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P
Brainfreeze; I appreciate you sharing your Testimony..
When people come to Realize that it Is All About Jesus As you did..
They will come to Realize that they can Not DO Anything Anything, Anything
That would deserve Their Salvation..
They would come to Realize that "water baptism"
is an Outward Expression
Publicly showing the World that I am Reborn
as Jesus as my Lord and Savior
Of an Inward Feeling
Is the HEART felt Realization
that I am a sinner going to hell
in Need of a Savior
JESUS CHRIST SAVES
HE is the BRIDGE between us and GOD
It Is ALL About HIS Grace and Mercy
Gods Riches At Christ Expense
When people come to Realize that it Is All About Jesus As you did..
They will come to Realize that they can Not DO Anything Anything, Anything
That would deserve Their Salvation..
They would come to Realize that "water baptism"
is an Outward Expression
Publicly showing the World that I am Reborn
as Jesus as my Lord and Savior
Of an Inward Feeling
Is the HEART felt Realization
that I am a sinner going to hell
in Need of a Savior
JESUS CHRIST SAVES
HE is the BRIDGE between us and GOD
It Is ALL About HIS Grace and Mercy
Gods Riches At Christ Expense
J
This is usually the only occasion that people bring up in the New Testament when it seems as though someone hasn't been baptized. However, the occasion was before Jesus' death and therefore before the new law (Christianity). The thief did not need to be baptized b/c he was saved under the old law.
Hebrews 9:16-17 "For where a will is involved, the death of the one who made it must be established. For a will takes effect only at death, since it is not in force as long as the one who made it is alive."
Hebrews 9:16-17 "For where a will is involved, the death of the one who made it must be established. For a will takes effect only at death, since it is not in force as long as the one who made it is alive."
J
Where is this cry out the Jesus in scripture?
There are many reasons why the sinners prayer is not valid:
1) it's not scriptural
2) God doesn't hear sinners (John 9:31 "We know that God does not listen to sinners...")
3) the only way to be a Christian is to be IN Christ (Eph 2:13 "But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.")
4) We get INTO Christ through baptism, through the blood of Christ cleansing us of our sins (Gal 3:26-27 "for in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith. For as many of you as were baptized INTO Christ have put on Christ.")
There are many reasons why the sinners prayer is not valid:
1) it's not scriptural
2) God doesn't hear sinners (John 9:31 "We know that God does not listen to sinners...")
3) the only way to be a Christian is to be IN Christ (Eph 2:13 "But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.")
4) We get INTO Christ through baptism, through the blood of Christ cleansing us of our sins (Gal 3:26-27 "for in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith. For as many of you as were baptized INTO Christ have put on Christ.")
J
If they were Christians, they would've needed to be baptized, whether it's specifically stated or not. They would not have been a part of the church otherwise.
Purpose of baptism:
1) to be added to the body of Christ, the church (1 Cor 12:13)
2) to wash away your sins (Acts 22:16)
3) to receive the gift of the Holy Spirit (Acts 2:38)
Purpose of baptism:
1) to be added to the body of Christ, the church (1 Cor 12:13)
2) to wash away your sins (Acts 22:16)
3) to receive the gift of the Holy Spirit (Acts 2:38)
The Parable of the Lost Sheep
Luke 15:6-7
…6"And when he comes home, he calls together his friends and his neighbors, saying to them, 'Rejoice with me, for I have found my sheep which was lost!' 7"I tell you that in the same way, there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine righteous persons who need no repentance.
Luke 15:6-7
…6"And when he comes home, he calls together his friends and his neighbors, saying to them, 'Rejoice with me, for I have found my sheep which was lost!' 7"I tell you that in the same way, there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine righteous persons who need no repentance.
you say when you got saved.....the scripture says the goodness of God brings us to repentance.....you were brought to repentance.....the scripture says ....repent and be baptised unto the remission of sins.....Paul and Cornelius had almost the same experience.......in the case of Paul... Acts 22:16
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.
In the case of Cornelius.....
Acts 11:13-15King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]13 [/SUP]And he shewed us how he had seen an angel in his house, which stood and said unto him, Send men to Joppa, and call for Simon, whose surname is Peter;
[SUP]14 [/SUP]Who shall tell thee words, whereby thou and all thy house shall be saved.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, as on us at the beginning.
Acts 10
[SUP]44 [/SUP]While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
[SUP]45 [/SUP]And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.
