS hurts you! And if I encourage you to also make SOLID your HIGH CALLING in Christ... You know Paul also said... I PREACH YOU THE TRUTH, WHY DO YOU CONSIDER ME THE ENEMY? ... My friend it is TRUE... GOD WANTS US PRFECT RIGHT HERE ON EARTH... Mat 5:48 is enough Bible to confirm this...

The thing is this... Is this too big for you to beleive? I do not think so. I think the HATE you have for sin, is only the beginnig of God’s GLORY IN YOU!
Let me leave you with this one thought.... Jesus said the Glory God has given Him HE GAVE TO US.... how HOLY, how PERFECT and how GODLY is that glory? Remember GLORY is a GODLY GLORIFICATION... how Godly was Jesus in the FLESH? How GODLY will he be IN YOUR FLESH?

All we have to do is CHANGE PLACES WITH HIM... And that is what we should talk about, and if we do sin, let us CONFESS to eachother and we pray for God’s forgiveness, and MOVE ON!!!!

Let us start our OWN CHURCH... One that TRULY WANTS TO HAVE FELLOWSHIP WITH FATHER AND SON! And let us TRUST HIM with the CLEANSE OF ALL UNRIGHTEOUSNESS... but we CONFESS EVERY SIN TO EACHOTHER and let us walk worthy of the vacation wherewith we are called...

Let us do this with lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love. Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.... I know God ants this, and we can be JOINED PERFECTLY together in HIS BODY for HIS GLORY...

Please Lord Jesus HELP US AMEN!

Bookends · Oct 10, 2013

Cobus said:

Cobus, I do not run and hide, I'm a family man and I have a local church family and life thus this site is the least of priorities. So if I don't ever respond to you it's not in flight do to the lack of a scriptural foundation.

It is the power in the blood that saves us, meaning that through Christ's sacrifice brings atonement. Yes God looks at the heart, but it's the heart of man to accept the free gift, which is the atonement of our transgression. God is reconciled to man by His son the mediator and it is Christ's sacrifice on the cross that qualifies Him for that position.

1) 1 Peter 1:2,
[SUP]2 [/SUP]elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, in sanctification of the Spirit, for obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ:Grace to you and peace be multiplied.

We (God's people) are elect, or chosen and separated or set apart for 2 basic functions on earth, 1) to live in obedience and 2) to spread the gospel and make disciples, by what means do we is this accomplished? Peter makes it clear is by the sprinkling of Christ's blood, meaning His atonement.

2)Isaiah 53:5
[SUP]5 [/SUP]But He was wounded for our transgressions,
He was bruised for our iniquities;
The chastisement for our peace was upon Him,
And by His stripes we are healed.

Isaiah makes it clear we are healed by what Christ did on the Cross, not by what God does within us. We are healed by Christ sacrificial atonement, not by our complete sanctification.

3)John 6
[SUP]53 [/SUP]Then Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no life in you. [SUP]54 [/SUP]Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. [SUP]55 [/SUP]For My flesh is food indeed[SUP][/SUP] and My blood is drink indeed. [SUP]56 [/SUP]He who eats My flesh and drinks My blood abides in Me, and I in him. [SUP]57 [/SUP]As the living Father sent Me, and I live because of the Father, so he who feeds on Me will live because of Me. [SUP]58 [/SUP]This is the bread which came down from heaven—not as your fathers ate the manna, and are dead. He who eats this bread will live forever.”

Do you literally drink His blood? Does Christ come down just for you and pours His blood into your cup so you can drink it? No, this is Christ's body broken for us for the forgiveness of our sins. Those who partake, who believe into His sacrifice will be saved, all spoken in the metaphor of a physical act, eating. You become what you eat, what you eat, take, becomes a part of you, it is processed in you and becomes a part of you.

4)Romans 3
[SUP]25 [/SUP]whom God set forth as a propitiation by His blood, through faith, to demonstrate His righteousness, because in His forbearance God had passed over the sins that were previously committed,

How did the Israelites escape the last Egyptian plaque Cobus, the angel of death saw the blood of the lamb on the door. Do you get it yet? Did God save them because they where sinless, fully sanctified, No...But God did separate them from Egypt and made a people out them? This is a type or example of what Christ blood does to the saints today, we are separted, set apart, sanctified from the world and it's ways by His BLOOD! I pray for you Cobus, I'm out of time, but could give 100s of examples and scripture.

