Abide in Christ, or in sin

[Jeff_56]

They recognize sin in themselves instantly or sin outside themselves?

Why would they need to recognize sin if they are abiding in Christ?

why did Jesus recognize sin ?

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

Well yeah, that was my whole point.

You seemed to be saying that some people who abide in Christ also abide in sin.

I really don't see how one could of got that idea out of my OP?

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

they, specifically, are never in the vine, not to start with, and not later. (so they are never even as if "taken from the vine" being never one in the vine)....

You make a good point Jeff.

 

[dcontroversal]

Show me where I said exactly what you just stated I said. If you cannot provide it, then you can add bearing false witness to your list of sins.

Sounds familiar...OH yeah.....there is a word for the following type of activity and seems you need to get the log out of your eye before you can see clearly dude.......

Here I will post your accusatory LIE once more.....go cut and paste where anyone who believes in eternal security has said, implied or taught what you are accusing of......or be found a liar! Rather simple.....

Originally Posted by InSpiritInTruth

They want to hear feel good preachers who tell them they can sin all they want and still be "IN CHRIST" WHICH IS A LIE.

So did the above two sins cause you to lose your salvation?

 

[JosiahUntoTheChrist]

Whats happening here is that most of the people are demonstrating that they abide in sin by calling out each others sin without showing love and understanding.

 

[Jeff_56]

You make a good point Jeff.

okay, for clarity, we ,,,, "we" who are abiding in yahshua hamashiach are not supposed to "make good points" (in so many ways this is important, that i didn't even realize until i was halfway through typing the first part of this sentence... i.e. revelation, literally, while abiding)....

look in the NT letters, and the GOSPEL, and the TORAH >>> please show me where, any where that God, Jesus, Moses, ..... *(see footnote) , Paul, Simon Peter(the small pebble), John the Apostle, or anyone else said "that's a good point"....

*okay, Moses might have told Jethro that he made a good point(or had a good point)... or 'that's good advice' (Moses did as Jethro suggested)....

SUBJECT to YAHWEH.... HIS SOVEREIGNTY. ah ha ! that's it ! subject to JESUS CHRIST. no thought or imagination or dream or opinion or 'point' outside of HIM. all in all in HIM according to HIS WORD....

emphatically, because a lot of posts opinions points and challenges are not of or from or in line with HIM.

most simply, "let every word and action be as from the Father in heaven" (it is written, somewhere)

same as Jesus. He did nothing of or for Himself.

that's why so few follow Him. they don't want to give up getting and doing and having for themselves.


yes, this is a little bit of a discourse, subject to Yahweh's Sovereignty and Yahshua as a source, and
will be as needed in His Plan clarified for those who are seeking Him, if there is anyone doing so; Yahweh willing....

 

[DesiredHaven]

they, specifically, are never in the vine, not to start with, and not later. (so they are never even as if "taken from the vine" being never one in the vine)....

Jesus speaks of branches in Him that bear not fruit (being cast forth). So they are shown as starting in him

The reason I used bastards is because of the contrast in sons who are chastised whereas a bastard would not be, but neither do the fruitless branches ( but in respects to getting pruned) rather the branches in Him that bear fruit (get pruned/ purged) as Jesus said.

I am using them to contrast between true sons simply because they wouldnt be true sons (so to speak). Following the same course of fruitless branches (which are men) taken away of God (the Husbandman) these being cast forth (even going out from Christ) the Vine as its He that is sanctifieth and of them that are sanctified He is not ashamed to call them brethren. He that hath not the Spirit of Christ is none of His (out from Him). I just dont see any difference between a false brethren, or fruitless branches or bastards (not true sons). And that as far as using them to either compare or contrast with. If He is not ashamed to call them which are sanctified brethren (and these are not) then if they be false brethren (having not the Spirit of Christ) which them them His. Bastards just makes sense to use (without chastisement) verses sons (of each son he receives He chatises). So I wouldnt count the same as sanctified, or as even receiving correction (whether of pruning/ via fruitless branch or chastisement/ via a son. Unfruitful according this, or as that bearing "thorns and briers" nigh unto the cursing way.

 

[DesiredHaven]

Sounds familiar...OH yeah.....there is a word for the following type of activity and seems you need to get the log out of your eye before you can see clearly dude.......

Here I will post your accusatory LIE once more.....go cut and paste where anyone who believes in eternal security has said, implied or taught what you are accusing of......or be found a liar! Rather simple.....

Originally Posted by InSpiritInTruth

They want to hear feel good preachers who tell them they can sin all they want and still be "IN CHRIST" WHICH IS A LIE.

So did the above two sins cause you to lose your salvation?

Heres the context to for those reading

 

[Grandpa]

why did Jesus recognize sin ?

Ask Jesus.

 

[Jeff_56]

Jesus speaks of branches in Him that bear not fruit (being cast forth). So they are shown as starting in him

The reason I used bastards is because of the contrast in sons who are chastised whereas a bastard would not be, but neither do the fruitless branches ( but in respects to getting pruned) rather the branches in Him that bear fruit (get pruned/ purged) as Jesus said.
........

i think if you check the Scripture(which you do almost every post i've seen) that you will find that the branches in Him that bear not fruit have received discipline and not responded. (they may even have been covered with fertilizer! to see if that might prompt something! )

the bastards never ever are disciplined. they never ever are in the vine naturally nor grafted in.

 

[Jeff_56]

Ask Jesus.

you asked me. why didn't you ask Jesus ? I remain in Jesus and will help you if He permits, but so far you have adamantly and perniciously refused to listen to Him....