[SUP]46 [/SUP]For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,
[SUP]47 [/SUP]Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
[SUP]48 [/SUP]And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.
In the case of Cornelius.....
Acts 11:13-15King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]13 [/SUP]And he shewed us how he had seen an angel in his house, which stood and said unto him, Send men to Joppa, and call for Simon, whose surname is Peter;
[SUP]14 [/SUP]Who shall tell thee words, whereby thou and all thy house shall be saved.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, as on us at the beginning.
Acts 10
[SUP]44 [/SUP]While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
[SUP]45 [/SUP]And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.
[SUP]46 [/SUP]For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,
[SUP]47 [/SUP]Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
[SUP]48 [/SUP]And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.
J
[/SIZE]
Tyler, that is just you saying it. It is contrary to scripture. All a man need do is trust the Savior (faith/belief) over & over the Lord tells us that. Here is just a part of the evidence:
NO WATER MENTIONED!
Ps 37:5-6
Commit thy way unto YHWH;
Trust also in him, and he will bring it to pass.
And he will make thy righteousness to go forth as the light,
And thy justice as the noonday.
Acts 15:8
And God, who knoweth the heart, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Spirit, even as he did unto us; and he made no distinction between us and them, cleansing their hearts by faith.
Acts 26:18b
that they may receive remission of sins and an inheritance among them that are sanctified by faith in me.
Rom 1:16-17
For I am not ashamed of the gospel: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 17 For therein is revealed a righteousness of God from faith unto faith: as it is written, But the righteous shall live by faith.
Rom 3:21-30
But now apart from the law a righteousness of God hath been manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 22 even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ unto all them that believe; for there is no distinction; 23 for all have sinned, and fall short of the glory of God; 24 being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: 25 whom God set forth to be a propitiation, through faith, in his blood, to show his righteousness because of the passing over of the sins done aforetime, in the forbearance of God; 26 for the showing, I say, of his righteousness at this present season: that he might himself be just, and the justifier of him that hath faith in Jesus. 27 Where then is the glorying? It is excluded. By what manner of law? of works? Nay: but by a law of faith. 28 We reckon therefore that a man is justified by faith apart from the works of the law. 29 Or is God the God of Jews only? is he not the God of Gentiles also? Yea, of Gentiles also: 30 if so be that God is one, and he shall justify the circumcision by faith, and the uncircumcision through faith.
Rom 4:1ff
:1 What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather, hath found according to the flesh? 2 For if Abraham was justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not toward God. 3 For what saith the scripture? And Abraham believed God, and it was reckoned unto him for righteousness. 4 Now to him who works, the reward is not reckoned as of grace, but as of debt. 5 But to him that works not, but believeth on him that justifies the ungodly, his faith is reckoned for righteousness. 6 Even as David also pronounces blessing upon the man, to whom God reckons righteousness apart from works, 7 saying,
Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven,
And whose sins are covered.
8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not reckon sin.
9 Is this blessing then pronounced upon the circumcision, or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say, To Abraham his faith was reckoned for righteousness. 10 How then was it reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision: 11 and he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while he was in uncircumcision: that he might be the father of all them who believe, though they be in uncircumcision, that righteousness might be reckoned unto them; 12 and the father of circumcision to them who not only are of the circumcision, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham which he had in uncircumcision. 13 For not through the law was the promise to Abraham or to his seed that he should be heir of the world, but through the righteousness of faith. 14 For if they that are of the law are heirs, faith is made void, and the promise is made of none effect: 15 for the law works wrath; but where there is no law, neither is there transgression. 16 For this cause it is of faith, that it may be according to grace; to the end that the promise may be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all 17 (as it is written, A father of many nations have I made thee) before him whom he believed, even God, who giveth life to the dead, and calleth the things that are not, as though they were. 18 Who in hope believed against hope, to the end that he might become a father of many nations, according to that which had been spoken, So shall thy seed be. 19 And without being weakened in faith he considered his own body now as good as dead (he being about a hundred years old), and the deadness of Sarah’s womb; 20 yet, looking unto the promise of God, he wavered not through unbelief, but waxed strong through faith, giving glory to God, 21 and being fully assured that what he had promised, he was able also to perform. 22 Wherefore also it was reckoned unto him for righteousness.
Rom 5:1-2
Being therefore justified by faith, let us have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ; through whom also we have had our access by faith into this grace wherein we stand; and let us boast in hope of the glory of God.