Bookends · Oct 10, 2013

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BjIYL7GBHZQ" target="_blank">[video=youtube;BjIYL7GBHZQ]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BjIYL7GBHZQ[/video]
Give praise and glory all to God for what He did.

Cobus · Oct 10, 2013

Bookie I do not see where you see the GOD LOOKS AT THE BLOOD? Why look at something that HAS BEEN DONE TO GET THE PERSON IN GOD...

Boy do you read alot of things in verse that tells us how God GETS us clean.... Let me ask you this... Jesus says no one comes to the FATHER except by Him! Let us say you are now PASSED through His blood and you ARE WITH THE FATHER.... Is the BLOOD now BEHIND you... You are now snactified, purified, justified and Glorified... Is there ANY more blood coming your way? You are now IN GOD.. why would God look at the BLOOD if you are IN HIM... Some sau through the blood others say at the blood... Man there is NO verse that says GOD LOOKS AT THE BLOOD... NONE!!!

If we call up a lot of verses and we teist what they ACTUALLY say, we can Easily say you have to gamble to revieve the blood of Jesus... Did the guards not toss for his bloodstained cloth? So we have to gamble to attain the blood.... See how easy it is to proof rubbish with the Word...

Come on if God LOOKS at the Blood, He would have said so. He did not say so, and that is why I cannot EVER utter the words... God looks at the Blood of Jesus to define us as saints.... Saints are SAINTS because Jesus was manifested to TAKE away their sin. Only people whose sin are TAKEN away God will declare SAINTS... God CANNOT declare a sinner a Saint, that would be a lie, and we know God CANNOT lie.

This is the wonderful thing about God... He says... PUT THE SPIRITS to the TEST... If God calls a person a saint I bet my whole life, you will find that person without SIN... And God will know BETTER than us what is a saint... This twisted version of SAINTS you try to sell as saints is NOT in the Bible.

Look at a deacon... God says he should be TRIED and JUDGED and he should have a pure conscience... Only the BLOOD of Jesus can was so clean... but!!!! To stay that clean is ANOTHER matter. Why would god have people JUDGED by the church before they are appointed?

They should KNOW the mystery of the faith.... You see what I mean... they have to have FAITH and have the mystery on a pure conscience.... PURE conscience? OR FAKE PURE? Come on admit it GOD CAN ACTUALLY MAKE SAINTS.... Morally blameless, and Spiritually pure... MOST HOLY ONE...

Does HOLY not mean WITHOUT SIN? Why can’t a person that attend a church not admit, that God is HOLY and so is ALL HIS CHILDREN... God says IN TRUE HOINESS...

Tell me straight.... ARE THERE SIN IN TRUE HOLINESS?

notuptome · Oct 10, 2013

Cobus said:

Roger, The whole Bible has only a discription of TWO COCEPTS... One is telling you where the unsaved go and what they do. And the other CONTEXT is to show how God saves, and what these people do and where they go... There are only TWO roads in the Bible. The one is a cotext (content of information) of how to get to hell.... And the OTHER is the WAY God saves ALL from going to hell. This content of information (context) describes God's will.

You ask how 1 John 1 and 1 John 3 comes together. Oh thank you for asking. And I will show you what God showed me in 1 John 1 with reference to 1 John 3....

1 John 1: 8 9 and 10... Please just remember 1 John 1 starts with this statement... that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ.

Here John has ALREADY put himself and the other Godly men in the catagory of the people BORN OF GOD. If John says his fellowship is with the Father, and with His Son, then the Father and the son is IN John, and John in them. No person will be in the Father and the Son, if that person is not made PERFECTLY one WITH GOD. And ALL who is made perfectly ONE with God is made so by the ONE SEED, ONE HOLY SPIRIT, that God PUTS IN THEM ALL, and THAT SPIRIT CANNOT SIN, IT IS THE HOLY SPIRIT.... That is why God ADDED the TRULY.

If you want me to show you how SPECIAL a Godly Job it was to make John and all the others in the “OUR FELLOWSHIP” It is the MESSAGE I am trying to relate to you for a few years now, the SAME GOOD MESSAGE Jesus taught, and ALL THESE FELOLWSHIP people taught, I will put it in two little words .... BE PERFECT!

