The Rapture

[AVoiceintheWilderness]

Yes it is!!!!! My interest in this subject had been aroused due to many of my friends falling for the Left Behind books. I tell them it is fiction and they assure me that they know that, but the way they talk tells me they have swallowed the lie

I, too, was decieved. Probably mostly cause I was thrilled that there was an actual movie out about something Biblical. Unfortunately not. Exodus was also terrible and Noah was a crying shame.

Once I was made aware that there even 'was' a controversy between Pre-trib theory and Post-trib, I took a much closer look in scripture. Overall, it just seems that the Pre-trib concept 'fits' the NWO/enemy agenda much better and is not so Biblical after all. Mostly because there are many verses that clearly state that we will suffer through the Trib.

It will be a time for God to test all His faithful servants and to save 'countless' souls. Kind of a final crucible to render the purest metals to the top.

 

[AVoiceintheWilderness]

P.S. I also have family members who strictly adhere to mainstream Christian, feel-good, concepts, like the Left Behind series, and it is very frustrating and painful to not be able to open their eyes. All we can do is pray that God will grant them spiritual sight. From what I understand it is granted only to those who have a very sincere yearning for the Truth.

 

[Willie-T]

I am with you on this. The rapture is an invention of two ministers in Scotland , who when heard of a young girls' (Margaret McDonald) story of a visitation by a spirit who gave her this information in the first place, ran with it and created a whole new religion based on this. No one will find any trace of rapture theory before 1830, it simply did not exist anywhere. For those interested in the origins of the rapture, I direct you to read "The incredible cover up" by Dave MacPherson, who wrote this documentary after tracing the origins from the U.S. to England, then to Scotland. This has all been recorded in church history. Many people hear of this by word of mouth and have no idea where and when it originated from as with so many other so called church doctrines that are not of God , nor Christ, but from the mouths of men.

Actually, a Jesuit Priest, Francisco Ribera, came up with the idea in a book on prophecy he wrote around 1585-1590.

 

[Magenta]

... I was thrilled that there was an actual movie out about something Biblical. Unfortunately not. Exodus was also terrible and Noah was a crying shame.

I really enjoyed both those movies. Did they widely depart from what is written? Yes, they did. They were Hollywood productions, after all. But aside from that, I found their treatment of the subject matter, especially in Noah, innovative. God speaking through dreams... that was not Biblical for Noah regarding the flood, but it is one of the ways God's revealed written Word proclaims prophets hear from God. And how the animals were called... beautifully rendered. Just think of all the people that may have had a spark ignited in them as a result of watching either modernized movie. Both Russell Crowe and Christian Bale are excellent actors who brought their well honed skills to the task, not to mention the countless others who contributed their talents, including Jennifer Connelly and Anthony Hopkins.

 

[AceMichaels]

I, too, was decieved. Probably mostly cause I was thrilled that there was an actual movie out about something Biblical. Unfortunately not. Exodus was also terrible and Noah was a crying shame.

Once I was made aware that there even 'was' a controversy between Pre-trib theory and Post-trib, I took a much closer look in scripture. Overall, it just seems that the Pre-trib concept 'fits' the NWO/enemy agenda much better and is not so Biblical after all. Mostly because there are many verses that clearly state that we will suffer through the Trib.

It will be a time for God to test all His faithful servants and to save 'countless' souls. Kind of a final crucible to render the purest metals to the top.

I think that is when God's Light will shine the brightest through us! I have no scripture for this, just a hunch

 

[blondieindahouse]

I really enjoyed both those movies. Did they widely depart from what is written? Yes, they did. They were Hollywood productions, after all. But aside from that, I found their treatment of the subject matter, especially in Noah, innovative. God speaking through dreams... that was not Biblical for Noah regarding the flood, but it is one of the ways God's revealed written Word proclaims prophets hear from God. And how the animals were called... beautifully rendered. Just think of all the people that may have had a spark ignited in them as a result of watching either modernized movie. Both Russell Crowe and Christian Bale are excellent actors who brought their well honed skills to the task, not to mention the countless others who contributed their talents, including Jennifer Connelly and Anthony Hopkins.