Rom 9:30:
What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, who followed not after righteousness, attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith: but Israel, following after a law of righteousness, did not arrive at that law. Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by works. They stumbled at the stone of stumbling; even as it is written,
Behold, I lay in Zion a stone of stumbling and a rock of offence:
And he who believes on him shall not be put to shame.
Rom 10:4ff
For Christ is the end of the law unto righteousness to everyone who believes. For Moses writeth that the man that doeth the righteousness which is of the law shall live thereby. But the righteousness which is of faith says thus, Say not in thy heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down
or, Who shall descend into the abyss? (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead.) But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach.
Gal 2:15-16
We being Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles, yet knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, even we believed on Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ, and not by the works of the law: because by the works of the law no flesh shall be justified.
Tyler, that is just you saying it. It is contrary to scripture. All a man need do is trust the Savior (faith/belief) over & over the Lord tells us that. Here is just a part of the evidence:
NO WATER MENTIONED!
Ps 37:5-6
Commit thy way unto YHWH;
Trust also in him, and he will bring it to pass.
And he will make thy righteousness to go forth as the light,
And thy justice as the noonday.
Acts 15:8
And God, who knoweth the heart, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Spirit, even as he did unto us; and he made no distinction between us and them, cleansing their hearts by faith.
Acts 26:18b
that they may receive remission of sins and an inheritance among them that are sanctified by faith in me.
Rom 1:16-17
For I am not ashamed of the gospel: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 17 For therein is revealed a righteousness of God from faith unto faith: as it is written, But the righteous shall live by faith.
Rom 3:21-30
But now apart from the law a righteousness of God hath been manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 22 even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ unto all them that believe; for there is no distinction; 23 for all have sinned, and fall short of the glory of God; 24 being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: 25 whom God set forth to be a propitiation, through faith, in his blood, to show his righteousness because of the passing over of the sins done aforetime, in the forbearance of God; 26 for the showing, I say, of his righteousness at this present season: that he might himself be just, and the justifier of him that hath faith in Jesus. 27 Where then is the glorying? It is excluded. By what manner of law? of works? Nay: but by a law of faith. 28 We reckon therefore that a man is justified by faith apart from the works of the law. 29 Or is God the God of Jews only? is he not the God of Gentiles also? Yea, of Gentiles also: 30 if so be that God is one, and he shall justify the circumcision by faith, and the uncircumcision through faith.
Rom 4:1ff
:1 What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather, hath found according to the flesh? 2 For if Abraham was justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not toward God. 3 For what saith the scripture? And Abraham believed God, and it was reckoned unto him for righteousness. 4 Now to him who works, the reward is not reckoned as of grace, but as of debt. 5 But to him that works not, but believeth on him that justifies the ungodly, his faith is reckoned for righteousness. 6 Even as David also pronounces blessing upon the man, to whom God reckons righteousness apart from works, 7 saying,
Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven,
And whose sins are covered.
8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not reckon sin.
9 Is this blessing then pronounced upon the circumcision, or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say, To Abraham his faith was reckoned for righteousness. 10 How then was it reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision: 11 and he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while he was in uncircumcision: that he might be the father of all them who believe, though they be in uncircumcision, that righteousness might be reckoned unto them; 12 and the father of circumcision to them who not only are of the circumcision, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham which he had in uncircumcision. 13 For not through the law was the promise to Abraham or to his seed that he should be heir of the world, but through the righteousness of faith. 14 For if they that are of the law are heirs, faith is made void, and the promise is made of none effect: 15 for the law works wrath; but where there is no law, neither is there transgression. 16 For this cause it is of faith, that it may be according to grace; to the end that the promise may be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all 17 (as it is written, A father of many nations have I made thee) before him whom he believed, even God, who giveth life to the dead, and calleth the things that are not, as though they were. 18 Who in hope believed against hope, to the end that he might become a father of many nations, according to that which had been spoken, So shall thy seed be. 19 And without being weakened in faith he considered his own body now as good as dead (he being about a hundred years old), and the deadness of Sarah’s womb; 20 yet, looking unto the promise of God, he wavered not through unbelief, but waxed strong through faith, giving glory to God, 21 and being fully assured that what he had promised, he was able also to perform. 22 Wherefore also it was reckoned unto him for righteousness.
