I Have Questions: about GENESIS 2-5 ( Forum Bible study )

[nathan3]

First, I ask that you all use the utmost self control for this thread. Please do not post : videos, or pictures. This is not about disagreements, but your thoughts on the questions. Please direct your responses to the questions posed, and not at each-other as best you can. If its absolutely necessary to respond to another members post, please be respectful, and keep back and forth to a bare minimum ( no name calling or threats of hell and damnation ) .

The focus is, the questions . The more related scripture you can post with your thoughts about the questions the better. ( I want everyone's thoughts about this )


There are questions I have thought about this. But, now I want to ask everyone else; about what the majority of preachers of God's word are teaching about what was the sin in the Garden .


I have watched people paint me pictures of apple trees , & snakes, an how it was the downfall of man. But, I never been satisfied with that explanation I have heard .

So I want to see if anyone is satisfied or not with what they have heard from their preachers and teachers ?

I want you to keep in mind one fact as I pose these questions to you :

Genesis 1: 27-28 - God said, be fruitful and multiply . So its no sin to have sex and produce children. Agreed ?

Keep that in mind, when thinking about the questions below . I'm going to present these questions in the order they occurred in Genesis 3, in Eden, were the sin took place : : : :



1. Why, after Eve and Adam took from the tree of knowledge of good an evil, did they realize they were naked ?


2. Why, if the sin was eating a fruit, did they not cover their privet parts with an apron of fig leaves , instead of their mouths ?


3. Why, were did two seeds come from ?


4. Why, did God mention the Serpent having a seed ( Gen 3: 14-15 ; Rev 12:9 ) ? And a need to separate them ?


5.Why, did this result in Eve becoming pregnant ?


6. Why is Cain, not listed in Adams genealogy ?





Now, while you consider those, if you want, take a look at the results of a word study I did. You do not have to, agree with my word study. But its here for everyone to consider.





I took the time, to do a word study with the word seed , found in Gen 3:15-

2233


zera`
zeh'-rah


from 'zara`' (2232); seed; figuratively, fruit, plant, sowing-time, posterity:--X carnally, child, fruitful, seed(-time), sowing- time.


I also, wanted to see where else in the Bible this word zera was used. So that I can see how it was used.


I found zera` was translated into a few things in many places. A complete look should be done, but for times sake , I'm going to look at just these two in Leviticus . Zera` was translated carnally in Leviticus .Now I want to see how it was used there.


carnally
Lev 18:20, Lev 19:20


Leviticus 18:20

Moreover thou shalt not lie carnally with thy neighbour's wife, to defile thyself with her.

Here it is being used to describe sleeping with a women.


Leviticus 19:20

And whosoever lieth carnally with a woman, that is a bondmaid, betrothed to an husband, and not at all redeemed, nor freedom given her; she shall be scourged; they shall not be put to death, because she was not free.

It is being used the same here. Then why is it translated seed there ? And I would say, given the fact that they both were ashamed of their nakedness ? But they were not before ( Genesis 2:15 )

What are your thoughts ?

 

[nathan3]

Also, when posting scriptural references . All that is really needed is the Book, chapter, and verses. Posting a few full text at a time is fine, but for space, an time, its better that everyone use Bible Gate way to pull up the full texts .

( please also, no name calling, calling out or mentioning of denominations, churches or individuals by name. lets stick to the scriptures. )



I also will just be observing, for this thread. I will Not be posting farther .

 

[Isdaniel]

1. Why, after Eve and Adam took from the tree of knowledge of good an evil, did they realize they were naked ?

What Adam and Eve wore spiritually were robes of righteousness even though they were naked

When they sin that robe of righteousness was replaced by a robe of unrighteousness and shame


Adam and Eve when created were literally naked and wore no carnal clothes but spiritual clothes
[h=3]Revelation 19:8[/h]King James Version (KJV)

[SUP]8 [/SUP]And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white: for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints.

Adam and Eve after sinning were spiritually naked and also realized that thus were given carnal clothes

Revelation 16:15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.