 

[DesiredHaven]

2 Ti 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine;
but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

2 Ti 4:4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

Turning from the truth, teachers after their lusts is feel good teachers

The doctrine of Christ is according to godliness, even the grace of God teaches us to deny worldly and ungodly lusts, and also that those who would live godly in Christ (not ungodly) would be persecuted

 

[Grandpa]

I really don't see how one could of got that idea out of my OP?

I think I was looking at some of the responses to your post and thinking they were your explanations.

But they were someone elses posts.

That was my misunderstanding.

 

[dcontroversal]

Why is it that you guys do not understand the concept of chastisement....you post about no way a believer can sin and still be saved which directly contradicts the reasons and usage of chastisement by God......

1. WHY does GOD chasten?
2. Who does God chasten?
3. What is the purpose of chastening?
4. If there is NO chastening then the person is not a?

1. God chastens BECAUSE OF SIN
2. GOD CHASTENS HIS CHILDREN<===NOTE HIS CHILDREN WHO HAVE SIN (STILL HIS CHILDREN)
3. TO BRING THEM TO REPENTANCE so AS TO YEILD FRUIT
4. NOT A SON, NEVER WAS A SON

A SON of GOD is STILL A SON of GOD and has NOT LOST SALVATION WHEN IN SIN TO THE POINT OF BEING WHIPPED BY GOD. A SON OF GOD WHILE IN SIN WILL NOT YEILD FRUIT...GOD WHIPS HIS CHILDREN WHO ARE STILL CHILDREN TO BRING THEM ON LINE WITH BEARING FRUIT.....

This one set of verses found in Hebrews blows the whole premise out of the water that sin in a believer causes them to lose salvation which is tied directly to SONSHIP...............

 

[Sirk]

Sounds familiar...OH yeah.....there is a word for the following type of activity and seems you need to get the log out of your eye before you can see clearly dude.......

Here I will post your accusatory LIE once more.....go cut and paste where anyone who believes in eternal security has said, implied or taught what you are accusing of......or be found a liar! Rather simple.....

Originally Posted by InSpiritInTruth

They want to hear feel good preachers who tell them they can sin all they want and still be "IN CHRIST" WHICH IS A LIE.

So did the above two sins cause you to lose your salvation?

I see we still have to some work to do to get these lumberjacks off of everyone else's land.

 

[dcontroversal]

Heres the context to for those reading

View attachment 117164

So now he needs you to defend his accusation which is sin making you partaker of it....His accusation was false as no one believes that or teaches that.....and his statement to threescore makes him a hypocrite.....now you are part of that accusation...good luck with that!

Here I will post your accusatory LIE once more.....go cut and paste where anyone who believes in eternal security has said, implied or taught what you are accusing of......or be found a liar! Rather simple.....

Originally Posted by InSpiritInTruth

They want to hear feel good preachers who tell them they can sin all they want and still be "IN CHRIST" WHICH IS A LIE.

 

[DesiredHaven]

i think if you check the Scripture(which you do almost every post i've seen) that you will find that the branches in Him that bear not fruit have received discipline and not responded. (they may even have been covered with fertilizer! to see if that might prompt something! )

the bastards never ever are disciplined. they never ever are in the vine naturally nor grafted in.

Yes the other parable where tree didnt bear fruit, and the dresser would fertilize it and if bear fruit fine but if not well...

He was coming looking for fruit and not finding any for a period of three years asking why it took up the ground if its somewhat useless in that condition

Luke 13:8 And he answering said unto him,

Lord, let it alone this year also, till I shall dig about it, and dung it:

Luke 13:9 And if it bear fruit, well: and if not, then after
that thou shalt cut it down.

The branches taken away were not bearing fruit in Christ and taken away and them which were bearing fruit were pruned to bear even more fruit in Christ

 

[tribesman]

Well yeah, that was my whole point.

You seemed to be saying that some people who abide in Christ also abide in sin. I didn't see how that was possible.

It's the CC thingy that one with going in and out of salvation. It just ain't there in scriptures, so we need that harmonizing element of putting forth all scripture applicable regarding justification and sanctification to get it right and sound. You and crossnote already did that here and ty for it.

 

[DesiredHaven]

So now he needs you to defend his accusation which is sin making you partaker of it....His accusation was false as no one believes that or teaches that.....and his statement to threescore makes him a hypocrite.....now you are part of that accusation...good luck with that!

Here I will post your accusatory LIE once more.....go cut and paste where anyone who believes in eternal security has said, implied or taught what you are accusing of......or be found a liar! Rather simple.....

Originally Posted by InSpiritInTruth

They want to hear feel good preachers who tell them they can sin all they want and still be "IN CHRIST" WHICH IS A LIE.

I simply posted the conversation so the reader could see the context of the conversation

Unless you would prefer to conceal it from them?

 

[dcontroversal]

So now he needs you to defend his accusation which is sin making you partaker of it....His accusation was false as no one believes that or teaches that.....and his statement to threescore makes him a hypocrite.....now you are part of that accusation...good luck with that!

Here I will post your accusatory LIE once more.....go cut and paste where anyone who believes in eternal security has said, implied or taught what you are accusing of......or be found a liar! Rather simple.....

Originally Posted by InSpiritInTruth

They want to hear feel good preachers who tell them they can sin all they want and still be "IN CHRIST" WHICH IS A LIE.

I will add that the use of (THEY) in context is directed at everyone who was on that thread who believes in and was making a stand in favor of the security of the believer.....so...it was not a general statement, but a pointed statement and accusation which was false!