With all my heart I believe ALL who have TRULY FELLOWSHIP WITH THE FATHER AND THE SON, ARE BORN OF GOD! And because of this they CANNOT SIN! Jesus said in John 17... That they may be PERFECTLY ONE, they in me and I in them... John 17. John is IN CHRIST, and CHRIST (The SEED) is IN HIM.... And in them is NO SIN! That is why John wrote... THAT WE MAY ALSO HAVE FELLOWSHIP WITH HIM (THEM) AND CHRIST...

Now that we know, John is already one with the SEED in him and BORN of GOD, John is going to share with us HOW WE DO GET TO HAVE FELLOWSHIP...

1 John 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
We already know John CANNOT sin so why would he make this statement. Of coarse John has no sin. He is already forgiven, and sin removed from him and BORN OF GOD and CANNOT sin. BUT! If John does what EVERY other Godly man did, Jesus, Paul, Peter, James, ALL Godly men, did one this right through the Bible.... They humbled THEMSELVES to the LEVEL of the people that they preached too! God , OUR GREAT GOD, humbled HIMSELF TO BE A MAN OF FLESH to bring us this MESSAGE I AM TEACHING YOU TODAY! God humbled HIMSELF to be man and say... BE PERFECT! And we want to throw it back in His face? WOW!

John ALREADY made distinction between himself and the ones that HAVE FELLOWSHIP WITH GOD, and the ones HE PREACH TOO... He said THAT YOU ALSO MAY HAVE FELLOWSHIP WITH US... So the WE is not as you and SEPECIALLY “ETERNAL GREATFUL” believes... This WE IS HUMBLING and includes the ones that still NEED TO FELLOWSHIP WITH JOHN AND GOD...

Well here is John the BORN OF GOD humbling himself to say... Not one of you (us or we, if he humbles himself to their level) can say he has no sin, so he has no need to do the next verse... 9.

9. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

AH!!!! Why do John have to confess sin if he already has fellowship? In 1 John 3 he is going to make the BOLD Truth in the fellowship with God there IS NO SIN COMMITTED... That will contradict ALL he wrote... So AGIAN, this WE is for the ones that HAS NOT YET GOT FELLOWSHIP, those that still SIN...

BUT now we are ging to bring 1 John 3 in as well for ALL of 1 John 1... If we CONFESS our sin... Is this not what the WHOLE Bible teaches how we get RID OF THE SIN IN OUR LIVES? Show me repentance WITHOUT confession... There is none... Confession is a STEP OF REPENTANCE... And REPENTANCE CLEANSE US... PURIFIES us... Look what 1 John 3 says.. And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.We can ONLY purify through the BLOOD of Jesus... REPENT! Confess, and get purified! What is this hope in us? To be made to have FELLOWSHIP with God.... To be SONS OF GOD! ONE WITH GOD. Do you see how 1 John 1 and 1 John 3 comes together? Same this said in BOTH CHAPTERS...

So now we do CONFESS and what happens.... GOD CLEANSE US FROM ALL UNRIGHTEOUSNESS! How ? Explained in 1 John 3.... All who has hope cleanse themselves as HE IS CLEAN, And hhow clean is that... EVEN AS HE IS PURE... AS CLEAN AS GOD... but does it STAY that clean or will we FALL AGAIN... NOPE... Jesus says He will FORGIVE, and HE WILL... 1 John 3:5... And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.

Jesus was manifested to TAKE AWAY OUR SIN, AND PUT US IN HIMSELF... AND LOOK!!!!!!!!!! IN HIM IS NO SIN.... Do you see that when Jesus forgives, HE TAKE AWAY AND PUT YOU IN HIM? FELLOWSHIP WITH HIM AND FATHER GOD, MEANSE IN US IS NO SIN, BECAUSE WE ARE IN HIM. And TRULY there are NO SIN IN HIM! AND ALSO NO SIN IN US... HIS SEED IS IN US! If we are PURE AS HE IS PURE. And we get that way to CONFESS!!!! AND HE FORGIVES AND CLEANSE!!!

Now the NEXT WE that John will use is ONLY THE ONES THAT ARE IN GOD!!!!! The ones that HAS FELLOWSHIP.... The ONES that did purify themselves as HE IS PURE.... and God ALLOWED THE PURE PERSON IN TO FELLOWSHIP.... This WE are WHOSOEVER IS BORN OF GOD... IT IS NOT A PERSON THAT STILL NEED TO CONFESS!!!!!