 

[homwardbound]

All I see is this:
Before the eating from the tree that brought death, the only tree in the garden that would bring forth death, they were only alive in their Souls.
Genesis 2:7 And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

No mention of ever being alive in the flesh or the Spirit of God, man is at that time a living Soul. Prior to the eating of that tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

Now after they ate from it they became aware of being naked and were ashamed, their eyes were opened. They were now alive in flesh aware of it, and now were wanting to be master God in the flesh, not yet aware of this being ashamed for now, knowing that they are to die now as god said would be, so they hid. Now notice this God had Mercy and clothed them. putting them out of the Garden to till the ground on their own, to play God.

now I want you to notice that no one as of that time had eaten from the tree of life yet, for God guarded it until the time appointed for it to come forth

Genesis 2:9 And out of the ground made the Lord God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.
Genesis 3:17 And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life
Genesis 3:22 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

So God prevented flesh to eat from the tree of life, until the time appointed for us to be born in the Spirit came forth through Christ Jesus. This is done in the resurrected Christ, by Father through the death of Christ, which is today our death to this flesh that came alive that day of the eating of that tree of death. Christ hung on that tree and condemned all sin to flesh.
Romans 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

So the battle is and as always been Flesh verses God's Spirit that is today able to live in us and for us to see things from God the Father's vantage point

Galatians 4:29 But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.

Same battle as what was started then with Adam and Eve, difference today is we are Born from God the Father in God's Spirit with God through Son Christ's finished work at the cross, where by his death we are made: presented to Father for new life in the Spirit of Father
Colossians 1:22 in the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:

So from the beginning fast forward to today, by Father's Mercy through Son Christ. we those that believe Father and want this new life receive it from Father and are born of the Spirit of God here and now. Renewing our mindsets from birth on as Saul learned to, to the point of being

Galatians 2:20
I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

So is this for us too, or just Paul, How Merciful is God, and how is it anyone else's Fault that we all are first born of this sinful flesh nature, since we all are born after the similitude of Adam and Eve.
Can an orange seed produce Banana's?
And sex was only ever meant to have children, not for a reprobate mind of pleasure, as is what is promoted today used as the operation for sales.

So does this world and its temporal things appeal to you, me and others anymore? not id you are born of God and thus God doing the teaching you will see and agree, as you grow up and put away childish things
Thanks

 

[Elin]

I'm going to present these questions in the order they occurred in Genesis 3, in Eden, were the sin took place.

1. Why, after Eve and Adam took from the tree of knowledge of good an evil, did they realize they were naked ?

Perhaps they were clothed in a light of glory, of which they were stripped when they disobeyed.
Perhaps the loss caused them shame because of the loss of their innocence in disobedience.

2. Why, if the sin was eating a fruit, did they not cover their privet parts with an apron of fig leaves , instead of their mouths ?

Shame was the result of the "fallen" nature,
in which shame all sinful mankind now shares when totally uncovered.
Shame is now part of the fallen (sinful) nature.

3. Why, were did two seeds come from ?

The Hebrew word here for seed is zera, which means "progeny."

The seed of the woman are the people of God.
The seed of the serpent are unbelievers who are not the people of God (Jn 8:44).

4. Why, did God mention the Serpent having a seed ( Gen 3: 14-15 ; Rev 12:9 ) ?

Probably to announce the enormously gigantic struggle between God and the evil one which would be taking place in the hearts and history of mankind.

And a need to separate them ?

The two seeds are separated by their two separate destinies.

5.Why, did this result in Eve becoming pregnant ?

My Bible doesn't state that.

If you are referring to "Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you,"
I see a couple of things:

1) a conflict between her attraction for him and his authority over her, which would be for her a source of trouble and pain rather than joy and pleasure,
2) her attraction for him could be a source of jealousy, either because of his authority or because of her desire for an exclusive relationship.

6. Why is Cain, not listed in Adams genealogy ?

Cain would not be in Adam's genealogy, he would be in Adam's progeny.

Most genealogies, if not all, are of the chosen line from which Messiah would descend.
Cain and Abel (murdered) were not part of the chosen line.

I took the time, to do a word study with the word seed , found in Gen 3:15-

2233 - zera`- zeh'-rah
from 'zara`' (2232); seed; figuratively, fruit, plant, sowing-time, posterity:--X carnally, child, fruitful, seed(-time), sowing- time.

Zera` was translated carnally in Leviticus 18:20 .

"Moreover thou shalt not lie carnally with thy neighbour's wife, to defile thyself with her."

Here it is being used to describe sleeping with a women.

Yes, progeny is the result of sexual intercourse between two fleshly (meat, carnal) bodies, carnal sexual intercourse.

 

[Isdaniel]

i really hope that this thread does not go into that serpent seed nonsense


no insult intended

just truth

bless

 

[Isdaniel]

Why, were did two seeds come from ?