View attachment 134236

I hated the movie Noah! It was a disgrace to Gods word. Rock people? Really? I didnt pay to see it and wouldnt give hellywood a dime for most everything they come up with
My friend rented it and it ruined my evening.
I did like "Gods not Dead" which came out around the same season. It rocked it!!

 

[AceMichaels]

I hated the movie Noah! It was a disgrace to Gods word. Rock people? Really? I didnt pay to see it and wouldnt give hellywood a dime for most everything they come up with
My friend rented it and it ruined my evening.
I did like "Gods not Dead" which came out around the same season. It rocked it!!

"Gods not Dead" was a good movie and thought provoking! I still wear the bracelet that came with the DVD!!!

 

[blondieindahouse]

"Gods not Dead" was a good movie and thought provoking! I still wear the bracelet that came with the DVD!!!

Ah cool! Came with a bracelet eh? I wouldnt mind having that dvd.

 

[popeye]

Actually, a Jesuit Priest, Francisco Ribera, came up with the idea in a book on prophecy he wrote around 1585-1590.

He was futurist. he did his own study apart from catholicism.

But the truth is the catholics started killing and torturing "heretics",such as myself ,around 390 ad.
So where are the thousands of sermons and written record of a pretrib rapture???? They burned them and the authors.

Just as pagans have always done throughout every era, the Roman Catholics utilized pain and torture for the sheer panic it spread among the people. In this picture, we see a Catholic Bishop having his eyes put out for some type of heresy of which he was accused and for which he would not repent. Eye piercing was generally given to a learned person because their livelihood and their passion was academic pursuit. After their eyes were put out, they were usually destitute and could no longer influence people with their "heresy" any longer. Truly, these terrified villagers discovered firsthand that the yoke of Rome was horrible, heavy to be borne, and terribly oppressive. The light yoke of the Savior seemed like a distant memory, lost in the mists of many centuries, hidden by the veil of pagan Rome.

THE TRUE FACE OF THE ROMAN CATHOLIC INQUISITON -- ROTTEN SPIRITUAL FRUIT FROM THE ABYSS OF HELL
^^^^^^^^^^ I did not write that ^^^^^^^ .....it is some default from "cuuting edge website^^^^^^^^^

So,can we conclude from this that the catholics originated non futurist erroneous historicist doctrine????

 

[shotgunner]

No tribulating for me. I'm God's child and he saves his children from wrath. You'll can stay if you want. I'll save you a seat at the table.

 

[KennethC]

I hated the movie Noah! It was a disgrace to Gods word. Rock people? Really? I didnt pay to see it and wouldnt give hellywood a dime for most everything they come up with
My friend rented it and it ruined my evening.
I did like "Gods not Dead" which came out around the same season. It rocked it!!

Not only did it show the fallen angels as rock giants it also showed they could redeem themselves and go back to heaven, but the scriptures say they are bound in chains tell judgment. (2 Peter 2:4, Jude 1:6)

Movie directors have a tendency to twist and mess up movies that are suppose to be based out of the bible, as not to many actually follow the scriptures.

Son of God did the same thing as the movie had Jesus go in and kiss Lazarus on the head, but the scripture in John 11:43 Jesus stayed outside the tomb and called in a loud voice for Lazarus to come out.

 

[crossnote]

There is no rapture. There is an appointed time to die and an appointed time for the Lord to return in judgement and get his people. I suppose you could call that a "rapture" if you want but either way when God's elect leave this world they get to see the Lord as he is and worship him forever. For now while we are here let us praise the Lord for his goodness and wonderful works to the children of men and warn others to trust only in Christ's finished work, never anything they do.

I am so thankful I am not under the curse of the Law. May God bless you as only he can do.............

...all without scriptural support?

 

[crossnote]

I believe the "rapture" will take place at the end of time after the Tribulation at the last trump just like Gods Word says.