This verse is for the ones that HAS FELLOWSHIP WITH GOD... verse 10...
If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

Now that these people are TRULY BORN OF GOD and they CANNOT sin, they speak to people that still has no fellowship, do you think these non fellowship sinners will notice the HOLY SINLESS LIFE these holy people live? YES they will NEVER see them sin, and they will ask.... DO YOU SIN, HAVE YOU EVER SINNED? Did John sin, EVER? YES! God says ALL have sinned and fall short of the GLORY... but John is now in that GLORY, He has fellowship IN GLORY with GOD. So that simply means John did what HE PREACH NOW.... John did sin and he would not say... I have not sinned, so I need not confess... John did confess and God did forgive and cleanse John from all unrightousness, and God did take away his sin and God did put His Seed in John in the place of sin. And yet John had sinned before all this. So John CANNOT SAY HE HAVE NOT SINNED.... And look... God’s WORD IS IN JOHN... What is God’s WORD.... GOD SAID IN THE BEGINNING WAS THE WORD AND THE WORD WAS GOD... God is in JOHN!

Did 1 John 1 and 1 John 3 come together for you now my friend. I pray God will REVEAL this to you. Love you my friend, and the ONLY reason I do this, is to encourage you to BELIEVE God still make people ONE WITH HIM! If that is not perfection here on earth there is no perfection here on earth. But if God do make us One with Him, how can God still be pure, if we are the sin in Him? So god CANNOT allow a sinner into Him, then GOD will lie to say.... THERE IS NO SIN IN HIM... That is why God FIRST cleanse us FROM ALL UNRIGHTEOUSNESS... SIN IS unrighteousness... And God says... Those that are righteous are righteous as HE IS RIGHTOUES, and he just said IN HIM IS NO SIN! Then ther is ASLO NO SIN IN THEM THAT HAVE FELLOWSHIP........

All that and you miss the most basic and simple context of all. It is not what you do but what Christ has done. When Jesus washed the feet of His disciples He illustrated the need for believers to daily confess their failings before the Lord. Treading through this world we become soiled and need the Lord to cleanse us from that filth that we accumulate. Jesus clearly taught that is was not a re-saving but a continuous renewing of the clean relationship that the new birth created.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

JDecree · Oct 10, 2013

Here is a question:

Cobus, when a person is water baptized, does it need to be done by a fully sanctified perfected saint in order to be effective?
What about the laying on of hands to recieve the Holy Spirit, does that need to be performed by a perfected saint?

If so we have a problem.

JDecree · Oct 10, 2013

Were Moses and Aaron perfected fully? If so, why were they commanded to offer sin offerings for themselves and the people of Israel over and over? If they were perfected, when does this take place in the bible? Surely somewhere the LORD would tell us something like, "By this time Moses was perfect and did not need to offer for his sins."

What do you make of the Hebrews quote that says if we sin wilfully after coming to a full knowledge of the truth? I would think in your point of view, this could only be referring to perfection, right? So then if we are one with Christ and perfect and incapable of sinning, then why would this need to be said? Do you think you can be both perfect and still possibly sin afterwards?

Cobus said:

No I wouldnt tell you to stop. Unless I knew for a fact it was wrong. I dont yet, but each day it becomes less logical. We serve a logical God.

You gotta think about this. This is what I am faced with everytime some self-ordained internet teacher opens his mouth:
1. If they are right and I reject it, what will happen?
2. If they are wrong and I believe it, what will happen?

Now I apply that to your teaching.
1. If you are right and I reject it, I am a dead man walking. Everyone I know WILL go to hell.
2. If you are wrong and I believe it, I will spend my whole life waiting for this one moment to happen that will never happen. I will be in a sense putting my faith in that experience happening so that I will be saved. I will be on my death bed thinking "wow, He never made me free like He promised" and all hope will be lost and I WILL go to hell.

This isnt a game and I know you dont see it as one either.