Rom 5:1-2
Being therefore justified by faith, let us have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ; through whom also we have had our access by faith into this grace wherein we stand; and let us boast in hope of the glory of God.
Rom 9:30:
What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, who followed not after righteousness, attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith: but Israel, following after a law of righteousness, did not arrive at that law. Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by works. They stumbled at the stone of stumbling; even as it is written,
Behold, I lay in Zion a stone of stumbling and a rock of offence:
And he who believes on him shall not be put to shame.
Rom 10:4ff
For Christ is the end of the law unto righteousness to everyone who believes. For Moses writeth that the man that doeth the righteousness which is of the law shall live thereby. But the righteousness which is of faith says thus, Say not in thy heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down
or, Who shall descend into the abyss? (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead.) But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach.Gal 2:15-16
We being Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles, yet knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, even we believed on Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ, and not by the works of the law: because by the works of the law no flesh shall be justified.
Did you know that belief and faith are not synonymous? Belief doesn't require action, for "...even the demons believe.." (James 2:19). However, to have faith, you must act, for "..faith without works is dead" (James 2:20). It is impossible to have faith without action. So, if a verse says their hearts were cleansed by faith...you should ask yourself..what did they do?
Now I'm not saying that we can get ourselves to heaven by what we do, we can't. BUT, we MUST follow Christ. Jesus said "If you love me, keep my commandments" (John 14:15). So, not getting baptized, FOR (1) the remission of your sins, (2) to be added to the church, and (3) to receive the gift of the Holy Spirit, is not following the commands of Jesus. It is showing a lack of love for Him.
God "...commands all men everywhere to repent" (Acts 2:38)
Jesus said "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and the Son and the Holy Spirit" (Mat 28:19)
Peter said in Acts 2:38 "...Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins and ye shall receive the Holy Ghost"
Saul said in Acts 22:16 "...be baptized and wash away your sins..."
After baptism you are added in to the church, Acts 2:41 "So those who received his word were baptized, and there were added that day about three thousand souls"
those of you who keep reminding us that baptism is commanded are missing the point.
no one has said "do not be H[SUB]2[/SUB]O baptized" --
the argument is that Christ's blood is what atones for sin, not H[SUB]2[/SUB]O.
that the Holy Spirit regenerates and renews, not H[SUB]2[/SUB]O.
that the second birth is by Spirit, not by H[SUB]2[/SUB]O a second time - can you crawl back into your mother's womb?
Christ does not baptize with H[SUB]2[/SUB]O, but with fire and spirit.
we answer Him in good conscience with H[SUB]2[/SUB]O - but we don't clean our souls with it - only the Lord can do that, and is faithful to do it!
this thread should have been imparting understanding, but it's turned into empty repetitious argument because some H[SUB]2[/SUB]O fanatics think some of us are saying "don't be baptized" when in fact what we're saying is "understand what true baptism is and what H[SUB]2[/SUB]O immersion represents"
no one has said "do not be H[SUB]2[/SUB]O baptized" --
the argument is that Christ's blood is what atones for sin, not H[SUB]2[/SUB]O.
that the Holy Spirit regenerates and renews, not H[SUB]2[/SUB]O.
that the second birth is by Spirit, not by H[SUB]2[/SUB]O a second time - can you crawl back into your mother's womb?
Christ does not baptize with H[SUB]2[/SUB]O, but with fire and spirit.
we answer Him in good conscience with H[SUB]2[/SUB]O - but we don't clean our souls with it - only the Lord can do that, and is faithful to do it!
this thread should have been imparting understanding, but it's turned into empty repetitious argument because some H[SUB]2[/SUB]O fanatics think some of us are saying "don't be baptized" when in fact what we're saying is "understand what true baptism is and what H[SUB]2[/SUB]O immersion represents"
1 Corinthians 1:17 For Christ did not send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel—not with wisdom and eloquence, lest the cross of Christ be emptied of its power.
Paul was sent to preach!!! Paul was NOT sent to Baptize!!
The Church "ADDS" people to Jesus' body by "BAPTISM"!
PACEMAKER There is MORE to the Church then just preaching; Church also MAKES "DISCIPLES!"
FACT: "DISCIPLES" are IN God' family!
They are IN God' Family because.. They were ADOPTED into God' family by the waters of baptism!
Matthew 12:49Pointing to his disciples, he said, “Here are my mother and my brothers.
PACEMAKER DO YOU SEE IT??? "Disciples" are Jesus' brothers!