God that calleth

Romans 9
[SUP]11 [/SUP](For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth
[SUP]12 [/SUP]It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
[SUP]13 [/SUP]As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

 

[Isdaniel]

Why, were did two seeds come from ?
Sin results had already taken effect thus the bad seed will come and did come and will be here
John 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

 

[Isdaniel]

Why, did God mention the Serpent having a seed ( Gen 3: 14-15 ; Rev 12:9 ) ? And a need to separate them ?


Isaiah 14

[SUP]19 [/SUP]But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet.

[SUP]20 [/SUP]Thou shalt not be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land, and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned.
[SUP]21 [/SUP]Prepare slaughter for his children for the iniquity of their fathers; that they do not rise, nor possess the land, nor fill the face of the world with cities.

 

[Isdaniel]

2. Why, if the sin was eating a fruit, did they not cover their privet parts with an apron of fig leaves , instead of their mouths ?


I do not see that they cover their mouths in the bible

Was their mouths naked ?

 

[Isdaniel]

I do not understand this question

.Why, did this result in Eve becoming pregnant ?

Genesis 1
[SUP]26 [/SUP]And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
[SUP]27 [/SUP]So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

[SUP]28 [/SUP]And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.


Genesis 3

[SUP]16 [/SUP]Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.

The above is a statement for when she becomes pregnant with Adam . it is not saying that at that [point in time she was pregnant .

Genesis 4

King James Version (KJV)

4And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the Lord.

[SUP]2[/SUP]And she again bare his brother Abel. And Abel was a keeper of sheep, but Cain was a tiller of the ground.

Note it is Adam that had sex with his wife and the child was Cain which came from the Lord because God is the Creator. But we know from conception Cain was the seed of the wicked one thus God word being fullfilled while Abel was the seed of the Righteous or of God

Today we have the seed of God and the seed of the wicked one and that is spiritually speaking

 

[Isdaniel]

i really hope this is not a serpent seed doctrine that
[h=3] Branhamite push [/h]

 

[Isdaniel]

Why is Cain, not listed in Adams genealogy ?


This is a spiritual thing to point To Jesus

Cain was the son of Adam carnally bu the son of the devil spiritually

people to day have two fathers Their carnal father and Spiritual Father which could either be God or the devil

 

[1still_waters]

1. Why, after Eve and Adam took from the tree of knowledge of good an evil, did they realize they were naked ?

Because their eyes were opened.
7 Then the eyes of both were opened, and they knew that they were naked.

2. Why, if the sin was eating a fruit, did they not cover their privet parts with an apron of fig leaves , instead of their mouths ?

Umm they did cover their private parts.
7 Then the eyes of both were opened, and they knew that they were naked. And they sewed fig leaves together and made themselves loincloths.

3. Why, were did two seeds come from ?
4. Why, did God mention the Serpent having a seed ( Gen 3: 14-15 ; Rev 12:9 ) ? And a need to separate them ?

I think when we interpret this scripture we have to consider the use of figurative/symbolic language and weigh it against the overall context of the Bible.

14 The Lord God said to the serpent,“Because you have done this,
cursed are you above all livestock
and above all beasts of the field;
on your belly you shall go,
and dust you shall eat
all the days of your life.
15 I will put enmity between you and the woman,
and between your offspring[e] and her offspring;
he shall bruise your head,
and you shall bruise his heel.”

There is talk of bruising heads and heels.
We know this is trying to symbolically portray the victory of Jesus over Satan.
It's not that a literal head and heel are going to be bruised.

Given this type of symbolism, and given the fact we don't see anything in scripture that strongly, and overtly says Satan had sex with humans, we need to under stand the seed in reference to him is symbolic too, meaning the seed he sews spiritually.

.......

5.Why, did this result in Eve becoming pregnant ?

Nothing in the text clearly indicates Satan had sex with Eve, and she became pregnant.
We have an account that follows the biblical pattern of a man knowing a woman, resulting in children from them.
To read Satan Eve sex into it, is to break a major biblical pattern.

4 Now Adam knew Eve his wife, and she conceived and bore Cain, saying, “I have gotten[a] a man with the help of the Lord.” 2 And again, she bore his brother Abel.

6. Why is Cain, not listed in Adams genealogy ?

For the same reason Abel isn't
It's showing the seed of promise.
Seth====>Jesus

 

[Bookends]

The two seeds are symbolic.

Seed of the serpent are those who have fallen into sin and born into sin, which is everyone.

Seed of the woman is Christ.