Cobus said:

Claiming you had a vision doesnt add any weight to what you say. Only YOU had that vision, I didnt. I once heard a story of a man who is now sinless aparently who said he died twice and went to hell and pleaded with God to let him go and God did(yeah because that is possible :-/ ). So now he comes back and his mission from God is to tell everybody they dont really know Christ and if they still sin they are not His. Then he tells the world that "thus sayeth the LORD" and said such and such events were going to happen...they didnt. Then the man says dont read your bible. Yet he says it all SO convincingly, with scripture and all. Surely he isnt lying? He even has a beard!

Cobus said:

(Gal 5:1) Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.
So final that Paul here warns US of going back to the old covenant even after being made free, thus, sinning and falling from grace and putting Christ to an open shame. But you say that once Christ has made us free from sin that there is no possiblity to sin because Christ is in us and us in Him.

Cobus said:

Yes this will lead to the truth one way or another. God can use anything to reveal the truth.

Again I dont see you as evil, a curse, a liar, or my enemy. I know what it is to believe something false and feel the drive to go and tell the whole world of the 'hidden truth' you have discovered. Whether your message is true or not, I cant say, but it would be hypocritical of me to judge you for speaking what you think is true when I have done the same.

Cobus said:

I know you are sincere my friend, I do. But sincerity does not equal truth.

Cobus · Oct 11, 2013

This might be long, but please read it with an open heart. If you cannot see the Truth in it at least see the love. I am sure you are not that blind, and if you are, LORD you can SHOW THEM... I do this because I am not called to please men, but to SERVE GOD! and ONLY HOLY PEOPLE CAN SERV GOD.

I AM NOT PERFECT, BUT I KNOW I WILL BE. Maybe at the end of this ESSAY! Or maybe NEVER, IT IS NOT IN MY HANDS, IT IS IN HIS. I am not even so BOLD as to say.. HE HAS TO MAKE ME PERFECT... but I am VERY SURE that ALL GOOD is from HIM and not FROM ME! I have faith IN HIM, and that HE COMMANDED ME TO BE PERFECT, HE SHALL DO SO! Nothing Satan says or preaches from ALL the worlds pulpits will change this verse, NOTHING.... Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

I will share this revelation... On this day Friday 11 October 2013, God showed me the differance between a PURE SPIRIT and THE HOLY SPIRIT... They are BOTH 100% WITHOUT SIN, but the one CAN GO BACK TO SIN, or START SINNING the OTHER CANNOT SIN, NOT 10 BILLION YEARS BACK, and NOT NOW, and NOT EVER! SPIRIT CANNOT SIN!

If you cannot understand this simple English, I can explian in AFRIKAANS... But this is quite simple to see if WE read the Bible and the words God spoke to man... The FIRST words God spoke to man after God took them out of Eden...

We talk about the sin of Adam so many times, but let us look at the two sons, Cain and Abel....

After they made their offering unto the LORD, the LORD had respect for Abel and his offering but not for Cain and his.... Now this is very weird, why would they OFFER if they had NO SIN... I hope you all know there WAS NO LAW TO BREAK, so THERE WAS NO SIN TO BE COMMITTED. God Himself says SIN IS TRANSGRESSING THE LAW... Or was there UNWRITTEN LAW?

Cain realised the LORD did not respect his offering, and he was VERY WROTH, and his countenance fallen... MOPED? Brooding inside and head hanging... Just about to throw a tantrim? Then the LORD notice this and said....
Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen? If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.

WOW! Did God really say this... Remember there was no HOLY SPIRIT BAPTISM, NO JESUS DIED ON THE CROSS, NOT EVEN A LAW OR COMMANDMENTS, NO OFFERINGS AND RULES TO THE OFFERINGS.... Why would the LORD RESPECT ONE OFFERING AND NOT THE OTHER... UNFAIR? IS GOD UNFAIR?

Forget ALL, focus on the POWER TO RULE OVER SIN... EVEN WHEN GOD REJECTED OR NOT RESPECTED CAIN'S OFFERING, CAIN STILL HAD THE POWER TO RULE OVER SIN... Sin was lieth at the door of Cains heart, and CAIN LET IT IN, NOT RULING OVER IT TO KEEP IT OUTSIDE.... Cain did not have to wonder what will happen, GOD TOLD HIM.... IF YOU DO WELL, SHALL THOU NOT BE ACCEPTED... AND THERE WAS NO LAW TO TELL CAIN HOW TO DO WELL.... YET THERE WAS SIN AT THE DOOR...