Disciples are made by Baptism!
Jesus' BROTHERS are made by Baptism!
THINK: God has JUST ONE (1) SON! God' ONE (1) son is named Jesus, if you are to be called "Child of God" you MUST be "IN the body of Jesus"!
PACEMAKER To be ADDED to Jesus' body is what saves you!
Verse #38 (below) tells you: Baptism removes sins! Verse #38 (below) tells you: The "GIFT" comes from Baptism, sent from God, the GIFT is the Holy Spirit!
38 Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39 The promise is for you and your children and for all who are far off—for all whom the Lord our God will call.”
40 With many other words he warned them; and he pleaded with them, “Save yourselves from this corrupt generation.” 41 Those who accepted his message were baptized, and about three thousand were added to their number that day.
PACEMAKER Do you see it? 3000 people were saved they were "ADDED" to Jesus body by baptism!
PACEMAKER If you were to look for the Church Jesus established 2000 years ago you would look for a church that Baptizes to save!
Hermas said this in 80 A.D.
"‘I have heard, sir,’ said I [to the Shepherd], ‘from some teacher, that there is no other repentance except that which took place when we went down into the water and obtained the remission of our former sins.’ He said to me, ‘You have heard rightly, for so it is’" (The Shepherd 4:3:1–2 [A.D. 80]).
Justin Martyr said this in 151 A.D.
"As many as are persuaded and believe that what we [Christians] teach and say is true, and undertake to be able to live accordingly . . . are brought by us where there is water, and are regenerated in the same manner in which we were ourselves regenerated. For, in the name of God, the Father and Lord of the universe, and of our Savior Jesus Christ, and of the Holy Spirit, they then receive the washing with water. For Christ also said, ‘Except you be born again, you shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven’ [John 3:3]" (First Apology 61 [A.D. 151]).
PACEMAKER The Church has ALWAYS baptized to make God' Disciples!
Paul was sent to preach!!! Paul was NOT sent to Baptize!!
The Church "ADDS" people to Jesus' body by "BAPTISM"!
PACEMAKER There is MORE to the Church then just preaching; Church also MAKES "DISCIPLES!"
FACT: "DISCIPLES" are IN God' family!
They are IN God' Family because.. They were ADOPTED into God' family by the waters of baptism!
Matthew 12:49Pointing to his disciples, he said, “Here are my mother and my brothers.
PACEMAKER DO YOU SEE IT??? "Disciples" are Jesus' brothers!
Disciples are made by Baptism!
Jesus' BROTHERS are made by Baptism!
THINK: God has JUST ONE (1) SON! God' ONE (1) son is named Jesus, if you are to be called "Child of God" you MUST be "IN the body of Jesus"!
PACEMAKER To be ADDED to Jesus' body is what saves you!
Verse #38 (below) tells you: Baptism removes sins! Verse #38 (below) tells you: The "GIFT" comes from Baptism, sent from God, the GIFT is the Holy Spirit!
38 Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39 The promise is for you and your children and for all who are far off—for all whom the Lord our God will call.”
40 With many other words he warned them; and he pleaded with them, “Save yourselves from this corrupt generation.” 41 Those who accepted his message were baptized, and about three thousand were added to their number that day.
PACEMAKER Do you see it? 3000 people were saved they were "ADDED" to Jesus body by baptism!
PACEMAKER If you were to look for the Church Jesus established 2000 years ago you would look for a church that Baptizes to save!
Hermas said this in 80 A.D.
"‘I have heard, sir,’ said I [to the Shepherd], ‘from some teacher, that there is no other repentance except that which took place when we went down into the water and obtained the remission of our former sins.’ He said to me, ‘You have heard rightly, for so it is’" (The Shepherd 4:3:1–2 [A.D. 80]).
Justin Martyr said this in 151 A.D.
"As many as are persuaded and believe that what we [Christians] teach and say is true, and undertake to be able to live accordingly . . . are brought by us where there is water, and are regenerated in the same manner in which we were ourselves regenerated. For, in the name of God, the Father and Lord of the universe, and of our Savior Jesus Christ, and of the Holy Spirit, they then receive the washing with water. For Christ also said, ‘Except you be born again, you shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven’ [John 3:3]" (First Apology 61 [A.D. 151]).
PACEMAKER The Church has ALWAYS baptized to make God' Disciples!