When one believes and places their faith in the atoning death of Christ, God takes that person out of the family of Satan, and places them in the family of God by adoption. Hence, you have the saying "BORN AGAIN". Its a spiritual rebirth.

These two seeds aren't literally sperm or an egg, it is (God) vs evil (sin), or two families one being unrighteous and the other being righteous.

 

[zone]

The two seeds are symbolic.

Seed of the serpent are those who have fallen into sin and born into sin, which is everyone.

Seed of the woman is Christ.

When one believes and places their faith in the atoning death of Christ, God takes that person out of the family of Satan, and places them in the family of God by adoption. Hence, you have the saying "BORN AGAIN". Its a spiritual rebirth.

Colossians 1
12 giving thanks to the Father, who has qualified us to share in the inheritance of the saints in Light. 13 For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son, 14 in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.

 

[zone]

So I want to see if anyone is satisfied or not with what they have heard from their preachers and teachers ?

absolutely.

1. Why, after Eve and Adam took from the tree of knowledge of good an evil, did they realize they were naked ?

if that tree was actually satan, and in partaking of it, they had sex with him....what or who is the tree of life?
just a tree? or a divine being?
what is the implication of this?

 

[Bookends]

Colossians 1
12 giving thanks to the Father, who has qualified us to share in the inheritance of the saints in Light. 13 For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son, 14 in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.

Amen Girl! thanks for backing me up ...

 

[SpaceCowboy]

First, I ask that you all use the utmost self control for this thread. Please do not post : videos, or pictures. This is not about disagreements, but your thoughts on the questions. Please direct your responses to the questions posed, and not at each-other as best you can. If its absolutely necessary to respond to another members post, please be respectful, and keep back and forth to a bare minimum ( no name calling or threats of hell and damnation ) .

The focus is, the questions . The more related scripture you can post with your thoughts about the questions the better. ( I want everyone's thoughts about this )


There are questions I have thought about this. But, now I want to ask everyone else; about what the majority of preachers of God's word are teaching about what was the sin in the Garden .


I have watched people paint me pictures of apple trees , & snakes, an how it was the downfall of man. But, I never been satisfied with that explanation I have heard .

So I want to see if anyone is satisfied or not with what they have heard from their preachers and teachers ?

I want you to keep in mind one fact as I pose these questions to you :

Genesis 1: 27-28 - God said, be fruitful and multiply . So its no sin to have sex and produce children. Agreed ?

Keep that in mind, when thinking about the questions below . I'm going to present these questions in the order they occurred in Genesis 3, in Eden, were the sin took place : : : :



1. Why, after Eve and Adam took from the tree of knowledge of good an evil, did they realize they were naked ?


2. Why, if the sin was eating a fruit, did they not cover their privet parts with an apron of fig leaves , instead of their mouths ?


3. Why, were did two seeds come from ?


4. Why, did God mention the Serpent having a seed ( Gen 3: 14-15 ; Rev 12:9 ) ? And a need to separate them ?


5.Why, did this result in Eve becoming pregnant ?


6. Why is Cain, not listed in Adams genealogy ?





Now, while you consider those, if you want, take a look at the results of a word study I did. You do not have to, agree with my word study. But its here for everyone to consider.





I took the time, to do a word study with the word seed , found in Gen 3:15-

2233


zera`
zeh'-rah


from 'zara`' (2232); seed; figuratively, fruit, plant, sowing-time, posterity:--X carnally, child, fruitful, seed(-time), sowing- time.


I also, wanted to see where else in the Bible this word zera was used. So that I can see how it was used.


I found zera` was translated into a few things in many places. A complete look should be done, but for times sake , I'm going to look at just these two in Leviticus . Zera` was translated carnally in Leviticus .Now I want to see how it was used there.


carnally
Lev 18:20, Lev 19:20


Leviticus 18:20

Moreover thou shalt not lie carnally with thy neighbour's wife, to defile thyself with her.

Here it is being used to describe sleeping with a women.


Leviticus 19:20

And whosoever lieth carnally with a woman, that is a bondmaid, betrothed to an husband, and not at all redeemed, nor freedom given her; she shall be scourged; they shall not be put to death, because she was not free.

It is being used the same here. Then why is it translated seed there ? And I would say, given the fact that they both were ashamed of their nakedness ? But they were not before ( Genesis 2:15 )

What are your thoughts ?

I think your jelous.

 

[jag1977]

Message me one question at a time and I will answer all you ask.