Is this not the same for EVERY PERSON HERE ON CC... Do we have to KNOW what is wrong by reading the LAW? And if we do sin, did we RULE over sin or did JUST AS CAIN did, NOT rule over sin? Hey I am sitting here and typing to you, and I can stand up here and go clobber this loudmouth man outside my office. Or I can stand up here and go try my luck with that "sexy" little thing opposite the street... Even though I am married... Oh, sin do lieth at the door, but I choose to educate my brothers and sisters, that GOD MADE THEM POWERFUL ENOUGH TO RULE OVER SIN.

Satan teach you that yuo are to weak to resist the devil without the PHYSICAL assistance of God. But god showed in Genesis 4 that Cain can rule over sin, and he SHOULD rule over sin, but he chose NOT TOO! Every sin we do, we CHOSE not to rule over the sin, but to become PART of the sin. God says RESIST THE DEVIL AND HE WILL FLEE FROM YOU... Why do you think God said to CAIN YOU SHALL RULE OVER IT... Because God knew he made CAIN POWERFUL ENOUGH TO CHOOSE TO RULE OVER SIN...

I am strong enough to NEVER smoke again... the cigarettes I once loved, I HATE now. Oh boy do people stink that smoke.. WOW, specially these black that rolls ZOLLE from newspaper and cheap tabacco... WOW they smell like old smoked wrotten bacon... Wah! And to think I smoked for about 20 years... Thank God he took it away, and so did he with my other sins as well... Today I RULE over sin, adultery, hating other people, lying, blasphemy against my Lord, using His name in vain, covreting my neighbours things, including his wife, and his black horse (ferrari), I do not greed for much money, I do not steal no more, but I work with my hands that is GOOD... teaching you these things....And givng to the needy as GOD LEADS.

I give no person a single reason to hate me, yet I am VERY DISLKED, for what I believe. Even lady Zone, I love her as myself and gave her not one single little reason to dislike me, yet she does. And she does not even know me. Only what I believe. I wonder if God reveals my heart to the people that I cry for, what they would say then?

I CRY for unbelief.... And I used to wept for my sins, BUCKETS FULL. Now? What do I wept for now? How God's Truth is "discussed" in the Bible Forum... The unbelief of sinners that God's Salvation is GOD'S WILL BE DONE HERE AS IT IS DONE IN HEAVEN...

Is it God's will that we are PART of sin, or is it HIS will that we RULE OVER SIN? You see if I commit sin, SIN RULES OVER ME. No use Jesus died for my sin, but I appoint it my master AGAIN and AGAIN... God made Cain.. RIGHT? Now did God fill Cain with the HOLY SPIRIT? There is NO scripture that God did, and I think such a GODLY ACT would have been in the Bible if God did.... Cain was a PURE spirit, even AFTER God rejected his offering.... Cain was pure... Sin was still leing at the door, it was not IN HIM YET!!!! But then he went and killed his brother.. the SIN that Cain let in was KILLING Abel...

Did you see that SIN DESIRED for Cain..... Now is sin desire for Cain, and Cain adhere to the desire, then Cain became a sinner.... What about us? If GOD desires for us as sinners, will we become HOLY if we adhere to GOD? Is this not also a Biblical fact? It is.. the only problem is... people understnads the Cain become sinner part WAY better that Cobus become GODLY part? Why?

Why can we understnad the SINNING and EVIL in the Bible, but NOT the GODLY and the PURE nd the HOLY and the PERFECT? God describes BOTH sides so well. I just hope I do not bring tears to my Lord's eyes as did Jerusalem! And his disciples and close friends... Three times Jesus wept... THREE times... And all for UNBELIEF... Jesus cried three times because the people did not BELIEVE HIM...

Well I am NOT Jesus, yet i wept for my OWN unbelief, and nowadays, when I share what God puts on my heart and it is rejected... I weep! It is SO SAD that people cannot believe that God make a person not only RULE over satan and sin, but the one is taken away and the other FLEE fro you...

Why is it so important that I have to be perfect? Because it is GOD'S will. And if God destined me to be IN HIM, there is NOTHING that will stop God from making me PERFECT. If God wants Abel to remain pure, do you think he can work it that way... HE DID! Abel NEVER even had to be warned about sin leith at the door.... God kept sin away from the door! So Abel was not even tempted...