So we go up ↑ as Jesus comes down ↓ ?..and end up right back down?

 

[crossnote]

I am with you on this. The rapture is an invention of two ministers in Scotland , who when heard of a young girls' (Margaret McDonald) story of a visitation by a spirit who gave her this information in the first place, ran with it and created a whole new religion based on this. No one will find any trace of rapture theory before 1830, it simply did not exist anywhere. For those interested in the origins of the rapture, I direct you to read "The incredible cover up" by Dave MacPherson, who wrote this documentary after tracing the origins from the U.S. to England, then to Scotland. This has all been recorded in church history. Many people hear of this by word of mouth and have no idea where and when it originated from as with so many other so called church doctrines that are not of God , nor Christ, but from the mouths of men.

Tired story.
Debunked here... http://www.amazon.com/Understanding...qid=1440561746&sr=8-1&keywords=Paul+Wilkinson

 

[KennethC]

So we go up ↑ as Jesus comes down ↓ ?..and end up right back down?

We go up to meet the Lord in the air, God's wrath is poured out, and then we come down and reign with the Lord during the millennium.

 

[crossnote]

I believe I know what you're thinking with the 'wanting to be left behind' as opposed to being 'Raptured' or gathered up and away. I have seen/heard the theories about 'Taken' meaning being killed like as was in the days of Noah.

But from my reading and perception of it, to the best of my discernment, it doesn't appear to be Biblically accurate. Consider Matthew 24:29-31

"[SUP]29[/SUP] Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
[SUP]30[/SUP] And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
[SUP]31[/SUP] And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other."

Matthew 24:29 - 24:31

There are many other verses that refer to a rapture-like event, but this one really speaks to the exact point in time regarding the Trib and following Wrath.

What if the 'elect' there is the Jewish remnant?

 

[crossnote]

You mentioned the enemy and the reason these details are so utterly important to him and his forces upon the earth is that the concept of a Pre-Trib rapture event promises things that the Truth of the Bible does not.

Pre-Trip Rapture implies:

1. A second chance for those who are living unclean/unholy lives.

2. A second chance for Christians who believe all they have to do is believe in Jesus and they can live "like the devil" (as Charles Stanley and David Jeremiah would have you believe) and still slide in to home plate (Heaven) with their clothes smoking.

3. A clear way to know when the Tribulation has begun. By witnessing a Rapture-like event, it would be obvious that the 7 year Tribulation count-down had begun.

Without a Pre-Trib rapture, the enemy's forces can simply keep telling the world that everything is ok and nothing crazy is going on despite all the obvious signs that the Trib has begun and thus keep people calm and safe in their bubbles of Eternal Security/Salvation aloofness. Sinning away right up to the time that the saints are scooped out of the way and the world is devastated by God's final Wrath.

Strawmen...

 

[shotgunner]

Long but worth a read.

http://rev-gerald-wrenn.until-then.com/images/hopepdf/9_Comparing_Christs_Two_Comings.pdf

 

[crossnote]

Amen to that and I agree......! Post tribulation/pre-wrath ingathering/change at the 7th and final trump!

That 7th Trumpet in Revelation is the last trumpet of judgement...not for the Church.

 

[crossnote]

I, too, was decieved. Probably mostly cause I was thrilled that there was an actual movie out about something Biblical. Unfortunately not. Exodus was also terrible and Noah was a crying shame.

Once I was made aware that there even 'was' a controversy between Pre-trib theory and Post-trib, I took a much closer look in scripture. Overall, it just seems that the Pre-trib concept 'fits' the NWO/enemy agenda much better and is not so Biblical after all. Mostly because there are many verses that clearly state that we will suffer through the Trib.

It will be a time for God to test all His faithful servants and to save 'countless' souls. Kind of a final crucible to render the purest metals to the top.

The Great Tribulation is not for the Church. It was prophesied for Israel back in the Old Testament (Jacob's trouble et al). It is a time of refining of Israel. Now if you have swallowed the replacement pill, then naturally you are going to fit the Church in where Israel belongs.