I reply: To be saved by the Blood of Christ you MUST be IN Christ!LOOK... 5 For in him you have been enriched in every way—with all kinds of speech and with all knowledge—6 God thus confirming our testimony about Christ among you.YES you are 100% right... Christ does not baptize with H[SUB]2[/SUB]O, but with fire and spirit. posthuman The Groom sends the GIFT!!! God sends the Holy SPIRIT!!!!!!The BRIDE does the washing!!! The Church removes the sins with the waters of baptism!posthuman It takes TWO (2) parents to form a child! Just in case you don't know it takes a FATHER & MOTHER!God the >>FATHER>MOTHER
I reply: To be saved by the Blood of Christ you MUST be IN Christ!
LOOK... 5 For in him you have been enriched in every way—with all kinds of speech and with all knowledge—6 God thus confirming our testimony about Christ among you.
YES you are 100% right... Christ does not baptize with H[SUB]2[/SUB]O, but with fire and spirit.
posthuman The Groom sends the GIFT!!! God sends the Holy SPIRIT! Never the water part, always the Holy Spirit is God' action!
* The BRIDE does the washing!!! The Church removes the sins with the waters of baptism!
posthuman It takes TWO (2) parents to form a child! Just in case you don't know it takes a FATHER & MOTHER!
God the FATHER!
Church the MOTHER! Two Parents!
QUESTION Point me to scriptures that say; "The actions of men will send the Holy Spirit"!
QUESTION If you claim God as your FATHER then who is your MOTHER!?
I point out all must have a MOTHER to be born!
The title "FATHER" is never received until a MOTHER gives birth!
LOOK... 5 For in him you have been enriched in every way—with all kinds of speech and with all knowledge—6 God thus confirming our testimony about Christ among you.
YES you are 100% right... Christ does not baptize with H[SUB]2[/SUB]O, but with fire and spirit.
posthuman The Groom sends the GIFT!!! God sends the Holy SPIRIT! Never the water part, always the Holy Spirit is God' action!
* The BRIDE does the washing!!! The Church removes the sins with the waters of baptism!
posthuman It takes TWO (2) parents to form a child! Just in case you don't know it takes a FATHER & MOTHER!
God the FATHER!
Church the MOTHER! Two Parents!
QUESTION Point me to scriptures that say; "The actions of men will send the Holy Spirit"!
QUESTION If you claim God as your FATHER then who is your MOTHER!?
I point out all must have a MOTHER to be born!
The title "FATHER" is never received until a MOTHER gives birth!
P
Jumbalaya,
You always need to think about context
And have a Verse in Scripture
To Back Up what your Beliefs are when studying the Bible.
Who was being spoken to in this situation in the verse below?
The thief died after Jesus according to this verse...
John 19:32 So the soldiers came and broke the legs of the first, and of the other who had been crucified with him. 33 But when they came to Jesus and saw that he was already dead, they did not break his legs. 34 But one of the soldiers pierced his side with a spear, and at once there came out blood and water.
So , according to this verse; the thief would be under the New Law...
Because he died AFTER Jesus.. RIGHT..
Really ,the thief did NOT need to be "water baptized"
Because JESUS SAID Quote... Today you will see me in Paradise
Luke 23:
[SUP]39 [/SUP]One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him:
“Aren’t you the Messiah? Save yourself and us!”
[SUP]40 [/SUP]But the other criminal rebuked him. “Don’t you fear God,” he said, “since you are under the same sentence? [SUP]41 [/SUP]We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve.
But this man has done nothing wrong.”
[SUP]42 [/SUP]Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.[SUP][d][/SUP]”
[SUP]43 [/SUP]Jesus answered him, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise.”
Jesus Christ Knows your Heart
So "water baptism" is Not a Requirement for ones Salvation
When people come to Realize that it Is All About Jesus
And what HE says IS what Will Hapen..
They will come to Realize that they can Not DO Anything Anything, Anything
That would deserve Their Salvation..
They would come to Realize that "water baptism"
is an Outward Expression
Publicly showing the World that I am Reborn
as Jesus as my Lord and Savior
Of an Inward Feeling
Is the HEART felt Realization
that I am a sinner going to hell
in Need of a Savior
JESUS CHRIST SAVES
And if you LOVE HIM you will; if at all possible
get baptized as a symbol of being a Christ Follower..
John 8:36 So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed.