Guess what God does to the GODLY people on earth today? Do you think God would DELIVER them OUT of temptation today... If GOD deliver them OUT of temptation, do yo think they will FALL in that temptation? When God even keeps the temptation (sin leith at the door) AWAY from His godly people, do you think they can sin? If God gives a pure spirit the POWER that the devil would FLEE from that PURE SPIRIT, what do you think will happen to the DEVIL if the HOLY SPIRIT gets hold of HIM? Well let GOD show you what HE does with satan (the Devil) and sin and the root of sin TEMPTATION.

2 Peter 2:9.... The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished:

Do you truly believe God does this... DELIVER THE GODLY OUT OF TEMPTATIONS? That means GOD DELIVERS THEM OUT OF TEMTATIONS! WOW! GOD delivers them out, Not they deliver themselves, GOD DOES. I wonder if he does it well and effective... If he does not, they will still sin. but if He does do it well, how can they sin, I mean it IS GOD DELIVERING THEM. GOD the ALMIGHTY LORD OF HOLINESS!!!!

Do you believe this? Do you believe God delivers the GODLY out of temptatins... If you do, then LET HIM DELIVER YOU TOO! Believe HE CAN! If you do not, believe this, I cannot help! If you do, LET US WALK BEHIND JESUS WITH OR CROSSES.. AN FOLLOW HIM OUT OF TEMPTATIONS!!!!

A pure spirit we will have at the end of our WLAK BEHIND JESUS, and then GOD CAN TAKE THE PURE SPIRIT AND MAKE IT THE HOLY SPIRIT!.... Then we will have only the HOLY SPIRIT IN US!!!! WOW!!!!And that is the Gospel of Jesus Christ!

Cobus · Oct 11, 2013

JDecree said:

JDecree, let me show you if God declares them PERFECT of NOT...

Eph 4:11 to 13.... And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

My friend God says HE APPOINTED... So these men that need to PERFECT THE SAINTS.. are APPOINTED BY GOD. That means God made them HIS WORKERS to PERFECT the SAINTS.... Now would God appoint an imperfect person that sins, to make a non sinning person perfect? Wow is that not hithing the cart in front of the horses.... Or do you think God will PERFECT the APOSTLE and the PROPHET and the evangelist and the pastors and teachers... so that THEY ARE ABLE TO PERFECT the SINLESS SAINT?

Id God only EDIFY a perfected SAINT to the Body of Christ, how can an APOTLE, the MAIN PARTS of the BODY of Christ not be perfect? How can an imperfect man make a non sinning man perfect?

JDecree do you think this ONE Baptism God speaks of here in Eph 4 is a WATER baptism?... There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
Eph 4:5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
Eph 4:6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

JDecree you say the Truth SHALL come out... Let me ask you this, does my doctrine go agains a single verse in the Bible? If it does please quote that scripture, and I will show you it does not... There is only ONE doctrine that can accomodate the WHOLE BIBLE.. it is the Dotrine of.... God can only use PERFECT men for HIS CAUSE! God CANNOT use sinners as witnesses... Sinners can lie, His men CANNOT! Sinners can sin HIS MEN CANNOT!

Remember God makes ALL His Godly, truly holy, people in the IMAGE OF THE SON OF GOD... that IMAGE IS OF PERFECT NATURE... Nothing less...

My friend, I am not right GOD and HIS WORD is right... Let me ask you this.... When you pray the Lord's prayer and you say the words... FATHER let thou will be done, in earth as it is in heaven... Do you think there is sin in heaven? Do you thing there is ANY UNGODLNESS in heaven? Do you believe what you pray? Do you REALLY want God's will be done in you as HIS WILL is done in heaven? What is His will? For you to be perfect? Is it God's will that you should be perfect here on earth as you will be in heaven? YES IT IS... Now just START to believe it and SEE HOW GO HAS HIS WILL DONE IN YOU....

I would like to share one more thing with you.... If we had to save ourselves, heaven would be the most desolate place known to human....... But is God saves us, there is no other place for us.... And God saves us here on earth, to be IN HIS KINGDOM, AND HIS KINGDOM IN US...

Flesh CANNOT enter into the heavenly Kingdom, but the heavenly Kingdom can be in flesh as well.. If you can understnad how this is possible you are a DEEP WISE MAN!

Grace = Salvation.

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