HE is the BRIDGE between us and GOD
It Is ALL About HIS Grace and Mercy
Gods Riches At Christ Expense
You always need to think about context
And have a Verse in Scripture
To Back Up what your Beliefs are when studying the Bible.
Who was being spoken to in this situation in the verse below?
The thief died after Jesus according to this verse...
John 19:32 So the soldiers came and broke the legs of the first, and of the other who had been crucified with him. 33 But when they came to Jesus and saw that he was already dead, they did not break his legs. 34 But one of the soldiers pierced his side with a spear, and at once there came out blood and water.
So , according to this verse; the thief would be under the New Law...
Because he died AFTER Jesus.. RIGHT..
Really ,the thief did NOT need to be "water baptized"
Because JESUS SAID Quote... Today you will see me in Paradise
Luke 23:
[SUP]39 [/SUP]One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him:
“Aren’t you the Messiah? Save yourself and us!”
[SUP]40 [/SUP]But the other criminal rebuked him. “Don’t you fear God,” he said, “since you are under the same sentence? [SUP]41 [/SUP]We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve.
But this man has done nothing wrong.”
[SUP]42 [/SUP]Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.[SUP][d][/SUP]”
[SUP]43 [/SUP]Jesus answered him, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise.”
Jesus Christ Knows your Heart
So "water baptism" is Not a Requirement for ones Salvation
When people come to Realize that it Is All About Jesus
And what HE says IS what Will Hapen..
They will come to Realize that they can Not DO Anything Anything, Anything
That would deserve Their Salvation..
They would come to Realize that "water baptism"
is an Outward Expression
Publicly showing the World that I am Reborn
as Jesus as my Lord and Savior
Of an Inward Feeling
Is the HEART felt Realization
that I am a sinner going to hell
in Need of a Savior
JESUS CHRIST SAVES
And if you LOVE HIM you will; if at all possible
get baptized as a symbol of being a Christ Follower..
John 8:36 So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed.
HE is the BRIDGE between us and GOD
It Is ALL About HIS Grace and Mercy
Gods Riches At Christ Expense
P
Dogknox,
you said " Paul was sent to preach!!!
Paul was NOT sent to Baptize!!
And
DO YOU SEE IT??? "Disciples" are Jesus' brothers!
Disciples are made by Baptism!
Jesus' BROTHERS are made by Baptism!
So, if I understand what you are Saying
Paul did Not want to participate in something
that is a Requirement to be a Disciple...
Again you left off part of the verse
1 Corinthians 1:17
For Christ did not send me to baptize,
but to preach the gospel—not with wisdom and eloquence,
What does this part of this verse mean to you""
lest the cross of Christ be emptied of its power.
They are still more Questions that you have over looked in my post
numbers #605 and #622
you said " Paul was sent to preach!!!
Paul was NOT sent to Baptize!!
And
DO YOU SEE IT??? "Disciples" are Jesus' brothers!
Disciples are made by Baptism!
Jesus' BROTHERS are made by Baptism!
So, if I understand what you are Saying
Paul did Not want to participate in something
that is a Requirement to be a Disciple...
Again you left off part of the verse
1 Corinthians 1:17
For Christ did not send me to baptize,
but to preach the gospel—not with wisdom and eloquence,
What does this part of this verse mean to you""
lest the cross of Christ be emptied of its power.
They are still more Questions that you have over looked in my post
numbers #605 and #622
J
If Jesus saved someone before He died, does that negate the fact that He saved that person? No.
Saying that baptism does not save is going against scripture. You would be directly disagreeing with the teachings of Jesus:
1 Peter 3:21 "There is also an antitype which NOW SAVES US—baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,"
Also, if you look at that verse again...it says that baptism saves "THROUGH the resurrection of Jesus Christ". Christ had not been raised from the dead yet when the thief was saved, the resurrection is part of the foundation of the Christian faith:
1 Corinthians 15:14 "And if Christ has not been raised, then our preaching is in vain and your faith is in vain."
Saying that baptism does not save is going against scripture. You would be directly disagreeing with the teachings of Jesus:
1 Peter 3:21 "There is also an antitype which NOW SAVES US—baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,"
Also, if you look at that verse again...it says that baptism saves "THROUGH the resurrection of Jesus Christ". Christ had not been raised from the dead yet when the thief was saved, the resurrection is part of the foundation of the Christian faith:
1 Corinthians 15:14 "And if Christ has not been raised, then our preaching is in vain and your faith is in vain."
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